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Judgement and Being Judged

znpaaneah

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Hello znpaaneah, I believe that while we are, of course, to judge ourselves, I believe the Bible tells us to do far more than that.

Please see what I just said about this in the preceding post (#18) as I believe that I addressed most of what you just said there.

Thanks :)

God bless you!!

--David
Yes, we are to try and to test the word, to discern false prophets. However, this word still applies. You can't judge that someone who is doing the same thing as you. The same test you put others through you will have to be held to that same standard. Therefore before you can judge someone is a false prophet you must carefully examine yourself. You cannot judge the flesh if you are fleshly and you cannot judge greed if you are greedy. In my opinion six/sevenths of our judgment must be on ourselves and only then can we judge the fruit of others.

Luke 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
 
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jmldn2

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Hello jmldn2, et al, that's what it says .. e.g. Matthew 7:1; Luke 6:37. The question is, did the Lord mean, "DO NOT JUDGE", ~period~, or did the He actually mean something else?

For instance, if the Lord Jesus meant "do not judge" PERIOD, then why does He immediately begin to speak of the "ways" that we choose to judge others (in v2), or bother giving us an example & explanation of what He meant/wants us to avoid doing (hypocritical judgments) in the following three verses (v3-5)?

Matthew 7
1 Do not judge so that you will not be judged.

2 For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you.

3 Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye?
5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.

Then there's v6 to consider. What are we to make of it (Matthew 7:6, that is) and how can we obey it (judge/discern who the "dogs" and "swine" are, IOW) if "do not judge" is meant as a blanket statement covering every kind of judgment in every situation?

Matthew 7
6 Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

Lastly, if "do not judge" is a command without any exceptions from the Lord, then what do we do with this?

Matthew 7
15 Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
16 You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they?
17 So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 So then, you will know them by their fruits.

So, while our judging/discerning the motivation(s) of another's heart is almost always wrong, it seems to me that we are commanded to judge the ~behavior~ of others (what they say and/or do, what is good/bad, right/wrong, righteous/sinful according to the Scriptures), for both our sake and the sake of others (particularly in the church), and for the sake of the sinning brother or sister in Christ, as well, yes .. e.g. Matthew 18:15-17 cf 1 Corinthians 11:32.

God bless you!!

--David
p.s. - the above was all from Matthew 7 alone. Perhaps we should take a look at what the rest of the Bible has to say, too?

The other question that comes to mind is this, is our judgment/discernment of others ALWAYS a bad thing, or does the Bible tell us that it should actually be considered to be a blessing to others, and if so, in what ways/in what situations does the Bible tell us that it is?
A very good explanation about judging and thank you for your reply. To me judging means it's ok to judge the "behavior" but as for judging another's heart/soul, that is up to God only. Even judging behavior, in my opinion, should be done with mercy!. May God bless you
 
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jmldn2

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Amen, You got that right but we humans like to critizize the dog poop in our neighbors yard when our yard is stinkin up the neighborhood.
Yep we do. I just believe judging someone's heart/soul should strictly be up to God Almighty
 
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jmldn2

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I interpret this slightly different.

The Lord did not tell us not to judge. Rather He said with what judgment you judge you shall be judged. That is simply a warning not to judge others, but it loses all power if you are judging yourself: "With what judgement you judge yourself you shall be judged".

So I agree it is a mistake to simplify this to say the Lord said not to judge. What He warned about was judging others, by all means you can still judge yourself. He tells us clearly to focus on the beam that is in our own eye to remove that. Likewise, instead of judging others as "dogs" and "swine" look in the mirror. Is there any tinge of the flesh or self in you?
I judge myself all the time.
 
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St_Worm2

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I judge myself all the time.
Me too :) God wants us to do so, yes? .. e.g. 2 Corinthians 13:5

But I'm glad that we have each other for the things that I miss about myself .. which at times is a lot!

God bless you!! (Numbers 6:24-26)

--David
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Question for the group:

If someone says, "So-and-so is not saved because x, y, and z", will they be judged by that same standard?

Here's a hypothetical scenario:

I say "Johnny is going to end up in Hell because he doesn't eat corn flakes for breakfast every morning." We both die and Johnny goes to Heaven because breakfast cereal doesn't matter, HOWEVER...my sincere belief is that you have to eat corn flakes to be saved.

What happens to me.

If I require something that God does not require for salvation...
Am I just wrong? Or am I in danger of trusting in my own standard rather than the cross?
No one can know who is saved or lost that is for Jesus alone to decide, only He knows who are the wheat and who are the tares and what we all do or don’t do and only He can read our heart. We can judge people based on peoples fruits (not salvation judging) but more like this person is doing drugs and denies Christ I do not want to be around or have my children around their influence etc.
 
