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Mary was a good person and had a sinful nature like all of us.

NotUrAvgGuy

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James states that both faith in Jesus Christ and good works are necessary for salvation.

Jesus first redeemed us on the cross, our faith and baptism first saved us, and our continued good works until we die will make us worthy to enter into heaven to live with God.


Paul states that we are not saved by the works of the Law of Moses.

Galatians 2:16 yet we know that a person is justified not by the works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ. And we have come to believe in Christ Jesus, so that we might be justified by faith in Christ, and not by doing the works of the law, because no one will be justified by the works of the law.



Now about the following verse:

Titus 3:5 he saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy, through the water of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus came to earth to redeem us because God loved us.
Jesus did not come to earth to redeem us because we had earned redemption for ourselves by doing good works.


Adam's disobedience caused mankind's spiritual alienation from God. Only a person who was both God and man could atone for Adam's sin and thereby make possible again our living with God forever. This one mediator, Jesus Christ, was both God and man, and he willingly died a sacrificial death on the cross to repair our spiritual relationship with God, which Adam's sin had severed.
“It is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast.”
(Ephesians 2:8-9)

No qualification is put on "works" in this passage. Note it is by grace we have been saved. Grace means "unmerited favor." God does not save us by grace then say we have to maintain it by works. The verb "saved" is in the perfect tense meaning it is finished, completed. We don't need to maintain it by good works. Good works are the fruit of our salvation but never the basis of it. Yes, we must have good works but they are guaranteed if we are saved as God performs good works through those He saves. Baptism is not required for salvation and does not save us. It is something we do in obedience after we are saved.

We can never be worthy to enter heaven based on our own efforts or good works. God's standard is perfection. It is only by the imputed righteousness of Christ that we can be worthy of heaven.
 
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The ark of the first covenant was holy, so holy that God killed a man for touching it.

2 Samuel 6:6-7 When they came to the threshing floor of Nacon, Uzzah reached out his hand to the ark of God and took hold of it, for the oxen shook it. The anger of the Lord was kindled against Uzzah; and God struck him there because he reached out his hand to the ark; and he died there beside the ark of God.

Mary is the ark of the new covenant. Jesus, the son of God, who is the new covenant, resided within her womb (ark) for nine months.

Two covenants, two arks. Both extremely holy. Both arks were created for a specific holy purpose, never to be used again for any other purpose.
We have two types of arks that preceded Mary. The first was Noah's ark. We call it an "ark" in English but it actually comes from a different Hebrew word than the Ark of the Covenant. In the case of Noah's ark, the Hebrew word teivah is used. That same word is used in one other place and that is to describe the basket that carried the baby Moses on the Nile. Those two arks were used to carry and preserve the life of people.

The word translated "ark" in "Ark of the Covenant" is the Hebrew word aron which means "chest" or a small cupboard in modern Hebrew. It is a type of container. The word aron is also used in two places. It is used in the title Ark of the Covenant and it is also used to describe the coffin in which Joseph's corpse was kept.

The ancient Greek Septuagint text usually calls it the kiboton marturion, which literally means Box [of] Testimony. This is a logical name, because the box was built to hold many pieces of testimony, that is, proofs, or pieces of evidence, of the things that God did for Israel. (Ark of the Covenant = Chest of Proofs, Chest of the Sacred Agreement — 2001 Translation of the Bible)

In the OT, the Ark of the Covenant had two purposes. The contents on the inside were testaments to God's deliverance of the Jews from Egypt. The 10 Commandments, Aaron's rod, mana, etc. Reminders of God's covenant with his people. The second purpose had to do with the lid, which was known as the Mercy Seat. It was designed to fit the description of God's throne in Revelation with two Cherubim's wings outstretched over the seat. It was here, once a year on the Day of Atonement, that the High Priest sprinkled the blood of the sacrifice for making atonement for the nation's sins.

The Ark did not "carry God" or "contain God." It was upon the Mercy Seat that God made special visitation but God is spirit and omnipresent and cannot be contained or limited to one location. The Ark was an important symbol of God's presence but did not carry God. During the Exodus, God created a whirlwind to protect the Israelites by day and a pillar of fire by night. God was present yet God is everywhere. God did not come forth from the Ark.

In what way could Mary be considered a type of ark? First of all, the Ark was specific to Israel. It contained relics related to their deliverance from bondage in Egypt. It was lost long before the time of Christ. The Ark is to reappear during the Tribulation in the new Temple, which again is specific to Jews. Since the Mosaic Covenant was made with Israel, and the Ark was a symbol of that Covenant, it does not follow that the New Covenant must have the same symbol. The New Covenant is made with all men, Jew and Gentile, who would believe. It is not specific to Israel, as was the Mosaic Covenant. There were other OT covenants and none of them had an ark as a symbol. There is no pattern to say all covenants had an ark as a symbol so the New Covenant would not have to have such a symbol.

Yes, Mary "contained" Jesus, who is the means of our deliverance under the New Covenant, but only in a temporary way. The Ark of the Covenant contained its relics the entire time it existed. Mary only "contained" Jesus for 9 months. The Israelites kept the Ark in the Tent of Meeting or the Temple. Mary was never kept anywhere. The Ark of the Covenant was too holy to touch, yet we see no such thing with Mary. No one touched her and then died. What made the Ark holy was not what it contained but the Mercy Seat on top where God's presence would be manifest. It was not the contents which Catholics see Jesus as the "contents" of Mary as a type of ark. It was Jesus' death that issued the New Covenant. Not his birth by Mary.
If Jesus had sibling brothers, he would have asked one of them to take care of his mother instead of asking John.

John 19:26-27

Brothers and sisters meant any close relative in the Aramaic language. Brothers and sisters can also mean an alliance of like-minded people. Acts 2:37
Not necessarily. While that was Jewish tradition, Jesus' brothers were not believers at the time of His death. Mary was a believer, and Jesus would have wanted to leave her in the care of someone who would provide for her spiritual and physical needs. Entrusting her to John would have accomplished both.

