Tim Walz embellished his military service record

[RDKirk]

Maybe you don't know the answer for this, but if someone were contemplating retirement, is it common practice for them to accept a provisional promotion knowing that they won't be able to fulfill the requirements for the new title?

The day you go over sufficient time to retire, you're always kind of contemplating retirement. You're really only still in it for the personal satisfaction.

I can remember the very day and moment that personal satisfaction died for me, having to do with a couple of young troops (not mine) who were being strung through the ringer by the commander and had their careers ended for a peccadillo. In fact, their boss actually stood up at the commander's table and challenged, "Which of us didn't do the same thing at that age?"

Nobody could say a word to that. I realized at that point that I'd been in too long.

 

[RDKirk]

Thank you for your informative point of view. The biggest quibble I have with your post is the characterization of Guardsmen and Reservists. Most of my fellow soldiers with whom I have served in the Army National Guard are less than 30 years old and they are in good, but not great, physical shape.

I said "fighting a paunch." I didn't say the fight was lost. If he's a Guard E-8 or E-9, he's older than 30 years, fighting a paunch, dealing with thinning hair, with a wife wanting him to stay home for a while and kids in middle school.

 

[Vambram]

So, in your opinion, under what conditions is a commander allowed to retire?

In my opinion, it is not honorable for commanders and senior NCOs to retire just before a deployment during a time of war. I know that I would never have done what Walz did and retire out instead of leading my Battalion overseas.

 

[RDKirk]

I don't believe that the senior NCOs who served with Walz agree with you concerning blowing smoke about duty.

They've got their personal axes to grind, and they've got a chance to grind them in public, so grinding away they are.

 

[JosephZ]

I don't believe that the senior NCOs who served with Walz agree with you concerning blowing smoke about duty.

In 2022, former battalion commander Joseph Eustice, who served with Walz, told the Star Tribune that the accusations against Walz stemmed from ill-informed or “sour-grapes” soldiers who were passed over for promotions. “He was a great soldier,” Eustice told the Tribune. “When he chose to leave, he had every right to leave … The man did nothing wrong when he chose to leave the service; he didn’t break any rules.”

 

[Vambram]

They've got their personal axes to grind, and they've got a chance to grind them in public, so grinding away they are.

Respectfully, I disagree.

 

[RDKirk]

So, in your opinion, under what conditions is a commander allowed to retire?

They didn't even have orders to deploy. They probably expected to deploy, but until you've been ordered to deploy, you have no duty to deploy. If you're eligible for retirement, frankly the military doesn't even want you anymore. They'd actually rather you leave and let them promote a younger man into your position.

 

[JosephZ]

In my opinion, it is not honorable for commanders and senior NCOs to retire just before a deployment during a time of war.

His unit didn't receive orders for deployment until after he retired.

 

[Bradskii]

I hope this has traction. I want to see Trump commenting on it. Would he be that dumb?

 

[Vambram]

In 2022, former battalion commander Joseph Eustice, who served with Walz, told the Star Tribune that the accusations against Walz stemmed from ill-informed or “sour-grapes” soldiers who were passed over for promotions. “He was a great soldier,” Eustice told the Tribune. “When he chose to leave, he had every right to leave … The man did nothing wrong when he chose to leave the service; he didn’t break any rules.”

It is true that he did not break any rules and it is also true that he had the right to retire. However, it is still also true that a really good CSM should have led by example, stayed with his Battalion, and led his fellow soldiers and NCOs over into that deployment into Iraq.

 

[iluvatar5150]

In my opinion, it is not honorable for commanders and senior NCOs to retire just before a deployment during a time of war. I know that I would never have done what Walz did and retire out instead of leading my Battalion overseas.

What’s your idea of “just before”? He left almost a year before they deployed. Some combat units were getting deployed after only 18 months back. Everybody’s gotta nail that six month
window or else they’re deserters?

 

[RDKirk]

It is true that he did not break any rules and it is also true that he had the right to retire. However, it is still also true that a really good CSM should have led by example, stayed with his Battalion, and led his fellow soldiers and NCOs over into that deployment into Iraq.

