Louisiana classrooms now required by law to display the Ten Commandments

[The Liturgist]

I get the impression that Hammster does not mean to put a Spanish language Bible on an equal footing with those others.

Hammster is not posting in this thread…

 

[DaisyDay]

(Continued)

Whereas in 1854, the United States House of Representatives declared `It [religion] must be considered as the foundation on which the whole structure rests . . . Christianity; in its general principles, is the great conservative element on which we must rely for the purity and permanence of free institutions';

Whereas in 1864, by law Congress added `In God We Trust' to American coinage;

Whereas in 1864, Congress passed an act authorizing each State to display statues of 2 of its heroes in the United States Capitol, resulting in numerous statues of noted Christian clergymen and leaders at the Capitol, including Gospel ministers such as the Revs. James A. Garfield, John Peter Muhlenberg, Jonathan Trumbull, Roger Williams, Jason Lee, Marcus Whitman, and Martin Luther King Jr., Gospel theologians such as Roger Sherman, Catholic priests such as Father Damien, Jacques Marquette, Eusebio Kino, and Junipero Serra, Catholic nuns such as Mother Joseph, and numerous other religious leaders;

Whereas in 1870, the Federal Government made Christmas (a recognition of the birth of Christ, an event described by the U.S. Supreme Court as `acknowledged in the Western World for 20 centuries, and in this country by the people, the Executive Branch, Congress, and the courts for 2 centuries') and Thanksgiving as official holidays;

Whereas, beginning in 1904 and continuing for the next half-century, the Federal Gvernment printed and distributed The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth for the use of Members of Congress because of the important teachings it contained;

Whereas in 1931, Congress by law adopted the Star-Spangled Banner as the official National Anthem, with its phrases such as `may the Heav'n-rescued land Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation,' and `this be our motto, `In God is our trust!';

Whereas in 1954, Congress by law added the phrase `one nation under God' to the Pledge of Allegiance;

Whereas in 1954, a special Congressional Prayer Room was added to the Capitol with a kneeling bench, an altar, an open Bible, an inspiring stained-glass window with George Washington kneeling in prayer, the declaration of Psalm 16:1: `Preserve me, O God, for in Thee do I put my trust,' and the phrase `This Nation Under God' displayed above the kneeling, prayerful Washington;

Whereas in 1956, Congress by law made `In God We Trust' the National Motto, and added the phrase to American currency;

Whereas the constitutions of each of the 50 States, either in the preamble or body, explicitly recognize or express gratitude to God;

Whereas America's first Presidential Inauguration incorporated 7 specific religious activities, including--

(1) the use of the Bible to administer the oath;

(2) affirming the religious nature of the oath by the adding the prayer `So help me God!' to the oath;

(3) inaugural prayers offered by the President;

(4) religious content in the inaugural address;

(5) civil leaders calling the people to prayer or acknowledgment of God;

(6) inaugural worship services attended en masse by Congress as an official part of congressional activities; and

(7) clergy-led inaugural prayers, activities which have been replicated in whole or part by every subsequent President;

Whereas President George Washington declared `Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports';

Whereas President John Adams, one of only 2 signers of the Bill of Rights and First Amendment, declared `As the safety and prosperity of nations ultimately and essentially depend on the protection and the blessing of Almighty God, and the national acknowledgment of this truth is not only an indispensable duty which the people owe to Him';

Whereas President Jefferson not only attended Divine services at the Capitol throughout his presidency and had the Marine Band play at the services, but during his administration church services were also begun in the War Department and the Treasury Department, thus allowing worshippers on any given Sunday the choice to attend church at either the United States Capitol, the War Department, or the Treasury Department if they so desired;

Whereas Thomas Jefferson urged local governments to make land available specifically for Christian purposes, provided Federal funding for missionary work among Indian tribes, and declared that religious schools would receive `the patronage of the government';

Whereas President Andrew Jackson declared that the Bible `is the rock on which our Republic rests';