While Jesus and the Apostles spoke Aramaic, the NT was written in Greek and inspired by the Holy Spirit. It was inspired in Greek, not Aramaic. It is true that the Greek word used for "brothers" can mean relatives or like-minded people; there is a specific Greek word for cousins that was not used. It is true we cannot prove these were blood brothers and sisters, but in the absence of evidence to the contrary, the natural reading of the text would be that they were. It is also far less likely that Jesus' hometown people would have commented on knowing his cousins. Their point was they knew His family. They watched him grow up and knew His brothers and sisters. To them, He was an ordinary boy from their town and could hardly be the Messiah. Their familiarity with Him (and His family) blinded them to who He really was.
Relatives of Jesus:

Mark 6:3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary and brother of James and Joses and Judas and Simon, and are not his sisters here with us?” And they took offense at him.

Mark 15:40 There were also women looking on from a distance; among them were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joses, and Salome.
 
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Jan001

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“It is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast.”
(Ephesians 2:8-9)

No qualification is put on "works" in this passage. Note it is by grace we have been saved. Grace means "unmerited favor." God does not save us by grace then say we have to maintain it by works. The verb "saved" is in the perfect tense meaning it is finished, completed. We don't need to maintain it by good works.
Please keep the context of Ephesians 2:8-9 intact by including Ephesians 2:10.

Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God— 9 not the result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are what he has made us, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand to be our way of life.

Ephesians 2:10 is a command, not a suggestion. If we do not do these good works that God prepared for us to do, we will not be judged worthy to inherit eternal life. Matthew 25:31-46


Of course, it is grace that saves us. What exactly is this grace?

This grace is the Holy Spirit's continual presence abiding within our souls.
Hebrews 10:29-30

When I die, if Jesus does not see his Spirit abiding within my soul, he will declare that he does not know me or know where I am from and then I will be abiding in hell forever. Luke 13:25-27 (if I do evil and do not repent), Matthew 25:1-13 (if I lack good works at the time of my death)


What will cause the Holy Spirit of Grace to leave my soul and thereby cause me to be unsaved? 1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Ezekiel 33:12-15 And you, mortal, say to your people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not save them when they transgress; and as for the wickedness of the wicked, it shall not make them stumble when they turn from their wickedness; and the righteous shall not be able to live by their righteousness when they sin. 13 Though I say to the righteous that they shall surely live, yet if they trust in their righteousness and commit iniquity, none of their righteous deeds shall be remembered; but in the iniquity that they have committed they shall die
(lose their salvation). 14 Again, though I say to the wicked, “You shall surely die,” yet if they turn from their sin and do what is lawful and right— 15 if the wicked restore the pledge, give back what they have taken by robbery, and walk in the statutes of life, committing no iniquity—they shall surely live, they shall not die.

"Saved" does not mean "completed" or "finished."

Salvation is a lifelong process. It is not a one-time event.

Past tense:


Ephesians 2:8

Present Tense:

1 Corinthians 1:18 For the message about the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

Future Tense:

Acts 15:11 On the contrary, we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will.”

Romans 5:9 Much more surely then, now that we have been justified by his blood, will we be saved through him from the wrath of God.

1 Timothy 2:15 Yet she will be saved through childbearing, provided they continue in faith and love and holiness, with modesty.


We do need to maintain our salvation by our good works. We have been given hope of eternal life, but no guarantee of eternal life. Jesus will judge us by our works as soon as we die. John 5:28-29,1 Corinthians 15:1-2

Titus 3:6-8 This Spirit he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 8 The saying is sure.
I desire that you insist on these things, so that those who have come to believe in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works; these things are excellent and profitable to everyone.



 
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Jan001

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Baptism is not required for salvation and does not save us. It is something we do in obedience after we are saved.

Baptism is required for salvation. It is the baptism commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 which first saves us and makes us Jesus' disciples.

Mark 16:16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved; but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

Of course, the person who does not believe will not consent to be baptized and so he will not be saved!


Ephesians 5:26 in order to make her holy by cleansing her with the washing of water by the word, Acts 2:38

We can never be worthy to enter heaven based on our own efforts or good works. God's standard is perfection. It is only by the imputed righteousness of Christ that we can be worthy of heaven.
I agree that we cannot be worthy to enter heaven based solely on our own efforts or good works.

That is why righteous Lazarus was waiting in a place under the earth with righteous Abraham until Jesus died on the cross so that they could be redeemed from Adam's sin and thereby be made worthy to enter into heaven. Righteousness is not imputed. God sees us exactly as we are. If the Holy Spirit (Grace) is living within us, we are righteous. His abiding presence within our souls is what makes us righteous.

The evil rich man was not a righteous man when he died and so he went to his own place in hell. He failed to help Lazarus when he could have helped him. Perhaps he did other evil things as well.

Many Christians will be surprised after they die. 1 Timothy 5:8
 
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Jan001

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In what way could Mary be considered a type of ark? First of all, the Ark was specific to Israel. It contained relics related to their deliverance from bondage in Egypt. It was lost long before the time of Christ. The Ark is to reappear during the Tribulation in the new Temple, which again is specific to Jews. Since the Mosaic Covenant was made with Israel, and the Ark was a symbol of that Covenant, it does not follow that the New Covenant must have the same symbol. The New Covenant is made with all men, Jew and Gentile, who would believe. It is not specific to Israel, as was the Mosaic Covenant. There were other OT covenants and none of them had an ark as a symbol. There is no pattern to say all covenants had an ark as a symbol so the New Covenant would not have to have such a symbol.

The first covenant (Law of Moses) was in effect until Jesus died on the cross. Mary was under the first covenant until her son died on the cross.

Why would the ark of the now obsolete first covenant be seen in heaven? For what purpose? However, the mother of Jesus, whose womb conceived, sheltered, and nourished the son of God could be seen in heaven at the time that the Book of Revelation was written.

