Is Astrology a science?

[Hans Blaster]

You can etch metal with salt water.

If you say so, but how is that relevant? Chalk is not metal, and the cliffs weren't etched, they were eroded.

 

[AV1611VET]

If you say so, but how is that relevant? Chalk is not metal, and the cliffs weren't etched, they were eroded.

Did I even hint that the cliffs were metal ... or etched?

 

[Tuur]

I did a double bachelors, zoology and geology,
before I started grad school.

You might like to read " Basin and Range" ( McPhee)
Take a look at least. A great writer, not a geologist
or writing for geologists. One of my profs commented
on reading his work, " there'd be a lot more geologists if
he wrote the texts ".
Anyway, glad you are interested, carry on.

I might give it a look. Just these things grab my attention like something shiny, and I try to read up on it. Like stumbling across something called the Surrency Bright Spot, which is on the old suture zone between the old North American and African plates. Or walking along where an artificial pond was dug out and finding fossilized ripples in a bit of sandstone that was dug up.

 

[Mark Quayle]

I'm a teacher of Israel?
I don't even know what that means.

So, dear Mark.
You refuse to tell us how a person becomes saved.

This says a lot.
You should be honest about your calvinist faith.
Any mainline Christian could post how in one sentence.

Please stop telling me I create strawmen.
Thanks.

You speak as if you know how to become saved, asking me to tell you, so yeah, I said what Jesus said to Nicodemus, who should have known about being born again.

And now you claim I "refuse to tell us how a person becomes saved"? I told you! A person becomes saved by the Spirit of God taking up residence within. God calls that being "born of the Spirit", being "born again", "born of God" and several other things, and also says several things it is not —"not born of yourselves", "not born of man's decision" and such. You want more detail? We've been through the detail. A person is saved by Grace, through Faith, and that not of the person saved, but of God. The Spirit of God generates the faith by which a person believes in Christ.

Amazing how you speak, mocking, falsely representing, even implying I'm being dishonest, and you want me to stop telling you that you create strawmen? Really?? Here are your words:

GodsGrace101 said:
"How does a person trust a God that has no rules?
Does whatever He wants to at any given moment...
To any given person,
Including banishing them to hell
For no reason,
And is totally unjust.

How do you trust an unjust God?"

That is a strawman; it is a false representation of what I believe, of what Reformed theology teaches, of what Calvinism teaches —and I explained in #223 how it is a strawman,
Mark Quayle said:
"Who says he has no rules? What in the world are you talking about? Whatever he wants will be altogether just.

And where do you get the notion he banishes anyone to hell for no reason? Where do you get that he is totally unjust?

This isn't the first time you erected a strawman to beat up on. Just a different venue."

—and you ignored my questions. Not only that, you begin some kind of line that I am being dishonest about my faith? Exactly how? What in the world are you talking about to say (in #225) that if I don't think I'm reformed in faith I should find out? Where did you get that notion?? See that little chevron below my name and avatar? Click on it. Read down what pops up. It will show I call myself Reformed, (as if you didn't know).

You ask:
How do we become saved?
How does one become born again?

—I told you. By the Spirit of God. "Born of the Spirit". Do you honestly think that aside from the work of God in them, a person can have genuine faith, of himself, by mere decision? "HOW?"

 

[GodsGrace101]

I might give it a look. Just these things grab my attention like something shiny, and I try to read up on it. Like stumbling across something called the Surrency Bright Spot, which is on the old suture zone between the old North American and African plates. Or walking along where an artificial pond was dug out and finding fossilized ripples in a bit of sandstone that was dug up.

What is the Surrency Bright Spot?

 

[GodsGrace101]

You speak as if you know how to become saved, asking me to tell you, so yeah, I said what Jesus said to Nicodemus, who should have known about being born again.

And now you claim I "refuse to tell us how a person becomes saved"? I told you! A person becomes saved by the Spirit of God taking up residence within. God calls that being "born of the Spirit", being "born again", "born of God" and several other things, and also says several things it is not —"not born of yourselves", "not born of man's decision" and such. You want more detail? We've been through the detail. A person is saved by Grace, through Faith, and that not of the person saved, but of God. The Spirit of God generates the faith by which a person believes in Christ.

Amazing how you speak, mocking, falsely representing, even implying I'm being dishonest, and you want me to stop telling you that you create strawmen? Really?? Here are your words:

GodsGrace101 said:
"How does a person trust a God that has no rules?
Does whatever He wants to at any given moment...
To any given person,
Including banishing them to hell
For no reason,
And is totally unjust.

How do you trust an unjust God?"

That is a strawman; it is a false representation of what I believe, of what Reformed theology teaches, of what Calvinism teaches —and I explained in #223 how it is a strawman,
Mark Quayle said:
"Who says he has no rules? What in the world are you talking about? Whatever he wants will be altogether just.

And where do you get the notion he banishes anyone to hell for no reason? Where do you get that he is totally unjust?

