The First Resurrection

[SavedByGrace3]

Oh, okay.
Why may I ask?

Basically because this was the first resurrection, and this is where we get the new birth and eternal life. We were quickened together with Him, and received His life.

 

[eleos1954]

I love this answer. Firstfruit of the first resurrection.
That is a very precise, clear and simple answer.
Would have been nice if you had referenced the scripture that mentions the first resurrection. Revelation 20:6

Excellent!
So, no person who died prior Christ has part with the first resurrection.
None of those persons are firstfruits to God, and have not been resurrected to heaven with a glorified body - 1 Corinthians 15:20-23.


Which scripture did you find that says, "Jesus will retain His glorified human body"?
If this is an opinion, or there are no scriptures to back any claims made...
Please remember to give an honest, positive response backed up by scripture and reason in a loving manner.
If you are not using scripture to back up your response, or you are speaking from personal opinion, please preface your statements with "In my opinion," or "I believe."


Corruptible in this case, means perishable.
Whether sinful, or sinless, mankind has corruptible bodies - that is, perishable, or subject to decay.

HELPS Word-studies
Cognate: 5349 phthartós (an adjective, derived from 5351 /phtheírō) – perishable, what easily perishes disintegrates (corrupts) – like the break-down of the physical body during our natural lifetime. See 5351 (phteírō).

From phtheiro; decayed, i.e. (by implication) perishable -- corruptible.
phtheiró: to destroy, corrupt, spoil

However, yes, it is through sin that man dies. Romans 5:12
Thus, we would not be withering away, had Adam not sinned. Genesis 2:17; Deuteronomy 32:5; Psalm 36:9; Acts 17:28

Which scripture did you find that says, "Jesus will retain His glorified human body"?

John affirms what false prophets deny, namely that “Jesus Christ [is] coming in the flesh” (2 John 7). Paul adds that once the cosmic conflict is over, all things will again be subject to the Father, and “the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God be all in all” ( 1 Cor. 15:28, NASB). The Incarnation will never be suspended. Christ became human forever. His sacrifice is an eternal one.

Jesus became man in a human form to forever bridge the separation between mankind and God ... to become all in all ... Everything exists through Him and for Him and will continue to exist through Him and for Him for eternity.

The end of the Incarnation would be the end of our divine-human Saviour. It is simply impossible for this to happen…What happened in the Incarnation was not something that could be undone once it accomplished its purpose.

Colossians 1:21–23

And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard.

The appearance of Jesus after His accession.

Luke 24:9

Berean Literal Bible
See My hands and My feet, that I am He. Touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones, as you see Me having."

He was and is man and God forever.

 

[eleos1954]

Why do you refer to these as lost?

I don't ... those in the 1st are the saved .... those in the 2nd are the lost ... sorry if i didn't make that clear.

 

[CoreyD]

When Jesus returns all judgement for all times has taken place .... the saved are taken to heaven for 1,000 years .... those left on planet earth are destroyed on planet earth (with the brightness of His coming**) and the earth is left in a desolate condition ... but this is not the full end .... after the 1,000 years the 2nd resurrection (of the lost) takes place .... the battle of Gog and Magog takes places .... attacks the New Jerusalem that has descended from heaven. God destroys the earth and everything in it (this is the 2nd death for eternity) and then makes everything new and His people will dwell with Him forever on the new earth. Amen!

All of that is in 2 Thessalonians 2 KJV?

I don't see...

When Jesus returns all judgement for all times has taken place.

Which verse please?

I don't see...

the saved are taken to heaven for 1,000 years .... those left on planet earth are destroyed on planet earth (with the brightness of His coming**) and the earth is left in a desolate condition

Which verse please?

You said this before.

after the 1,000 years the 2nd resurrection (of the lost) takes place

I was hoping you would answer as to why you refer to these as lost? Since no scripture does.
That is your opinion, then.
Please be reminded...
If you are not using scripture to back up your response, or you are speaking from personal opinion, please preface your statements with "In my opinion," or "I believe."

Thanks however for giving me the picture you see. I appreciate that.
Regarding judgment, the scriptures tell us this:
Matthew 12:40-42
40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41 The men of Nineveh will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and indeed a greater than Jonah is here. 42 The queen of the South will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and indeed a greater than Solomon is here.

Matthew 5:28, 29
28 Do not be amazed at this; for a time is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,
29 and will come out: those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the bad deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

So, the Bible does say there will be a resurrection to judgment.
All judgment for all times has not taken place at Jesus' coming.
This period is called judgment day. Matthew 10:15; Matthew 11:22-24
Since John 5:28, 29, and Acts 24:15 occurs at the same time as Revelation 20:12, 13, this resurrection is the same - the second.

Some people believe that this amounts to God resurrecting people to just judge them as evil, and send them to eternal torments.
This however, is not compatible with the scriptural purpose of the resurrection, and in that light, makes no sense.

The apostle Paul, in speaking positively about the resurrection, said, "I have a hope in God, which these men themselves also accept / await / welcome, that there is going to be a resurrection, both of the righteous and the unrighteous" Acts 24:15
They looked forward to the resurrection, because both the righteous, and the unrighteous, would be coming back.

Certainly, no one welcomes being raised up to be banished to eternal torment.
We welcome a second chance at life, So the unrighteous dead would indeed have that chance, during the 1,000 years. Revelation 20:12, 13

Also it is during this resurrection that the Bible says, "The sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades (Hell according to KJV and other translations) gave up their dead, and each one was judged according to his deeds". Revelation 20:13
So, the belief that persons are resurrected to be cast into hellfire, is not compatible with this scripture, which says that "Hell gave up the dead that were in them".