Revelation 11:19-12:1 Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant was seen within his temple; and there were flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake, and heavy hail. 12 A great portent appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. 2 She was pregnant and was crying out in birth pangs, in the agony of giving birth. 3 Then another portent appeared in heaven: a great red dragon, with seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. 4 His tail swept down a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth. Then the dragon stood before the woman who was about to bear a child, so that he might devour her child as soon as it was born. 5 And she gave birth to a son, a male child, who is to rule[a] all the nations with a rod of iron.
Yes, Mary "contained" Jesus, who is the means of our deliverance under the New Covenant, but only in a temporary way. The Ark of the Covenant contained its relics the entire time it existed. Mary only "contained" Jesus for 9 months. The Israelites kept the Ark in the Tent of Meeting or the Temple. Mary was never kept anywhere. The Ark of the Covenant was too holy to touch, yet we see no such thing with Mary. No one touched her and then died. What made the Ark holy was not what it contained but the Mercy Seat on top where God's presence would be manifest. It was not the contents which Catholics see Jesus as the "contents" of Mary as a type of ark. It was Jesus' death that issued the New Covenant. Not his birth by Mary.

Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant! Mary conceived him, sheltered him, and nourished him until it was time for him to be born.

Luke 22:20 And he did the same with the cup after supper, saying, “This cup that is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood. Hebrews 9:15

Not necessarily. While that was Jewish tradition, Jesus' brothers were not believers at the time of His death.
Where in Scripture does it say that Jesus' brothers were not believers in Christianity?

Matthew 13:55 Is not this the carpenter’s son? Is not his mother called Mary? And are not his brothers James and Joseph and Simon and Judas?

These are not siblings. Joseph aka Joses and James the younger were sons of a different Mary who was married to Cleopas aka Clopas.

John 19:25 And that is what the soldiers did. Meanwhile, standing near the cross of Jesus were his mother, and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Magdalene.

James the younger and Joses (aka Joseph) were Jesus' first cousins. Their mother Mary Cleopas was a sister to Mary, the mother of Jesus. Judas was the son of James, the apostle. Luke 6:16 If Simon was Jesus' sibling, he would have been listed first in the list of his "brothers." The apostle named Simon the Zealot was a Cananaean. Matthew 10:1-4

Mark 15:40 There were also women looking on from a distance; among them were Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James the younger and of Joses, and Salome.

How about we agree to disagree? Time to move on to another topic. :)
 
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NotUrAvgGuy

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Please keep the context of Ephesians 2:8-9 intact by including Ephesians 2:10.
Ephesians 2:8-10 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God— 9 not the result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are what he has made us, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand to be our way of life.

Ephesians 2:10 is a command, not a suggestion. If we do not do these good works that God prepared for us to do, we will not be judged worthy to inherit eternal life. Matthew 25:31-46
It is not stated as a command (no imperative voice) but as an expectation. Verse 9 makes it clear that we "have been saved" (past tense) but He who saved us has created us for "good works, which God, prepared beforehand to be in our way of life." Prior to being saved, we cannot do good works. It is only after we are saved, transformed, and given a new nature that we can do good works and even then only because it is God doing the good works through us. He prepared the good works and He does them through us. Good works are the by-product or fruit of our salvation but never the basis of it.

When you combine what Paul teaches and what James teaches, it is this: salvation is by faith alone and not the result of works but salvation transforms us and we then walk in the good works which God has prepared for us beforehand. Good works necessarily follow salvation. If you are truly saved, you will produce fruit (i.e. good works). If you say you are saved, but have no good works, then your claim is shown to be false. It never was true. It's not that you were saved but then failed to follow through with good works and lost that salvation. No, you were never saved! You might have mouthed the right words and fooled people, but God knows the heart and as Jesus said, a good tree does not produce bad fruit. You can call yourself a Christian all you want but if your life shows no change, the you should examine your heart (as Paul teaches) and question if you are really saved. God doesn't save us conditionally upon our continuing to live up to His expectations. He saves us unconditionally then graces us to produce good works. It is all His grace. His grace saves us. His grace preserves us in salvation. His grace enables us to do good works. It is not: faith + works = salvation. It is: faith = salvation. True faith -> good works. We have no part in our salvation except to respond in faith which God gives us the grace to do. That is why in heaven the saints are depicted as taking off their crowns (given for good works) and throwing them back to the feet of Jesus on His throne in recognition that it was He who worked in and through us to produce those good works. All the glory goes to Him and Him alone.

Of course, it is grace that saves us. What exactly is this grace?
This grace is the Holy Spirit's continual presence abiding within our souls.
Hebrews 10:29-30

When I die, if Jesus does not see his Spirit abiding within my soul, he will declare that he does not know me or know where I am from and then I will be abiding in hell forever. Luke 13:25-27 (if I do evil and do not repent), Matthew 25:1-13 (if I lack good works at the time of my death)

What will cause the Holy Spirit of Grace to leave my soul and thereby cause me to be unsaved?
1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Ezekiel 33:12-15 And you, mortal, say to your people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not save them when they transgress; and as for the wickedness of the wicked, it shall not make them stumble when they turn from their wickedness; and the righteous shall not be able to live by their righteousness when they sin. 13 Though I say to the righteous that they shall surely live, yet if they trust in their righteousness and commit iniquity, none of their righteous deeds shall be remembered; but in the iniquity that they have committed they shall die (lose their salvation). 14 Again, though I say to the wicked, “You shall surely die,” yet if they turn from their sin and do what is lawful and right— 15 if the wicked restore the pledge, give back what they have taken by robbery, and walk in the statutes of life, committing no iniquity—they shall surely live, they shall not die.

"Saved" does not mean "completed" or "finished."

Salvation is a lifelong process. It is not a one-time event.
No, there are many verses that use "saved" in the present tense as in "you are saved" (right now!). Salvation is a one-time event. Sanctification is the working out of that salvation throughout the rest of our lives. The people Ezekiel spoke about were the self-righteous. Those who thought themselves righteous apart from God. Notice they are called "wicked." The sons of God are not called "wicked." Yes, we all sin, but the wicked are those who never had faith. They were self-righteous and their "righteous deeds" were not righteous in the eyes of God and their sins were not forgiven so "they shall die." This is not talking about the saved but the damned.

