Was Jesus rich financially?

[tonychanyt]

See Was Jesus rich financially?

 

[HTacianas]

I don't think so.

Leviticus 12:

Jesus' parents couldn't afford a lamb, Luke 2:



At the beginning of Jesus' public ministry, he told the rich young man in Matthew 19:

At the time, Jesus would not have much personal possession. He preached what he did.

Jesus' ministry itself wasn't rich either. After Mary anointed Jesus' feet, the ministry's money bag holder/accountant complained in John 12:

A year's wages were a lot of money to Jesus' ministry.

At the time of Jesus' death, he didn't have much either as John took up the responsibility for Jesus' mother in John 19:


Was Jesus rich or poor?

From the numerical monetary perspective, at the time of Jesus' ministry, he lived the lifestyle of a minimalist.

Jesus was in all likelihood an Essene and lived in what we would call a monastery. That would account for his whereabouts between the ages of 12 and 30. They held all their possessions communally and when he left to begin his ministry anything he had would have been left behind.

 

[tonychanyt]

Jesus was in all likelihood an Essene and lived in what we would call a monastery.

verse?

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I don't think so.

Leviticus 12:

Jesus' parents couldn't afford a lamb, Luke 2:



At the beginning of Jesus' public ministry, he told the rich young man in Matthew 19:

At the time, Jesus would not have much personal possession. He preached what he did.

Jesus' ministry itself wasn't rich either. After Mary anointed Jesus' feet, the ministry's money bag holder/accountant complained in John 12:

A year's wages were a lot of money to Jesus' ministry.

At the time of Jesus' death, he didn't have much either as John took up the responsibility for Jesus' mother in John 19:


Was Jesus rich or poor?

From the numerical monetary perspective, at the time of Jesus' ministry, he lived the lifestyle of a minimalist.

Right, especially when on the road the last years of his life. But if he also was a tektonos like his father he could probably make a decent living.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Interesting thought.

The other side of the coin is present also.

Matt 2:1Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, wise men from the East came to Jerusalem, 2 saying, “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we have seen His star in the East and have come to worship Him.”​

​

It is an interesting study to see what the gifts were presented to honor the birth of a king. The most common denominator I have found is 10 talents of gold as a tribute. If accurate:

Bible Weights and Measurements

One talent of gold is - 75.4 pounds, making 10 talents 754 pounds or a little over $22,000,000 in todays currency. That doesn't include the spices.

Then we can look at the feeding of the 5,000 plus woman and children.

Mark 6:37 But He answered and said to them, “You give them something to eat.”​

And they said to Him, “Shall we go and buy two hundred denarii worth of bread and give them something to eat?”​

​

Notice: they were asking if Jesus wanted to spend 200 Denarii - they did not say they did not have the money for it. So what is a denarii?

Matt 20:2 2 Now when he had agreed with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard.​

​

Matt equate a denarii with a days wages. How much do you make in a day? 15.00 an hour, they worked a 12 hour day = 180.00 times 200 is 36,000 that they were asking permission to spend.

 

[tonychanyt]

Interesting thought.

The other side of the coin is present also.

Matt 2:1Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, behold, wise men from the East came to Jerusalem, 2 saying, “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we have seen His star in the East and have come to worship Him.”​

​

It is an interesting study to see what the gifts were presented to honor the birth of a king. The most common denominator I have found is 10 talents of gold as a tribute. If accurate:

Bible Weights and Measurements

One talent of gold is - 75.4 pounds, making 10 talents 754 pounds or a little over $22,000,000 in todays currency. That doesn't include the spices.

Then we can look at the feeding of the 5,000 plus woman and children.

Mark 6:37 But He answered and said to them, “You give them something to eat.”​

And they said to Him, “Shall we go and buy two hundred denarii worth of bread and give them something to eat?”​

​

Notice: they were asking if Jesus wanted to spend 200 Denarii - they did not say they did not have the money for it. So what is a denarii?

Matt 20:2 2 Now when he had agreed with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard.​

​

Matt equate a denarii with a days wages. How much do you make in a day? 15.00 an hour, they worked a 12 hour day = 180.00 times 200 is 36,000 that they were asking permission to spend.

