Discussion Baptisms in the Holy Spirit

[Richard T]

No it hasn't.

I believe scripture, not people:

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in a tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God; for no man understandeth; but by the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

This passage from The Holy Spirit is just as applicable to acts 2 as it was to the Corinthians. GOD changes not.

If a Christian is claiming that GOD had them speak in human languages as their gift of tongues, they are either lying or faking the gift. Either way it is not the true gift.

Tongues are a sign for unbelievers. seems like personal tongues are speaking to God, corporate operations of the gift various kinds of tongues tongues are a sign, can be interpreted, and can be in a foreign language. Ultimately corporate tongues seem to be directed at bringing something to the body. Here is charismatic teaching on this. Modern Day Tongues | Effectual Grace

Oral Roberts says he spoke directly in a foreign language before. Tested By Their Teaching: Oral Roberts - Gospel Guardian vol.22, no.22, pg.2b-3,5b-6

the blue letter bible quotes the scholar Gruden, who is still read in AOG seminaries among others that Acts 2 is known foreign languages. Were the Tongues in Scripture Known Languages? by Don Stewart

Often scriptures seem contradictory, it is just our understanding of them can be limited. Galations gives this example. Do we bear our own burdens? or bear others? Both I would argue.

Galatians 6:2-5 (KJV)
2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.
3 For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.
4 But let every man prove his own work, and then shall he have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
5 For every man shall bear his own burden.

 

[ARBITER01]

Tongues are a sign for unbelievers. seems like personal tongues are speaking to God, corporate operations of the gift various kinds of tongues tongues are a sign, can be interpreted, and can be in a foreign language. Ultimately corporate tongues seem to be directed at bringing something to the body. Here is charismatic teaching on this. Modern Day Tongues | Effectual Grace
Often scriptures seem contradictory, it is just our understanding of them can be limited. Galations gives this example. Do we bear our own burdens? or hope others. Both I would argue.

If you are going to say your abide by scripture, as you made the claim to the other person in this thread, then by all means start abiding by it,....

1Co 14:2 For he that speaketh in a tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God; for no man understandeth; but by the spirit he speaketh mysteries.

There is no place for personal opinions on this subject. The gift of tongues requires the gift of interpretation to be understood. It's the sole purpose of the gift of interpretation,..... to interpret the gift of tongues. That gift has no other purpose than to provide interpretation/understanding of the gift of tongues that we cannot understand

Do you yet see how ridiculous your statement is?

 

[ARBITER01]

Maybe the topic can get back "on topic" from this derail into the gifts.

The topic is "baptism/immersion in The Holy Spirit."

This was promised by Jesus to his followers before He arose into heaven. Baptism/immersion "in" The Holy Spirit is not the filling of The Holy Spirit, it is the born again experience, whereby we are immersed into The Holy Spirit and regenerated by the blood of Jesus.

Jesus contrasted what John was doing with water to what would happen to the disciples with The Holy Spirit, hence why He used the word "in."

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I have been in the AOG and came to like Vineyard, for the spirituality, more that the exegesis. In there pastor Randy Clark mentions people immersed in the Holy Spirit and a thorough inner change and empowerment takes place, but only after that do they receive there prayer language.

In Catholic Charismatic circles, priests speak of praying in tongues and asking for a gift to pray to Mary in tongues.

 

[ARBITER01]

I have been in the AOG and came to like Vineyard, for the spirituality, more that the exegesis. In there pastor Randy Clark mentions people immersed in the Holy Spirit and a thorough inner change and empowerment takes place, but only after that do they receive there prayer language.

In Catholic Charismatic circles, priests speak of praying in tongues and asking for a gift to pray to Mary in tongues.

Charismatic Catholics tend to keep ahold of a lot of their denominational doctrine after their Spiritual filling. That can tend to cause some theological problems.

Scripturally, we can receive the filling of The Holy Spirit after our water immersion, just like Jesus, and also like what Peter taught,...

Act 2:38 And Peter said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

- repentance
- water immersed in the name of Jesus
- can receive The Holy Spirit

AOG teaches a subsequent event for the filling of The Holy Spirit, and that aligns with scripture. It was also my personal experience. I received my filling about a year or so after my born again experience.

Scripture can present a confusing picture somewhat though. Both events, with the Judeans in acts 2 and the gentiles of Cornelius's house, received their Spiritual birth and filling back to back apart from water immersion. I think they were one time events from GOD, sort of GOD's calling card on the events where He started it and not man.

Everyone I have ever talked to always received the filling of The Holy Spirit subsequent from their regeneration, so again, I think those two events were particular to GOD actions.

 

[Pioneer3mm]

the AOG and came to like Vineyard

I was involved in AOG & Vineyard.
---
Vineyard has less emphasis..on 'speaking in tongues'..
---
I am saying this..from my experience (Vineyard).

 

[Paradise Haven]

Have you been baptized in the Holy Spirit? More than once? What changes took place?

I have been given the gift of tongues, and I asked for another language in addition to the first. I have this. But I am not yet baptized in the Holy Spirit.

How did you gain your grace of baptism in the Holy Spirit?