Whereas President Abraham Lincoln declared that the Bible `is the best gift God has given to men . . . But for it, we could not know right from wrong'

Whereas President William McKinley declared that `Our faith teaches us that there is no safer reliance than upon the God of our fathers, Who has so singularly favored the American people in every national trial and Who will not forsake us so long as we obey His commandments and walk humbly in His footsteps';

Whereas President Teddy Roosevelt declared `The Decalogue and the Golden Rule must stand as the foundation of every successful effort to better either our social or our political life';

Whereas President Woodrow Wilson declared that `America was born to exemplify that devotion to the elements of righteousness which are derived from the revelations of Holy Scripture';

Whereas President Herbert Hoover declared that `American life is builded, and can alone survive, upon . . . [the] fundamental philosophy announced by the Savior nineteen centuries ago';

Whereas President Franklin D. Roosevelt not only led the Nation in a 6 minute prayer during D-Day on June 6, 1944, but he also declared that `If we will not prepare to give all that we have and all that we are to preserve Christian civilization in our land, we shall go to destruction';

Whereas President Harry S. Truman declared that `The fundamental basis of this Nation's law was given to Moses on the Mount. The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings which we get from Exodus and St. Matthew, from Isaiah and St. Paul';

Whereas President Harry S. Truman told a group touring Washington, DC, that `You will see, as you make your rounds, that this Nation was established by men who believed in God. . . . You will see the evidence of this deep religious faith on every hand';

Whereas President Dwight D. Eisenhower declared that `Without God there could be no American form of government, nor an American way of life. Recognition of the Supreme Being is the first, the most basic, expression of Americanism. Thus, the founding fathers of America saw it, and thus with God's help, it will continue to be' in a declaration later repeated with approval by President Gerald Ford;

Whereas President John F. Kennedy declared that `The rights of man come not from the generosity of the state but from the hand of God';

Whereas President Ronald Reagan, after noting `The Congress of the United States, in recognition of the unique contribution of the Bible in shaping the history and character of this Nation and so many of its citizens, has . . . requested the President to designate the year 1983 as the `Year of the Bible', officially declared 1983 as `The Year of the Bible';

Whereas every other President has similarly recognized the role of God and religious faith in the public life of America;

Whereas all sessions of the United States Supreme Court begin with the Court's Marshal announcing, `God save the United States and this honorable court';

Whereas a regular and integral part of official activities in the Federal courts, including the United States Supreme Court, was the inclusion of prayer by a minister of the Gospel;

Whereas the United States Supreme Court has declared throughout the course of our Nation's history that the United States is `a Christian country', `a Christian nation', `a Christian people', `a religious people whose institutions presuppose a Supreme Being', and that `we cannot read into the Bill of Rights a philosophy of hostility to religion';

Whereas Justice John Jay, an author of the Federalist Papers and original Justice of the United States Supreme Court, urged `The most effectual means of securing the continuance of our civil and religious liberties is always to remember with reverence and gratitude the Source from which they flow';

Whereas Justice James Wilson, a signer of the Constitution, declared that `Human law must rest its authority ultimately upon the authority of that law which is Divine . . . Far from being rivals or enemies, religion and law are twin sisters, friends, and mutual assistants';

Whereas Justice William Paterson, a signer of the Constitution, declared that `Religion and morality . . . [are] necessary to good government, good order, and good laws';

Whereas President George Washington, who passed into law the first legal acts organizing the Federal judiciary, asked, `where is the security for property, for reputation, for life, if the sense of religious obligation desert the oaths in the courts of justice?';

Whereas some of the most important monuments, buildings, and landmarks in Washington, DC, include religious words, symbols, and imagery;

Whereas in the United States Capitol the declaration `In God We Trust' is prominently displayed in both the United States House and Senate Chambers;