The correct understanding therefore, is that the second resurrection, takes place during the 1,000 years, where persons are given an opportunity to learn the truth (books were opened), and be judged based on their response to those things written. Revelation 20:12
They could have their names written in the book of life, be living in harmony with the things written in the books.

This is the picture these scriptures paint for us.

 

[CoreyD]

Basically because this was the first resurrection, and this is where we get the new birth and eternal life. We were quickened together with Him, and received His life.

Where do you read that in the Bible?
I have not read any scripture which refers to spiritual resurrection as the first resurrection.
This is your opinion.
If you are not using scripture to back up your response, or you are speaking from personal opinion, please preface your statements with "In my opinion," or "I believe."

These scriptures all refer to Jesus' resurrection as the first.
Acts 26:23

that the Messiah would suffer and, as the first to rise from the dead, would bring the message of light to his own people and to the Gentiles.”

Colossians 1:18

He is also the head of the body, the church; and He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, so that He Himself will come to have first place in everything.

Revelation 1:5

and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and has released us from our sins by His blood,

 

[CoreyD]

John affirms what false prophets deny, namely that “Jesus Christ [is] coming in the flesh” (2 John 7). Paul adds that once the cosmic conflict is over, all things will again be subject to the Father, and “the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God be all in all” ( 1 Cor. 15:28, NASB). The Incarnation will never be suspended. Christ became human forever. His sacrifice is an eternal one.

Yes, Jesus came in the flesh.
How else could he die, if he did not come in flesh.
1 Peter 3:18 says, he was put to death in the flesh.

Jesus became man in a human form to forever bridge the separation between mankind and God ... to become all in all ... Everything exists through Him and for Him and will continue to exist through Him and for Him for eternity.

The end of the Incarnation would be the end of our divine-human Saviour. It is simply impossible for this to happen…What happened in the Incarnation was not something that could be undone once it accomplished its purpose.

Colossians 1:21–23

And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard.

The appearance of Jesus after His accession.

Luke 24:9

Berean Literal Bible
See My hands and My feet, that I am He. Touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones, as you see Me having."

He was and is man and God forever.

So God is not a spirit? John 4:24

 

[CoreyD]

I don't ... those in the 1st are the saved .... those in the 2nd are the lost ... sorry if i didn't make that clear.

You did.
I asked why you refer to those - in the second resurrection - as lost?

 

[eleos1954]

All of that is in 2 Thessalonians 2 KJV?

I don't see...

Which verse please?

I don't see...

Which verse please?

You said this before.

I was hoping you would answer as to why you refer to these as lost? Since no scripture does.
That is your opinion, then.
Please be reminded...
If you are not using scripture to back up your response, or you are speaking from personal opinion, please preface your statements with "In my opinion," or "I believe."

Thanks however for giving me the picture you see. I appreciate that.
Regarding judgment, the scriptures tell us this:
Matthew 12:40-42
40 For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41 The men of Nineveh will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and indeed a greater than Jonah is here. 42 The queen of the South will rise up in the judgment with this generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and indeed a greater than Solomon is here.

Matthew 5:28, 29
28 Do not be amazed at this; for a time is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,
29 and will come out: those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the bad deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

So, the Bible does say there will be a resurrection to judgment.
All judgment for all times has not taken place at Jesus' coming.
This period is called judgment day. Matthew 10:15; Matthew 11:22-24
Since John 5:28, 29, and Acts 24:15 occurs at the same time as Revelation 20:12, 13, this resurrection is the same - the second.

Some people believe that this amounts to God resurrecting people to just judge them as evil, and send them to eternal torments.
This however, is not compatible with the scriptural purpose of the resurrection, and in that light, makes no sense.

The apostle Paul, in speaking positively about the resurrection, said, "I have a hope in God, which these men themselves also accept / await / welcome, that there is going to be a resurrection, both of the righteous and the unrighteous" Acts 24:15
They looked forward to the resurrection, because both the righteous, and the unrighteous, would be coming back.

Certainly, no one welcomes being raised up to be banished to eternal torment.
We welcome a second chance at life, So the unrighteous dead would indeed have that chance, during the 1,000 years. Revelation 20:12, 13

Also it is during this resurrection that the Bible says, "The sea gave up its dead, and Death and Hades (Hell according to KJV and other translations) gave up their dead, and each one was judged according to his deeds". Revelation 20:13
So, the belief that persons are resurrected to be cast into hellfire, is not compatible with this scripture, which says that "Hell gave up the dead that were in them".

The correct understanding therefore, is that the second resurrection, takes place during the 1,000 years, where persons are given an opportunity to learn the truth (books were opened), and be judged based on their response to those things written. Revelation 20:12
They could have their names written in the book of life, be living in harmony with the things written in the books.

This is the picture these scriptures paint for us.
View attachment 351333

Paul was aware of separate resurrections for the saved and unsaved when he wrote that when Christ comes the saved will rise first.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16 NKJV

The saved will then judge the unsaved for a thousand years.

And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them….. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power…Revelation 20:4-6 NKJV

The saved only die once. When they are resurrected in the first resurrection they will live eternally. They will not die a second time. But when the unsaved are resurrected at the end of the thousand years, Satan will tempt them to try and destroy the New Jerusalem, and that is when the fire will come down from God and destroy them. They will be tormented day and night forever, or in other words for the rest of their lives-until they die, and will never live again.

Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever. Revelation 20:7-10 NKJV
Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:14-15 NKJV

The unsaved will then experience the second-eternal death, never to live again, while the saved enjoy the new earth for all eternity, never to die again. We see these concepts in the story where Jesus resurrected Lazarus.