This isn't the first time you erected a strawman to beat up on. Just a different venue."

—and you ignored my questions. Not only that, you begin some kind of line that I am being dishonest about my faith? Exactly how? What in the world are you talking about to say (in #225) that if I don't think I'm reformed in faith I should find out? Where did you get that notion?? See that little chevron below my name and avatar? Click on it. Read down what pops up. It will show I call myself Reformed, (as if you didn't know).

You ask:
How do we become saved?
How does one become born again?

—I told you. By the Spirit of God. "Born of the Spirit". Do you honestly think that aside from the work of God in them, a person can have genuine faith, of himself, by mere decision? "HOW?"

My goodness Mark,
@AV1611VET explained it in one verse.
And I can't even remember if he's a believer....been away a couple of years due to problems.

I'm not going to further derail this thread,
But YOU friend are a calvinist. All your beliefs are calvinist, so stop saying you're not and misrepresenting God, ESPECIALLY by denying your belief system and ESPECIALLY to atheists.

 

[GodsGrace101]

If you say so, but how is that relevant? Chalk is not metal, and the cliffs weren't etched, they were eroded.

Do some here believe cliffs were etched by God?

 

[GodsGrace101]

You speak as if you know how to become saved, asking me to tell you, so yeah, I said what Jesus said to Nicodemus, who should have known about being born again.

And now you claim I "refuse to tell us how a person becomes saved"? I told you! A person becomes saved by the Spirit of God taking up residence within. God calls that being "born of the Spirit", being "born again", "born of God" and several other things, and also says several things it is not —"not born of yourselves", "not born of man's decision" and such. You want more detail? We've been through the detail. A person is saved by Grace, through Faith, and that not of the person saved, but of God. The Spirit of God generates the faith by which a person believes in Christ.

Amazing how you speak, mocking, falsely representing, even implying I'm being dishonest, and you want me to stop telling you that you create strawmen? Really?? Here are your words:

GodsGrace101 said:
"How does a person trust a God that has no rules?
Does whatever He wants to at any given moment...
To any given person,
Including banishing them to hell
For no reason,
And is totally unjust.

How do you trust an unjust God?"

That is a strawman; it is a false representation of what I believe, of what Reformed theology teaches, of what Calvinism teaches —and I explained in #223 how it is a strawman,
Mark Quayle said:
"Who says he has no rules? What in the world are you talking about? Whatever he wants will be altogether just.

And where do you get the notion he banishes anyone to hell for no reason? Where do you get that he is totally unjust?

This isn't the first time you erected a strawman to beat up on. Just a different venue."

—and you ignored my questions. Not only that, you begin some kind of line that I am being dishonest about my faith? Exactly how? What in the world are you talking about to say (in #225) that if I don't think I'm reformed in faith I should find out? Where did you get that notion?? See that little chevron below my name and avatar? Click on it. Read down what pops up. It will show I call myself Reformed, (as if you didn't know).

You ask:
How do we become saved?
How does one become born again?

—I told you. By the Spirit of God. "Born of the Spirit". Do you honestly think that aside from the work of God in them, a person can have genuine faith, of himself, by mere decision? "HOW?"

PS
Read your last sentence.
Read John Calvin's Institutes.

 

[AV1611VET]

Do some here believe cliffs were etched by God?

He's got his wires crossed.

I submit two major geological phenomena as evidence of the Flood: meandering rivers and white cliffs.

More appropriately, they would constitute evidence of God's cleanup afterwards.

The meandering rivers etching serpentine paths into the earth's surface; and the white cliffs being formed when God swept up coccoliths into nice neat piles.

 

[GodsGrace101]

He's got his wires crossed.

I submit two major geological phenomena as evidence of the Flood: meandering rivers and white cliffs.

More appropriately, they would constitute evidence of God's cleanup afterwards.

The meandering rivers etching serpentine paths into the earth's surface; and the white cliffs being formed when God swept up coccoliths into nice neat piles.

Agreed on meandering rivers.
That's how valleys were formed too.

But what do you mean by God sweeping up?

 

[Mark Quayle]

My goodness Mark,
@AV1611VET explained it in one verse.
And I can't even remember if he's a believer....been away a couple of years due to problems.

I'm not going to further derail this thread,
But YOU friend are a calvinist. All your beliefs are calvinist, so stop saying you're not and misrepresenting God, ESPECIALLY by denying your belief system and ESPECIALLY to atheists.

Yes, @AV1611VET is a believer, and I think very well of him, but he didn't explain HOW one's confession is real, nor how the heart can believe. I mentioned John 3, "the whole chapter", which includes both John 3:16 and John 3:18 and several other related references; and that should have been enough for you, but I went into what you apparently think of as Calvinistic-detail-and-therefore-by-definition-false, by which your visceral reaction apparently blinded you to what I was trying to say.

