Catholics, evangelicals explore common ground rooted in shared ‘love of Jesus Christ’

[Michie]

CINCINNATI (OSV News) — A group of Catholics and evangelicals has released a one-page document that identifies areas of common ground among the two largest Christian groups in the world.

“The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition”is “the fruit of a new ecumenical dialogue,” according to a news release from Glenmary Home Missioners in Cincinnati on the document.

Document highlights shared faith in Jesus Christ​

“At the most basic level, Catholics and evangelicals share a love of Jesus Christ,” said Alexei Laushkin, founder of Kingdom Mission Society, an evangelical organization that helped spearhead the effort.

Catholic efforts were led by Nathan Smith, ecumenical director for Glenmary Home Missioners, a Catholic society of priests, brothers and laypeople who work in evangelical-dominant areas of Appalachia and the South.

Smith and Laushkin have established a website, to disseminate the document and to gather signatures of support not only from evangelical and Catholic institutions, but also from everyday Christians from those traditions, they said.

Continued below.

Catholics, evangelicals explore common ground rooted in shared 'love of Jesus Christ'

"The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition" is "the fruit of a new ecumenical dialogue," according to a news release from Glenmary Home Missioners in Cincinnati on the document.

www.oursundayvisitor.com

 

[chevyontheriver]

CINCINNATI (OSV News) — A group of Catholics and evangelicals has released a one-page document that identifies areas of common ground among the two largest Christian groups in the world.

“The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition”is “the fruit of a new ecumenical dialogue,” according to a news release from Glenmary Home Missioners in Cincinnati on the document.

Document highlights shared faith in Jesus Christ​

“At the most basic level, Catholics and evangelicals share a love of Jesus Christ,” said Alexei Laushkin, founder of Kingdom Mission Society, an evangelical organization that helped spearhead the effort.

Catholic efforts were led by Nathan Smith, ecumenical director for Glenmary Home Missioners, a Catholic society of priests, brothers and laypeople who work in evangelical-dominant areas of Appalachia and the South.

Smith and Laushkin have established a website, to disseminate the document and to gather signatures of support not only from evangelical and Catholic institutions, but also from everyday Christians from those traditions, they said.

Continued below.

Catholics, evangelicals explore common ground rooted in shared 'love of Jesus Christ'

"The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition" is "the fruit of a new ecumenical dialogue," according to a news release from Glenmary Home Missioners in Cincinnati on the document.

www.oursundayvisitor.com

This is good news. To what extent does this have traction among evangelicals?

We Catholics and Evangelicals recognize one another as brothers and sisters in Christ who have received the same baptism and call,
as belonging to one and the same Christian family, and as sharing the same faith, hope, and love (1 Thess. 1:3).

Is this true for most or all Evangelicals? It reads OK to this Catholic but I have to ask how many Evangelicals it reads true for. I have never heard of any of the Evangelical signers before. To what extent do they speak for all Evangelicals?

 

[RileyG]

This is good news. To what extent does this have traction among evangelicals?

Is this true for most or all Evangelicals? It reads OK to this Catholic but I have to ask how many Evangelicals it reads true for. I have never heard of any of the Evangelical signers before. To what extent do they speak for all Evangelicals?

I really don't know.

I mean, many Evangelicals don't consider us Christians and consider the RCC the Harlot mentioned in Revelation 17. Of course, they are sadly mistaken.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I really don't know.

I mean, many Evangelicals don't consider us Christians and consider the RCC the Harlot mentioned in Revelation 17. Of course, they are sadly mistaken.

Well, maybe they are all over that now. Or maybe only a few are. I wish I knew.

 

[RileyG]

Well, maybe they are all over that now. Or maybe only a few are. I wish I knew.

Some are definitely anti-Catholic. I can't say all, though.

 

[Michie]

This is good news. To what extent does this have traction among evangelicals?

Is this true for most or all Evangelicals? It reads OK to this Catholic but I have to ask how many Evangelicals it reads true for. I have never heard of any of the Evangelical signers before. To what extent do they speak for all Evangelicals?