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jmldn2

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Hello jmldn2, et al, that's what it says .. e.g. Matthew 7:1; Luke 6:37. The question is, did the Lord mean, "DO NOT JUDGE", ~period~, or did the He actually mean something else?

For instance, if the Lord Jesus meant "do not judge" PERIOD, then why does He immediately begin to speak of the "ways" that we choose to judge others (in v2), or bother giving us an example & explanation of what He meant/wants us to avoid doing (hypocritical judgments) in the following three verses (v3-5)?

Matthew 7
1 Do not judge so that you will not be judged.

2 For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you.

3 Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother’s eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye?
4 Or how can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ and behold, the log is in your own eye?
5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.

Then there's v6 to consider. What are we to make of it (Matthew 7:6, that is) and how can we obey it (judge/discern who the "dogs" and "swine" are, IOW) if "do not judge" is meant as a blanket statement covering every kind of judgment in every situation?

Matthew 7
6 Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces.

Lastly, if "do not judge" is a command without any exceptions from the Lord, then what do we do with this?

Matthew 7
15 Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
16 You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they?
17 So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.
18 A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit.
19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
20 So then, you will know them by their fruits.

So, while our judging/discerning the motivation(s) of another's heart is almost always wrong, it seems to me that we are commanded to judge the ~behavior~ of others (what they say and/or do, what is good/bad, right/wrong, righteous/sinful according to the Scriptures), for both our sake and the sake of others (particularly in the church), and for the sake of the sinning brother or sister in Christ, as well, yes .. e.g. Matthew 18:15-17 cf 1 Corinthians 11:32.

God bless you!!

--David
p.s. - the above was all from Matthew 7 alone. Perhaps we should take a look at what the rest of the Bible has to say, too?

The other question that comes to mind is this, is our judgment/discernment of others ALWAYS a bad thing, or does the Bible tell us that it should actually be considered to be a blessing to others, and if so, in what ways/in what situations does the Bible tell us that it is?
A good post and great questions. To me "judging" another's heart is wrong. Only God should have that privilege. Yes, some behaviors can be "judged" as far as perspective sake. However, people usually do not stop at that but continue on to decide someone's state of soul. Yes, the bible has plenty to say about judging. I would rather say "discernment" or decipher.
 
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jmldn2

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No one can know who is saved or lost that is for Jesus alone to decide, only He knows who are the wheat and who are the tares and what we all do or don’t do and only He can read our heart. We can judge people based on peoples fruits (not salvation judging) but more like this person is doing drugs and denies Christ I do not want to be around or have my children around their influence etc.
Behavior good/bad is something I believe we all judge, whether or not we realize it. I just do not believe in trying to decide if one is save or not. That is God's job. And sometimes we all exhibit bad behavior.
 
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Jeff Saunders

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Christians have a standard because of the cross. How about this scenario:
Johnny is not saved because he does not believe Jesus Christ of Nazareth came in the flesh. Nothing to say that at any time Johnny can be saved as he has until death to come to faith.
Blessings
He has multiple ages after this one to follow Jesus, we are not confined to just the mortal bodies expiration date to follow Jesus. Our body dies not accept Jesus we do our Spirit , which is us, we are not our body, its just a shell we use for a short time.
 
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David Lamb

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He has multiple ages after this one to follow Jesus, we are not confined to just the mortal bodies expiration date to follow Jesus. Our body dies not accept Jesus we do our Spirit , which is us, we are not our body, its just a shell we use for a short time.
But we read in the New Testament:

“"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."” (Joh 8:24 NKJV)

Jesus didn't say, "You will die in your sins, but don't worry about it - you'll have plenty of chances after death to believe in Me and be saved."
 
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jmldn2

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But we read in the New Testament:

“"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."” (Joh 8:24 NKJV)

Jesus didn't say, "You will die in your sins, but don't worry about it - you'll have plenty of chances after death to believe in Me and be saved."
I agree. God gives us until the moment of death to make a choice. Believe or not believe. That choice is while we are alive.
 
