The KJVO myth...

[trophy33]

It might appear that way to you who has a hatred for believers trusting in a perfect Word of God 100%

No need to be so emotional.

But I take your response to mean you do not realize that your own arguments are against the KJVO.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Sometimes I wonder if you realize how you are shooting yourself in the foot with your posts.

What do you have to offer me that is better?
Do you have a pure Word that you can hold in your hands that you completely trust?
What makes me trust a sea of Modern Bibles?
How do I know I have the right original language manuscripts?
How do I know if I am interpreting the original dead languages correctly?

This sounds like too much doubt for me.
I know I can just read and believe my King James Bible.
It’s simple and I have many evidences to prove it is the pure Word of God (or it is closet to being the most pure Word). My goal is to live by the Word of God in what it says.
I take it by faith. But you want to take that faith away from me. You want destroy my faith in the Bible (the KJB). To give me what? A sea of imperfect Bibles that do not all say the same thing?
God is not the author of confusion.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

No need to be so emotional.

But I take your response to mean you do not realize that your own arguments are against the KJVO.

By your constant bombardment of attacks against a believer holding to a 100% trust in God’s Word (the KJB), it can only be taken as a form of hatred for such a position. Folks here have already thrown around words like the devil, and hell in relation to a believer trusting in the KJB as the pure Word of God. Do you disagree with their use of such words?

 

[trophy33]

By your constant bombardment of attacks against a believer holding to a 100% trust in God’s Word (the KJB), it can only be taken as a form of hatred for such a position.

One of your wrong conclusions.

Folks here have already thrown around words like the devil, and hell in relation to this kind of belief. Do you disagree with their use of such words?

Sure, I do not like "the Hitler argument". From any side.

 

[trophy33]

What do you have to offer me that is better?

A consistent stance. You cannot argue against something in the way that is also possible to apply to your own position and to look consistent instead of strongly biased.

Do you have a pure Word that you can hold in your hands that you completely trust?

You mean a pure bible print?

What makes me trust a sea of Modern Bibles?

You obviously do not trust them, so nothing.

How do I know I have the right original language manuscripts?
How do I know if I am interpreting the original dead languages correctly?

Of course its not something you are given from day one. You either have to practice the reading in Greek or to rely on experts in the field like you rely on medieval anglican experts.

But you want to take that faith away from me. You want destroy my faith in the Bible (the KJB).

If you have such anxiety, I recommend to leave online discussion forums. If you stay, you must deal with different opinions and views to yours.

And as almost always, what you say can be applied to you too. You want to destroy the faith of others in non-KJV bibles.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The KJV (NOT"KJB")

They call it the King James BIBLE for a reason. So KJB is an abbreviation for King James Bible.
There is a documentary called the KJB. There is the DKJB which is the Defined King James BIBLE.

DKJB - Defined King James Bible (religious scripture) | AcronymFinder

has been changed quite a few times. You admit as much by claiming the CE was "refined" (changed) 7 times. As translating becomes more-exact, sometimes a translation must be improved.
Some doctrines may SEEM more-pure to you, but are they more-ACCURATE in the KJV? I showed ya two that are not, in Ex. 20:13 & 1 Tim. 6:10.

I already explained these verses already. Time to move on.

And why go to the bother of trying to read 2 translations at once insteada simply using a translation that one can clearly understand? Sometimes your stuff defies logic.

I can say the same for you. If you want your Modern Rome Bibles, then go right ahead and have them if you are Catholic.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

One of your wrong conclusions.

This is patently false. You have been attacking my belief in the King James Bible.

Sure, I do not like "the Hitler argument". From any side.

But you never really stood up and said anything.

 

[Strong in Him]

Show me in the Greek, or show me in the original languages. You know what that sounds like to me? It sounds like the Roman Catholic Church.

