School faces lawsuit for making student remove 'only two genders' shirt: 'Censoring a 7th-grader'

[Servus]

Everyone is a member of various protected classes.
I'm not sure what child you're talking about. The one in the OP? He is a boy. That is his gender identity. A t-shirt reading "Boys stink" would be targeting a protected class of which he is a member (even if it correctly expresses the opinion of the wearer.).

Try again. His shirt didn't have any derogatory words like "stink" or "stupid" like Larnievc came up with.

 

[Larniavc]

No I mean it how you meant it when you made the comparison.

But that's not what I meant. Or said.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Yes! And wearing a t shirt to show that you are a hater of a protected demographic is something only a hateful person would do.

Speaking the truth is hate now?

Science has found two genders, period.

Apparently the science you disagree with simply doesn't exist or what?

There are only two biological genders. What's in people's heads that declare there to be more is literally just in their heads and there's no actual evidence of there being anything other than male or female.

Saying so is no more hateful than saying the sky is blue.

And since when is insanity a protected class such that we can't say things that are scientifically and biologically true anymore? I mean really....

 

[essentialsaltes]

Try again.

Ugh. You're missing the point. "Wearing the shirt you want" is not a protected class. So if the school determines that shirt violates dress code, that doesn't make the kid 'unprotected'.

 

[Merrill]

That's a TERF thing and your Constitution means you'll always have the right to say awful things to people.

So I wouldn't worry.

TERF lol

as if confirming the reality of biological sex is "radical feminism"? And excluding guys wearing female costumes is "exclusionary"

but my point was that the Constitution isn't protecting speech

 

[Bradskii]

The kid is operating on his own.

You simply cannot be that naïve...

 

[Bradskii]

I was listening to a newscast yesterday, and they were talking about how women wearing "I love J.K. Rowling shirts" were arrested in Ireland for "hate speech"

What radio station can you be listening to that would have anyone on that would say something so patently false? And more to the point, how on earth do people accept such nonsense as being fact? What hope is there for reasonable discussion on any matter when such patently absurd comments are taken as being true?

 

[Hazelelponi]

You simply cannot be that naïve...

You think kids are undivided on these issues - really?

My stepson walked away from college after the first week because of the stuff going on there (all men are rapists etc etc)..

If you don't think those feelings of disgust at what is being taught don't crop up FAR earlier than college age with the stuff going on in early grades I would call you naive...

My kids are older but all my grandkids are in school and believe me, they aren't all little left wingers who believe in imaginary genders.

Kids aren't as stupid as all that. It's simply being foisted upon them.

 

[BNR32FAN]

He's only allowed to wear clothes bearing slogans that don't target a protected class. He can't wear a "Christianity is stupid" t-shirt, either. It has nothing to do with any 'they' or some 'agenda'.

No. I'm saying that saying there are not more than 2 genders is hate speech. I don't think people who disagree with me is automatically hate speech. I don't say that people who claim God is real is hate speech just because I think that they are wrong.

So please stop saying that about me. I'm specifically saying that wearing THAT t shirt is hate speech.

But if people say there are more than two genders then we are expected to just keep our mouth shut because someone might get offended. That is offensive to me.

 

[Bradskii]

You think kids are undivided on these issues - really?

My stepson walked away from college after the first week because of the stuff going on there (all men are rapists etc etc)..

If you don't think those feelings of disgust at what is being taught don't crop up FAR earlier than college age with the stuff going on in early grades I would call you naive...

My kids are older but all my grandkids are in school and believe me, they aren't all little left wingers who believe in imaginary genders.

Kids aren't as stupid as all that. It's simply being foisted upon them.

Sure...the kid decided, entirely unprompted, that a difficult matter such as gender identity was something he was going to investigate. And despite every single authoritative definition of gender on the planet telling him exactly what it was, he decided, entirely unprompted, that he was going to reject that. And, entirely unprompted, was going to get a t shirt printed (using his paper round money) saying that there were only two genders and wear it to school to make a statement to...who? His friends? The teachers? And having broken school dress rules, he was told to change it and/or be sent home. Which was just what he wanted. No-one else, of course. It was he alone making this stand against liberal, left wing, anti-Christian behaviour. So entirely unprompted, he contacted a lawyer and rang Fox to see if they were interested in his personal opinions. Which of course they were.

Now either there is a lot of wink-wink, nudge-nudging going on between some people in this thread to the effect that they know exactly that this is a stunt dreamed up by the parents to involve their kid in making a political point and they know that we know that they know, but shhh, let's pretend otherwise. Or, heaven forbid, you DO actually believe this kid instigated the whole thing. I which case, the chances of a reasonable discussion on this matter, which were low to start with, are now just about zero.

And I'll bet that no-one has checked to see what prompted this circus? Was it something the school was doing? Was there a class where someone mentioned gender? Was there something to which a parent might object?