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Jeff Saunders

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But we read in the New Testament:

“"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."” (Joh 8:24 NKJV)

Jesus didn't say, "You will die in your sins, but don't worry about it - you'll have plenty of chances after death to believe in Me and be saved."
But we read in the New Testament:

“"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins."” (Joh 8:24 NKJV)

Jesus didn't say, "You will die in your sins, but don't worry about it - you'll have plenty of chances after death to believe in Me and be saved."
Yes most will die in their sins, and Hebrews 9:27" it is appointed for man to die once and then the judgement", you are making the mistake of thinking that the judgement is that same as the sentence of punishment. You have made the classic mistake of thinking that this is talking about eternal heaven or "hell", but that is a lie from the evil one to make you think God is a monster who creates children and then abandons them to forever torture them, that is what the pagan gods do not the God of creation. What does scripture say?
JOHN 4:42 " Jesus is the Christ, the Savior of the world(cosmos)" not a potential savior.
JOHN 12:47 "Jesus came to save the cosmos not to judge it"
LUKE 15:4/ MATT 18:12 Jesus will leave the ninety-nine and not stop till the last sheep be found. this is the Fathers heart, God does not do abandonment, that's the enemy
The judgement is did you follow Jesus and become reconciled while in the mortal body by dying to self and picking up your cross and following Jesus or did you live for self? If you did follow Jesus then you go to aionion life, life in Jesus in the next age. If you lived to self, blaspheming the Holy Spirit that God has placed on all flesh,( Acts 2:17&18), then you go in to judgement Matt 25:46 kolasis aionios in the Greek , kolasis is a arborist term for pruning an tree or vine to make it produce more fruit. a correction not corporal judgement.
We know what Gods will is 1 Tim 2:3-6 Its Gods will that all be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth.
Isaiah 45:23 / Rom 14:11 / Phil 2:10-11 all say Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. ( the Greek word for confess is Exomologeo - to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise to without reservations. not a forced false acknowledgement )
The big question is are you going to be part of the Gods kingdom and reign and rule with him or are you going to give up your inheritance and become a subject of Gods kingdom? Jesus will get 100% of what he paid for, God will not be robbed.
 
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David Lamb

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Yes most will die in their sins, and Hebrews 9:27" it is appointed for man to die once and then the judgement", you are making the mistake of thinking that the judgement is that same as the sentence of punishment. You have made the classic mistake of thinking that this is talking about eternal heaven or "hell", but that is a lie from the evil one to make you think God is a monster who creates children and then abandons them to forever torture them, that is what the pagan gods do not the God of creation. What does scripture say?
JOHN 4:42 " Jesus is the Christ, the Savior of the world(cosmos)" not a potential savior.
JOHN 12:47 "Jesus came to save the cosmos not to judge it"
LUKE 15:4/ MATT 18:12 Jesus will leave the ninety-nine and not stop till the last sheep be found. this is the Fathers heart, God does not do abandonment, that's the enemy
The judgement is did you follow Jesus and become reconciled while in the mortal body by dying to self and picking up your cross and following Jesus or did you live for self? If you did follow Jesus then you go to aionion life, life in Jesus in the next age. If you lived to self, blaspheming the Holy Spirit that God has placed on all flesh,( Acts 2:17&18), then you go in to judgement Matt 25:46 kolasis aionios in the Greek , kolasis is a arborist term for pruning an tree or vine to make it produce more fruit. a correction not corporal judgement.
We know what Gods will is 1 Tim 2:3-6 Its Gods will that all be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth.
Isaiah 45:23 / Rom 14:11 / Phil 2:10-11 all say Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. ( the Greek word for confess is Exomologeo - to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise to without reservations. not a forced false acknowledgement )
The big question is are you going to be part of the Gods kingdom and reign and rule with him or are you going to give up your inheritance and become a subject of Gods kingdom? Jesus will get 100% of what he paid for, God will not be robbed.
Yes, the New Testament certainly says that Jesus is the Saviour. It also tells us who He saves:


“"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” (Joh 3:16 NKJV)

“"He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."” (Joh 3:36 NKJV)

Jesus said:

“"I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.” (Joh 10:11 NKJV)

Then He said to some of His hearers:

“"But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you.” (Joh 10:26 NKJV)

I looked in vain for any bible reference that says that if we don't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ in this life, we will get another opportunity to do so after death.
 
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Jeff Saunders

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Yes, the New Testament certainly says that Jesus is the Saviour. It also tells us who He saves:


“"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” (Joh 3:16 NKJV)

“"He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."” (Joh 3:36 NKJV)

Jesus said:

“"I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.” (Joh 10:11 NKJV)

Then He said to some of His hearers:

“"But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you.” (Joh 10:26 NKJV)

