Who Won the First Republican Debate?

[essentialsaltes]

538 asked likely GOP primary voters who did best and worst, and a few other questions, including some comparisons from before and after the debate.

Here's the post-debate shift in general support. Looks like Haley got the largest magnitude gain, while Burgum got the largest percentage increase, more than doubling from Nowheres-ville all the way to Both Dakotas.

 

[St_Worm2]

Ramaswamy is a Soros sponsored Hindu vegetarian that criticizes killing animals for food, who is "Polythestic" believing in many "gods"

Hello Truth7t7, yes, I know that he is of the Hindu faith (which holds to a seemingly countless # of "gods"). With that thought in mind, I find it interesting that he did not say, "the gods are real" (instead of "God is real").

However, considering the context of what he said above (in point #1 of his "10 Truths", that "we come from different walks but are bound by a common creed"), it seems clear that he was not referring to the "gods" of his particular "faith", or to anyone else's for that matter, but to "God", in general, as the "higher power" to which most people look to know what "truth" is (whoever their God/gods may be), as well the One by Whom they believe that they will be held accountable in the age to come (for what they did with "the truth" throughout their lives here).

As far as his "personal" beliefs go, vegetarian or otherwise, what does that have to do with this discussion? That said, here's a quote from him on this topic.

"I was a biotech investor for nearly seven years, and I was a biotech CEO for nearly seven years after that. I have many personal beliefs on matters that went beyond biotechnology. For example, I’m vegetarian because I believe it is wrong to kill sentient animals for culinary pleasure. But ~I never banned my employees from eating meat."~ ​

​

~Written Testimony of Vivek Ramaswamy Before the U.S. Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Hearing Entitled “The Dignity of Work” April 29, 2021​

​

--David
p.s. - everything that you've posted in this thread so far about Ramaswamy has been deceptive (innuendos and 1/2 truths, etc.). Why? I assume that you didn't know, because (intentional) lies, innuendos, deceptions and half-truths are the business of politicians and Satan, not Christians (or they certainly shouldn't be anyway, as I'm sure you'd agree).

For what it's worth, I find Ramaswamy interesting in a number of ways (especially as a politician, because he says things that politicians typically do not say), and I believe that he makes a number of very important points (and I also believe that he won the debate the other night). That doesn't mean that I would vote for him (I, in fact, do not believe that he will be the RNC's candidate, or that he could win the general election for President if he was).

Lastly, I wish he would have included something in his "10 Truths" about his position on abortion (especially since he seemed to have no hesitation in addressing other politically "hot" topics in that article). I'm sure that we have not heard the last from him so, hopefully, he will do so soon.

 

[Truth7t7]

Hello Truth7t7, yes, I know that he is of the Hindu faith (which holds to a seemingly countless # of "gods"). With that thought in mind, I find it interesting that he did not say, "the gods are real" (instead of "God is real").

However, considering the context of what he said above (in point #1 of his "10 Truths", that "we come from different walks but are bound by a common creed"), it seems clear that he was not referring to the "gods" of his particular "faith", or to anyone else's for that matter, but to "God", in general, as the "higher power" to which most people look to know what "truth" is (whoever their God/gods may be), as well the One by Whom they believe that they will be held accountable in the age to come (for what they did with "the truth" throughout their lives here).

As far as his "personal" beliefs go, vegetarian or otherwise, what does that have to do with this discussion? That said, here's a quote from him on this topic.

"I was a biotech investor for nearly seven years, and I was a biotech CEO for nearly seven years after that. I have many personal beliefs on matters that went beyond biotechnology. For example, I’m vegetarian because I believe it is wrong to kill sentient animals for culinary pleasure. But ~I never banned my employees from eating meat."~ ​

​

~Written Testimony of Vivek Ramaswamy Before the U.S. Senate Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Hearing Entitled “The Dignity of Work” April 29, 2021​

​

--David
p.s. - everything that you've posted in this thread so far about Ramaswamy has been deceptive (innuendos and 1/2 truths, etc.). Why? I assume that you didn't know, because (intentional) lies, innuendos, deceptions and half-truths are the business of politicians and Satan, not Christians (or they certainly shouldn't be anyway, as I'm sure you'd agree).

For what it's worth, I find Ramaswamy interesting in a number of ways (especially as a politician, because he says things that politicians typically do not say), and I believe that he makes a number of very important points (and I also believe that he won the debate the other night). That doesn't mean that I would vote for him (I, in fact, do not believe that he will be the RNC's candidate, or that he could win the general election for President if he was).

Lastly, I wish he would have included something in his "10 Truths" about his position on abortion (especially since he seemed to have no hesitation in addressing other politically "hot" topics in that article). I'm sure that we have not heard the last from him so, hopefully, he will do so soon.