This might give a bit more info:

History​

The Gift of Being Christian Together is the fruit of a collaborative project between Kingdom Mission Society (Evangelical)
and Glenmary Home Missioners (Catholic).

Both organizations seek to foster a deepening of unity between Christians and together noticed the need for further clarity on how Catholics and Evangelicals may recognize one another as sharing in the name of Christian.

Over multiple years, representatives from both organizations met to discuss this topic with theologians from the Catholic Church and the Evangelical community, which included Methodists, Reformed, Wesleyans, Anglicans and those in the Free Church tradition.

Significant time was given to prayer for the project as well as to a deepening of unity between Christians even in the midst of our differences and current separation.

Following this process we are pleased to jointly produce The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition.

We are grateful to the many theologians who contributed to this work:

Dr. Jonathan Ciraulo, Ph.D.
Dr. Miranda Cruz, Ph.D.
Dr. Dawn Eden Goldstein, JCL, STD
Rev. Dr. Craig R. Higgins, DMin
Mr. Ben Homan
Rev. Walter Kedjierski, Ph.D.
Dr. Alan Mostrom, Ph.D.
Dr. Howard A. Snyder, Ph.D.
Rev. Ignatius John Schweitzer, O.P., S.T.L

The Gift of Being Christian Together

thegiftofbeingchristiantogether.org

 

[chevyontheriver]

This might give a bit more info:

History​

The Gift of Being Christian Together is the fruit of a collaborative project between Kingdom Mission Society (Evangelical)
and Glenmary Home Missioners (Catholic).

Both organizations seek to foster a deepening of unity between Christians and together noticed the need for further clarity on how Catholics and Evangelicals may recognize one another as sharing in the name of Christian.

Over multiple years, representatives from both organizations met to discuss this topic with theologians from the Catholic Church and the Evangelical community, which included Methodists, Reformed, Wesleyans, Anglicans and those in the Free Church tradition.

Significant time was given to prayer for the project as well as to a deepening of unity between Christians even in the midst of our differences and current separation.

Following this process we are pleased to jointly produce The Gift of Being Christian Together: An Ecumenical Statement of Fidelity and Recognition.

We are grateful to the many theologians who contributed to this work:

Dr. Jonathan Ciraulo, Ph.D.
Dr. Miranda Cruz, Ph.D.
Dr. Dawn Eden Goldstein, JCL, STD
Rev. Dr. Craig R. Higgins, DMin
Mr. Ben Homan
Rev. Walter Kedjierski, Ph.D.
Dr. Alan Mostrom, Ph.D.
Dr. Howard A. Snyder, Ph.D.
Rev. Ignatius John Schweitzer, O.P., S.T.L

The Gift of Being Christian Together

thegiftofbeingchristiantogether.org

OK. Maybe it's a baby step in the right direction.

 

[chevyontheriver]

chevyontheriver and RileyG,​

The word "evangelical" has different meanings. In the past, I remember that the term "Neo-evangelical" was used for some to distinguish some evangelicals from others. The difference concerns eccumenticalism and views of Rome and Protestant liberalism. Neo-evangelicalism is more of a historic term not used any more. Names like Billy Graham, Harold Ockenga, CFH Henry, and Bernard Ramm, take a different position that many other evangelicals. The other more conservative group would be people related to the "Chicago statement on Biblical Innerrancy" (Oddly also signed by Harold Ockenga).

From a Roman Catholic perspective (specifically, the Anathema's of the Council of Trent) the more conservative group would be heretical. That would be the view that I would take. As an illustration of our herecy (the more conservative group) you need merely look at statements within our doctrinal statements on the doctrine of justification. Many here, including me, would adhere strictly to the concept sola fide (salvation is by faith alone). If you look in the 6th session of the Council of Trent, and scroll down to the cannons, you can see anathema's pronounced upon conservative evangelicals and reformed people. Please see General Council of Trent: Sixth Session - Papal Encyclicals

Below are a few of the cannons anathematizing evangelicals:
CANON V.-If any one saith, that, since Adam’s sin, the free will of man is lost and extinguished; or, that it is a thing with only a name, yea a name without a reality, a figment, in fine, introduced into the Church by Satan; let him be anathema.