I looked in vain for any bible reference that says that if we don't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ in this life, we will get another opportunity to do so after death.
Show me the scripture that says there is a Trinity, you can't find one verse , but if you take scripture as a whole you find the Trinity all over scripture.
The same applies to salvation after the mortal body dies, its all over scripture.
Phil 2:10-11/Rom 14:11/ Isa 45:23 Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. The Greek word for confess is Exomologeo- to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise without reservations. Either this scripture which God repeated three times is true or it is false, if true most of humanity must come to reconciliation after the mortal body had died.
John 12:32 and I, when I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me. The Greek word for draw is helko, which means to drag like a fishing net, all men will be drawn to Jesus , again this is post mortem for most of humanity.
2 Cor:19 in Christ God was reconciling the world (cosmos) to himself, not counting peoples trespasses against them, and he has given us the message of reconciliation . This reconciliation will take multiple ages but it will be completed. This only can happen if postmortem repentance is true.
Rom 5:18 Just as the result of one trespass was condemnation of all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness wasa justification that brings life for all men.
1 Pet 3:19 Jesus preached to the dead. why would Jesus preach to the dead if their fate was sealed, that makes no sense
There are others but I think from these you can see why I believe that repentance after the mortal body dies is not only possible but will be the majority.
God dies not save the body all bodies die, unless you are here for the second coming, we are not our body, this is just a temporary vessel that we inhabit for a short time. God saves us, we are spirit and our spirit has no end, that is what is saved not our body. That is why post mortem salvation must be true. Jesus will get 100% of what he paid for, God will not be robbed. .
 
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jmldn2

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And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: Hebrew 9:27

And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. Acts: 16:31

Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. Romans 3:20

For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation. II Corinthians 6:2

Luke:16-19 The rich man in hell asking for Lazarus to tell about the terrible place called "hell."

It is our faith in Christ Jesus which saves our souls. People are given many chances while alive to repent and accept Christ. I personally do not believe in salvation once we die.
 
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CoreyD

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Question for the group:

If someone says, "So-and-so is not saved because x, y, and z", will they be judged by that same standard?

Here's a hypothetical scenario:

I say "Johnny is going to end up in Hell because he doesn't eat corn flakes for breakfast every morning." We both die and Johnny goes to Heaven because breakfast cereal doesn't matter, HOWEVER...my sincere belief is that you have to eat corn flakes to be saved.

What happens to me.

If I require something that God does not require for salvation...
Am I just wrong? Or am I in danger of trusting in my own standard rather than the cross?
This scenario reminds me of Acts 15:1-31
What I see there, is a recognition of a means of direction.
In other words, all the members adjusted their view based on their recognizing whom Jesus was directing to feed his sheep, and so, once these gave the directive, the issue was resolved.
The same cannot be said of the xx thousand denominations that think they are all being directed by Jesus.
 
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David Lamb

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Show me the scripture that says there is a Trinity, you can't find one verse , but if you take scripture as a whole you find the Trinity all over scripture.
The same applies to salvation after the mortal body dies, its all over scripture.
Phil 2:10-11/Rom 14:11/ Isa 45:23 Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. The Greek word for confess is Exomologeo- to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise without reservations.
I understand from the three Greek lexicons to which I have access, that Exomologeo can mean to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise without reservations, but it can also mean simply "confess" as one of the lexicons says:
1) to confess
2) to profess
2a) acknowledge openly and joyfully
2b) to one’s honour: to celebrate, give praise to
2c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage
Either this scripture which God repeated three times is true or it is false, if true most of humanity must come to reconciliation after the mortal body had died.
John 12:32 and I, when I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all men unto me. The Greek word for draw is helko, which means to drag like a fishing net, all men will be drawn to Jesus , again this is post mortem for most of humanity.
2 Cor:19 in Christ God was reconciling the world (cosmos) to himself, not counting peoples trespasses against them, and he has given us the message of reconciliation . This reconciliation will take multiple ages but it will be completed. This only can happen if postmortem repentance is true.
Rom 5:18 Just as the result of one trespass was condemnation of all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness wasa justification that brings life for all men.
1 Pet 3:19 Jesus preached to the dead. why would Jesus preach to the dead if their fate was sealed, that makes no sense
There are others but I think from these you can see why I believe that repentance after the mortal body dies is not only possible but will be the majority.
God dies not save the body all bodies die, unless you are here for the second coming, we are not our body, this is just a temporary vessel that we inhabit for a short time. God saves us, we are spirit and our spirit has no end, that is what is saved not our body. That is why post mortem salvation must be true. Jesus will get 100% of what he paid for, God will not be robbed. .
Yet we have bible verses which tell us that we must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ now. For example:

“For He says: "In an acceptable time I have heard you, And in the day of salvation I have helped you." Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.” (2Co 6:2 NKJV)

Then we have the parable Jesus told about the rich man and Lazarus.

“"So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. "And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. "Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ "But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. ‘And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’” (Lu 16:22-26 NKJV)

Not the slightest hint that the selfish rich man could change after physical death.
 