It's got nothing to do with the Roman Catholic church.
You are saying that compared with the KJV, other versions are false and remove verses; I am saying "let's compare ALL versions with the Greek, to see if they were removed, or if they were never there in the first place". The fact that you have always, over a number of threads, refused to do this tells me that you are scared of what such a comparison might show. If the KJV was found to agree with the Greek, you'd shout it from the roof tops, I would look foolish and would have no reason to say that the modern translations did not remove verses.
It wouldn't alter the fact that we do not need ONE verse to prove the Trinity, but would prove your point that the KJV was more accurate in this matter.

But you can't, or won't, do that.
So be it - opportunity lost.

This is just one clue that all Modern Bibles are tied to Rome.

No, it isn't.
But as you can't answer my points, and have been proved wrong in your claim that I could not speak to a JW about the Trinity using an NIV, it stands to reason that you would change the subject.

But you have chosen your side. I have chosen mine.

Yes - my "side" is that I fully believe in and accept the Trinity - and have done so without the help of the KJV. Therefore I learned it from another Bible.

That is simply a fact; there's no other way of saying it.

 

[trophy33]

This is patently false. You have been attacking my belief in the King James Bible.

Sure, because its silly and because you present it publicly. I do not feel any strong emotions regarding the KJVO, though.

But you never really stood up and said anything.

I do not read every post.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Of course its not something you are given from day one. You either have to practice the reading in Greek or to rely on experts in the field like you rely on medieval anglican experts.

Not all scholars agree with each other, and there is no apostle Paul alive to truly tell if I got my Greek correct or not. I would be constantly doubting if my interpretation was true or not because I did not grow up in Bible times speaking that language and writing it when it was among a living culture. I would be guessing at best. Also, relying on scholars or my Pastor reminds me a lot of the Catholic Church in how they say I cannot understand the Bible without their special elite priests in giving me the meaning. I have to rely on their interpretations blindly and just accept it.

If you have such anxiety, I recommend to leave online discussion forums. If you stay, you must deal with different opinions and views to yours.

Who said to that I had anxiety? I didn’t say I had an anxiety. That is something you are imagining that I don’t have. However, I am slightly saddened by the words used here and the continual unbelief in what I believe the Bible says. But I have been through a lot worse on other Christian forums, where I was called some really bad stuff (Which is not allowed here). So these kinds of discussions are like a walk in the park by comparison to where I used to discuss God’s Word.

And as almost always, what you say can be applied to you too. You want to destroy the faith of others in non-KJV bibles.

Not at all because I am giving them the alternative to trust in a pure Word of God (the KJB).
There is no real trust in the Modern Translation camp because they do not even have the originals and they do not claim any one particular group of manuscripts only being the most pure. Their Bibles are always ever changing and never settle. So the faith always changes ever so slightly. That’s not the kind of faith I have. I have a sure foundation upon God’s Word that does not change. There can be only one Word of God and not many. It’s simple logic.

 

[pescador]

I have one primary question... Why do the KJVO crowd consider that translation to be the only valid English translation? What is it about a 409-year-old translation of the Bible source texts that KJVOs consider to be such an accurate translation? Aside, of course, from the unsupported claim that somehow those translators were so gifted and/or had access to perfect sources that they alone 1) knew what God actually said (and meant!) in Hebrew/Aramaic/Koine Greek and 2) were able to perfectly express those words/ideas/concepts in the Englyshe of their time (which is not spoken/written any longer)..

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It's got nothing to do with the Roman Catholic church.

Sure it does.

Most of all your Modern Bibles comes from the Critical Text.

This constantly changing Critical Greek Text is under the direct supervision of the Vatican. They come right out and tell you this. They aren't even trying to hide it. Here is a photo of page 45 from right out of the Nestle-Aland 27th edition.

Source:
The KJB Only versus the Latin Vulgate Only Argument by: Another King James Bible Believer

But Guess which Bible the Roman Catholic Church does NOT want you to read -

Source:
Undeniable Proof the ESV, NIV, NASB, Holman Standard, NET, Jehovah Witness NWT etc. are the new "Vatican Versions" by: Another King James Bible Believer

 

[trophy33]

Not all scholars agree with each other, and there is no apostle Paul alive to truly tell if I got my Greek correct or not. I would be constantly doubting if my interpretation was true or not because I did not grow up in Bible times speaking that language and writing it when it was among a living culture. I would be guessing at best. Also, relying on scholars or my Pastor reminds me a lot of the Catholic Church in how they say I cannot understand the Bible without their special elite priests in giving me the meaning. I have to rely on their interpretations blindly and just accept it.