Past tense:

Ephesians 2:8

Present Tense:

1 Corinthians 1:18 For the message about the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

Future Tense:

Acts 15:11 On the contrary, we believe that we will be saved through the grace of the Lord Jesus, just as they will.”

Romans 5:9 Much more surely then, now that we have been justified by his blood, will we be saved through him from the wrath of God.

1 Timothy 2:15 Yet she will be saved through childbearing, provided they continue in faith and love and holiness, with modesty.


We do need to maintain our salvation by our good works. We have been given hope of eternal life, but no guarantee of eternal life. Jesus will judge us by our works as soon as we die. John 5:28-29,1 Corinthians 15:1-2

Titus 3:6-8 This Spirit he poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 8 The saying is sure.
I desire that you insist on these things, so that those who have come to believe in God may be careful to devote themselves to good works; these things are excellent and profitable to everyone.

There is a sense in which the Scriptures speak of salvation in 3 tenses. We were saved in that our names were written in the Book of Life before we even existed. We are saved if we have put our faith and trust in Christ. We are being saved in that the ultimate goal of our salvation (being in God's presence) is yet future. We should devote ourselves to good works but not to maintain our salvation but out of love and obedience to God who will give us the grace to do so.
 
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David Lamb

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Baptism is required for salvation. It is the baptism commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 which first saves us and makes us Jesus' disciples.

Mark 16:16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved; but the one who does not believe will be condemned.
But notice that Mark 16:16 does not say that the one who is not baptized will be condemned. Saying that baptism is required for salvation is putting the cart before the horse. When the Ethiopian asked Philip for baptism, what happened?:

“Then Philip said, "If you believe with all your heart, you may." And he answered and said, "I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."” (Ac 8:37 NKJV)

Belief was required for salvation, and you had to be a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ to be baptized.
 
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Jan001

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When you combine what Paul teaches and what James teaches, it is this: salvation is by faith alone and not the result of works but salvation transforms us and we then walk in the good works which God has prepared for us beforehand. Good works necessarily follow salvation. If you are truly saved, you will produce fruit (i.e. good works). If you say you are saved, but have no good works, then your claim is shown to be false. It never was true. It's not that you were saved but then failed to follow through with good works and lost that salvation. No, you were never saved!
I disagree. Jesus states that some people believe for a while and then they fall away. They believed, but then they lost their salvation. You cannot lose something that you never had.

Luke 8:13 The ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe only for a while and in a time of testing fall away.

Paul states that the Galatians who became circumcised have fallen away from the faith. You can not fall away from grace/salvation if you never had it.

Galatians 5:4 You who want to be justified by the law have cut yourselves off from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.


No, there are many verses that use "saved" in the present tense as in "you are saved" (right now!). Salvation is a one-time event. Sanctification is the working out of that salvation throughout the rest of our lives. The people Ezekiel spoke about were the self-righteous. Those who thought themselves righteous apart from God. Notice they are called "wicked." The sons of God are not called "wicked." Yes, we all sin, but the wicked are those who never had faith. They were self-righteous and their "righteous deeds" were not righteous in the eyes of God and their sins were not forgiven so "they shall die." This is not talking about the saved but the damned.
Salvation is not a one-time event. It is a life-long process. 1 Peter 5:8

You cannot be damned until after you physically die. The wicked are people who do wicked things. The righteous are people who do righteous things. What we do determines whether we are righteous or wicked.

If the righteous do evil, they lose the grace that first saved them. If they do not repent before they physically die, they will be damned. If they repent and make restitution, God will forgive them and they will not be damned after they physically die.
There is a sense in which the Scriptures speak of salvation in 3 tenses. We were saved in that our names were written in the Book of Life before we even existed. We are saved if we have put our faith and trust in Christ. We are being saved in that the ultimate goal of our salvation (being in God's presence) is yet future. We should devote ourselves to good works but not to maintain our salvation but out of love and obedience to God who will give us the grace to do so.

The Book of Life changes according to our works. If our names are in the Book of Life at the time of our death, we will inherit eternal life. So, if our names were still in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world after all God's works were finished, we would inherit eternal life. Hebrews 4:3

Revelation 3:5 If you conquer, you will be clothed like them in white robes, and I will not blot your name out of the book of life; I will confess your name before my Father and before his angels.


If we do not do the good works that the Father has prepared for us to do, we will not be able to enter into heaven. Matthew 25:31-46

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his work, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared in advance that we should do them.

Matthew 12:50 For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven, he is my brother and sister and mother.

Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.

Luke 6:45-55 The good person out of the good treasure of the heart produces good, and the evil person out of evil treasure produces evil; for it is out of the abundance of the heart that the mouth speaks. 46 “Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I tell you? 47 I will show you what someone is like who comes to me, hears my words, and acts on them. 48 That one is like a man building a house, who dug deeply and laid the foundation on rock; when a flood arose, the river burst against that house but could not shake it, because it had been well built. 49 But the one who hears and does not act is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. When the river burst against it, immediately it fell, and great was the ruin of that house.”

James 1:22-27 But be doers of the word, and not merely hearers who deceive themselves. 23 For if any are hearers of the word and not doers, they are like those who look at themselves in a mirror; 24 for they look at themselves and, on going away, immediately forget what they were like. 25 But those who look into the perfect law, the law of liberty, and persevere, being not hearers who forget but doers who act—they will be blessed in their doing. 26 If any think they are religious, and do not bridle their tongues but deceive their hearts, their religion is worthless. 27 Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to care for orphans and widows in their distress, and to keep oneself unstained by the world.


No good works, no heaven.