Judgement takes place in heaven (before Jesus returns) .... the books are opened in heaven ... the books in heaven contain every persons life that they lived and they are judged by them ... what is written in the books .... those in Christ will be pardoned ... and these are in the first resurrection and go to heaven for 1,000 years.

The book of life contains the names of all who have ever entered the service of God. Jesus bade His disciples: “Rejoice, because your names are written in heaven” (Luke 10:20). Paul speaks of his faithful fellow workers, “whose names are in the book of life” (Philippians 4:3). Daniel, looking down to “a time of trouble, such as never was,” declares that God's people shall be delivered, “every one that shall be found written in the book.” And the revelator says that those only shall enter the city of God whose names “are written in the Lamb's book of life” (Daniel 12:1; Revelation 21:27).

1 Corinthians 15:23
22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ the firstfruits; then at His coming, those who belong to Him.

1 Corinthians 6:3

New King James Version
Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?

Paul sums it up nicely here ....

1 Thessalonians 4


The Return of the Lord

13Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. 14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

18Therefore encourage one another with these words.

If there is a first to rise then there is a second, that happens later.

Those in Christ first ... but that leaves those no in Christ (the rest of the dead)

“The rest (the second) of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended” (Revelation 20:5, ESV).

When this second group of people are raised from the dead, they will not experience eternal life. Instead, they will experience the Second Death—complete separation from God for eternity. And when anyone is separated from their life force (breath of life), they cease to exist.

“Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:14, 15, ESV).

There is no reason to state a "first" ...unless there is a second.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Where do you read that in the Bible?
I have not read any scripture which refers to spiritual resurrection as the first resurrection.
This is your opinion....

Post #6
Later in Collisans, Paul expands on the topic of the spiritual resurrection of Christ the head together with His body, which is each believer individually:

Colossians 2:12-13 KJV
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Jesus is the head. When God raised the head, the body came with Him. This occurred on the 3rd day when God raised Him. This is primarily speaking of the spiritual resurrection, where we were raised up together with Him.

Ephesians 2:1-6 KJV
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

A more accurate translation of John 3:15-16 shows us how eternal life comes to us. We believe "into Christ."

John 3:15 LITV
15 that everyone believing into Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that everyone believing into Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This passage discusses the need to be born again. We are born again by believing "into" Christ, that is, His death, burial, and resurrection, which Paul calls being baptized into Christ.

Romans 6:3-4 LITV
3 Or are you ignorant that all who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?
4 Therefore, we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, so also we should walk in newness of life.

Peter restates this principle in his own terminology:

1 Peter 1:3 KJV
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The resurrection of Jesus imparted the new birth to believers, which is the reception of eternal life.

 

[CoreyD]

Post #6
Later in Collisans, Paul expands on the topic of the spiritual resurrection of Christ the head together with His body, which is each believer individually:

Colossians 2:12-13 KJV
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

Jesus is the head. When God raised the head, the body came with Him. This occurred on the 3rd day when God raised Him. This is primarily speaking of the spiritual resurrection, where we were raised up together with Him.

Ephesians 2:1-6 KJV
1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

A more accurate translation of John 3:15-16 shows us how eternal life comes to us. We believe "into Christ."

John 3:15 LITV
15 that everyone believing into Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that everyone believing into Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This passage discusses the need to be born again. We are born again by believing "into" Christ, that is, His death, burial, and resurrection, which Paul calls being baptized into Christ.

Romans 6:3-4 LITV
3 Or are you ignorant that all who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?
4 Therefore, we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, so also we should walk in newness of life.

Peter restates this principle in his own terminology:

1 Peter 1:3 KJV
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

The resurrection of Jesus imparted the new birth to believers, which is the reception of eternal life.

Try this.
Go to post #6. Hit Ctrl+F, and type the word "first".
Tell me if you see any highlights in Post #6.
Do the same for this post.

Nothing in post #6 nor this post has any scripture which refers to spiritual resurrection as the first resurrection.
This is your opinion....

You are off on a different subject to the OP.

 

[CoreyD]

Basically because this was the first resurrection, and this is where we get the new birth and eternal life. We were quickened together with Him, and received His life.

This is your opinion.
Let me ask... would you agree the scriptures you used do not refer to that resurrection as the first?

 

[CoreyD]

Paul was aware of separate resurrections for the saved and unsaved when he wrote that when Christ comes the saved will rise first.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16 NKJV

I am not familiar with that term, unsaved.
Which translation are you quoting?
Does unsaved refer to unrighteous, as mentioned at Acts 24:15?
If so, the righteous and unrighteous mentioned there are the same as mentioned at John 5:28, 29.
Do you agree?

In which case, the righteous are not referred to as the heirs of the kingdom.
The Bible refers to righteous as those who fear God, and this includes persons going all the way back to Abel.

The saved will then judge the unsaved for a thousand years.

Only those having part in the first resurrection, will judge the unrighteous for the thousand years. Revelation 20:4
Who has part in the first resurrection? Jesus, and then whom?

The saved only die once. When they are resurrected in the first resurrection they will live eternally. They will not die a second time.

The Bible says the second death has no authority over those having part in the first resurrection. Revelation 20:6
They are immortal, and cannot die again. 1 Corinthians 15:54

But when the unsaved are resurrected at the end of the thousand years, Satan will tempt them to try and destroy the New Jerusalem, and that is when the fire will come down from God and destroy them. They will be tormented day and night forever, or in other words for the rest of their lives-until they die, and will never live again.

The "unsaved" are resurrected twice, then?
If the unsaved are judged during the thousand years, then how are they resurrected at the end of the thousand years?

Interestingly, that can be put in proper perspective, if you understood it as the scriptures paint it for us.
The unrighteous are judged by the Saints, during the thousand years.
At the end of the thousand years 'the dead - the unrighteous - come to life'. That is, they come to life spiritually, as they no longer have sin.