So some of your interpretations will not be correct (like they are not correct now and you just do not realize that).
And what will happen? Nothing serious. Just a normal life in which we grow and do our best. We trust in God and in His leading, no?

Who said to that I had anxiety? I didn’t say I had an anxiety. That is something you are imagining that I don’t have.

Some of your formulations seem quite emotional and influenced by fear. But of course, you know the best what you feel, I just say how it looks like.

Not at all because I am giving them the alternative to trust in a pure Word of God (the KJB).

The answer is to be lead by the Spirit and by a good reason. And to be prepared to change when some new information comes. Not to fanatically accept one specific bible print forever.

There is no real trust in the Modern Translation camp because they do not even have the originals and they do not claim any one particular group of manuscripts only being the most pure. Their Bibles are always ever changing and never settle. So the faith always changes ever so slightly. That’s not the kind of faith I have. I have a sure foundation upon God’s Word that does not change. There can be only one Word of God and not many. It’s simple logic.

The Bibles are ever changing because our knowledge is growing. For example we have over 6,000 manuscripts today, in medieval ages they had about a dozen. Of course it will change our Greek editions. For better.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I have one primary question... Why do the KJVO crowd consider that translation to be the only valid English translation? What is it about a 409-year-old translation of the Bible source texts that KJVOs consider to be such an accurate translation? Aside, of course, from the unsupported claim that somehow those translators were so gifted and/or had access to perfect sources that they alone 1) knew what God actually said (and meant!) in Hebrew/Aramaic/Koine Greek and 2) were able to perfectly express those words/ideas/concepts in the Englyshe of their time (which is not spoken/written any longer)..

Because we trust God’s Word in what it says in Psalms 12:6-7, and Matthew 24:35.

Psalms 12:6-7 says,
“The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.”

Matthew 24:35 says,
“Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.”

Please take note that Psalms 12:6-7 is altered in certain Modern Bibles to remove this promise (Which is very suspicious), and Jesus’ words have been altered in Modern Bibles for the worse.

Words of Jesus are taken away by Modern Translations.

Jesus said Heaven and Earth shall pass away but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 24:35). But in Modern Translations some of our Lord’s words have passed away (or they are missing).

1. The words of Jesus on “Fasting so as to cast out persistent devils” is removed in Matthew 17:21. I can personally testify that this works. So obviously it is a method that the devil does not want believers to know about or it is something he wants believers to doubt such words as being true so as hinder in helping them.
   
   
2. Removal of the words “You know not what spirit you-all are of.” (Luke 9:55). The details of the rebuke towards John and James is missing. One problem is that one can think that the neutered Modern Translation version of this rebuke is teaching that our rebukes need to be only a positive and happy manner. Meaning, that we should only speak only good things towards others. Another problem is that it speaks against the NT teaching on Non Resistance. Yet another problem is that it can lead some people to make James and John out to be men who never made any mistakes (which can lead to idolizing them in some way).
   
   
3. Certain words of our Lord in Acts of the Apostles 9:5-6 are removed. The words in Acts of the Apostles 9:5 that say, “it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks” is removed. In Acts of the Apostles 9:6, the words "And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do?" are removed. The removal of the words on Acts of the Apostles 9:5 is wrong because it can make a believer wrongfully think that God does not have anything to do with us if we have not fully submitted to Him yet. However, we see here that God is actively trying to reach Paul even up until He had His vision with the Lord. The removal of words in Acts of the Apostles 9:6 is problematic because it makes it look like Paul may not have been in fear of the Lord when he had this vision, too. It is also problematic to remove such words because Paul is being polite and correct in asking the Lord in what to do. This means we should be seeking and asking God for the direction for our lives, as well. We have to be polite and humble with God and ask, and not make demands of Him, as well. But we need to ask for God's direction for our life. For the enemy would want nothing more than for a believer to be outside of God's will and not asking the Lord for direction in their life.