CANON VII.-If any one saith, that all works done before Justification, in whatsoever way they be done, are truly sins, or merit the hatred of God; or that the more earnestly one strives to dispose himself for grace, the more grievously he sins: let him be anathema.

CANON XI.-If any one saith, that men are justified, either by the sole imputation of the justice of Christ, or by the sole remission of sins, to the exclusion of the grace and the charity which is poured forth in their hearts by the Holy Ghost, and is inherent in them; or even that the grace, whereby we are justified, is only the favour of God; let him be anathema.

CANON XXIV.-If any one saith, that the justice received is not preserved and also increased before God through good works; but that the said works are merely the fruits and signs of Justification obtained, but not a cause of the increase thereof; let him be anathema.

CANON XXIX.-If any one saith, that he, who has fallen after baptism, is not able by the grace of God to rise again; or, that he is able indeed to recover the justice which he has lost, but by faith alone without the sacrament of Penance, contrary to what the holy Roman and universal Church-instructed by Christ and his Apostles-has hitherto professed, observed, and taught; let him be anathema.

CANON XXX.-If any one saith, that, after the grace of Justification has been received, to every penitent sinner the guilt is remitted, and the debt of eternal punishment is blotted out in such wise, that there remains not any debt of temporal punishment to be discharged either in this world, or in the next in Purgatory, before the entrance to the kingdom of heaven can be opened (to him); let him be anathema.

CANON XXXII.-If any one saith, that the good works of one that is justified are in such manner the gifts of God, as that they are not also the good merits of him that is justified; or, that the said justified, by the good works which he performs through the grace of God and the merit of Jesus Christ, whose [Page 49] living member he is, does not truly merit increase of grace, eternal life, and the attainment of that eternal life,-if so be, however, that he depart in grace,-and also an increase of glory; let him be anathema.

Sola fide (Faith alone) is merely one issue. There are other issues, such as the issue of authority. Conservative evangelicals also make statements on biblical innerrancy which conform to the theology of sola scriptura (The bible alone is the only innerrant authority for faith and practice).

I recognize that most western Roman Catholics are far more liberal than the authorative statements of the Council of Trent, but it needs to be remembered, that the Council of Trent is still cannonized into formal doctrine within the Roman Catholic Church. If many of the statements in the Council of Trent were to be formally renounced, that might help open conversation between Roman Catholics and conservative evangelicals quite a bit. Until then, we do not accept Baptismal initial justification. Neither do we accept the Mass as an increase in justification. We do have differences in the way we look at the Gospel.


Your heretical friend,
Don

OK. You have self-identified as a heretic and presumably you are one Evangelical who would be against this Evangelical and Catholic statement and would want no share in it. So among forum Evangelicals so far we have 100% against the joint statement.

I would advise you to learn to distinguish between ‘canons’ and ‘cannons’. Also to learn how anathemas from the Council of Trent apply and do not apply. For example, the anathemas are for holders of particularly worded propositions. If you want to be a heretic that’s your business but some historical understanding would be useful.

I had some hopes about this Evangelical/Catholic statement but my suspicions that they were premature seem well founded.

 

[fide]

In fact:

"There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call,
one Lord, one faith, one baptism,
one God and Father of us all, who is above all and through all and in all."
(Eph 4:4-6)

Ecumenism can a dangerous thing, as Unitatis Redintegratio pointed out. To focus on our commonalities alone could be or become a "false irenicism" which would be very dangerous to all involved.

11. The way and method in which the Catholic faith is expressed should never become an obstacle to dialogue with our brethren. It is, of course, essential that the doctrine should be clearly presented in its entirety. Nothing is so foreign to the spirit of ecumenism as a false irenicism, in which the purity of Catholic doctrine suffers loss and its genuine and certain meaning is clouded.