Remember, in Revelation 20:12, who are standing before the throne?
"I saw the dead, both great and small".

Are these dead people, in a physical sense? No. They are "standing before the throne, and books were opened".
So these people are the spiritually dead - the same as unrighteous, who are being judged for the 1,000 years.

How then do they come alive spiritually?
The same way we did.
John 15:3; John 17:17; 2 Corinthians 3:6; Ephesians 2:1, 5; Colossians 2:13; 2 Thessalonians 2:13
By means of God's word, and spirit, made possible through the sacrificial blood of the lamb.

So, these ones need to be taught God's word to be cleansed (Books were opened).
As High Priest, with his joint priests, Christ applies the blood of the sacrifice to those resurrected unrighteous ones, and they can have their sins forgiven, and completely cleansed, or removed. Hebrews 4:15; Hebrews 7:24, 25

The Saints too, as priests, and judges, are able to sympathize, having gone through greater trials on earth.
By the end of the thousand years, their sins are scrubbed clean. They are sinless - perfect. Hebrews 10:1, 14; Hebrews 7:11

The unsaved will then experience the second-eternal death, never to live again, while the saved enjoy the new earth for all eternity, never to die again. We see these concepts in the story where Jesus resurrected Lazarus.

I really wish I knew what you meant by unsaved, but those whose names are not written in the book of life are wicked, and they do experience the second death - eternal death.
Perhaps we agree, but the terms are what has me uncertain.

Judgement takes place in heaven (before Jesus returns) .... the books are opened in heaven ... the books in heaven contain every persons life that they lived and they are judged by them ... what is written in the books .... those in Christ will be pardoned ... and these are in the first resurrection and go to heaven for 1,000 years.

I understand that this is what many believe - that God keeps a record of every deed one does, and those who die unrighteous, brings them back to life to torment them forever, but as I pointed out, this view is not supported in the Bible.
Do you believe this scripture? Romans 6:7
Does it agree with what you are saying?

The book of life contains the names of all who have ever entered the service of God. Jesus bade His disciples: “Rejoice, because your names are written in heaven” (Luke 10:20). Paul speaks of his faithful fellow workers, “whose names are in the book of life” (Philippians 4:3). Daniel, looking down to “a time of trouble, such as never was,” declares that God's people shall be delivered, “every one that shall be found written in the book.” And the revelator says that those only shall enter the city of God whose names “are written in the Lamb's book of life” (Daniel 12:1; Revelation 21:27).

Thanks for those scriptural references.
Yes, the righteous ones all have their names written in the book of life.

1 Corinthians 15:23
22For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23But each in his own turn: Christ the firstfruits; then at His coming, those who belong to Him.

1 Corinthians 6:3

New King James Version
Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?

Paul sums it up nicely here ....

1 Thessalonians 4


The Return of the Lord

13Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death, so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope. 14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

18Therefore encourage one another with these words.

If there is a first to rise then there is a second, that happens later.

Those in Christ first ... but that leaves those no in Christ (the rest of the dead)

“The rest (the second) of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended” (Revelation 20:5, ESV).

When this second group of people are raised from the dead, they will not experience eternal life. Instead, they will experience the Second Death—complete separation from God for eternity. And when anyone is separated from their life force (breath of life), they cease to exist.

“Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:14, 15, ESV).

There is no reason to state a "first" ...unless there is a second.

Thanks again.
Can you please give me a list of at least a dozen names of those dead in Christ?

 

[eleos1954]

I am not familiar with that term, unsaved.
Which translation are you quoting?
Does unsaved refer to unrighteous, as mentioned at Acts 24:15?
If so, the righteous and unrighteous mentioned there are the same as mentioned at John 5:28, 29.
Do you agree?

In which case, the righteous are not referred to as the heirs of the kingdom.
The Bible refers to righteous as those who fear God, and this includes persons going all the way back to Abel.


Only those having part in the first resurrection, will judge the unrighteous for the thousand years. Revelation 20:4
Who has part in the first resurrection? Jesus, and then whom?


The Bible says the second death has no authority over those having part in the first resurrection. Revelation 20:6
They are immortal, and cannot die again. 1 Corinthians 15:54


The "unsaved" are resurrected twice, then?
If the unsaved are judged during the thousand years, then how are they resurrected at the end of the thousand years?

Interestingly, that can be put in proper perspective, if you understood it as the scriptures paint it for us.
The unrighteous are judged by the Saints, during the thousand years.
At the end of the thousand years 'the dead - the unrighteous - come to life'. That is, they come to life spiritually, as they no longer have sin.

Remember, in Revelation 20:12, who are standing before the throne?
"I saw the dead, both great and small".

Are these dead people, in a physical sense? No. They are "standing before the throne, and books were opened".
So these people are the spiritually dead - the same as unrighteous, who are being judged for the 1,000 years.

How then do they come alive spiritually?
The same way we did.
John 15:3; John 17:17; 2 Corinthians 3:6; Ephesians 2:1, 5; Colossians 2:13; 2 Thessalonians 2:13
By means of God's word, and spirit, made possible through the sacrificial blood of the lamb.

So, these ones need to be taught God's word to be cleansed (Books were opened).
As High Priest, with his joint priests, Christ applies the blood of the sacrifice to those resurrected unrighteous ones, and they can have their sins forgiven, and completely cleansed, or removed. Hebrews 4:15; Hebrews 7:24, 25

The Saints too, as priests, and judges, are able to sympathize, having gone through greater trials on earth.
By the end of the thousand years, their sins are scrubbed clean. They are sinless - perfect. Hebrews 10:1, 14; Hebrews 7:11


I really wish I knew what you meant by unsaved, but those whose names are not written in the book of life are wicked, and they do experience the second death - eternal death.
Perhaps we agree, but the terms are what has me uncertain.