Thanks for an alternate point of view

At the beginning of Jesus' public ministry, he told the rich young man in Matthew 19:

21 Jesus answered, “If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”

How rich was Jesus at this time?

 

[Always in His Presence]

Thanks for an alternate point of view

At the beginning of Jesus' public ministry, he told the rich young man in Matthew 19:


How rich was Jesus at this time?

We do not know - there is no mention of His personal wealth in Scripture so we cannot definitively say one way or another.

Another thing to consider:

John 19:24 They said therefore among themselves, “Let us not tear it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be,” that the Scripture might be fulfilled which says: “They divided My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots.” Therefore the soldiers did these things.​

​

If Jesus was financially poor what worth would the soldiers see in his clothing that made them not only want preserve it, but cast lots for it?

 

[Blade]

So if Christ was just a man how could He make others rich by His poverty? In what sense was He rich? "The magi gave valuable gifts" ever look into that? As in how long it did take them to get to Christ who would not be a baby any more. Then what gifts did they give? Yet its written "For you are recognizing [more clearly] the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [His astonishing kindness, His generosity, His gracious favor], that though He was rich, yet for your sake He became poor, so that by His poverty you might become rich (abundantly blessed)." I think there is SO MUCH more to that verse

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

“Shall we go and buy two hundred denarii worth of bread and give them something to eat?”

I always took that as sarcasm.

 

[HTacianas]

verse?

If you read the accounts of the Essenes found in Josephus, Tacitus, and the Dead Sea Scrolls you'll find a lot of the underpinnings of the teachings of Jesus. For example, the Essenes considered it a privilege to wear white, they avoided marriage, they kept all property in common, they referred to themselves as "the sons of light", and they did not consider a man to be a judge (meaning elder) until he had reached 30 years of age. The new testament has it:

On the priviledge of wearing white:

Rev 3:4 “You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy.

On marriage:

Mat 19:11 But He said to them, “All cannot accept this saying, but only those to whom it has been given:

Mat 19:12 “For there are eunuchs who were born thus from their mother’s womb, and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven’s sake. He who is able to accept it, let him accept it.”

Communal property:

Act 4:34 Nor was there anyone among them who lacked; for all who were possessors of lands or houses sold them, and brought the proceeds of the things that were sold,

Act 4:35 and laid them at the apostles’ feet; and they distributed to each as anyone had need.

Sons of light:

Luk 16:8 “So the master commended the unjust steward because he had dealt shrewdly. For the sons of this world are more shrewd in their generation than the sons of light.

Jhn 12:36 “While you have the light, believe in the light, that you may become sons of light.” These things Jesus spoke, and departed, and was hidden from them.

1Th 5:5 You are all sons of light and sons of the day. We are not of the night nor of darkness.

Age of eldership:

Luk 3:23 Now Jesus Himself began His ministry at about thirty years of age

 

[tonychanyt]

If you read the accounts of the Essenes found in Josephus, Tacitus, and the Dead Sea Scrolls you'll find a lot of the underpinnings of the teachings of Jesus.

Can you display the relevant quotes from these texts? It will save the efforts of everyone. Thanks.

 

[HTacianas]

Can you display the relevant quotes from these texts? It will save the efforts of everyone. Thanks.

For there are three philosophical sects among the Jews. The followers of the first of which are the Pharisees; of the second, the Sadducees; and the third sect, which pretends to a severer discipline, are called Essens. These last are Jews by birth, and seem to have a greater affection for one another than the other sects have. These Essens reject pleasures as an evil, but esteem continence, and the conquest over our passions, to be virtue. They neglect wedlock, but choose out other persons children, while they are pliable, and fit for learning, and esteem them to be of their kindred, and form them according to their own manners. They do not absolutely deny the fitness of marriage, and the succession of mankind thereby continued...