This is disturbing that the Modern Translations would remove such precious words from our Lord. For we know that these words can benefit our walk with Him. Some who hold so tightly to the Codex Sinaiticus and the Codex Vaticanus manuscripts (along with their Babel bibles) as being the Word of God will of course never see such truths that I speak of here. They will just blindly trust the scholar who holds to the corrupted Alexandrian texts that removes these beautiful words from our Lord Jesus Christ. Little do they fully grasp the entire truth of our Lord's words that say, “Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.” (Matthew 24:35).

 

[trophy33]

This constantly changing Critical Greek Text is under the direct supervision of the Vatican.

Please, read it more carefully. It does not say that the Nestle-Aland (or UBS) text is under the direct supervision of the Vatican.

You are a native English speaker, you should be able to read a longer sentence without such mistake.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

So some of your interpretations will not be correct (like they are not correct now and you just do not realize that).
And what will happen? Nothing serious. Just a normal life in which we grow and do our best. We trust in God and in His leading, no?


Some of your formulations seem quite emotional and influenced by fear. But of course, you know the best what you feel, I just say how it looks like.

The answer is to be lead by the Spirit and by a good reason. And to be prepared to change when some new information comes. Not to fanatically accept one specific bible print forever.


The Bibles are ever changing because our knowledge is growing. For example we have over 6,000 manuscripts today, in medieval ages they had about a dozen. Of course it will change our Greek editions. For better.

My reasons in trusting in the King James is not solely emotionally based. You can check out all my reasons with Scripture in defense of the King James Bible being the pure Word in this CF thread here.

I have provided 30 reasons in defense of the KJB being the Word of God.

Granted, I do not think you will accept these reasons I made with Scripture, though. You seem pretty resistant to anything I bring up. This is where we can simply then agree to disagree in love and respect and move on and simply love one another in Christ.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Please, read it more carefully. It does not say that the Nestle-Aland (or UBS) text is under the direct supervision of the Vatican.

You are a native English speaker, you should be able to read a longer sentence without such mistake.

Okay. Look. A Catholic cardinal was an editor on this 27th edition by Nestle and Aland and this cardinal’s name is in the book and you can look up to see if he is a cardinal or not. Just read the WHOLE article to the link. There is other corroborating evidence, as well.

 

[trophy33]

Okay. Look. A Catholic cardinal was an editor on this 27th edition by Nestle and Aland and this cardinal’s name is the book and you can look up to see if he is a cardinal or not. Just read the WHOLE article to the link. There is other corroborating evidence, as well.

So?
Erasmus was a catholic priest and worked on his text alone. And protestants in Europe had no problem adopting his work.
Nestlé Aland has a committee composed of representatives of various Christian branches and from universities.

There is around one billion of catholics and they need a Bible too. Why should not they be allowed to work on the Greek text alongside others?

 

[robycop3]

I am trying to understand your relentless hatred for the King James Bible. Is it really worth it to attack a Bible that Christians trust? What if certain Christians lose their faith altogether by your attack against God’s Holy Word? Does God call us to continually live our lives in focus on an attack against a particular group of Christians who believe a particular Word of God? Why is that bad to you that they trust wholly in the Holy Bible? What is the end result or goal for these people if you convince them? How will they have changed in following Christ for the better by your efforts? I just don’t see anything positive coming out of your attack of the KJB at all.

I don't hate the KJV; I hate the false KJVO MYTH. Proving it wrong requires pointing out the deficiencies of the KJV. Again, you show where you got your KJVO myth from by using one of their mantras: "You hate the KJV."

I think you are just looking to see mistakes where none exists even if sound explanations are given. You want to see mistakes in the King James Bible. Admit it. It has nothing to do with the verses you are quoting. You are merely fishing to find anything wrong with the KJB because of your own personal reasons. Maybe a King James Only person did you wrong in the past, or maybe you had a bad experience in studying the KJB. I don’t know what that reason is, but something is influencing you on a crusade against the brethren in trusting completely in God’s Word by faith. Does a complete trust in God’s Word upset you?