Whereas around the top of the walls in the House Chamber appear images of 23 great lawgivers from across the centuries, but Moses (the lawgiver, who--according to the Bible--originally received the law from God,) is the only lawgiver honored with a full face view, looking down on the proceedings of the House;

Whereas religious artwork is found throughout the United States Capitol, including in the Rotunda where the prayer service of Christopher Columbus, the Baptism of Pocahontas, and the prayer and Bible study of the Pilgrims are all prominently displayed; in the Cox Corridor of the Capitol where the words `America! God shed His grace on thee' are inscribed; at the east Senate entrance with the words `Annuit Coeptis' which is Latin for `God has favored our undertakings'; and in numerous other locations;

Whereas images of the Ten Commandments are found in many Federal buildings across Washington, DC, including in bronze in the floor of the National Archives; in a bronze statue of Moses in the Main Reading Room of the Library of Congress; in numerous locations at the U.S. Supreme Court, including in the frieze above the Justices, the oak door at the rear of the Chamber, the gable apex, and in dozens of locations on the bronze latticework surrounding the Supreme Court Bar seating;

Whereas in the Washington Monument not only are numerous Bible verses and religious acknowledgments carved on memorial blocks in the walls, including the phrases: `Holiness to the Lord' (Exodus 28:26, 30:30, Isaiah 23:18, Zechariah 14:20), `Search the Scriptures' (John 5:39), `The memory of the just is blessed' (Proverbs 10:7), `May Heaven to this Union continue its beneficence', and `In God We Trust', but the Latin inscription Laus Deo meaning `Praise be to God' is engraved on the monument's capstone;

Whereas of the 5 areas inside the Jefferson Memorial into which Jefferson's words have been carved, 4 are God-centered, including Jefferson's declaration that `God who gave us life gave us liberty. Can the liberties of a nation be secure when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just, that His justice cannot sleep forever';

Whereas the Lincoln Memorial contains numerous acknowledgments of God and citations of Bible verses, including the declarations that `we here highly resolve that . . . this nation under God . . . shall not perish from the earth'; `The Almighty has His own purposes. `Woe unto the world because of offenses; for it must needs be that offenses come, but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh' (Matthew 18:7), `as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said `the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether' (Psalms 19:9), `one day every valley shall be exalted and every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight and the glory of the Lord shall be revealed and all flesh see it together' (Dr. Martin Luther King's speech, based on Isaiah 40:4-5);

Whereas in the Library of Congress, The Giant Bible of Mainz, and The Gutenberg Bible are on prominent permanent display and etched on the walls are Bible verses, including: `The light shineth in darkness, and the darkness comprehendeth it not' (John 1:5), `Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore, get wisdom and with all thy getting, get understanding' (Proverbs 4:7), `What doth the Lord require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God' (Micah 6:8), and `The heavens declare the Glory of God, and the firmament showeth His handiwork' (Psalm 19:1);

Whereas numerous other of the most important American government leaders, institutions, monuments, buildings, and landmarks both openly acknowledge and incorporate religious words, symbols, and imagery into official venues;

Whereas such acknowledgments are even more frequent at the State and local level than at the Federal level, where thousands of such acknowledgments exist, and

Whereas the first week in May each year would be an appropriate week to designate as `America's Spiritual Heritage Week': Now, therefore, be it

Resolved, That the United States House of Representatives--

(1) affirms the rich spiritual and diverse religious history of our Nation's founding and subsequent history, including up to the current day;

(2) recognizes that the religious foundations of faith on which America was built are critical underpinnings of our Nation's most valuable institutions and form the inseparable foundation for America's representative processes, legal systems, and societal structures;

(3) rejects, in the strongest possible terms, any effort to remove, obscure, or purposely omit such history from our Nation's public buildings and educational resources; and

(4) expresses support for designation of a `America's Spiritual Heritage Week' every year for the appreciation of and education on America's history of religious faith.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/111th-congress/house-resolution/397/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%22HRES+397+IH+111th+CONGRESS%22%5D%7D&r=3&s=2

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.RES.397:

A house resolution proposed in 2009 (we are currently in the 118th Congress) that went nowhere.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/111th-congress/house-resolution/397

H.Res.397 - Affirming the rich spiritual and religious history of our Nation's founding and subsequent history and expressing support for designation of the first week in May as "America's Spiritual Heritage Week" for the appreciation of and education on America's history of religious faith. 111th Congress (2009-2010)​

​

So, I'm not sure of the point of posting this failed resolution from 15 years ago?