We do disagree. Time will tell which of us is correct. :)
 
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Jan001

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But notice that Mark 16:16 does not say that the one who is not baptized will be condemned. Saying that baptism is required for salvation is putting the cart before the horse. When the Ethiopian asked Philip for baptism, what happened?:

“Then Philip said, "If you believe with all your heart, you may." And he answered and said, "I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God."” (Ac 8:37 NKJV)

Belief was required for salvation, and you had to be a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ to be baptized.
Salvation requires both faith and baptism.

In Mark 16:16, it is implied that an unbaptized person will not be saved. If a person believes, he will become baptized and thereby be saved. A person who does not believe will not become baptized and so he will not be saved.

Regarding the Ethiopian, as soon as he believed the good news about Jesus, he wanted to be baptized. Philip must have told him that he needed to believe and be baptized in order to be saved.

Acts 8:35-38 Then Philip began to speak, and starting with this scripture, he proclaimed to him the good news about Jesus. 36 As they were going along the road, they came to some water; and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water! What is to prevent me from being baptized?” 38 He commanded the chariot to stop, and both of them, Philip and the eunuch, went down into the water, and Philip baptized him.

Baptism:

1 Corinthians 6:11 And some of you were guilty of these abominations! But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

The baptism with water as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 washes away all our sins. This washing away of our sins through baptism prepares us to be sanctified by the presence of the Holy Spirit within our souls. This happens simultaneously. Ephesians 5:26

Titus 3:5 not because of works of righteousness that we did but according to his mercy, he saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

1 Peter 3:21 And baptism, which this prefigured, now saves you—not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
 
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David Lamb

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Salvation requires both faith and baptism.

In Mark 16:16, it is implied that an unbaptized person will not be saved. If a person believes, he will become baptized and thereby be saved. A person who does not believe will not become baptized and so he will not be saved.

Regarding the Ethiopian, as soon as he believed the good news about Jesus, he wanted to be baptized. Philip must have told him that he needed to believe and be baptized in order to be saved.

Acts 8:35-38 Then Philip began to speak, and starting with this scripture, he proclaimed to him the good news about Jesus. 36 As they were going along the road, they came to some water; and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water! What is to prevent me from being baptized?” 38 He commanded the chariot to stop, and both of them, Philip and the eunuch, went down into the water, and Philip baptized him.

Baptism:

1 Corinthians 6:11 And some of you were guilty of these abominations! But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

The baptism with water as commanded by Jesus in Matthew 28:18-20 washes away all our sins. This washing away of our sins through baptism prepares us to be sanctified by the presence of the Holy Spirit within our souls. This happens simultaneously. Ephesians 5:26

Titus 3:5 not because of works of righteousness that we did but according to his mercy, he saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

1 Peter 3:21 And baptism, which this prefigured, now saves you—not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
I don't agree. When the jailer at Philippi asked what he had to do to be saved, the apostles replied, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved," not "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be baptized and you will be saved." True, once he and his household had believed and were saved people, they were baptized, but that was after believing. The same with the Ethiopian who asked Philip if he could be baptized. Philip said that if he believed with all his heart, he could be baptized.

The verse from 1 Peter 3 looks at first as if it means that being baptized saves us, but does it? Barnes in his commentary writes: "Baptism. Not the mere application of water, for that idea the apostle expressly disclaims, when he says that it involves not "putting away the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God." The sense is, that baptism, including all that is properly meant by baptism as a religious rite — that is, baptism administered in connexion with true repentance, and true faith in the Lord Jesus, and when it is properly a symbol of the putting away of sin, and of the renewing influences of the Holy Spirit, and an act of unreserved dedication to God — now saves us."

However, I'll leave it there because we seem to be straying from the subject of the thread.
 
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NotUrAvgGuy

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I disagree. Jesus states that some people believe for a while and then they fall away. They believed, but then they lost their salvation. You cannot lose something that you never had.
Luke 8:13 The ones on the rock are those who, when they hear the word, receive it with joy. But these have no root; they believe only for a while and in a time of testing fall away.

Paul states that the Galatians who became circumcised have fallen away from the faith. You can not fall away from grace/salvation if you never had it.

Galatians 5:4 You who want to be justified by the law have cut yourselves off from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
In Galatians 5, Paul contrasts being saved by the works of the law with being saved by grace. He teaches that you cannot be justified by the works of the law (or works in general). Salvation is by grace. Note they want to be justified by the law. No one can be justified by keeping the law. By wanting that, they reject grace and thus fall away from it. One could say they were on the doorstep of grace, then turned their backs and fell away from it. These verses do not teach that these people had salvation and then lost it. They heard the gospel and responded favorably but not with sincere faith. Those who are saved will not fall away.

30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified. (Romans 8:30)

First God predestines those to salvation. Then He calls them. Then He justifies them. Then He glorifies them. It does not say at each step that they only go onto the next step if they have good works. They will have good works because it is God who works through them for His glory. He prepared the good works in advance and He gives them the grace to walk in those good works. God does not call and justify and then not glorify.

Salvation is not a one-time event. It is a life-long process. 1 Peter 5:8

You cannot be damned until after you physically die. The wicked are people who do wicked things. The righteous are people who do righteous things. What we do determines whether we are righteous or wicked.

If the righteous do evil, they lose the grace that first saved them. If they do not repent before they physically die, they will be damned. If they repent and make restitution, God will forgive them and they will not be damned after they physically die.
1 Peter 5 addresses sanctification, not salvation. We are to stand firm in our faith and resist Satan. Jesus told Peter that Satan wished to "sift you like wheat." Peter denied the Lord 3 times yet never wavered in his faith. He stumbled but did not fall, or he fell but got back up. Satan wants to rob us of our joy, make us ineffective for the Lord, and load us down with sin. We are to resist that, but Satan cannot rob us of our salvation. Not if we have true saving faith. Those who give lip service to faith but don't honestly believe will show their true colors in time. They were never saved. You can fall away from grace and never be saved. Grace is offered to all men. That doesn't mean all are saved. Salvation is a one-time event. Sanctification is a life-long process.

