Vaccine hesitancy, and how to reach hesitant groups...

[ThatRobGuy]

Obviously there's been talk about weather or not the nation will reach its goal of having 70% vaccinated by July 4th (looks like there's a solid chance that we won't quite get there)

I see a lot of emphasis put on the fact that conservative males have a high level of hesitancy (obviously I know that's for political reasons...both on the part of the people refusing the vaccine, as well as on the part of the people who want to shine a spotlight on their refusal)

...but I think there needs to be more effort put on targeting some other groups that are statistically demonstrating some hesitancy as well.

I'll use my home state of Ohio as an example (last time I checked, national trends seemed to mostly line up with my state's trends)

Thankfully my state offers an interactive dashboard for seeing some more granular data on the matter:
COVID-19 Vaccination Dashboard

And there are some other groups that seem to "stand out" with regards to lagging vaccination rates.

Obviously in the case (like with staunchly conservative males) where it's due to a deeply held partisan value (or indirectly related to it), options are going to be limited with how you appeal to them.

...but that same "partisan objection" doesn't exists within the Black and 20-29 communities (in fact, statistically speaking, people from those two groups largely are on the side of the political party that's heavily encouraging vaccination)

So what piece of information is missing, or what concerns exist that could be alleviated among those two groups?, and what messaging is missing that could "turn the tide" so to speak?

In my own state, the 20-29 demographic alone would account for roughly 2 million people, and with only 38% of that age group being vaccinated, getting that additional 62% on-board would get us a lot closer to where we need to be.

 

[Crwth]

"Where we need to be"? Where's that? 70% vaccinated? Says who? And based on what? And why 70% and not 60% or 80% or...?

I was involved in a cult once. I know all the signs, the language, the appeals, the ridicule of those who won't go along, and pressures of non-members to join, the various techniques of mind control to achieve group acquiescence... the list is lengthy and nefarious. And appeals like those here are eerily reminiscent of those scarier times.

[time to take my Ivermectin]

 

[ThatRobGuy]

"Where we need to be"? Where's that? 70% vaccinated? Says who? And based on what? And why 70% and not 60% or 80% or...?

I was involved in a cult once. I know all the signs, the language, the appeals, the ridicule of those who won't go along, and pressures of non-members to join, the various techniques of mind control to achieve group acquiescence... the list is lengthy and nefarious. And appeals like those here are eerily reminiscent of those scarier times.

[time to take my Ivermectin]

I was referring to 70% in terms of the goal that was stated, I don't think anyone knows what the magic number for heard immunity is yet... (although reasonable estimates are generally between 70-80%)

With regards to Ivermectin, good luck with that...

Why You Should Not Use Ivermectin to Treat or Prevent COVID-19

Yellow Card scheme for adverse events does not suggest any new side effects of COVID-19 vaccines

Ivermectin is an unproven therapy that was pushed by, what's basically, the UK equivalent of "America's Frontline Doctors" -- "The Evidence-Based Medicine Consultancy", and are a company heavily focused on trying to pitch Ivermectin as a treatment...(much like AFD tried to pitch hydroxychloroquine)

...and the director of this organization is Tess Lawrie, who also heads up the "Ivermectin Recommendation Development Panel" in the UK.

Diving head first into a treatment, because it's coming from an outlier in the profession (just because they happen to agree with whatever anti-vaxx sentiments one may have) is more cult'ish behavior.

For people who seem to be so worried about using the products from "Big Pharma" due to fear over side effects and adverse reactions, their haphazard willingness to use other "Big Pharma" products, off-label I might add, (when there are clear warnings of side effects when doing so) seems to be counter-intuitive.

Using a pharmaceutical product that has no anti-viral properties, and is an anti-parasitic drug for treating parasitic worms, headlice, and certain forms of heartworm in livestock, in order to try to fight a virus, seems like something that would only be done by someone who didn't research what it is they're taking...

...and I'd be interested to know where people are getting this stuff as it's an Rx-only drug. Are the people who swear by this stuff buying it illegally, or did they simply find an MD/DO practicing in an "alternative integrated clinic" who's irresponsibly prescribing this stuff to people.

Not to mention, if they're worried about side effects, the listed side effects for Ivermectin are:
nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, hypotension (low blood pressure), allergic reactions (itching and hives), dizziness, ataxia (problems with balance), seizures, coma and even death.

Anyone who takes it as a covid prophylactic is either A) just disparately trying to go against the mainstream for the sake of being "anti-mainstream", or B) has been listening to a quack like a chiropractor/naturopath/homeopath, and not subjecting those sources to the same level of scrutiny they apply to actual doctors.

 

[Crwth]

LOL

Apparently I'm not that good at being facetious.

 

[sandman]

So what piece of information is missing, or what concerns exist that could be alleviated among those two groups?, and what messaging is missing that could "turn the tide" so to speak?