Hindus follow vegetarianism in a direct association to their religious beliefs in reincarnation and their many god's

They believe souls of humans reincarnate upon death into animals, cows are also considered to be a god in their polythestic beliefs

Ramaswamy will never be a GOP nominee for president IMHO

Wikipedia: Kamadhenu (Sanskrit: कामधेनु, [kaːmɐˈdʱeːnʊ], Kāmadhenu), also known as Surabhi (सुरभि, Surabhi or सुरभी, Surabhī[1]), is a divine bovine-goddess described in Hinduism as the mother of all cows. She is a miraculous cow of plenty who provides her owner whatever he desires and is often portrayed as the mother of other cattle. In iconography, she is generally depicted as a white cow with a female head and breasts, the wings of a bird, and the tail of a peafowl or as a white cow containing various deities within her body. Kamadhenu is not worshipped independently as a goddess. Rather, she is honored by the Hindu veneration of cows, who are regarded as her earthly embodiments.

 

[Truth7t7]

--David
p.s. - everything that you've posted in this thread so far about Ramaswamy has been deceptive (innuendos and 1/2 truths, etc.). Why? I assume that you didn't know, because (intentional) lies, innuendos, deceptions and half-truths are the business of politicians and Satan, not Christians (or they certainly shouldn't be anyway, as I'm sure you'd agree).

Your claims are a "Direct Personal Attack" on a difference of opinion

Jesus Is The Lord

 

[essentialsaltes]

Hindus follow vegetarianism in a direct association to their religious beliefs in reincarnation and their many god's

While vegetarianism is common, it is not universally required in Hinduism.

 

[Arcangl86]

Hindus follow vegetarianism in a direct association to their religious beliefs in reincarnation and their many god's

They believe souls of humans reincarnate upon death into animals, cows are also considered to be a god in their polythestic beliefs

Ramaswamy will never be a GOP nominee for president IMHO

Wikipedia: Kamadhenu (Sanskrit: कामधेनु, [kaːmɐˈdʱeːnʊ], Kāmadhenu), also known as Surabhi (सुरभि, Surabhi or सुरभी, Surabhī[1]), is a divine bovine-goddess described in Hinduism as the mother of all cows. She is a miraculous cow of plenty who provides her owner whatever he desires and is often portrayed as the mother of other cattle. In iconography, she is generally depicted as a white cow with a female head and breasts, the wings of a bird, and the tail of a peafowl or as a white cow containing various deities within her body. Kamadhenu is not worshipped independently as a goddess. Rather, she is honored by the Hindu veneration of cows, who are regarded as her earthly embodiments.

Out of curiosity, how do you feel about identity politics?

 

[BPPLEE]

Trump had my vote; until some fresh young blood, with similar goals, showed up at the debate, where Trump declined to engage him.

Ramaswamy has won my vote.

I liked him too but you should look into some of the businesses that he owned. He was singing a different tune about China a few years back

 

[St_Worm2]

Your claims are a "Direct Personal Attack" on a difference of opinion

Hardly. It was intended to be informative/helpful, NOT an attack of any sort.

p.s. - everything that you've posted in this thread so far about Ramaswamy has been deceptive (innuendos and 1/2 truths, etc.). Why? I assume that you didn't know, because (intentional) lies, innuendos, deceptions and half-truths are the business of politicians and Satan, not Christians (or they certainly shouldn't be anyway, as I'm sure you'd agree).

For what it's worth, I find Ramaswamy interesting in a number of ways (especially as a politician, because he says things that politicians typically do not say), and I believe that he makes a number of very important points (and I also believe that he won the debate the other night). That doesn't mean that I would vote for him (I, in fact, do not believe that he will be the RNC's candidate, or that he could win the general election for President if he was).

Lastly, I wish he would have included something in his "10 Truths" about his position on abortion (especially since he seemed to have no hesitation in addressing other politically "hot" topics in that article). I'm sure that we have not heard the last from him so, hopefully, he will do so soon.

 

[Truth7t7]

Out of curiosity, how do you feel about identity politics?

Please explain what "Identity Politics" is, after that I will give you my opinion?

 

[HARK!]

I liked him too but you should look into some of the businesses that he owned. He was singing a different tune about China a few years back

I hadn't even heard of him until about a week before the debate. I'd be interested in whatever information you might have to share.

BTW, I didn't see your vote in the poll. So far it looks like more Liberals have voted in my poll than Conservatives. Go figure.

 

[Truth7t7]

While vegetarianism is common, it is not universally required in Hinduism.

Fact remains the same, Ramaswamy is a Hindu Vegetarian that opposes killing animals for food, and it's my opinion it's in direct relationship to the Hindu beliefs of reincarnation and animal deities

 

[BPPLEE]

I hadn't even heard of him until about a week before the debate. I'd be interested in whatever information you might have to share.