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Jeff Saunders

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I understand from the three Greek lexicons to which I have access, that Exomologeo can mean to acknowledge, openly and joyfully, to celebrate, to give praise without reservations, but it can also mean simply "confess" as one of the lexicons says:
1) to confess
2) to profess
2a) acknowledge openly and joyfully
2b) to one’s honour: to celebrate, give praise to
2c) to profess that one will do something, to promise, agree, engage

Yet we have bible verses which tell us that we must believe on the Lord Jesus Christ now. For example:

“For He says: "In an acceptable time I have heard you, And in the day of salvation I have helped you." Behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.” (2Co 6:2 NKJV)

Then we have the parable Jesus told about the rich man and Lazarus.

“"So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. "And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. "Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ "But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. ‘And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’” (Lu 16:22-26 NKJV)

Not the slightest hint that the selfish rich man could change after physical death.
Of coarse 2Cor 6:2 says now is the time for salvation, Gods heart is for all to come to salvation, Gods love is infinite the more that come to faith now the fuller the kingdom would be, but because God has given us free will most will not come in, they lose their inheritance. This verse is not saying that that day is the only day, that was 2000 years ago. Jesus will pursue his lost sheep until he finds them, he does not give up, he will get 100% of what he paid for.
As for the parable it is just that a parable not a statement of the afterlife , even if it was , its pre cross, before the cross all the dead went to sheol, but Jesus went to sheol and set the captives free, both sides not just a few.
 
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David Lamb

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Of coarse 2Cor 6:2 says now is the time for salvation, Gods heart is for all to come to salvation, Gods love is infinite the more that come to faith now the fuller the kingdom would be, but because God has given us free will most will not come in, they lose their inheritance. This verse is not saying that that day is the only day, that was 2000 years ago. Jesus will pursue his lost sheep until he finds them, he does not give up, he will get 100% of what he paid for.
As for the parable it is just that a parable not a statement of the afterlife , even if it was , its pre cross, before the cross all the dead went to sheol, but Jesus went to sheol and set the captives free, both sides not just a few.
I wonder why the apostles and other Christians were willing to undergo hardships, torture, and even death in spreading the gospel, if, as you seem to hold, if people don't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ before they die, they'll get a second chance after death? Yet we read of an urgency to spread the gospel.
 
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Jeff Saunders

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I wonder why the apostles and other Christians were willing to undergo hardships, torture, and even death in spreading the gospel, if, as you seem to hold, if people don't believe on the Lord Jesus Christ before they die, they'll get a second chance after death? Yet we read of an urgency to spread the gospel.
This is the way I look at it, the offer we have from the Father is follow Jesus and die to self and live your life for him and his Kingdome and confess Jesus to the cosmos, then when your mortal body dies, Jesus says well done my good and faithful servant, you have confessed me before men and now I will confess you to my Father, enter into my rest, you have gained your inheritance, you will now rule and reign with Jesus as part of the Kingdom you are part of the family with God, one with Jesus.
If one lives for self, in all its forms, when your mortal body dies you are judged as one who did not follow Jesus while in the mortal body and according to Math 25:46 you go into kolasis aionios, which is the pruning off of all that is keeping you from producing fruit, but its only for the age, we are not told how long that will be.
This time for unbelievers is the second death, the body died now you soul must die, remember these people lived for themselves they did not die to self and all that they have made of their life ( their soul ) must die, they did not die to self while in the mortal body so they must die to self, in the Lake of fire, once they have been washed clean and refined, Malachi 3:2 God is like a refiners fire and like a fullers soap, Then as Phil 2:10-11 Every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord,
When that is complete then 1Cor 15:28 God will be all in all and the New Heaven and New Earth will be created. Those losing their inheritance will be subjects of the Kingdom, those who followed Jesus will be one with Jesus and will rule and reign with Him.
This is how I see Gods plan, his heart if for all his children to gain and be part of the inheritance but because he had given us free will to choose, most choose themselves.
Once you have had and experience with the living God and taste and see how good and loving he is, and you give your life to him and try to live out of his love, then you love all of the body of Christ all his creation and you too will want all to come to the knowledge of Jesus and be part of the Kingdom. Gods heart is so full of love for all his creation and when you have experienced that yourself, you can't help but to want all humanity to be part of it, Thats Gods heart, it greaves him to see his children squander their inheritance, Also the more people who follow Jesus now the better our time in this mortal body will be. Just think about what life would be like if all or most people followed Jesus now, no murder, rape, stealing and all the other junk we deal with.
Look at what Jesus did for us, should we not also put up with hardships to have the Fathers heart and be involved in his love for all humanity?
 
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