The Book of Life changes according to our works. If our names are in the Book of Life at the time of our death, we will inherit eternal life. So, if our names were still in the Book of Life before the foundation of the world after all God's works were finished, we would inherit eternal life. Hebrews 4:3
Revelation 3:5 If you conquer, you will be clothed like them in white robes, and I will not blot your name out of the book of life; I will confess your name before my Father and before his angels.
Revelation 3:5 is a promise, not a threat. It does not teach that a believer's name can be blotted out of the Book of Life but rather that God will never blot their names out. Those who don't believe never had their names written in the Book of Life. The word "if" is not found in the Greek. A more literal translation would be, "The one overcoming will be clothed like them..." Naturally, all who are saved will overcome. That is a statement of fact, not a condition. The entire verse is a statement of fact and promise. Believers will overcome, and their names will not be blotted out of the Book of Life.

Hebrews 4:3 says nothing about losing salvation or the Book of Life.

If we do not do the good works that the Father has prepared for us to do, we will not be able to enter into heaven.
Matthew 25:31-46

Ephesians 2:10 For we are his work, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared in advance that we should do them.

Matthew 12:50 For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven, he is my brother and sister and mother.

Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father in heaven.

Luke 6:45-55 The good person out of the good treasure of the heart produces good, and the evil person out of evil treasure produces evil; for it is out of the abundance of the heart that the mouth speaks. 46 “Why do you call me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I tell you? 47 I will show you what someone is like who comes to me, hears my words, and acts on them. 48 That one is like a man building a house, who dug deeply and laid the foundation on rock; when a flood arose, the river burst against that house but could not shake it, because it had been well built. 49 But the one who hears and does not act is like a man who built a house on the ground without a foundation. When the river burst against it, immediately it fell, and great was the ruin of that house.”

James 1:22-27 But be doers of the word, and not merely hearers who deceive themselves. 23 For if any are hearers of the word and not doers, they are like those who look at themselves in a mirror; 24 for they look at themselves and, on going away, immediately forget what they were like. 25 But those who look into the perfect law, the law of liberty, and persevere, being not hearers who forget but doers who act—they will be blessed in their doing. 26 If any think they are religious, and do not bridle their tongues but deceive their hearts, their religion is worthless. 27 Religion that is pure and undefiled before God, the Father, is this: to care for orphans and widows in their distress, and to keep oneself unstained by the world.

No good works, no heaven.

We do disagree. Time will tell which of us is correct. :)
This is where the Catholic understanding of salvation and the Protestant (and I believe Biblical) view differ. Catholicism teaches that grace is infused into the soul at baptism and baptized individual is instantly saved. They must maintain that grace through the Sacraments and avoiding a mortal sin. If they commit a mortal sin, they must repent and confess through the Sacrament of Penance. Good works are necessary in maintaining salvation.

Protestants (and the Bible, I believe) believe that when a person truly believes in their heart, the righteousness of Christ is imputed to them (imputed, not infused). They now stand judicially righteous and blameless before God but only by grace and Christ's death on the cross to forgive their sins and His righteousness imputed to them. Then begins the life-long process of sanctification, during which we walk in the good works God has prepared beforehand for us, but by His grace. He prepared those good works for us to do, and He gave us a new nature that we can now willingly obey. Not perfectly, as we still have the remnants of our sinful nature, but we will progress in sanctification by doing good works. That we will do them is not in question. We have been changed. The old man has died, and the new man lives. Just as before salvation, we could not do a single good work, after salvation, we cannot help but do good works as it is God doing them through us.

Works are the fruit, or evidence, or salvation. No one can see the heart except God. We can fool men with our words and act the part of a Christian. This is why the church is full of wheat and tares. The tares look indistinguishable from the wheat but God can see the difference. Wheat is good to eat. Tares are weeds. Those who are wheat will produce good works. Those who are tares will not. To our own eyes (for we can deceive ourselves) and to the world it is what we do and don't do that gives evidence to our state of salvation. That is why Paul admonishes us to question our salvation if we have no good works. He doesn't say to start doing good works. He says to question whether or not we are saved! If we are saved then we will have good works but if we have deceived ourselves and have no good works then we need to re-examine our faith. Some people might think that because they were baptized or responded to an altar call they are saved. Some think just being born in a Christian family and going to church makes them saved. Such people never responded in faith. The easiest way for them to test themselves is to look at their lives and see if they show evidence of salvation.

All those verses about having to have good works are true, but they will always be true of anyone who is saved. You have to understand the process. First comes faith, which leads to salvation. Then comes sanctification, which leads to good works. Sanctification follows salvation as night follows day. James's warnings are to those who are self-deceived and think they are saved but show no evidence of it. He is not teaching that works save us. Otherwise, you have Paul teaching salvation by faith alone, and James teaching it by works. God does not contradict Himself.

It is like saying you have to have a high school diploma to have graduated from high school verses you have to meet the requirements of graduation. If you meet the requirements, you will get a diploma. The diploma always follows. Both are true but it is meeting the requirements that leads to having the diploma. Salvation leads to good works. The good works don't save us but are outcome of salvation and since it is God who does them through us, we will have them.
 
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Jan001

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I don't agree. When the jailer at Philippi asked what he had to do to be saved, the apostles replied, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved," not "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be baptized and you will be saved." True, once he and his household had believed and were saved people, they were baptized, but that was after believing. The same with the Ethiopian who asked Philip if he could be baptized. Philip said that if he believed with all his heart, he could be baptized.

The verse from 1 Peter 3 looks at first as if it means that being baptized saves us, but does it? Barnes in his commentary writes: "Baptism. Not the mere application of water, for that idea the apostle expressly disclaims, when he says that it involves not "putting away the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God." The sense is, that baptism, including all that is properly meant by baptism as a religious rite — that is, baptism administered in connexion with true repentance, and true faith in the Lord Jesus, and when it is properly a symbol of the putting away of sin, and of the renewing influences of the Holy Spirit, and an act of unreserved dedication to God — now saves us."