I understand that this is what many believe - that God keeps a record of every deed one does, and those who die unrighteous, brings them back to life to torment them forever, but as I pointed out, this view is not supported in the Bible.
Do you believe this scripture? Romans 6:7
Does it agree with what you are saying?


Thanks for those scriptural references.
Yes, the righteous ones all have their names written in the book of life.


Thanks again.
Can you please give me a list of at least a dozen names of those dead in Christ?

Those who have a sincere on-going relationship with Christ are the saved (those who do not are the unsaved). Judgement is completely up to Jesus ... only He knows the secret things ... we are not privy to a "list of names" ... what we know is what kind of character a person should have to receive eternal life ... and that is to be like Christ ... He is our example in everything.

When one accepts Jesus as their Lord and Savior they begin to have a spiritual relationship with Him .... through the Holy Spirit then works in the believer to help them change their thinking and doing away from sin. If one does not have a spiritual relationship with Christ they are spiritually dead ... if they remain that way they will not receive eternal life ... they will experience 2 deaths ... spiritual and physical.

When Jesus returns the 1st resurrection happens and those will receive glorified bodies along with a pure spiritual condition ... this is when both the spiritual and physical come together for eternity. Right now we live on the promise this will happen.

Of course God keeps a record of everyone's life .... how else can He judge anyone? God knows everything. The record of His keeping is described as "books" ... if one remains in the book of life they will receive eternal life when Jesus returns.

The (saved) are those who died a earthly death but not a spiritual death in Christ ... those believers who have died (earthly death) prior to the second coming of Christ... (a few living at the time of His return will be translated-won't experience the 1st death nor the 2nd death) as

Revelation states there will be a 'remnant".

There is special meaning to the remnant of believers that will exist in the last days, when earth is at its worst, right before Christ's Second Coming. Scripture tells us who will make up this end-time remnant: those “who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus” (Revelation 12:17, ESV)

1 John 3:20 ESV​

For whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything.

God does not torment people for eternity .... there is no "burning place" ... hell is the grave ... when one dies earthly death (1st death) ... they are in a dormant state in the grave .... described biblically as a sleep ... appropriately because one day all will be resurrection ... each in their own turn.

The unrighteous are judged by the Saints, during the thousand years.
At the end of the thousand years 'the dead - the unrighteous - come to life'. That is, they come to life spiritually, as they no longer have sin.

No ... the unrighteous dead are raised physically (with corruptible bodies) and are spiritually dead dead as well. They went to the grave spiritually and physically dead in their sin and will remain that way and will be resurrected in that state ... they will not be given immortality ... subject to the 2nd death of which is for eternity. They are raised totally corruptible (spiritually and physically). They are indeed raised in their sinful condition (both spiritual and physical)

Judgement is totally up to Jesus (not us) .... during the 1,000 years the saints (in heaven) will have access to all of God's judgements of those in the 2nd resurrection and it will be found by the saints that God executed perfect judgement in every case. All records of judgement will be open to us. The judgement of the saints after looking at the records will be in total agreement of that of Gods judgements were.

John 5
21For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whom He wishes. 22Furthermore, the Father judges no one, but has assigned all judgment to the Son, 23so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.…
Berean Standard Bible

When Jesus returns His judgement has taken place and the 1st resurrection is of those of whom Jesus applied His righteousness to and He takes them to heaven for the 1,000 years (the saved for eternity) ... everyone else left on planet earth are destroyed .... after the 1,000 years in heaven .... THEN the 2nd resurrection (of the lost - unsaved) happens .... the New Jerusalem from heaven descends to the earth (along with the saints fully under God's protection) and all the wicked lost, satan and his angels attack the city .... this is the battle of Gog and Magog .... and God then destroys them for eternity ... never to exist again (2nd death for eternity). He then makes everything new and He dwells with His people for eternity.

Do you believe this scripture? Romans 6:7 ... yes of course, in context

Context is important ... in the context here Paul is talking about those who are in Christ (believers).

Resurrections ... in their order ...

1st Jesus - already done (overcame eternal death)
2nd - resurrection of those in Christ (the saved) when Jesus returns (changed given immortality for eternity)
interlude - 1,000 years spent in heaven by the saved ... then after the 1,000 years
3rd - resurrection of the lost (unsaved) raised in their sinful condition (unchanged) as they were when they died earthly death)

In some of the passages it talks about both groups ... but in other passages we find how that takes place .... all will hear His voice and come forth our of the grave but not at the same time and not in the same condition ... their are 2 resurrections separated by the 1,000 years.

 

[CoreyD]

Those who have a sincere on-going relationship with Christ are the saved (those who do not are the unsaved). Judgement is completely up to Jesus ... only He knows the secret things ... we are not privy to a "list of names" ... what we know is what kind of character a person should have to receive eternal life ... and that is to be like Christ ... He is our example in everything.

That is interesting.
You do not know the names of twelve righteous men?
Did God not outline what righteous is, and give us a long list of names of righteous ones, as well as their examples?

When one accepts Jesus as their Lord and Savior they begin to have a spiritual relationship with Him .... through the Holy Spirit then works in the believer to help them change their thinking and doing away from sin. If one does not have a spiritual relationship with Christ they are spiritually dead ... if they remain that way they will not receive eternal life ... they will experience 2 deaths ... spiritual and physical.

If one does not have a spiritual relationship with Christ, are they not spiritually dead?
So, they are dead, and they die physically, from the wages of sin. Romans 6:23
Do you agree with that?