It's wonderful to hear that you've experienced the gift of tongues in your spiritual journey. That's a significant indication of the Holy Spirit's presence and His desire to communicate with you in a unique way. When we talk about being baptized in the Holy Spirit, it's not just about receiving the gift of tongues or other spiritual manifestations, although those are important. It's about experiencing a deeper immersion in the presence and power of God's Spirit in your life.

Sometimes, the term "baptism in the Holy Spirit" can seem mysterious or unclear, but essentially, it's a personal encounter with God where His Spirit fills you in a way that brings a heightened awareness of His love, His power, and His purposes. This experience often brings a renewed sense of spiritual vitality and a deeper intimacy with God. It's about being empowered for greater service and living out your faith in a more dynamic way.

If you're unsure about what it means to be baptized in the Holy Spirit (Read 1 Corinthians Chapter 14 on proper use of tongues as a guide), continue seeking God earnestly through prayer and seeking His presence. Ask Him to reveal Himself to you in new ways and to fill you afresh with His Spirit. Sometimes it happens in a single moment of surrender, and other times it may be a process of growing deeper in your relationship with God. Stay open to His leading and His timing, trusting that He will fulfill His promises to you as you continue to seek Him with your whole heart.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Derived from Vineyard is Global Awakening and Ps Randy quotes Hebrews in that it mentions Baptisms in the Spirit... not singular. Hebrews 6.

 

[ARBITER01]

Derived from Vineyard is Global Awakening and Ps Randy quotes Hebrews in that it mentions Baptisms in the Spirit... not singular. Hebrews 6.

Not sure what global awakening is (not sure if it is something I would want to know),......

But there are at least 3 possible immersions in the word,...

- Spiritual immersion, where we are born again.
- Water immersion, after Spiritual immersion, where we show with water physically what has happened to us Spiritually
- Immersion of sufferings, a Godly life wrought with sufferings. Jesus talked about it going through it. Could be considered an immersion of fire.

Those are the only ones I know of in scripture. The filling of The Spirit with the fruits and gifts is just that, a filling, not another Spiritual immersion.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

YLT
6 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,


2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.


3 And this will we do, if God permit.


4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,


5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,


6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.


7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

There seems to be a lot in many layings on of hands and rains...

 

[ARBITER01]

YLT
6 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,


2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.


3 And this will we do, if God permit.


4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,


5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,


6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.


7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:

There seems to be a lot in many layings on of hands and rains...

Are you changing the topic?

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

No just saying I am persuaded by Randy Clarke and others that there is more than one baptism in the Holy Spirit for the seeker hungry for more of God.

 

[T.i.m.o.t.h.y.]

Verse 2 describes the kinds of baptisms. : of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

It's not explicit in that text if laying on of hands refers to more than one HS baptism experience. The argument for it is from a position of silence. Paul told Timothy to stir up the gift which he received by the laying on of hands.. Paul did not say for Timothy to have someone lay hands on him again to get a spiritual booster shot.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Verse 2 describes the kinds of baptisms. : of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

It's not explicit in that text if laying on of hands refers to more than one HS baptism experience. The argument for it is from a position of silence. Paul told Timothy to stir up the gift which he received by the laying on of hands.. Paul did not say for Timothy to have someone lay hands on him again to get a spiritual booster shot.

I think it is good to want more of the Holy Spirit, for holiness and power. Timothy must have been enough empowered. To be baptized in the Spirit means to be immersed in Him for a time. Baptize means immersion, like standing under a waterfall.

In Australia, we speak of Australia's baptism by fire, WW1, but that is not the same thing as actual and local substance totally covering one.

 

[T.i.m.o.t.h.y.]

I think it is good to want more of the Holy Spirit, for holiness and power. Timothy must have been enough empowered. To be baptized in the Spirit means to be immersed in Him for a time. Baptize means immersion, like standing under a waterfall.

In Australia, we speak of Australia's baptism by fire, WW1, but that is not the same thing as actual and local substance totally covering one.

I'm thinking of doing what the apostle Paul told Timothy to do and find out how often I can be baptized by the fire of the Holy Spirit by praying unceasingly for a few days.. and direct it toward some prayer situations that God parked on my heart.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I'm thinking of doing what the apostle Paul told Timothy to do and find out how often I can be baptized by the fire of the Holy Spirit by praying unceasingly for a few days.. and direct it toward some prayer situations that God parked on my heart.

This reminds me of the book, Lighting Fires by Randy Clark.

 

[T.i.m.o.t.h.y.]

This reminds me of the book, Lighting Fires by Randy Clarke.

I've listened to one video by him. He was speaking of the events of the Toronto revival that he was a part of. "Characteristics of revival"?.. "Come Holy Spirit"?

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I've listened to one video by him. He was speaking of the events of the Toronto revival that he was a part of. "Characteristics of revival"?.. "Come Holy Spirit"?

Asking, "come Holy Spirit" is part of pressing in, beginning with being born again, by receiving the Holy Spirit into your heart. So they preach to us, make straight the way, open your heart, reach out and take in the kingdom from above... And if you ask rightly for the anointing you should be given one.