It's more than a little humorous to me that you brand me a Calvinist, (which I don't mind or deny), and that therefore by definition I am misrepresenting God, but more than that, you imply here that as a Calvinist I must stop saying I'm not (which I asked you to explain where I said I'm not) and as a Calvinist I should stop misrepresenting God (which you haven't shown). It seems you only read enough of my post to object to it.

So, again,

1. Where have I denied being a Calvinist or Reformed?
2. Where have I misrepresented God?
3. And I'll add a third: Do you know what Reformed Theology teaches, or even that (at least doctrinally) the majority of Protestantism holds to most of the tenets of this "Calvinism" you think you know?

 

[Mark Quayle]

PS
Read your last sentence.
Read John Calvin's Institutes.

Really? I'm not obligated, apparently contrary to your worldview, to guess what you are hinting at.

 

[Astrid]

Agreed on meandering rivers.
That's how valleys were formed too.

But what do you mean by God sweeping up?

A sign of not a clue about geology.

 

[AV1611VET]

Agreed on meandering rivers.
That's how valleys were formed too.

But what do you mean by God sweeping up?

In a metaphorical sense, actually; but that's because I can't think of a better term.

"Stockpiled" perhaps?

In short, He took all the coccoliths and piled them in nice neat piles that are called "white cliffs" today.

 

[AV1611VET]

A sign of not a clue about geology.

I don't need a clue about geology.

Geology didn't do it.

God did it.

So it doesn't matter if I haven't a clue about geology, or I'm omniscient in geology.

Geology had nothing to do with it.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Yes, @AV1611VET is a believer, and I think very well of him, but he didn't explain HOW one's confession is real, nor how the heart can believe. I mentioned John 3, "the whole chapter", which includes both John 3:16 and John 3:18 and several other related references; and that should have been enough for you, but I went into what you apparently think of as Calvinistic-detail-and-therefore-by-definition-false, by which your visceral reaction apparently blinded you to what I was trying to say.

It's more than a little humorous to me that you brand me a Calvinist, (which I don't mind or deny), and that therefore by definition I am misrepresenting God, but more than that, you imply here that as a Calvinist I must stop saying I'm not (which I asked you to explain where I said I'm not) and as a Calvinist I should stop misrepresenting God (which you haven't shown). It seems you only read enough of my post to object to it.

So, again,

1. Where have I denied being a Calvinist or Reformed?
2. Where have I misrepresented God?
3. And I'll add a third: Do you know what Reformed Theology teaches, or even that (at least doctrinally) the majority of Protestantism holds to most of the tenets of this "Calvinism" you think you know?

1. You've said, more than once, that you don't know about calvinism,or at least, that you don't get your beliefs from calvinism.
2. You misrepresent God the same way every other calvinist does --- by changing His very nature.
You remove LOVE, MERCY AND JUSTICE from His very being.
3. Um. I've told you several times now that I go by John Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion. I mean, have you ever heard of it??
Please stop telling me I don't know what the reformed believe. Thanks.

 

[GodsGrace101]

Really? I'm not obligated, apparently contrary to your worldview, to guess what you are hinting at.

Hinting?
Here's your last sentence:

—I told you. By the Spirit of God. "Born of the Spirit". Do you honestly think that aside from the work of God in them, a person can have genuine faith, of himself, by mere decision? "HOW?"

Yes, Mark, a person becomes a born again believer BY HIS DECISION.
NOT, by some arbitrary decision made by God -
arbitrary - based on nothing.
Back to my original statement...
HOW can we trust a God that does not allow us to know His requirements to become saved?

Now, let's stop derailing this thread.

 

[GodsGrace101]

A sign of not a clue about geology.

@AV1611VET 's avatar states that science could take a hike.
Maybe he has absolutely no trust in science?
Can't remember...

 

[GodsGrace101]

In a metaphorical sense, actually; but that's because I can't think of a better term.

"Stockpiled" perhaps?

In short, He took all the coccoliths and piled them in nice neat piles that are called "white cliffs" today.

Is it metaphorical...
or did God literally take all the coccoliths (whatever they are) and stock pile them?
Your sentence no. 1 conflicts with your statement no. 3.

 

[Mark Quayle]

1. You've said, more than once, that you don't know about calvinism,or at least, that you don't get your beliefs from calvinism.
2. You misrepresent God the same way every other calvinist does --- by changing His very nature.
You remove LOVE, MERCY AND JUSTICE from His very being.
3. Um. I've told you several times now that I go by John Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion. I mean, have you ever heard of it??
Please stop telling me I don't know what the reformed believe. Thanks.

1. Yes, you are correct I don't get my beliefs from Calvinism. How does that make me not a Calvinist? or more to the point, how does that mean I deny being a Calvinist or Reformed? Must a Calvinist get his ideas from Calvin or Calvinism? I got mine from the Bible.

2. Mere Assertion. WHERE do I remove LOVE, MERCY and JUSTICE from His very being, except in your mind?

3. If you know what the Reformed believe, why do you keep misrepresenting it?