The human ear. Product of Intelligent Design or mindless evolution?

[BCP1928]

Yes, they exchange, by design. What they cannot do is plan the future through such exchange. That takes... a mind - not an "appearance" of a mind.

Yes that is correct. Biological evolution did not set out to make an ear. Biological evolution has no long term goals like that.

 

[BCP1928]

Yes, they exchange, by design. What they cannot do is plan the future through such exchange. That takes... a mind - not an "appearance" of a mind.

For that matter, they would not survive to exchange or grow at all in any direction unless they were supported by nutrients supplied by blood supplied by a beating heart supplied by - every breath given by the breath of God - using oxygen supplied by an even greater creation which exists on the most improbable and delicate threads of existence.

Ah... sometimes it's good to look up from the microscope and appreciate that ALL creation is incredibly interconnected and co-dependent. One would think it would all humble a guy, but for some, alas...

It certainly hasn't humbled you.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Interesting that the account of the Creation should not be considered in a discussion about Creation - but whatever.

You haven't offered *anything* related to the topic at hand. Does your scripture describe the parts of the ears of mammals or say how they were created? If so, feel free to quote it.

 

[Zaha Torte]

You haven't offered *anything* related to the topic at hand. Does your scripture describe the parts of the ears of mammals or say how they were created? If so, feel free to quote it.

If it did - would that make it scientific?

 

[Hans Blaster]

If it did - would that make it scientific?

No, but it would be on topic.

 

[BCP1928]

If it did - would that make it scientific?

That would depend on how the evidence which formed the basis of the description was gathered and evaluated..

 

[Gene2memE]

What evidence?

2016 review of the basics of hearing and its evolution:

Comparative Auditory Neuroscience: Understanding the Evolution and Function of Ears

2023 overview of evidence for the evolutionary development of hearing organs in early sarcopterygians and subsequent tetrapod species:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2667242123000246

 

[David Lamb]

You haven't offered *anything* related to the topic at hand. Does your scripture describe the parts of the ears of mammals or say how they were created? If so, feel free to quote it.

I'm not sure what sort of reply you expect to a question like that. Beyond saying that God said, "Let there be....." followed by a phrase with the meaning, "and it happened", the bible does not say how God went about creating, and certainly doesn't list things such as, "He made mammals' ears like this, and human eyes like that."

 

[BCP1928]

I'm not sure what sort of reply you expect to a question like that. Beyond saying that God said, "Let there be....." followed by a phrase with the meaning, "and it happened", the bible does not say how God went about creating, and certainly doesn't list things such as, "He made mammals' ears like this, and human eyes like that."

Evidently He left it to us to find out through science.

 

[David Lamb]

Evidently He left it to us to find out through science.

Except when that science disagrees with what the bible says.

 

[BCP1928]

Except when that science disagrees with what the bible says.

Who gets to decide what the Bible says?

 

[David Lamb]

Who gets to decide what the Bible says?

I know there are some bible passages which different Christians understand in various ways. I'm thinking more about things which the bible is clear about, such as the fact that God created all things. For example, here in the UK there is a well-known scientist called Richard Dawkins. He said or wrote things such as "What has 'theology' ever said that is of the smallest use to anybody? When has 'theology' ever said anything that is demonstrably true and is not obvious? What makes you think that 'theology' is a subject at all?" He wrote a book called "The God Delusion".

 

[BCP1928]

I know there are some bible passages which different Christians understand in various ways. I'm thinking more about things which the bible is clear about, such as the fact that God created all things. For example, here in the UK there is a well-known scientist called Richard Dawkins. He said or wrote things such as "What has 'theology' ever said that is of the smallest use to anybody? When has 'theology' ever said anything that is demonstrably true and is not obvious? What makes you think that 'theology' is a subject at all?" He wrote a book called "The God Delusion".

He is certainly well known by the people you will meet in this forum--most of us will have read one or more of his works. They are testimony to the fact that it is possible to accept the theory of evolution and still remain an atheist. But the existence of God is not at issue in this forum. Some of us believe in God, some do not, and there are believers on both sides of the evolution/creation debate.

 

[Astrid]

I'm not sure what sort of reply you expect to a question like that. Beyond saying that God said, "Let there be....." followed by a phrase with the meaning, "and it happened", the bible does not say how God went about creating, and certainly doesn't list things such as, "He made mammals' ears like this, and human eyes like that."

Bible don’t teach calculus either.

IF God gave people brains, he must have expected people to USE them.

Like, figure things out!,

 

[Astrid]

Except when that science disagrees with what the bible says.

So there really was a flood despite ten thousand ways to disprove it?

 

[Hans Blaster]

I know there are some bible passages which different Christians understand in various ways. I'm thinking more about things which the bible is clear about, such as the fact that God created all things. For example, here in the UK there is a well-known scientist called Richard Dawkins. He said or wrote things such as "What has 'theology' ever said that is of the smallest use to anybody? When has 'theology' ever said anything that is demonstrably true and is not obvious? What makes you think that 'theology' is a subject at all?" He wrote a book called "The God Delusion".

Dawkins is not wrong about the usefulness of 'theology' and now we have another off-topic distraction. Sigh.

 

[BCP1928]

Dawkins is not wrong about the usefulness of 'theology' and now we have another off-topic distraction. Sigh.

I think William F. Buckley's definition of metaphysics would apply to theology: "Tedious discourses about the inherently unknowable."
But the main topic of this board often seems to be disabusing biblical creationists of the inane notions they have about what the theory of evolution actually is and what it actually claims. Unfortunately, one of those inane notions is that the theory of evolution was intentionally created to disprove the existence of God, and so we are back to discussing theology. And yes, I am aware that I am often guilty of participating in such diversions, for which I beg your forgiveness.

 

[AV1611VET]

So there really was a flood despite ten thousand ways to disprove it?

Yes.

 

[Joseph G]

All this obsfucation away from the fact that none have yet to adequately challenge the OP. Seems unrelated, but I think this Scripture is spot on. Folks' problem is not with God's weak vessels - but with God Himself. What should be obvious to the "scientific mind", as with the "philosophical" and every other discipline, is not - and again - there is a reason.

"Humble thyself in the sight of the Lord, and He shall lift you up!"

Join the weak and foolish, friends, and His awe will bring you daily joy!

1 Corinthians 1:18-25 NIV

18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise;
the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate.”
20 Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than human wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than human strength."

biblegateway.com

 

[AV1611VET]

But the main topic of this board often seems to be disabusing biblical creationists of the inane notions they have about what the theory of evolution actually is and what it actually claims.

If I go back to college and end up flunking Evolution 101, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

Would you lose any sleep over flunking Macrame 101?

Not knowing anything about evolution isn't going to make my anchovy pizza taste any worse.