BTW, I didn't see your vote in the poll. So far it looks like more Liberals have voted in my poll than Conservatives. Go figure.

Mark Levin was talking about it on his radio show and apparently people that invested in two of his businesses lost a lot of money but he made huge profits.
I really like a lot of what he says I would just like to know more about his businesses

 

[Pommer]

Please explain what "Identity Politics" is, after that I will give you my opinion?

You’re such a political novice that you don’t know a basic trope from a few years ago, but expect us to listen to (and value) your opinions?

 

[Truth7t7]

You’re such a political novice that you don’t know a basic trope from a few years ago, but expect us to listen to (and value) your opinions?

Smiles

 

[Don Maurer]

What is the criteria for us to decide who "won" the debate? Obviously Trump still leads in the polls if that is the criteria. If the criteria is "gains," then Ramaswamy and Cristie each gained one small percentage point. On the other hand, if your asking about my subjective opinion, I chose Mike Pence in the poll for this thread. On the other hand, I do not get to chose because I am neither a democrat or republican. One the other hand (how many hands can I have?), I voted in the little poll at the top of this thread. I chose Mike Pence. Pence sticks in my mind for one of his statements. On Jan 6th, 2020 he chose the constitution over Trump. I look back in history and the charge of fraud was in other elections but no one ever attempted to overturn an election until 1861. In the past, not only election fraud occurred but there were oligarchs who financed candidates to receive political favors. The Woodrow Wilson era was full of corruption. The US Grant administration was also known for corruption. I certainly agree that I want to see clean elections without fraud and a government run without corruption, but I have doubts that the answer is to over turn elections. I think Mike Pence is a principled man whom our nation needs right now. Big tech corporations and social media monopolies are close to being as corrupt as Russian oligarchs. As an American, I want my liberties protected. While I would trust Trump far more than the radical left (Biden), that does not mean I trust Trump. Since Teddy Roosevelt is no longer here, I think Mike Pence is the man of the hour.

 

[Tall Timbers]

You’re such a political novice that you don’t know a basic trope from a few years ago, but expect us to listen to (and value) your opinions?

I would need an explanation of identity politics too. I don't expect anyone to listen to or value my opinions, but I suspect some would none-the-less.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

Trump and Carlson smashed the debate, a perfectly executed plan against Fox News who was the we support the temple of Satan in Boston and planned parenthood, by matching employee contributions, Fox experienced the loss in the Ole pocket book, lost revenue in $Advertising$

Not to mention he's polling at like 64% while DeSantis is at 18%, as many want to disregard this factual truth, head in the sand, let's pretend like it's not happening

I've never heard anything about The Fox News channel supporting the Satan temple and planning parenting. Where did you get this info? I don't watch The Fox News channel or Tucker. Be cause Tucker lied for months over election lies. And The Fox News channel allowed these lies to keep going on. Also Trump knowingly lied about many things.

 

[essentialsaltes]

I've never heard anything about The Fox News channel supporting the Satan temple and planning parenting. Where did you get this info?

Reportedly, the system Fox uses for employees to match their own personal charitable contributions with company contributions includes The Satanic Temple and Planned Parenthood (both legitimate charities). It is not clear to me whether any Fox employee ever actually gave money to either. NTTAWWT.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I don't know if anyone "won" per say

Several saw some slight bumps in the polls if that counts? I voted DeSantis simply because he's still clearly in 2nd place, and received a bump while Trump went down 6%.

But each of the candidates seemed to be running in their own distinct conservative ideological lane (apart from Asa and Burgum, who were running in the "sell gift cards for less than face value in order to meet the individual donor requirements" lane...not kidding on that one...that's actually a thing that happened)

I'd say they all got a little bit of what they wanted.

Christie wanted to run in the lane of "New England republican...willing to call out Trump".
Pence wanted to be the "Christian conservative who put constitution above Trump loyalty" guy.
Vivek wanted to be the "Young, quick on his feet, high energy, anti-establishment" guy combined with a little bit of "hedge my bet so Trump will pick me as his VP if/when I lose the primary" guy.
Haley wanted to be the "Traditional establishment GOP with pragmatism"
Scott wanted to be the "Outwardly calm, sings the praises of the American dream"
DeSantis wanted to be the "Look what I did in Florida, I can do it at a National level" guy


I'd say they all somewhat succeeded in their goal of establishing their lanes as a "first run".

You typically don't get "winners and losers" of debates until the field gets whittled down to <= 3 people. When there's 6+ people talking over each other and only getting minutes of microphone time, the only thing they can do is establish which "type" of "Party XYZ" candidate they are.

 

[HARK!]

The Satanic Temple and Planned Parenthood (both legitimate charities).

Oh. I thought that they were one in the same; you know, with offering up babies to Moloch and all.

What on earth does any of this have to do with who won the debate?