 

[BCP1928]

Hammster is not posting in this thread…

Sorry. you're right. That was another thread.

 

[The Liturgist]

Wow, the irony created by using an R. Crumb image to promote the use of the Decalogue in public schools could form a black hole?

Hey, I use Slackware Linux, as does one of my mentors in the IT world, a Linux distribution which is compiled by Patrick Volkerding, who adheres to that belief system. The Ten Commandments, which collectively encapsulate the Great Commandment and the Golden Rule as expressed by Christ our True God, have the effect of precluding religious discrimination.

Indeed actually on that basis, just to make the point clearer, I think the school in Louisiana ought to post the Summary of the Law as stated by Christ, since the Golden Rule is the basis for religious toleration (as opposed to the enforced syncretism of Far Eastern religions, which many people assume incorrectly is tolerance, but in fact, it is the forced modification of some religions such as Buddhism, which in its original form was not practiced syncretically with, for instance, Hinduism, but in China, Viet Nam, Korea and Japan, Buddhism was forced to integrate with Taoism and Confucianism on the Continent, and Shinto (along with some elements of Neo Confucianist philosophy) in Japan. So while there might be religious toleration at present in Taiwan, Hong Kong, Korea and Japan, although alas not in the PRC, at least not for Confucianism, which as a formal religion is suppressed in mainland China, the origins of this were not actual toleration but rather a forced syncretism which also in some cases involved dissimulation (as is demonstrated by the existence of a Manichean temple disguised as a Buddhist temple, in China; were China a free society, the Manichees would have been able to openly practice their dualist religion (which was influenced primarily by Zoroastrianism and Docetic Christianity as well as the cult of Hermes) without disguising it as Buddhism.

Indeed, this is why Christianity was banned, first in Japan, and then in mainland China by the Kangxi Emperor in the early 18th century after the Dominicans, contrary to the position taken by the Jesuits, argued that ancestor worship was an error which was not compatible with Christianity, a position I really wish the Roman Catholic Church had held firm on. Indeed before the people’s Republic of China suppressed it, the Chinese Orthodox Church, established by Russian missionaries, had converted a number of Chinese people without making any syncretic concessions regarding “traditional Chinese rites”. And this church continues to flourish in Hong Kong and Taiwan, but sadly the PRC has not given it back the few cathedrals and parishes they did not obliterate, such as the Orthodox Christian cathedral in Harbin, which is particularly beautiful.

 

[The Liturgist]

A house resolution proposed in 2009 (we are currently in the 118th Congress) that went nowhere.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/111th-congress/house-resolution/397

​

​

H.Res.397 - Affirming the rich spiritual and religious history of our Nation's founding and subsequent history and expressing support for designation of the first week in May as "America's Spiritual Heritage Week" for the appreciation of and education on America's history of religious faith. 111th Congress (2009-2010)​

​

So, I'm not sure of the point of posting this failed resolution from 15 years ago?

The resolution may not have passed, but it expresses the truth, and cites true and accurate statements made by various authorities over the years.

By the way there is a Unitarian parish in New Mexico which displays an Eastern Orthodox cross but has an atheist pastor, something I find extremely offensive. Would you have any suggestions on where I might file a complaint about this misappropriation of our sacred symbols? They also displayed crosses that are uniquely associated and exclusively used by certain other Christian denominations.