The more the push the more resistant I become ….I don't know if the resistant ones feel the same but ......I am #1

You want me to trust a government that is telling me it’s safe …when those same people were willing to kill people and (probably many people) because they resisted the truth that hydroxychloroquine was extremely effective…all because of their hatred for Trump.

I don’t care what other people do or think …People want to get the vax that is fine… if they don’t that’s fine

Maybe in a year of two if it is proven to be safe, I will …maybe not. But with social and regular media smothering the side effects and deaths related to this …no thanks it all seems nefarious to me.

I have zero confidence in government, media, and those political puppets who speak for science…..and in turn are responsible for the development of this virus.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

LOL

Apparently I'm not that good at being facetious.

Dang... if you were being facetious, you sold it well lol...either that, or it's late and my irony-detectors are running at sub-optimal levels

 

[Crwth]

The more the push the more resistant I become ….I don't know if the resistant ones feel the same but ......I am #1

You want me to trust a government that is telling me it’s safe …when those same people were willing to kill people and (probably many people) because they resisted the truth that hydroxychloroquine was extremely effective…all because of their hatred for Trump.

I don’t care what other people do or think …People want to get the vax that is fine… if they don’t that’s fine

Maybe in a year of two if it is proven to be safe, I will …maybe not. But with social and regular media smothering the side effects and deaths related to this …no thanks it all seems nefarious to me.

I have zero confidence in government, media, and those political puppets who speak for science…..and in turn are responsible for the development of this virus.

Totally agree. My comments about the cultic aspects of this are basically where I'm coming from on it. Just weird, weird stuff going on right now. Not at all comfortable with how all this is being presented and pushed.

 

[Crwth]

Dang... if you were being facetious, you sold it well lol...either that, or it's late and my irony-detectors are running at sub-optimal levels

I've not taken Ivermectin, but all the other comments were genuine indeed.

I will NOT take the vaccine under these pressures.

 

[Tanj]

@ThatRobGuy how much of the age related graph is due to late onset of the approval of those age groups for vaccination? What does that data look like with that confounder regressed out?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

The more the push the more resistant I become

That's not a good reason to resist something...

The majority of people would push for making sure chefs clean their stations after cutting raw poultry...the fact that they push for it doesn't make sanitizing one's cooking area a bad idea, nor does it mean they're engaged in some sort of trickery.

You want me to trust a government that is telling me it’s safe

The covid vaccine development wasn't just a "government effort"...the private sector was heavily involved.

because they resisted the truth that hydroxychloroquine was extremely effective…all because of their hatred for Trump.

I don't doubt that they resisted hydroxychloroquine (and refused to even consider it) because of their hatred for Trump, but that doesn't, by default, mean that hydroxychloroquine was an effective treatment.

It's possible for both factions to be wrong (in their way of thinking) simultaneously.

 

[Bradskii]

I've not taken Ivermectin, but all the other comments were genuine indeed.

I will NOT take the vaccine under these pressures.

Are all governments and all medical organisations in every country on the planet involved in this 'cultish behaviour'? 'Cos, honestly, it comes across a tad like paranoia to me.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

@ThatRobGuy how much of the age related graph is due to late onset of the approval of those age groups for vaccination? What does that data look like with that confounder regressed out?

A few months ago, it would've played a larger factor...

But as of current times, Ohio is donating vaccine doses because they're about to expire.

Supply has outstripped demand in our state. Literally every pharmacy I go by has signs saying "walk-ins welcome" or "no appointment needed", and people just aren't getting them. It's basically been open to everyone 16 and older for a few months at this point.

Mid-march/Early-April is when it became open to everyone...there was a big spike at the beginning (for people who had been wanting it and waiting, but had to wait), and then another, much smaller, spike when DeWine announced the million dollar lottery...

You can see where the trend line is with regards to people getting it.

Basically, we're at a point where the people who haven't taken it, is because they don't want to.

 

[Strathos]

I'd like to point out that Trump never actually took HCQ when he had COVID, but he did get the vaccine.

 

[jacks]

So what piece of information is missing, or what concerns exist that could be alleviated among those two groups?, and what messaging is missing that could "turn the tide" so to speak?

To answer this part of your post. I've been surprised that they have resulted to things like lotteries and give-a-ways to get people vaccinated. (Not to mention the ineffective strategy of shaming.) This seems very superficial and wouldn't entice me if I was hesitant. What I would like to see is statistics on the number of cases/hospitalizations/deaths of vaccinated vs unvaccinated people. If those numbers clearly showed that the vaccine was effective, (and were presented every time they talked about Corvid's progress, not buried in some web site.) I believe that would convince some people they should get it.

 

[CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN]

I'd like to point out that Trump never actually took HCQ when he had COVID, but he did get the vaccine.