How long should he stay in waiting for those deployment orders? Remember, he's in the National Guard and actually has a life that he's living.

 

[Vambram]

His unit didn't receive orders for deployment until after he retired.

The Warning Orders were already sent to his Battalion. Therefore, the Battalion leaders knew that they were going to be deployed.

 

[RDKirk]

The Warning Orders were already sent to his Battalion. Therefore, the Battalion leaders knew that they were going to be deployed.

Warning Orders don't always pan out.

But again, he'd been in long enough to have done the duty he'd given his oath to do. Duty is something you sign up for, not something other yey-hoos who aren't even your boss get to impose upon you.

 

[Vambram]

How long should he stay in waiting for those deployment orders? Remember, he's in the National Guard and actually has a life that he's living.

There wasn't that many months between the WARNO and the deployment orders. As the Battalion CSM, he would know this.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

This claim that Walz abandoned his Battalion is being made based upon the words and writings of two retired Command Sergeant Majors from the Minnesota Army National Guard. I believe that those 2 men know Tim Walz a LOT BETTER than anyone of us can know him.

Blah blah blah.

My father was in charge of his reserve unit and their unit got deployed twice, both times he didn’t go with. The first time he wasn’t cleared to go by whomever decides such things because he had a heart attack 3 or 4 months prior, and the second time because the deployment orders came after he’d announced his retirement plans waaaaaaay beforehand and they were in the process of structuring the changeover. His age, time served, and changeover plan (his retirement meant his unit was being combined with another one) meant the higher ups decided he should stay back to coordinate the consolidation and equipment move.

Yet, there are like three or four doo dahs on his unit who believe he was ducking deployment and will insist so to this day. All of them being doo dahs that, by the way, ran afoul of him during their tenure there. But you ask them and they’ll say he tucked tail and ran. The heart attack, cardiac cath, the second heart attack he had 5 months after leaving, and the pacemaker they gave him afterwards were apparently a prolonged ruse to avoid deployment.

If you work somewhere with more than 5 other people, there’s a high likelihood one of them will be a doo dah with an axe to grind. Considering retiring from the military isn’t like giving your notice and leaving two weeks later and their orders came after he retired which means well after he announced his intention to retire, the whole “he abandoned his men” thing seems like a bit of a reach.

*ETA: I was just corrected. Deployed 4 times. Apparently they did partial deployments during Desert Storm, asked for volunteers, and enough people volunteered that they didn’t need to issue orders. They didn’t even take all the volunteers. And he was a volunteer that didn’t get picked because there was not a redundancy plan for the role he filled at the time.

 

[Fantine]

I think what it means, RD, is if Walz agreed with them politically they would be singing his praises.
They should be thanking him because, as chair of the Veterans' Committee in Congress, he made sure our vets and retirees got everything they needed.
My BIL and many military retirees were angry that for years they could not collect a VA disability and retirement simultaneously.
His older brother (my husband) was in Vietnam a few years and in the last few years has been at 100%. BIL had a non-com pension and a partial disability and my husband was getting the same amount each month, maybe more.
It was Congress members like Walz who worked for the vets and retirees.
TBT, if these two critics of Walz read what Project 2025's goals are for downsizing the VA, they might put Walz bumper stickers on their cars.

 

[variant]

In my opinion, it is not honorable for commanders and senior NCOs to retire just before a deployment during a time of war. I know that I would never have done what Walz did and retire out instead of leading my Battalion overseas.

I'm going to respect the multi-decade veterans decision not to want to deploy as a national guardsman to Bush's military adventure in Iraq.

It's a disgusting political attack to call a veteran dishonorable for it.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I'm going to respect the multi-decade veterans decision not to want to deploy as a national guardsman to Bush's military adventure in Iraq.

It's a disgusting political attack to call it dishonerable.

Not to mention a total denial of the fact that, with 24 years in and retirement on the horizon, they may not have deployed him with his unit if he did stay in and knew deployment was a risk.

 

[variant]

Not to mention a total denial of the fact that, with 24 years in and retirement on the horizon, they may not have deployed him with his unit if he did stay in and knew deployment was a risk.

Do they usually deploy people pushing 40 to the front lines?