No one other than the Eastern Orthodox uses the cross they are displaying, however, not even the sui juris Byzantine Rite Catholics or the Oriental Orthodox (who instead have their own cross designs, tending to favor a Greek cross, a Jerusalem cross, a St. Thomas Cross - particularly in India, and various distinctive crosses in Egypt and Armenia).

 

[BCP1928]

The resolution may not have passed, but it expresses the truth, and cites true and accurate statements made by various authorities over the years.

By the way there is a Unitarian parish in New Mexico which displays an Eastern Orthodox cross but has an atheist pastor, something I find extremely offensive. Would you have any suggestions on where I might file a complaint about this misappropriation of our sacred symbols? They also displayed crosses that are uniquely associated and exclusively used by certain other Christian denominations.

No one other than the Eastern Orthodox uses the cross they are displaying, however, not even the sui juris Byzantine Rite Catholics or the Oriental Orthodox (who instead have their own cross designs, tending to favor a Greek cross, a Jerusalem cross, a St. Thomas Cross - particularly in India, and various distinctive crosses in Egypt and Armenia).

Is it copywrited?

 

[The Liturgist]

Is it copywrited?

Probably, in some specific proportions, but that’s not really the point.

 

[BCP1928]

Probably, in some specific proportions, but that’s not really the point.

Well it is the point. Otherwise you don't control the use of the article.

 

[DaisyDay]

The resolution may not have passed, but it expresses the truth, and cites true and accurate statements made by various authorities over the years.

By the way there is a Unitarian parish in New Mexico which displays an Eastern Orthodox cross but has an atheist pastor, something I find extremely offensive. Would you have any suggestions on where I might file a complaint about this misappropriation of our sacred symbols? They also displayed crosses that are uniquely associated and exclusively used by certain other Christian denominations.

No one other than the Eastern Orthodox uses the cross they are displaying, however, not even the sui juris Byzantine Rite Catholics or the Oriental Orthodox (who instead have their own cross designs, tending to favor a Greek cross, a Jerusalem cross, a St. Thomas Cross - particularly in India, and various distinctive crosses in Egypt and Armenia).

Why don't you go to that parish and simply ask the pastor or parishioners about the crosses they have and display**. You might learn something and, if not, you can then ask them where to file a complaint. I'm not there and I'm not them so asking me seems like a rote exercise in fecklessness.

**If you get a friend to film the exchange and post it to TikTok in the Karen section you might get internet famous for fifteen minutes.

 

[DaisyDay]

Well it is the point. Otherwise you don't control the use of the article.

If you mean the wording of the resolution, it's public domain. If you mean the cross, .... I'm at a loss for words.....

 

[The Liturgist]

Why don't you go to that parish and simply ask the pastor or parishioners about the crosses they have and display**. You might learn something and, if not, you can then ask them where to file a complaint. I'm not there and I'm not them so asking me seems like a rote exercise in fecklessness.

**If you get a friend to film the exchange and post it to TikTok in the Karen section you might get internet famous for fifteen minutes.

So you’re saying I am a Karen (or more precisely a Darren) because I object to the the UUA using an Orthodox symbol in a manner that is offensive?

The raison d’etre for asking you where one could file a complaint about such a thing is to avoid bothering the local parish. I am not one to demand to speak to a manager.

I propose that if the Unitarian Universalist church in question cares about inclusion and religious diversity, they ought to respect Orthodox Christian sacred symbols and not engage in cultural appropriation.

But we seem to have discarded notions of respect for inclusion and religious diversity since in this thread it has been alleged by various people that the Samaritans are Jews, and Mormons are Christians, despite both groups disagreeing with this, that only Christians and Jews care about the Decalogue, and that an attempt to be more inclusive of religions such as Judaism, Christianity and Samaritanism, that have been wrongfully discriminated against in recent years.

 

[prodromos]

So you’re saying I am a Karen (or more precisely a Darren) because I object to the the UUA using an Orthodox symbol in a manner that is offensive?