These ones are not righteous. They are unrighteous.
These ones get a resurrection to judgment, according to John 5:28, 29, and Acts 24:15.
Do you agree with that?
When do you say this resurrection occurs?

Spiritually dead ones are "standing before the throne". Revelation 20:12
Are these the same unrighteous ones who are resurrected?

When Jesus returns the 1st resurrection happens and those will receive glorified bodies along with a pure spiritual condition ... this is when both the spiritual and physical come together for eternity. Right now we live on the promise this will happen.

Of course God keeps a record of everyone's life .... how else can He judge anyone? God knows everything. The record of His keeping is described as "books" ... if one remains in the book of life they will receive eternal life when Jesus returns.

You asked a question. Let us answer that.
So, you are doing wrong, and you change, and start doing good. What happens to your record?

The (saved) are those who died a earthly death but not a spiritual death in Christ ... those believers who have died (earthly death) prior to the second coming of Christ... (a few living at the time of His return will be translated-won't experience the 1st death nor the 2nd death) as
Revelation states there will be a 'remnant".

There is special meaning to the remnant of believers that will exist in the last days, when earth is at its worst, right before Christ's Second Coming. Scripture tells us who will make up this end-time remnant: those “who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus” (Revelation 12:17, ESV)

Can you elaborate?
You are saying the saved are all the people that died physically, but not a spiritual death in Christ. So would this be from Abel all the way through to today?
You are saying that some of those believers - the remnant - those who are alive at Jesus' coming, will not die?
How will they put on incorruptibility?
Didn't Paul say, in 1 Corinthians 15:36, "Senseless man, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die first."?

So, they must die, don't they.
What about Romans 6:7? Doesn't death cancel out sins?

1 John 3:20 ESV​

For whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything.

God does not torment people for eternity .... there is no "burning place" ... hell is the grave ... when one dies earthly death (1st death) ... they are in a dormant state in the grave .... described biblically as a sleep ... appropriately because one day all will be resurrection ... each in their own turn.

I'm glad we agree on that, if of course you mean all but the wicked.
The Bible holds out no hope for the wicked. Job 11:20; Proverbs 10:28; Proverbs 11:7

No ... the unrighteous dead are raised physically (with corruptible bodies) and are spiritually dead dead as well. They went to the grave spiritually and physically dead in their sin and will remain that way and will be resurrected in that state ... they will not be given immortality ...

I do agree with that.
When are these ones be resurrected?

subject to the 2nd death of which is for eternity. They are raised totally corruptible (spiritually and physically). They are indeed raised in their sinful condition (both spiritual and physical)

Yes, indeed, they are subject to the second death.
Is this conditional - based on what their life is like during the 1,000 years, or are they resurrected and then instantly cast into the lake of fire?

Judgement is totally up to Jesus (not us) .... during the 1,000 years the saints (in heaven) will have access to all of God's judgements of those in the 2nd resurrection and it will be found by the saints that God executed perfect judgement in every case. All records of judgement will be open to us. The judgement of the saints after looking at the records will be in total agreement of that of Gods judgements were.

I understand this is your opinion.
We can see if that fits well with what we establish.

John 5
21For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, so also the Son gives life to whom He wishes. 22Furthermore, the Father judges no one, but has assigned all judgment to the Son, 23so that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. Whoever does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him.…
Berean Standard Bible

When Jesus returns His judgement has taken place and the 1st resurrection is of those of whom Jesus applied His righteousness to and He takes them to heaven for the 1,000 years (the saved for eternity) ... everyone else left on planet earth are destroyed .... after the 1,000 years in heaven .... THEN the 2nd resurrection (of the lost - unsaved) happens .... the New Jerusalem from heaven descends to the earth (along with the saints fully under God's protection) and all the wicked lost, satan and his angels attack the city .... this is the battle of Gog and Magog .... and God then destroys them for eternity ... never to exist again (2nd death for eternity). He then makes everything new and He dwells with His people for eternity.

Is there a scripture that supports the view that "when Jesus returns His judgment has taken place"?

Do you believe this scripture? Romans 6:7 ... yes of course, in context

Context is important ... in the context here Paul is talking about those who are in Christ (believers).

Fair enough.

Judgement takes place in heaven (before Jesus returns) .... the books are opened in heaven ... the books in heaven contain every persons life that they lived and they are judged by them ...

So, you believe Romans 6:7 only applying to believers, and not to persons who die physically.
Just for the record, could you please explain, Romans 6:7 in its proper context.

Resurrections ... in their order ...

1st Jesus - already done (overcame eternal death)
2nd - resurrection of those in Christ (the saved) when Jesus returns (changed given immortality for eternity)
interlude - 1,000 years spent in heaven by the saved ... then after the 1,000 years
3rd - resurrection of the lost (unsaved) raised in their sinful condition (unchanged) as they were when they died earthly death)

Whoa Whoa Whoa.
There is a third resurrection now!!!?
Back up a bit please.

eleos1954 said:
.... after the 1,000 years the 2nd resurrection (of the lost) takes place .... the battle of Gog and Magog takes places .... attacks the New Jerusalem that has descended from heaven. God destroys the earth and everything in it (this is the 2nd death for eternity) and then makes everything new and His people will dwell with Him forever on the new earth. Amen!

.... after the 1,000 years in heaven .... THEN the 2nd resurrection (of the lost - unsaved) happens .... the New Jerusalem from heaven descends to the earth (along with the saints fully under God's protection) and all the wicked lost, satan and his angels attack the city .... this is the battle of Gog and Magog .... and God then destroys them for eternity ... never to exist again (2nd death for eternity). He then makes everything new and He dwells with His people for eternity.

Have you made a change?
According to Revelation 20:4-6, who have part in the first resurrection?

