Entire IHOP quit in the middle of their shift

[Hammster]

Once you stopped insisting that bosses have no responsibility to pay their workers decently, you became quite consistent.

When did I ever say that?

 

[Hammster]

Apparently your argument is that since it isn't happening to you, it can't happen to anyone.

That's not a strong argument, and it ignored the points I made about price/wage-fixing.

I think my argument is that I’ve been working 40 years, I had jobs in many industries, and they all work similarly, even the commissioned sales jobs.

 

[Hammster]

That is essentially what the law is, and by it being law, that would make it not theft. You vote for people who make the laws. they made minimum wage the law.

Which doesn’t change the fact that it’s theft.

 

[Vylo]

Which doesn’t change the fact that it’s theft.

I mean, it literally does. Theft is either taking something illegally or without permission. Minimum wage is legal, and permission is given by taking part in society and having your representation.

 

[RDKirk]

Yes, you said that already.

So how would you determine this number?

The federal government already has poverty level guidelines, which would be a place to start.

 

[RDKirk]

IHOP doesn’t really make me think of rich people driving expensive cars. The way economics seem to work, everyone pays when you pay more minimum wage. The problem as I see it is that America needs more decent paying manufacturing jobs. God’s Will be done.

Except that the powers-that-be decided to move America away from a production economy. I remember the politicians and financial pundits saying through the latter 80s that the US needed to move away from a production economy.

I personally didn't see how that was going to be a good idea, but what would I know?

 

[Hammster]

I mean, it literally does. Theft is either taking something illegally or without permission. Minimum wage is legal, and permission is given by taking part in society and having your representation.

So if the government said I could walk into your kitchen and make a sandwich, that would make it okay?

 

[Vylo]

So if the government said I could walk into your kitchen and make a sandwich, that would make it okay?

It would make it not stealing. It would also not happen with representation.

 

[Hammster]

It would make it not stealing. It would also not happen with representation.

No, it would make it legal theft.

 

[Vylo]

No, it would make it legal theft.

Legal theft means that it was done without permission. As long as you have representation, you have given your permission. That is why people being able to vote is so important.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Why, in a free market, should a business pay people unequally?

Huh? Who said anything about paying people equally or unequally?

It still seems that the business owner sets the wages. It’s their company, after all.

You might want to read up on how markets work. I think you’re missing the point.

 

[Jay Sea]

I tend to agree with you but, from experience, you will find a strong body of CF opinion which rejects the idea of pay rise in the belief that it results in higher prices or reduced employment.

There seems to be particular objection to any increase in the farcical US federal minimum wage.

OB

Governments could change tax structure and pay every one a living wage whether they work or not. Improve education and understanding of being a community and not just an individual and increase opportunities to train everyone to be part of a chosen service movement used in event of disasters; ie to be able to volunteer their help for free.
In Love
Jay Sea

 

[NxNW]

I think my argument is that I’ve been working 40 years, I had jobs in many industries, and they all work similarly, even the commissioned sales jobs.

I'm not sure how that's an argument, since it doesn't actually address any of the points I or others have made.

 

[probinson]

The federal government already has poverty level guidelines, which would be a place to start.

Poverty guidelines are based on family size. So are you suggesting that someone that is married with 2 kids should get paid more than someone who is single to perform the same job?

 

[RocksInMyHead]

Have you ever tried applying at Kroger without any job experience?

I have, actually (well, technically it was a Dillons, but Kroger owns Dillons). I got the job.

 

[Ken-1122]

I have, actually (well, technically it was a Dillons, but Kroger owns Dillons). I got the job.

Would you agree McDonalds is more likely to hire someone with no experience than Dillons? I can't speak for every single grocery store in the country, but usually when a high paying job hires someone with no experience, it is the exception not the rule; unless they have some type of apprenticeship program where they teach you a trade. Grocery stores generally don't operate that way. Low paying jobs have a reputation of being starter jobs; higher paying jobs do not have such a reputation.

 

[Ken-1122]

But that can be "theft" of the rest of us. If an employer does not pay a living wage, then the worker ends up getting food stamps and other money from the government, meaning it is "theft" from the rest of us; that we're subsidizing that business so he can pay his workers peanuts.

Yes, I know, you'll say various welfare programs are "theft." It doesn't really matter what you think, though, because those programs exist (whether they are theft, or not) and underpaying a worker causes them to end up taking advantage of those programs -- meaning the business owner is stealing from us.

No, the business owner is giving him a job when nobody else would; so the person ends up taking less from Government programs than he would take had he no job at all.

 

[RDKirk]

Poverty guidelines are based on family size. So are you suggesting that someone that is married with 2 kids should get paid more than someone who is single to perform the same job?

We're talking about a starting point to determine what a "livable wage" might be.

 

[Neogaia777]

Poverty guidelines are based on family size. So are you suggesting that someone that is married with 2 kids should get paid more than someone who is single to perform the same job?

No, just that me/we/you/me should have to pay them more, out of government programs, duh, didn't you know that...?

I mean it's not their fault that they had more kids than they were prepared to feed, sheesh...

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I couldn't resist.

But isn't that what the government (and taxpayer dollars) are for, and how governments are supposed to run/operate/work, etc...?

Sarcasm again, sorry...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

No, just that me/we/you/me should have to pay them more, out of government programs, duh, didn't you know that...?

I mean it's not their fault that they had more kids than they were prepared to feed, sheesh...

Sorry for the sarcasm, but I couldn't resist.

But isn't that what the government (and taxpayer dollars) are for, and how governments are supposed to run/operate/work, etc...?

God Bless!

Seriously though, the government always wastes very much more money than it ever gives to the poor, etc, with a ton of other programs/pork that they try hard to keep us from finding out about and/or knowing, etc, usually having to do with elections and getting re-elected continually usually, etc...

God Bless!