Are You *Really* Christians?

[Ben Leevey]

In light of this video, how would you answer the question in the title of this post?

 

[linux.poet]

AMBASSADOR HAT​

This thread has been moved from The Junk Drawer to Spiritual Formation and Disciplines.

The Statement of Purpose for The Junk Drawer includes:​

"The Junk Drawer forum is a place for Christian members to discuss and debate those topics that do not really fit in the other Christian Discussion & Debate forums. These topics would include any news item that may not be current, but is still relevant as a topic for debate; or any other topics (within the boundaries of the sitewide rules) that don't have a relevant link to use as a source of reference, or the link may be considered by some to be unreputable. If the topics would clearly fit in the General Politics, Current News & Events, Christian Philosophy & Ethics, Controversial Christian Theology, etc. forums, they would need to be started in their appropriate forums. No topics about the theology of any religion are allowed in this forum. Theological topics must be started in their appropriate forums."

Please note: No topics about the theology of an religion are allowed in this forum.
This is being ignored. This forum is for news and events that are not necessarily current . It is not for theology topics or ethical debates.​

Sorry, this one has got to move.

This was a bit of a tough decision, but the idea of "self-denying Christianity" strikes me as more of a spiritual discipline type topic, and the call to action in the video is an exhortation for believers to be more christlike and separate themselves from the world (Romans 12:2), which is what the spiritual disciplines forum is about. Not to mention the formation-style challenge question in the title. (It's not about debating who is a Christian and who is not, which would be yet another forum section altogether.)

The Spiritual Formation & Disciplines forum is a place for members to discuss spiritual formation the practice of spiritual disciplines (disciplines for the spiritual life), that enable Christians to grow spiritually and be transformed into the image of Christ. The spiritual disciplines are those practices found in Scripture that promote spiritual growth among believers in Jesus Christ, and that engage our mind and heart with God.

Please remember to read the Statements of Purpose for each forum that you intend to post in. Thanks!

(but this is a common mistake that a lot of people have made, the Junk Drawer looks like a true miscellaneous forum when it isn't.)

AMBASSADOR HAT OFF​

 

[ozso]

In light of this video, how would you answer the question in the title of this post?

Amos 6.1 primarily condemns Israel's social inequities, oppression of the poor, and disregard for God's covenant. And warns of imminent judgment and destruction upon Israel due to their sins.

Not sure how that fits into being a Christian.

This was a narration of something Horatius Bonar (1808-1889) wrote.

And this was Horatius Bonar's house. Have to wonder if he practiced what he preached to others.

 

[d taylor]

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A Christian defines as a person who follows Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily make one a born again child of God. That can only happen when a person believes in Jesus for Eternal Life salvation.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

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A Christian defines as a person who follows Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily make one a born again child of God. That can only happen when a person believes in Jesus for Eternal Life salvation.

Your statement is a bit confusing.
You say a Christian is defined by a person who follows Christ but then you say they are not a born again child of God.
I tell you this... anyone who follows Jesus Christ of Nazareth also believes in His Gospel of eternal life.
Blessings

 

[d taylor]

Your statement is a bit confusing.
You say a Christian is defined by a person who follows Christ but then you say they are not a born again child of God.
I tell you this... anyone who follows Jesus Christ of Nazareth also believes in His Gospel of eternal life.
Blessings

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No if you re-read what i said. I said a person may follow Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily mean they are born again. They very well may be born again and be following Christ in their life.

But there are going to be some people who are very obedient in their life to following Christ, but never actually believed in Jesus for Eternal Life.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

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No if you re-read what i said. I said a person may follow Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily mean they are born again. They very well may be born again and be following Christ in their life.

But there are going to be some people who are very obedient in their life to following Christ, but never actually believed in Jesus for Eternal Life.

So for you "born again" means believing in Jesus for eternal life. It may/should/must include following Christ in life.

But simply following Christ without belief is not good enough.

It makes me ask, if one does not believe in Christ for eternal life, why follow?

But I suppose these days we might call then cultural Christians. Cultural Christians are people who identify as Christians but may not have a personal relationship with Christ.

Cultural Christians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Maria Billingsley]

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No if you re-read what i said. I said a person may follow Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily mean they are born again. They very well may be born again and be following Christ in their life.

But there are going to be some people who are very obedient in their life to following Christ, but never actually believed in Jesus for Eternal Life.

Are you speaking of His Holy Spirit who dwells in the believer through regeneration? This is the born again believer. The flesh can not follow Jesus Christ of Nazareth . It is through His Holy Spirit's indwelling that keeps one on the narrow road. Love prevails in one's life through selflessness.

 

[Ben Leevey]

Amos 6.1 primarily condemns Israel's social inequities, oppression of the poor, and disregard for God's covenant. And warns of imminent judgment and destruction upon Israel due to their sins.

Not sure how that fits into being a Christian.

This was a narration of something Horatius Bonar (1808-1889) wrote.

And this was Horatius Bonar's house. Have to wonder if he practiced what he preached to others.

View attachment 359169

AMBASSADOR HAT​

This thread has been moved from The Junk Drawer to Spiritual Formation and Disciplines.

Sorry, this one has got to move.

This was a bit of a tough decision, but the idea of "self-denying Christianity" strikes me as more of a spiritual discipline type topic, and the call to action in the video is an exhortation for believers to be more christlike and separate themselves from the world (Romans 12:2), which is what the spiritual disciplines forum is about. Not to mention the formation-style challenge question in the title. (It's not about debating who is a Christian and who is not, which would be yet another forum section altogether.)

Please remember to read the Statements of Purpose for each forum that you intend to post in. Thanks!