The raison d’etre for asking you where one could file a complaint about such a thing is to avoid bothering the local parish. I am not one to demand to speak to a manager.

I propose that if the Unitarian Universalist church in question cares about inclusion and religious diversity, they ought to respect Orthodox Christian sacred symbols and not engage in cultural appropriation.

But we seem to have discarded notions of respect for inclusion and religious diversity since in this thread it has been alleged by various people that the Samaritans are Jews, and Mormons are Christians, despite both groups disagreeing with this, that only Christians and Jews care about the Decalogue, and that an attempt to be more inclusive of religions such as Judaism, Christianity and Samaritanism, that have been wrongfully discriminated against in recent years.

The France Olympic commitee has taken down the video of the opening ceremony where they did a blasphemous reproduction of "The Last Supper", due to the intense backlash they received. I guess we're all Karens now.

 

[HARK!]

The France Olympic commitee has taken down the video of the opening ceremony where they did a blasphemous reproduction of "The Last Supper", due to the intense backlash they received. I guess we're all Karens now.

Was that before or after their power mysteriously went off?

 

[DaisyDay]

So you’re saying I am a Karen (orismore precisely a Darren) because I object to the the UUA using an Orthodox symbol in a manner that is offensive?

Kevin, I think is the male equivalent. But no, I am not saying you ARE a Kevin, but wanting to "complain to the manager" yet actually complaining to me who has absolutely nothing to do with whatever the situation might actually be, is typically attributed to Karens.

The raison d’etre for asking you where one could file a complaint about such a thing is to avoid bothering the local parish. I am not one to demand to speak to a manager.

Ok, you don't want to speak to the manage? But you do want to file a complaint with a random person on the internet? I don't see how that is any better or more productive. You want to file a complaint with someone, but not a manager...This seems like escalating to "corporate" which I am given to understand is also Karenish behavior?

Since this is happening at the local parish - do Unitarians even have parishes? - the local parish should be the one to help you or not. If there is a central board of Unitarians overseeing the proper administration of crosses in local churches, I am unaware of it, sorry.

I propose that if the Unitarian Universalist church in question cares about inclusion and religious diversity, they ought to respect Orthodox Christian sacred symbols and not engage in cultural appropriation.

How do you know they don't? So far, all you've said is that they display one, but not how or why or what in particular is so offensive about this to you. Again, you haven't said anything about the history of this particular cross, so do you know anything about it?

But we seem to have discarded notions of respect for inclusion and religious diversity since in this thread it has been alleged by various people that the Samaritans are Jews, and Mormons are Christians, despite both groups disagreeing with this, that only Christians and Jews care about the Decalogue, and that an attempt to be more inclusive of religions such as Judaism, Christianity and Samaritanism, that have been wrongfully discriminated against in recent years.

I don't see that a Unitarian church having an unapproved-by-you cross in their possession has anything to do with violating inclusion and religious diversity. Can you explain?j


But now I'm curious - what is this cross and how is it used offensively? How did this church come by it? What do you think the proper resolution to your filing a complaint ought to be?

 

[DaisyDay]

The France Olympic commitee has taken down the video of the opening ceremony where they did a blasphemous reproduction of "The Last Supper", due to the intense backlash they received. I guess we're all Karens now.

Only if we are all demanding to speak to the manager.

 

[prodromos]

Only if we are all demanding to speak to the manager.

I don't want to speak to the manager, I want His/Her head (figuratively speaking).

 

[The Liturgist]

Ok, you don't want to speak to the manage? But you do want to file a complaint with a random person on the internet?

I didn’t say that now did I. I asked if you knew where I might be able to file a complaint; if you had said “no, I don’t know about that” I would have said “that’s quite alright” and we could have avoided further tarnishing the reputation of everyone happened to be named Karen or Daren. I knew a kindergarten teacher named Karen, or rather, to be more precise, she wasn’t my teacher but she was a teacher at the LCMS parochial school I attended during 3rd through 6th grade, and like the other people there she was so sweet.