No such thing as a "KJB" unless it's a new model Jaguar.
As I said, proving the KJV myth false requires pointing out deficiencies in the KJV.
I trust God's word by faith. You trust one outdated version of it by guesswork.
And I fight the KJVO myth because, as I said earlier, my calling is to work against false doctrines & cults, and the Holy Spirit has led me to conclusive proof that KJVO is false.

Again, you are limited human being and you are not God. Your knowledge is limited and you can be biased by your own emotions and wrong thinking of what you want to be true. So your claims of what you think is correct is nothing more than…. Claims. You can claim whatever you like…. But the truth will be proven one day in the end by our Lord.

YOU have claims; I have PROOF.

I will not even say that against Christians who believe in the OAO (Original Autograph Only) position, or they are a Modern Translation Only Proponent or they are an “Anti-God-Did-Not-Preserve-His-Words-Perfectly-In-Our-World-Language-Today” Type Believer. I don’t see it as a salvation issue in most cases.

OK, here's some proof for you: All true doctrines of faith/worship are found only in Scripture, either empirically or by clear implication, right? Well, just WHERE IN SCRIPTURE is KJVO found?????????????? If it aint there, it's FALSE, right?

Now, WHO is the ultimate source of all false doctrines of faith/worship? It's Ol' Scratch, isn't it? Therefore, he's the ultimate source of the KJVO myth, right?
See how easy that was?

But to speak evil against a believer for having too much faith in a Bible that is the most pure when compared to other Modern Version Bibles is a real low blow in my humble opinion.

Not when the statement against that belief is TRUE, & I just showed you that the statement "Satan invented KJVO" is true.

What if you are wrong? You could be speaking against God’s people having a 100% trust in God’s Holy Words and calling them evil. What if you are wrong, and you had to explain to the Lord how you were calling that which is good as evil? Do you not believe good Christians cannot be made by a King James Bible? Do you honestly believe that if they switched to following a sea of Modern Bibles that they will be a better Christian in wanting to live more for Christ? Is that what you truly believe? I have heard the stories that those who hold to Modern Bibles are the ones who end up being more liberal and turning away from the faith altogether. I almost lost my faith because of what a Modern Translation scholar said. Is that what you desire for me? To lose my faith in God’s Word altogether? Because it sounds like you are trying to tear down my faith or 100% trust in God’s Word. This is why I see no good in your crusade against those who trust in the Word of God completely (i.e. the KJB).
I am NOT wrong. Unlike KJVOs, I've PROVEN what I said. I've provided FACTS; you've provided opinion & guesswork. You depend upon dubious sources (I. E. Will Kinney's junk) for your KJVO intel; I depend upon Sripture & common sense for mine.

Guilt by association is not always true. Catholics believe in the Trinity, but that does not mean the Trinity is not true just because Catholics believe in it. So nice try. So your pointing out the SDA’s (of whom I strongly disagree with in regards to their keeping the Sabbath, etc.) is not really a valid argument against the King James Bible being the pure Word of God.

Well, actually, it IS. I showed you that Satan invented KJVO, and he influenced people such as Dr. Wilkinson, a SDA official, personal friend of Ellen White's, to introduce the current KJVO myth to men. And he influences YOU, as is evident by your repetition of the false "Psalm 12:6=7 thingie", which comes straight from his book, & was copied by J. J. Ray, Dr. D. O. Fuller, & other Koppie-Katt KJVO authors.It was not a REAL CHRISTIAN who introduced men to the current KJVO myth, even though some real Christians have come under thrall to it. WHOM DO YOU BELIEVE SUPPLIES THE POWER TO THAT THRALLDOM ???

I suggest you pray for the HOLY SPIRIT to manifest Himself in you & show you the falsehood of KJVO.

 

[trophy33]

Granted, I do not think you will accept these reasons I made with Scripture, though. You seem pretty resistant to anything I bring up.

Yes, I do not think your reasons are good and you present facts incompletely or even totally wrongly.

Thats why I react. No hatred is required, we just discuss the topic.