However, I'll leave it there because we seem to be straying from the subject of the thread.
The water of baptism is not meant to cleanse the dirt from a person's physical body. The water of baptism as commanded by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-20 literally cleanses the person's spiritual soul from all the sins on it at the time of his baptism, both Adam's sin and his own sins. This cleansing of the soul makes him righteous before God because the Holy Spirit now dwells within this clean soul. The presence of the Holy Spirit within the soul gives him a good conscience before God. This baptism is what first makes him Jesus' disciple.

There is no forgiveness for sins without first repenting for these sins. We must repent first and then be baptized in order to receive forgiveness for our sins, and it is this baptism commanded by Jesus Christ which makes us fit temples for the Holy Spirit to dwell in.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
 
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Valletta

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It is like saying you have to have a high school diploma to have graduated from high school verses you have to meet the requirements of graduation. If you meet the requirements, you will get a diploma. The diploma always follows. Both are true but it is meeting the requirements that leads to having the diploma. Salvation leads to good works. The good works don't save us but are outcome of salvation and since it is God who does them through us, we will have them.
Catholics believe that salvation is totally a gift from God, that there is nothing that we can do, no number of good works, to "earn" salvation.

1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation.59 He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them.60 Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament.61 The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit." God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.

John 3:5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. RSVCE
 
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In Galatians 5, Paul contrasts being saved by the works of the law with being saved by grace. He teaches that you cannot be justified by the works of the law (or works in general). Salvation is by grace. Note they want to be justified by the law. No one can be justified by keeping the law. By wanting that, they reject grace and thus fall away from it. One could say they were on the doorstep of grace, then turned their backs and fell away from it. These verses do not teach that these people had salvation and then lost it. They heard the gospel and responded favorably but not with sincere faith. Those who are saved will not fall away.

You cannot fall away from grace if you never had grace. You have not yet received grace if you are merely on the doorstep to grace.

It is grace that saves/sanctifies us.

How do we obtain this grace and thereby become Jesus' disciples? We first repent of our sins and then we are baptized according to the command given by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-20.

Mark 16:16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


It is Jesus' Holy Spirit's presence (grace) within the soul which sanctifies/saves the soul.

When a person commits a mortal sin (1 John 5:16-17, 1 Corinthians 6:8-10), he grievously insults the Holy Spirit of grace and the Holy Spirit departs from this person's soul. The Holy Spirit cannot live in a temple/soul that has been destroyed/defiled by mortal sin.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you? 17 If any one destroys God’s temple, God will destroy him. For God’s temple is holy, and that temple you are.

When the Holy Spirit of grace no longer abides in a person's soul, he is no longer saved.

Consequences of a Christian's unrepented mortal sin:

Hebrews 10:28-30 A man who has violated the law of Moses dies without mercy at the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment do you think will be deserved by the man who has spurned the Son of God, and profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and outraged the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.”

A Christian who commits a mortal sin is no longer saved. If he does not repent before death, he will receive God's vengeance in hell instead of the eternal with God that he was expecting to receive.
 
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30 and these whom He predestined, He also called; and these whom He called, He also justified; and these whom He justified, He also glorified. (Romans 8:30)

First God predestines those to salvation. Then He calls them. Then He justifies them. Then He glorifies them. It does not say at each step that they only go onto the next step if they have good works. They will have good works because it is God who works through them for His glory. He prepared the good works in advance and He gives them the grace to walk in those good works. God does not call and justify and then not glorify.

God did not first predestine people to eternal life. God did not arbitrarily predestine some people to eternal life and arbitrarily condemn others to perdition.

First, before he created the world, God, by his omniscience, foreknew all the people who had remained faithful to God's commandments until they died. These foreknown faithful-until-death people are the only people God predestined. Acts 2:23, Romans 8:29, Revelation 2:10

Hebrews 4:3 For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said, “As I swore in my wrath, ‘They shall never enter my rest,’” although his works were finished from the foundation of the world.

1 Peter 1:18-20 You know that you were ransomed from the futile ways inherited from your fathers, not with perishable things such as silver or gold, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, like that of a lamb without blemish or spot. 20 He was destined before the foundation of the world but was made manifest at the end of the times for your sake.


God desires all people to be saved, so he calls all people to be saved. 1 Timothy 2:4

Not everyone answers God's call.


Some people are like the seeds which fall on the path. They hear God calling, but they are distracted by Satan and so they never become Christians.

Called, but never baptized (justified) and never saved:
Mark 4:13-20 The sower sows the word. 15 And these are the ones along the path, where the word is sown; when they hear, Satan immediately comes and takes away the word which is sown in them.

Called, believed, and are baptized/justified, but fall away from grace later on and do not repent before they die:
16 And these in like manner are the ones sown upon rocky ground, who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with joy; 17 and they have no root in themselves, but endure for a while; then, when tribulation or persecution arises on account of the word, immediately they fall away.

Called, justified (baptized), but lacking good works:
18 And others are the ones sown among thorns; they are those who hear the word, 19 but the cares of the world, and the delight in riches, and the desire for other things, enter in and choke the word, and it proves unfruitful.


Called, justified, and glorified:
20 But those that were sown upon the good soil are the ones who hear the word and accept it and bear fruit, thirtyfold and sixtyfold and a hundredfold.

It is this last group only that God predestined, called, justified, and glorified before the foundation of the world.

Romans 8:30 And those whom he predestined he also called; and those whom he called he also justified; and those whom he justified he also glorified.
 
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NotUrAvgGuy

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Catholics believe that salvation is totally a gift from God, that there is nothing that we can do, no number of good works, to "earn" salvation.

1257 The Lord himself affirms that Baptism is necessary for salvation.59 He also commands his disciples to proclaim the Gospel to all nations and to baptize them.60 Baptism is necessary for salvation for those to whom the Gospel has been proclaimed and who have had the possibility of asking for this sacrament.61 The Church does not know of any means other than Baptism that assures entry into eternal beatitude; this is why she takes care not to neglect the mission she has received from the Lord to see that all who can be baptized are "reborn of water and the Spirit." God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments.