And indeed no one would even care about this, Orthodox or otherwise, if the Unitarian church in question had simply stuck to its own chalice, and had used a generic cross as opposed to the three-bar cross with the diagonal slanting bar used exclusively by the Eastern Orthodox.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Indeed, the argument that the US is not a Christian country is nonsensical. We may not have an established church, but when it comes down to it, on a functional level, even considering the rollbacks atheists managed to inflict during the period of judicial activism in the Supreme Court from which we now have some respite, the US is a Christian country, and indeed is more Christian than those European countries that made the mistake of having an Established Church.

It would do youself a great favor to learn the difference between a "nation of Christians" and a "Christian nation". The US is the former, not the latter. The government of the US is in no way based upon or dependent upon the Christian religion.

The problem with Established Churches like the Church of England, the Church of Sweden/Norway/Denmark etc is that they tend to be subject to political pressure since they are essentially organs of the state. I don’t think State Churches are a good idea, rather, I think a national piety is a good idea, centered around Christ our True God.

I don't know what "national piety" could be other than trying to drag us into your religious practice. We are not interested.

Of course the US is also the one country that consistently provided a tolerant haven for Jewry without the periodic pogroms and persecutions that occurred even in those European countries which did not seek to expel the Jews outright (which happened at one time in the UK, and would later happen in Spain and Portugal).

What distresses me about this thread however is the non-recognition by our atheist brethren of the status of certain religions like Samaritanism as distinct religions. Samaritans do not consider themselves to be Jews; the Jews do not consider the Samaritans to be Jews; the two religions are related, but not the same. So it seems to me to be grossly offensive that Christians and Mormons are being lumped together, despite the fact that we disagree on our identity, and likewise that Samaritans and Jews are not being recognized by the atheist members of this forum as distinct religions.

First, I'm not your bretheren. Second, ask a Mormon if they consider themselves Christian (they do). (Seriously, that's what you get worked up about?)

And it is not as though these are the only religions which embrace the Ten Commandments. There are several others that regard it as inspired which are even more exotic, which I have not mentioned yet, but will if our atheist friends continue to erroneously insist that this action favors Christianity and Judaism over other religions.

I would also note that Islam, while regarding the Old Testament to be corrupt, embraces the Ideas enumerated in the Ten Commandments as moral principles, albeit with some exceptions in the event of dealings with non-Muslims and other cases.

Good grief. The text in the law is an anglo-protestant version. They give short shrift versions used by others outside those traditions.

 

[HARK!]

The government of the US is in no way based upon or dependent upon the Christian religion.

Well, aside from everything else that I've mentioned in this thread, like the Decalogue plastered all over the Nation's Capital, I suppose if we ignore this nation's founding document; one could gain that impression.

Which Creator?

I'll give you a hint. It's not the Ishtar Bunny.

 

[DaisyDay]

I didn’t say that now did I.

You wanted to know where to file a complaint which is pretty much doing that if not saying that.

I asked if you knew where I might be able to file a complaint; if you had said “no, I don’t know about that” I would have said “that’s quite alright” and we could have avoided further tarnishing the reputation of everyone happened to be named Karen or Daren.

But why did you ask this of me?

I knew a kindergarten teacher named Karen, or rather, to be more precise, she wasn’t my teacher but she was a teacher at the LCMS parochial school I attended during 3rd through 6th grade, and like the other people there she was so sweet.

How lovely for you.

And indeed no one would even care about this, Orthodox or otherwise, if the Unitarian church in question had simply stuck to its own chalice, and had used a generic cross as opposed to the three-bar cross with the diagonal slanting bar used exclusively by the Eastern Orthodox.

And once again, why did this particular church use this particular cross?

Why did they use a chalice at all? Did you attend the service? There are a lot of unknowns here for you to be calling for anyone's head, it seems to me.