In some of the passages it talks about both groups ... but in other passages we find how that takes place .... all will hear His voice and come forth our of the grave but not at the same time and not in the same condition ... their are 2 resurrections separated by the 1,000 years.

Your opinion, yes.
However, let's hear from the scripture. That's important. our opinions are not important.

 

[CoreyD]

Hey, Mark.
I decided to ask here, since a poster used the term unsaved, which I am not familiar with, but I noticed you used the same term - "unsaved".
What's an unsaved person?

I know the scriptures talk about righteous, unrighteous and wicked.
I know the wicked are destroyed, or die without a hope of ever coming back.
However, the Bible holds out hope for both the righteous and unrighteous (Acts 24:15; John 5:28, 29).
So neither of those can be considered "unsaved".

So, can you please explain whom you use the term "unsaved" toward, and what scriptures you use to support that.
Thanks.

 

[Mark Corbett]

Hey, Mark.
I decided to ask here, since a poster used the term unsaved, which I am not familiar with, but I noticed you used the same term - "unsaved".
What's an unsaved person?

I know the scriptures talk about righteous, unrighteous and wicked.
I know the wicked are destroyed, or die without a hope of ever coming back.
However, the Bible holds out hope for both the righteous and unrighteous (Acts 24:15; John 5:28, 29).
So neither of those can be considered "unsaved".

So, can you please explain whom you use the term "unsaved" toward, and what scriptures you use to support that.
Thanks.

Although the Bible does not use the term "unsaved," it does talk Jesus saving His people:

CSB Matthew 1:21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to name Him Jesus, because He will save His people from their sins."

CSB John 10:9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved and will come in and go out and find pasture.

CSB Acts 2:21 Then everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

CSB Romans 10:9 If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

So, the "unsaved" are those who never to their death truly confess "Jesus is Lord," they do not enter into God's grace through Jesus, and they are not part of Jesus' people who have been saved from sins.

There are many other verses that mention being saved.

 

[CoreyD]

Although the Bible does not use the term "unsaved," it does talk Jesus saving His people:

CSB Matthew 1:21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to name Him Jesus, because He will save His people from their sins."

CSB John 10:9 I am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved and will come in and go out and find pasture.

CSB Acts 2:21 Then everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.

CSB Romans 10:9 If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

So, the "unsaved" are those who never to their death truly confess "Jesus is Lord," they do not enter into God's grace through Jesus, and they are not part of Jesus' people who have been saved from sins.

There are many other verses that mention being saved.

Oh, okay. So, you use opposites.
Can a person that has been saved become unsaved, and can an "unsaved" person be saved?

 

[Mark Corbett]

Oh, okay. So, you use opposites.
Can a person that has been saved become unsaved, and can an "unsaved" person be saved?

There is no question at all whether or not an unsaved person can become saved. The answer is yes. It happens when they hear the Gospel and they believe it and trust in Jesus.
Whether or not a truly saved person can become unsaved is a much more complex topic. Certainly, there are people who thought they were saved, and others thought they were saved, and then they abandoned the Christian faith they once seemed to have. So, it looks like they were saved and became unsaved. But perhaps they were never truly saved? Either way, I recommend not testing it!

 

[eleos1954]

That is interesting.
You do not know the names of twelve righteous men?
Did God not outline what righteous is, and give us a long list of names of righteous ones, as well as their examples?


If one does not have a spiritual relationship with Christ, are they not spiritually dead?
So, they are dead, and they die physically, from the wages of sin. Romans 6:23
Do you agree with that?

These ones are not righteous. They are unrighteous.
These ones get a resurrection to judgment, according to John 5:28, 29, and Acts 24:15.
Do you agree with that?
When do you say this resurrection occurs?

Spiritually dead ones are "standing before the throne". Revelation 20:12
Are these the same unrighteous ones who are resurrected?

You asked a question. Let us answer that.
So, you are doing wrong, and you change, and start doing good. What happens to your record?


Can you elaborate?
You are saying the saved are all the people that died physically, but not a spiritual death in Christ. So would this be from Abel all the way through to today?
You are saying that some of those believers - the remnant - those who are alive at Jesus' coming, will not die?
How will they put on incorruptibility?
Didn't Paul say, in 1 Corinthians 15:36, "Senseless man, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die first."?

So, they must die, don't they.
What about Romans 6:7? Doesn't death cancel out sins?



I'm glad we agree on that, if of course you mean all but the wicked.
The Bible holds out no hope for the wicked. Job 11:20; Proverbs 10:28; Proverbs 11:7


I do agree with that.
When are these ones be resurrected?


Yes, indeed, they are subject to the second death.
Is this conditional - based on what their life is like during the 1,000 years, or are they resurrected and then instantly cast into the lake of fire?


I understand this is your opinion.
We can see if that fits well with what we establish.


Is there a scripture that supports the view that "when Jesus returns His judgment has taken place"?


Fair enough.

So, you believe Romans 6:7 only applying to believers, and not to persons who die physically.
Just for the record, could you please explain, Romans 6:7 in its proper context.


Whoa Whoa Whoa.
There is a third resurrection now!!!?
Back up a bit please.

eleos1954 said:
.... after the 1,000 years the 2nd resurrection (of the lost) takes place .... the battle of Gog and Magog takes places .... attacks the New Jerusalem that has descended from heaven. God destroys the earth and everything in it (this is the 2nd death for eternity) and then makes everything new and His people will dwell with Him forever on the new earth. Amen!



Have you made a change?
According to Revelation 20:4-6, who have part in the first resurrection?


Your opinion, yes.
However, let's hear from the scripture. That's important. our opinions are not important.