I don't know how you do things in your part of the world, but where I come from, if there's a matter regarding my kids' schooling that I am unhappy about, then what I would do, and this might seem completely off the wall to you, I ring the school and make an appointment to see someone about it. Yeah, crazy eh? What I don't do is sit down with my wife and cook up some absurd scheme to put my objection on a t shirt and get my kid to wear it to school with the express intention of him being sent home so I could ring a lawyer and the local TV station to get my frustration aired nationally.

But hey, I guess you do things differently there. Maybe some parents don't actually mind using their kids as frontline fodder in the culture wars.

 

[Bradskii]

But if people say there are more than two genders then we are expected to just keep our mouth shut because someone might get offended. That is offensive to me.

How about if someone says that they are confused about their gender then you say 'OK, let's talk about this and see if we can help'. As opposed to 'There are only two genders'.

I appreciate getting the first one printed on a t shirt might cost a little more, but which do you think shows more compassion?

 

[Bradskii]

Speaking the truth is hate now?

That depends on what you consider the truth to be. If you knew someone was gay and you said 'Gays are going to hell' then I would class that as a hateful thing to say. As opposed to 'I am concerned for your immortal soul, may I talk to you about it', which I would class as a genuine concern for the person.

Similarly, as I just said, 'There are only two genders' (I'm really surprised there was no exclamation point after it) does nothing except reject what people might be feeling. As opposed to 'Are you confused about your gender or your sexuality? Can we talk - I'd like to help'.

It's not what you say. It's how you say it. But you knew that anyway.

 

[Bradskii]

This isn't the conspiracy theory section.

But you really think the kid was the only person who thought this up and went through it unprompted? To suggest that the parents were obviously involved is not a conspiracy. It's a recognition of the reality of the matter.

 

[Hazelelponi]

That depends on what you consider the truth to be. If you knew someone was gay and you said 'Gays are going to hell' then I would class that as a hateful thing to say. As opposed to 'I am concerned for your immortal soul, may I talk to you about it', which I would class as a genuine concern for the person.

Similarly, as I just said, 'There are only two genders' (I'm really surprised there was no exclamation point after it) does nothing except reject what people might be feeling. As opposed to 'Are you confused about your gender or your sexuality? Can we talk - I'd like to help'.

It's not what you say. It's how you say it. But you knew that anyway.

I agree that wording things more carefully is positive, but we are talking about a T-shirt "slogan" that a kid would pick out and wear.

Plus I HONESTLY don't see how saying "there are only two genders" is in any way disrespectful of anyone's feelings. That's kinda like saying a T-shirt from my day that said E=Mc2 might hurt someone's feelings. Scientific statements aren't hurtful.

I also don't think belief in more than two genders will send someone to hell either .. it's simply scientifically false.

It's more just a statement of fact, a fact that no one's feelings should be in anyway injured when confronted with.

People can stand in front of mirrors if it somehow confuses them.

 

[Servus]

But that's not what I meant. Or said.

What did you mean then?

 

[Servus]

Ugh. You're missing the point. "Wearing the shirt you want" is not a protected class. So if the school determines that shirt violates dress code, that doesn't make the kid 'unprotected'.

I was asking because I keep hearing about a protected class. So I figured there must be an unprotected class. Otherwise why make such a distinction? The kid's claim is the other side is doing what he got censored for. That one thing is being promoted and advocated while the other thing is being censored.

 

[essentialsaltes]

But if people say there are more than two genders then we are expected to just keep our mouth shut because someone might get offended.

Not generally. But schools can have dress codes, and the courts will have to determine if this one is being fairly applied.

 

[Hazelelponi]

I was asking because I keep hearing about a protected class. So I figured there must be an unprotected class. Otherwise why make such a distinction? The kid's claim is the other side is doing what he got censored for. That one thing is being promoted and advocated while the other thing is being censored.

Unprotected is white, straight, male, Christian, and conservative.

Protected classes are everyone else - though it should be said that women are loosing, or have already lost, their protected class to, of all people, men.

 

[essentialsaltes]

I was asking because I keep hearing about a protected class. So I figured there must be an unprotected class.

There isn't an unprotected class. It's not that black people are protected and white people are unprotected. All are protected from racial discrimination, because race is a protected class. It's not that genderfluid people are protected while cisgendered people are unprotected. All are. Because gender identity is a protected class.

The kid's claim is the other side is doing what he got censored for.

The dress code forbids targeting people based on a protected class; there is nothing wrong with celebrating people based on a protected class. They are not the same.

 

[Bradskii]

I agree that wording things more carefully is positive, but we are talking about a T-shirt "slogan" that a kid would pick out and wear.

Plus I HONESTLY don't see how saying "there are only two genders" is in any way disrespectful of anyone's feelings.

It was a political statement. As I said, it's surprising that wasn't an exclamation point after it. It was making a point. It wasn't simply making an offhand remark that would have no implications. It was a rejection of anyone who feels that their biological sex doesn't match their sense of their gender.

And I could care less whether you reject the definition of gender that every single authoritative source will give you. I don't care. What I care about are the people who are in distress about their sexuality. You repeating time after time after time that there are only two genders like some mantra doesn't help anyone in the slightest. It's actually harmful. Have some compassion for these people for heaven's sake.