John 3:5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. RSVCE
This passage says nothing about baptism. Jesus is telling Nicodemas that to enter the kingdom of God, one must be "born from above", i.e. have a spiritual birth. This was in contrast to the prevelant Jewish thinking that one could enter the kingdom of God by keeping the law. Jesus is saying that salvation comes "from above" and is not a product of any work or act of man. Paul teaches the same thing in Ephesians 2:8-9 when he says that salvation is by faith, not by works. If Jesus has meant baptism, He could have said you have to be baptized and born of the Spirit but He doesn't. In the Greek, "born of water" and "born of the spirit" are grammatically tied as though one act. When we exercise saving faith, we are washed of our sins and born of the spirit. Baptism follows as an act of obedience but we have already been washed of our sins when we exercised saving faith.

If baptism were required for salvation, then we could have a contradiction in Scripture with what Paul teaches in Ephesians.
 
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You cannot fall away from grace if you never had grace. You have not yet received grace if you are merely on the doorstep to grace.

It is grace that saves/sanctifies us.

How do we obtain this grace and thereby become Jesus' disciples? We first repent of our sins and then we are baptized according to the command given by Jesus Christ in Matthew 28:18-20.

Mark 16:16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned.

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.


It is Jesus' Holy Spirit's presence (grace) within the soul which sanctifies/saves the soul.

When a person commits a mortal sin (1 John 5:16-17, 1 Corinthians 6:8-10), he grievously insults the Holy Spirit of grace and the Holy Spirit departs from this person's soul. The Holy Spirit cannot live in a temple/soul that has been destroyed/defiled by mortal sin.

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 Do you not know that you are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit dwells in you? 17 If any one destroys God’s temple, God will destroy him. For God’s temple is holy, and that temple you are.

When the Holy Spirit of grace no longer abides in a person's soul, he is no longer saved.

Consequences of a Christian's unrepented mortal sin:

Hebrews 10:28-30 A man who has violated the law of Moses dies without mercy at the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much worse punishment do you think will be deserved by the man who has spurned the Son of God, and profaned the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and outraged the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him who said, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge his people.”

A Christian who commits a mortal sin is no longer saved. If he does not repent before death, he will receive God's vengeance in hell instead of the eternal with God that he was expecting to receive.
The Catholic Bible uses the word "mortal sin" where every other translations says "a sin leading to death." The only sin that leads to death is the sin of unbelief. No where does the Bible give is a list of "mortal sins." All sins can be forgiven except the sin of unbelief. A believer has already had his sins forgiven. Past, present, and future. Because He is now a child of God, he cannot exercise unbelief. It was God who gave Him faith to begin with and God does not take away that which He has given.
 
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Jan001

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The Catholic Bible uses the word "mortal sin" where every other translations says "a sin leading to death." The only sin that leads to death is the sin of unbelief. No where does the Bible give is a list of "mortal sins." All sins can be forgiven except the sin of unbelief. A believer has already had his sins forgiven. Past, present, and future. Because He is now a child of God, he cannot exercise unbelief. It was God who gave Him faith to begin with and God does not take away that which He has given.
A "sin leading to death," aka mortal sin, causes the person to fall from grace. Unless he repents before death, he will not inherit eternal life.
A "sin not leading to death," aka venial sin, does not cause a person to fall from grace.

Baptism removes Adam's sin and all of the sins on a person's soul at the time of his baptism. It does not forgive any of the sins a person commits after his baptism.

1 John 5:17 All wrongdoing is sinful, but not all sins are deadly.

1 John 1:8-10
If we claim that we are sinless,
we are only deceiving ourselves,
and the truth is not in us.
9 However, if we confess our sins,

he who is faithful and just
will forgive our sins

and cleanse us from all wrongdoing.
10 If we say that we have never sinned,
we make him out to be a liar,
and his word is not in us.


1 John 3:6 Whoever remains in him does not sin, and whoever sins has not seen him nor known him.

If you desire to remain in him, to continue to be saved, you must make the choice to not commit deadly sins.

Deadly, aka mortal sins:


1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9 Are you not aware that wrongdoers will never inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! Fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, sodomites,[a] 10 thieves, extortioners, drunkards, slanderers, swindlers—none of these will inherit the kingdom of God.



Disobedience is unbelief.
If you believe in God, you will obey his commandments. Luke 11:28, John 9:31, Acts 5:32, 2 Thessalonians 1:8, Hebrews 5:9, 1 John 2:3, 1 John 5:2


1 John 3:8 Everyone who sins comes from the devil, for the devil has been a sinner from the very beginning. The Son of God appeared for this very purpose: to destroy the work of the devil.

1 John 3:8-10
Everyone who sins comes from the devil,
for the devil has been a sinner
from the very beginning.
The Son of God appeared for this very purpose:
to destroy the work of the devil.
9 Whoever is born of God
does not sin,
because his seed[a] remains in him.
He cannot sin
because he is begotten by God.
10 This is what distinguishes
the children of God from the children of the devil:
anyone who fails to live righteously
does not belong to God;

neither does anyone who fails to love a brother.
 
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David Lamb

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The Catholic Bible uses the word "mortal sin" where every other translations says "a sin leading to death." The only sin that leads to death is the sin of unbelief. No where does the Bible give is a list of "mortal sins." All sins can be forgiven except the sin of unbelief. A believer has already had his sins forgiven. Past, present, and future. Because He is now a child of God, he cannot exercise unbelief. It was God who gave Him faith to begin with and God does not take away that which He has given.
Let me say that I don't believe in a distinction between "mortal" and "venial" sins. But I don't agree that the only sin that leads to death is unbelief. Romans 6:24 says:

“For the wages of sin [is] death, but the gift of God [is] eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Ro 6:23 NKJV)

It doesn't specify "the wages of the sin of unbelief."
 
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