You asked a question. Let us answer that.
So, you are doing wrong, and you change, and start doing good. What happens to your record?

There is no one that does good. We are judged by the law (everybody is), and the saved are covered by Christ’s blood (not the lost) … we are seen/deemed as perfect (not that we are or have been) because we are covered by the blood of Jesus.

Every human being has violated the law of God and is under its curse or condemnation (Gal. 3:10). The observance of the law has no atoning power; it cannot deliver from the power of sin because it is incapable of restoring life to sinners (verse 21). In fact, because of humanity’s sinful condition, the law, misused by sin, stimulates them to sin (Rom. 7:8, 9), even though the law itself is good (verse 12). What humans need is God’s grace through faith in Christ. To be under the law—seeking acceptance through it before God—is to exist under its condemnation and consequently under the power of sin (Rom. 3:21, 28).

rightenous … including the apostles.

There is righteousness in two aspects. First, there is the imputed righteousness of Christ, which is what Jesus has done for us, His righteousness that covers us and that is our entry into heaven and is a gift ... one can not "work their way to heaven" by being "good".

Second, there is the imparted righteousness of Christ, which is what He does in us, through the Holy Spirit, to mold us into His image. Thus understood, righteousness has two inseparable components, even though it's all really one righteousness--the righteousness of Christ, without which we would have no hope of salvation at all.

3rd - resurrection of the lost (unsaved) raised in their sinful condition (unchanged) as they were when they died earthly death

This was a typo … there are 2 resurrections.

All are judged in accordance of what is written in the books … the books are in heaven.

Paul was aware of separate resurrections for the saved and the lost when he wrote that when Christ comes the saved will rise first.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16 NKJV


The saved will then judge the unsaved and the fallen angels as well

And I saw thrones, and they sat on them, and judgment was committed to them….. And they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over such the second death has no power…Revelation 20:4-6 NKJV

The first resurrection escapes the power of death ... the second resurrection has no power ... no escape.

Those entering heaven get their sins blotted out after judgement of which has taken place when Christ returns.

Isaiah 43:25
I, yes I, am He who blots out your transgressions for My own sake and remembers your sins no more.

In the book of Micah (Micah 7:19) God says that He will throw the sins of His people into the depths of the sea.

Souls under the alter in heaven

The “souls” under the altar are symbolic. By taking them literally, one would have to conclude that the martyrs are not fully happy in heaven, for they are still crying out for vengeance.

This hardly sounds as if they are enjoying the reward of salvation. The desire for vengeance can make your life miserable.

John was not given a view of heaven as it actually is. “There are no white, red, black, or pale horses there with warlike riders. Jesus does not appear there in the form of a lamb with a bleeding knife wound. The four beasts do not represent actual winged creatures of the animal characteristics noted. Likewise, there are no ‘souls’ lying at the base of an altar in heaven. The whole scene was a powerful pictorial and symbolic representation.”

Revelation 20

4Then I saw the thrones, and those seated on them had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image, and had not received its mark on their foreheads or hands. And they came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
The vision John had was after all the saved had come to life and were in heaven.

1 Corinthians 6:3 CEV
Don't you know we will judge angels?

Paul describes nicely here about the return of Jesus

1 Thessalonians 4

The Return of the Lord


13But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18Wherefore comfort one another with these words.


Important notes:


People are in a dormant sleep in the grave.

We who are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord
(represents the remnant in Revelation)

The dead in Christ will rise first (before the others ... who are the others? the lost

Will bring with Him … to where? Heaven

Meet the Lord in the air … (not on planet earth)

Shall ever be with the Lord … from that time throughout eternity

John 14:3

Berean Literal Bible
And if I go and prepare a place for you, I am coming again and will receive you to Myself, that where I am, you may be also.

Where is Jesus? He's in heaven ... we go to be with Him at the first resurrection.

Revelation 20:6
KJ21
Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with Him a thousand years.

Blessed and holy in the 1st resurrection ... the lost are not deemed blessed and holy and are not in the 1st resurrection.

 

[CoreyD]

There is no question at all whether or not an unsaved person can become saved. The answer is yes. It happens when they hear the Gospel and they believe it and trust in Jesus.
Whether or not a truly saved person can become unsaved is a much more complex topic. Certainly, there are people who thought they were saved, and others thought they were saved, and then they abandoned the Christian faith they once seemed to have. So, it looks like they were saved and became unsaved. But perhaps they were never truly saved? Either way, I recommend not testing it!

That's interesting.
It puts saved in a different light now.
Matthew 24:13 says, "But the one who endures to the end will be saved."
So, saved in this context, means that nobody is saved, until they prove faithful to the end of their life, or the end of this world.

The scriptures you used are in a different context, and refers to a condition that can change.
For example, Hebrews 6:4-8 reads...

4 It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age 6 and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace. 7 Land that drinks in the rain often falling on it and that produces a crop useful to those for whom it is farmed receives the blessing of God. 8 But land that produces thorns and thistles is worthless and is in danger of being cursed. In the end it will be burned.​

So those who are in a saved condition, can fall away.
That would put them in what you refer to as "unsaved"... but now, Paul said, "It is impossible for those to be brought back to repentance."
They cannot be saved. The saved person who becomes "unsaved", cannot be saved.

This puts things in some new light.
A person that can be saved, is not wicked, hence, "unsaved" would have to be used in two different contexts.

1. the person is not in a saved condition - an unbeliever - who can either be 1) a wicked person, or 2) an unrighteous person.
2. the person is a believer, but has fallen away, thus becoming wicked.

The unbeliever, can become a believer. The unrighteous can become righteous. In that case, the "unsaved" can be saved.
The saved, in the context you used, can become unsaved. They are then, not unrighteous, nor righteous, but wicked.