(but this is a common mistake that a lot of people have made, the Junk Drawer looks like a true miscellaneous forum when it isn't.)

AMBASSADOR HAT OFF​

Thank you! Sorry for the mistake.

 

[d taylor]

So for you "born again" means believing in Jesus for eternal life. It may/should/must include following Christ in life.

But simply following Christ without belief is not good enough.

It makes me ask, if one does not believe in Christ for eternal life, why follow?

But I suppose these days we might call then cultural Christians. Cultural Christians are people who identify as Christians but may not have a personal relationship with Christ.

Cultural Christians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

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Show where Jesus is speaking to Nicodemus about being born again that Jesus states to be born again a person must follow Me/.Jesus. In John chapter 3 belief in Jesus is stated many times.

The people who did many wondrous things in Jesus' name. Jesus tells them He never know them.

If a person does not believe in Jesus, then why follow. Because they think this is the way to eternal life.

 

[Ben Leevey]

Amos 6.1 primarily condemns Israel's social inequities, oppression of the poor, and disregard for God's covenant. And warns of imminent judgment and destruction upon Israel due to their sins.

Not sure how that fits into being a Christian.

This was a narration of something Horatius Bonar (1808-1889) wrote.

And this was Horatius Bonar's house. Have to wonder if he practiced what he preached to others.

View attachment 359169

Note: the house was stone, most houses in England where stone. This was not pretentious in that day, but rather the norm.

As far as the size of the house, it had a lot of occupants over the years:

Don't discount the truth, but rather consider seriously your own life.

 

[Ben Leevey]

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A Christian defines as a person who follows Christ in their life, but that does not necessarily make one a born again child of God. That can only happen when a person believes in Jesus for Eternal Life salvation.

So is there such a thing as a saved person who's not a Christian, or visa versa? And if so, could you prove this w/ scripture?

 

[Ben Leevey]

Amos 6.1 primarily condemns Israel's social inequities, oppression of the poor, and disregard for God's covenant. And warns of imminent judgment and destruction upon Israel due to their sins.

Not sure how that fits into being a Christian.

If you take what Bonar said contextually you will see he is not trying to prove what he says with that scripture, but rather putting forth the impactful way that scripture states a truth, to state yet another truth.
If you want it proved, study the gospels, and Acts, and, if your mind is open, you will find the truth unavoidable. This video is not geared to prove, but rather to awaken.

 

[ozso]

If you take what Bonar said contextually you will see he is not trying to prove what he says with that scripture, but rather putting forth the impactful way that scripture states a truth, to state yet another truth.
If you want it proved, study the gospels, and Acts, and, if your mind is open, you will find the truth unavoidable. This video is not geared to prove, but rather to awaken.

That was extremely vague. What truth? Don't be cryptic. Be specific.

 

[Ben Leevey]

That was extremely vague. What truth? Don't be cryptic. Be specific.

I wasn't answering a question, so I did not need to be specific beyond a point. If you have a question I'll gladly answer it!

 

[ozso]

Note: the house was stone, most houses in England where stone. This was not pretentious in that day, but rather the norm.

As far as the size of the house, it had a lot of occupants over the years: View attachment 359186
Don't discount the truth, but rather consider seriously your own life.

Please, it's a gated 3 story castle. How about you? Do you live in a nice house with nice things? Since you're telling me to consider my life, tell me about yours. Oh wait, I just saw you're a teenager. You haven't even gotten started yet.

 

[ozso]

I wasn't answering a question, so I did not need to be specific beyond a point. If you have a question I'll gladly answer it!

What truth are you talking about? Don't be evasive. Don't be cryptic. Be specific.

 

[Ben Leevey]

Please, it's a gated 3 story castle. How about you? Do you live in a nice house with nice things? Since you're telling me to consider my life, tell me about yours. Oh wait, I just saw you're a teenager. You haven't even gotten started yet.

I already explained the house to you. It is not at all presumptuous by British standards. And as far as three stories go, in England (understandably) they build up.

As far as my own house, no. It's not fancy. It functions. No trim around most of the wall, a few cracks in the windows. But it keeps us warm, and makes it so we can function. Now would it be wrong to have trim, and windows that aren't cracked? By no means! But chasing this American dream, spending our lives seeking it, is dead wrong.

Our worldly amusements are also a serious issue that are eating the professed church from the inside out. Holiness, and self denial is becoming all but unknown.

 

[Ben Leevey]

What truth are you talking about? Don't be evasive. Don't be cryptic. Be specific.

The truth that the Church in Bonar's day, and the church, quite clearly from what Bonar said, in our day, is worldly.

Our whole world view is no longer Christ centered. No longer prepared to do anything, including die, for the sake of Christ. I can't help thinking, if the government suddenly started killing people if they didn't switch to believing Islam, that the population would quickly become mostly Muslim here in the USA.

Many people are no longer rooted in Christ, and the "self denial" for Christ "of the New Testament" days seems to have all but disappeared. Mothers pursue careers and leave the children to be taught damning lies by the world. It is akin to child sacrifice, but instead of sacrificing the body, you sacrifice the eternal soul! It is a great tragedy.

The beauties of Christ are drowned by our media. By our wicked music the glorifies things God says He hates, and by our televisions, spewing vile debauchery into our homes non-stop. Personal communion with Christ is almost a completely foreign concept to many.
I'm not speaking of cults. I'm not even speaking of Catholics, some of whom have never heard that the Bible exists. I am speaking of Baptists, Presbyterians, Anglicans, Lutherans, &c.

Does that answer your question?

 

[Aaron112]

So is there such a thing as a saved person who's not a Christian, or visa versa? And if so, could you prove this w/ scripture?

Is anyone in Scripture stated clearly to be a saved person
?