At the same time, the Catholic faith must be explained more profoundly and precisely, in such a way and in such terms as our separated brethren can also really understand.

Moreover, in ecumenical dialogue, Catholic theologians standing fast by the teaching of the Church and investigating the divine mysteries with the separated brethren must proceed with love for the truth, with charity, and with humility. When comparing doctrines with one another, they should remember that in Catholic doctrine there exists a "hierarchy" of truths, since they vary in their relation to the fundamental Christian faith. Thus the way will be opened by which through fraternal rivalry all will be stirred to a deeper understanding and a clearer presentation of the unfathomable riches of Christ.

 

[fide]

The next danger in ecuminism flows immediately from the UR 11, which I just quoted: the misunderstandable phrase "hierarchy of truths". The hierarchy is of truths - truths of God and His will, revealed by Him to His Church. What exists is not a hierarchy of one truth (Jesus is Lord) over many disposable and unnecessary options that God merely suggests, if you'd like.

It is interesting that. the dream given to Don Bosco in a time of much turmoil and attack on the Church, showed him the crucial importance of two pillars of the Faith, to which if the Church, anchored, would survive:
1. the Eucharist, and frequent reception of Him in His Real Presence: Jesus the Lord, and
2. Mary - help of Christians - as the Catechism teaches,

(Catechism 971) - “All generations will call me blessed”: “The Church’s devotion to the Blessed Virgin is intrinsic to Christian worship.” [Lk 1:48; Paul VI, MC 56] The Church rightly honors the Blessed Virgin with special devotion.

These two supernatural realities in our Faith seem most attractive to ecuminist distortion, modification or exclusion for the sake of "ecuminism."

 

[FaithT]

Some are definitely anti-Catholic. I can't say all, though.

I took some classes at the Lutheran church when I belonged there. One was about Catholics vs Lutherans and the head pastor who taught the class seemed to be against Catholics, IMO. Or at least some of our beliefs. I wish I could remember what he said, but I forget, now.

 

[RileyG]

I took some classes at the Lutheran church when I belonged there. One was about Catholics vs Lutherans and the head pastor who taught the class seemed to be against Catholics, IMO. Or at least some of our beliefs. I wish I could remember what he said, but I forget, now.

Yeah, probably best you forget it. They are probably uninformed.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I took some classes at the Lutheran church when I belonged there. One was about Catholics vs Lutherans and the head pastor who taught the class seemed to be against Catholics, IMO. Or at least some of our beliefs. I wish I could remember what he said, but I forget, now.

When was the last time any Catholic heard a homily or heard in a class anything talking down Protestants? It's been ages for me.

 

[RileyG]

When was the last time any Catholic heard a homily or heard in a class anything talking down Protestants? It's been ages for me.

I never have.

 

[Michie]

When was the last time any Catholic heard a homily or heard in a class anything talking down Protestants? It's been ages for me.

That would be a hard never for me. On the other hand, when I was a Protestant I heard it often where Catholicism was discussed. What’s sad is it basically outright lies based on ignorance.

 

[RileyG]

That would be a hard never for me. On the other hand, when I was a Protestant I heard it often where Catholicism was discussed. What’s sad is it basically outright lies based on ignorance.

Absolutely! They’re uninformed and don’t know that the church teaches.

 

[Michie]

Absolutely! They’re uninformed and don’t know that the church teaches.

Exactly. It pushed me right inside the Catholic doors too.

 

[RileyG]

Exactly. It pushed me right inside the Catholic doors too.

At least that’s a good thing

 

[Michie]

At least that’s a good thing

A lot of them evangelize people that way unknowingly. Once you hit that brick wall you question everything. You look into those things and learn all sorts of things that were not true concerning Catholicism. I was pretty angry for awhile.

 

[RileyG]

A lot of them evangelize people that way unknowingly. Once you hit that brick wall you question everything. You look into those things and learn all sorts of things that were not true concerning Catholicism. I was pretty angry for awhile.

At least you came to the fullness of the truth! God works in mysterious ways