Yes , but he brain washed a lot of people . HCQ was the miracle drug against COVID-19. Also trump and his family got the COVID-19 vaccination.

 

[Bradskii]

To answer this part of your post. I've been surprised that they have resulted to things like lotteries and give-a-ways to get people vaccinated. (Not to mention the ineffective strategy of shaming.) This seems very superficial and wouldn't entice me if I was hesitant. What I would like to see is statistics on the number of cases/hospitalizations/deaths of vaccinated vs unvaccinated people. If those numbers clearly showed that the vaccine was effective, (and were presented every time they talked about Corvid's progress, not buried in some web site.) I believe that would convince some people they should get it.

Maybe people like Springsteen should up the ante. For his show opening on Broadway it's 'No vaccine, no entry'.

 

[Taisho]

To answer this part of your post. I've been surprised that they have resulted to things like lotteries and give-a-ways to get people vaccinated. (Not to mention the ineffective strategy of shaming.) This seems very superficial and wouldn't entice me if I was hesitant. What I would like to see is statistics on the number of cases/hospitalizations/deaths of vaccinated vs unvaccinated people. If those numbers clearly showed that the vaccine was effective, (and were presented every time they talked about Corvid's progress, not buried in some web site.) I believe that would convince some people they should get it.

It should surprise you considering the US government doesn't have the same energy for Phillip Morris - where cigarettes are KNOWN to cause 480,000 deaths per year in the States.

Why do they care about this vaccine but not the smoking deaths? Why aren't governors banning Cigarettes? LOL...

Why do you all trust human so much - especially given history? Please think... just because a human is smart does not mean they have your best interest at heart.

Any self-aware human should have secondary and tertiary thoughts about taking a biotechnologically enhanced vaccine from companies that are for profit.

 

[Bradskii]

It should surprise you considering the US government doesn't have the same energy for Phillip Morris - where cigarettes are KNOWN to cause 480,000 deaths per year in the States.

Why do they care about this vaccine but not the smoking deaths? Why aren't governors banning Cigarettes? LOL...

Why do you all trust human so much - especially given history? Please think... just because a human is smart does not mean they have your best interest at heart.

Any self-aware human should have secondary and tertiary thoughts about taking a biotechnologically enhanced vaccine from companies that are for profit.

The harm from cigarettes is self inflicted. If someone is dumb enough to smoke knowing the dangers then Dawinism kicks in and they are removed from the gene pool.

And you object to a vaccine because you have to pay for it? When was the last time you took any medicine or had any medical procedure done that didn't increase the bottom line of umpteen companies? Maybe you know of some companies producing medical supplies that don't try to make a profit. Maybe you check the books of all companies involved before you agree to someone attempting to prevent you getting sick or curing you from what ails you.

That's an incredibly naive view you have there. Or maybe paranoid.

 

[Taisho]

The harm from cigarettes is self inflicted. If someone is dumb enough to smoke knowing the dangers then Dawinism kicks in and they are removed from the gene pool.

Yes, that attitude is definitely human-centric.

LOL. And, to your credit, the reason I am laughing is because Cigarretts were marketed to American citizens as safe in the infancy.

And you object to a vaccine because you have to pay for it?

No, I object to vaccines because historically, no nation has ever had the best interest of their citizens at heart.

When was the last time you took any medicine or had any medical procedure done that didn't increase the bottom line of umpteen companies?

Australia is also capitalist-forward; capitalists only care about making capital: that is the goal of capitalism - making more capital. It doesn't matter if it is at the expense of other humans.

Maybe you know of some companies producing medical supplies that don't try to make a profit. Maybe you check the books of all companies involved before you agree to someone attempting to prevent you getting sick or curing you from what ails you.

The proof is historic; all governments on this plane of existence have experimented on their population - and all we do is call it conspiracy lol...

As said, you are free to take a syringe of biotechnology from lab-coat-covered humans you believe have your best interest at heart. I am not arguing against human sovereignty to trust other humans because they lack confidence in their own discernment or knowledge.

That's an incredibly naive view you have there. Or maybe paranoid.

Both qualifications you gave are knee-jerk reactions to opposition toward the status quo. As said, there is plenty of social pressure people buckle under when it concerns this vaccine. I am not arguing another human abdicating his or her sovereignty to other humans they trust over their own logic. In the day of MIT OPEN COURSEWORKS, there is no excuse for any human to be ignorant of the biological, social, psychological, historical or political history when it comes to citizens of a nation. I am not arguing your latitude to trust other humans over yourself.

 

[Bradskii]

No, I object to vaccines because historically, no nation has ever had the best interest of their citizens at heart.

Maybe you've heard of this system that was invented to prevent governments doing what they will with the nations citizens. It's called democracy. It's not perfect. But a shame you don't use it.