These men are despisers of riches, and so very communicative as raises our admiration. Nor is there any one to be found among them who hath more than another; for it is a law among them, that those who come to them must let what they have be common to the whole order,—insomuch that among them all there is no appearance of poverty, or excess of riches, but every one's possessions are intermingled with every other's possessions; and so there is, as it were, one patrimony among all the brethren. They think that oil is a defilement; and if any one of them be anointed without his own approbation, it is wiped off his body; for they think to be sweaty is a good thing, as they do also to be clothed in white garments. - The Jewish War, Flavius Josephus Book II, Chapter 8

The Sons of Light and the forces of Darkness shall fight together to show the strength of God... The War Scroll, Dead Sea Scrolls

 

[tonychanyt]

For there are three philosophical sects among the Jews. The followers of the first of which are the Pharisees; of the second, the Sadducees; and the third sect, which pretends to a severer discipline, are called Essens. These last are Jews by birth, and seem to have a greater affection for one another than the other sects have. These Essens reject pleasures as an evil, but esteem continence, and the conquest over our passions, to be virtue. They neglect wedlock, but choose out other persons children, while they are pliable, and fit for learning, and esteem them to be of their kindred, and form them according to their own manners. They do not absolutely deny the fitness of marriage, and the succession of mankind thereby continued...

These men are despisers of riches, and so very communicative as raises our admiration. Nor is there any one to be found among them who hath more than another; for it is a law among them, that those who come to them must let what they have be common to the whole order,—insomuch that among them all there is no appearance of poverty, or excess of riches, but every one's possessions are intermingled with every other's possessions; and so there is, as it were, one patrimony among all the brethren. They think that oil is a defilement; and if any one of them be anointed without his own approbation, it is wiped off his body; for they think to be sweaty is a good thing, as they do also to be clothed in white garments. - The Jewish War, Flavius Josephus Book II, Chapter 8

The Sons of Light and the forces of Darkness shall fight together to show the strength of God... The War Scroll, Dead Sea Scrolls

Can you make explicit connections with Jesus' teaching?
This is how to do referencing in a scholarly manner:

1. Give the name of the source.
2. Provide the link to the source. It is the URL address
3. Indent the quoted text.
4. Bold the relevant keywords that are important to the point that you are making.
5. Be concise and to the point.

This is what I do for others who read my posts. It is a standard high-school scholarship. If you practice this, I guarantee you: it will improve your analytical thinking. In any case, no one is required to do it here

 

[HTacianas]

Can you make explicit connections with Jesus' teaching?
This is how to do referencing in a scholarly manner:

1. Give the name of the source.
2. Provide the link to the source. It is the URL address
3. Indent the quoted text.
4. Bold the relevant keywords that are important to the point that you are making.
5. Be concise and to the point.

This is what I do for others who read my posts. It is a standard high-school scholarship. If you practice this, I guarantee you: it will improve your analytical thinking. In any case, no one is required to do it here

Actually, the only source I've ever seen you provide is your own opinion. And this is twice that you've brushed off information ostensibly due to lack of formatting of source material rather than actually addressing the information.

 

[tonychanyt]

Actually, the only source I've ever seen you provide is your own opinion.

See The etymology of the name "Jesus"

 

[Diamond72]

Jesus was in all likelihood an Essene and lived in what we would call a monastery.

Jesus may have been aware of Essene & Hillel's teachings and the discussions among various Jewish scholars, the specifics of any direct influence remain a matter of scholarly conjecture since historical evidence is limited and indirect on this matter.

There is no suggestion He lived in a monastery. Matthew says: “And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people”

Just as we are called to preach, teach and heal.

 

[ThisDogDoneGone]

I actually get the impression that Jesus couch-surfed, in a sense. He did a lot of traveling with his disciples, and was often invited to people's houses where he was most likely fed and slept. Add the fact that the Jews weren't fond of him and Jesus was persecuted throughout the New Testament, living somewhat like a fugitive was not above him.


Luke 9, verse 12 "Now the day began to wear away, and the twelve came and said to him, "Send the crowd away to go into the surrounding villages and countryside to find lodging and get provisions, for we are here in a desolate place."
Luke 9, verse 33: "And as the men were parting from him, Peter said to Jesus, "Master, it is good that we are here. Let us make three tents, one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah"


There is also a verse where he commands Zacchaeus. Luke 19, verse 5. "And when Jesus came to the place, he looked up and said to him, "Zacchaeus, hurry and come donw, for I must stay at your house today."


(If anyone cares, I read the ESV version)