JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

[Leaf473]

Hello Leaf, my question was specifically to the 10 commandments in the new covenant. Not the "shadow laws" for remission of sins from the Levitical Priesthood of the old covenant laws that point to and are fulfilled and continued in Jesus to who they pointed to as Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world (John 1:29; 36 Hebrews 10:10) and his role as out Great High Priest (Hebrews 7:1-25) in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not me based on better promises *Hebrews 8:1-6. Jesus also discusses the 10 commandments in Matthew 5:19-22; 27-28 where he is applying God's law to our very thoughts and feelings (heart; see also Matthew 15:18-20) in fulfillment of the scriptures from Isaiah 42:21 where Jesus would come and magnify the law and make it honorable. You did not really clarify anything I asked you in my post you are responding to here and neither did you answer my questions. Did you wish to have another go?

Since the entire law would include the ten commandments, the answer I gave seems very clear to me.

But sure, I can rephrase it.

Are you claiming that Jesus fulfilled God's 10 commandments so that we do not have to as seems to be the teaching of many that disagree with the scriptures?

This part of the sentence seems to me to be not part of the question, but commentary.

...as seems to be the teaching of many that disagree with the scriptures?

So the question I see is

Are you claiming that Jesus fulfilled God's 10 commandments so that we do not have to?

The simple answer is: Yes.
The explanation is that Jesus fulfilled the entire law, which includes the Ten commandments.
We don't have to do that again and again, attempting to redo the work that Christ has completed.
At the same time, it is also true that when we love our neighbor as ourselves, the entire law is fulfilled.

So the fulfillment is a completed action in the past, as well as an ongoing activity in the present.

Does that answer your first question?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Since the entire law would include the ten commandments, the answer I gave seems very clear to me.

But sure, I can rephrase it.


This part of the sentence seems to me to be not part of the question, but commentary.


So the question I see is

The simple answer is: Yes.
The explanation is that Jesus fulfilled the entire law, which includes the Ten commandments.
We don't have to do that again and again, attempting to redo the work that Christ has completed.
At the same time, it is also true that when we love our neighbor as ourselves, the entire law is fulfilled.

So the fulfillment is a completed action in the past, as well as an ongoing activity in the present.

Does that answer your first question?

Jesus did not sacrifice His life so we could continue sinning. I worry that you think this way, becuase it’s not what the scriptures teach us.

Fulfill does not mean “abolish” which seems to be your definition, because when you are not required to do something like you state, that means “done away with” which is the opposite of what Jesus told us. Mathew 5:17-20.

From the mouth of our Savior:

Mathew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
1 John 3:4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness.

James seems to have the correct interpretation of what fulfill means

James 2:8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well; 9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all

We fulfill the laws when we obey not disobey. I would suggest you read Mathew 5:17-20 and really pray for the Holy Spirit to guide you on your understating of what fulfill means. If you read it in the proper context, it does not have Jesus contradicting Himself when He said He did not come to destroy the laws which is why He ends the passage with Mathew 5:19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Revelations 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

These reference the Ten Commandments and those practicing them without repentance are not able to enter into eternal life. True repentance means we are sorry for our sins and we want to change our behavior. Jesus can help us for those who are willing to really want to do God’s will. John 14:15-18.

 

[Leaf473]

Jesus did not sacrifice His life so we could continue sinning. I worry that you think this way, becuase it’s not what the scriptures teach us.

Fulfill does not mean “abolish” which seems to be your definition, because when you are not required to do something like you state, that means “done away with” which is the opposite of what Jesus told us. Mathew 5:17-20.

From the mouth of our Savior:

Mathew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
1 John 3:4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness.

James seems to have the correct interpretation of what fulfill means

James 2:8 If you really fulfill the royal law according to the Scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you do well; 9 but if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all

We fulfill the laws when we obey not disobey. I would suggest you read Mathew 5:17-20 and really pray for the Holy Spirit to guide you on your understating of what fulfill means. If you read it in the proper context, it does not have Jesus contradicting Himself when He said He did not come to destroy the laws which is why He ends the passage with Mathew 5:19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20 For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Revelations 22:14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.

These reference the Ten Commandments and those practicing them without repentance are not able to enter into eternal life. True repentance means we are sorry for our sins and we want to change our behavior. Jesus can help us for those who are willing to really want to do God’s will. John 14:15-18.

Hi SabbathBlessings,
Nice to meet you!

By way of explaining how I see things, let's start with one of the quotes you put in your post from Jesus, "Anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven."

I think Jesus is referring to the entire law there. Do we agree?

And he's referring to the entire law here as well, do we agree?
"You tithe mint and rue and every herb, but you bypass justice and the love of God. You ought to have done these, and not to have left the other undone."

One of those "least commandments" is found here in Numbers, "Make fringes in the borders of your garments throughout your generations, and put on the fringe of each border a cord of blue."

Do you make those fringes? If not, why not?

Looking forward to a great discussion!

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Hello Leaf, my question was specifically to the 10 commandments in the new covenant. Not the "shadow laws" for remission of sins from the Levitical Priesthood of the old covenant laws that point to and are fulfilled and continued in Jesus to who they pointed to as Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world (John 1:29; 36 Hebrews 10:10) and his role as out Great High Priest (Hebrews 7:1-25) in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not me based on better promises *Hebrews 8:1-6. Jesus also discusses the 10 commandments in Matthew 5:19-22; 27-28 where he is applying God's law to our very thoughts and feelings (heart; see also Matthew 15:18-20) in fulfillment of the scriptures from Isaiah 42:21 where Jesus would come and magnify the law and make it honorable. You did not really clarify anything I asked you in my post you are responding to here and neither did you answer my questions. Did you wish to have another go?

Your response here...

The simple answer is: Yes. The explanation is that Jesus fulfilled the entire law, which includes the Ten commandments. We don't have to do that again and again, attempting to redo the work that Christ has completed. At the same time, it is also true that when we love our neighbor as ourselves, the entire law is fulfilled.

Thanks Leaf, Yes this answers my question. Thanks for being honest. Jesus does not teach anywhere in the bible that he fulfilled Gods' law so that we no longer have to. This teaching is against the very Words of Jesus in Matthew 5 and the opposite of what Jesus and all the Apostles in the new covenant taught and does not agree with the scriptures at all and the purpose of Gods' law in the new covenant.

What Jesus actually said was "Think not that I am come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy but to fulfill them. Jesus goes on to say not one jot or tittle shall pass from the law till Heaven and earth pass away and all be fulfilled and that whosoever breaks one of the least of these commandments shall be called the least in God's Kingdom and that unless our righteousness exceeds that of the external appearance of the Scribes and the Pharisees we shall in no wise enter into Gods' kingdom. - Matthew 5:17-20.

Jesus fulfilled and obeyed all the law and the prophets. He obeyed Gods' 10 commandments and the "shadow laws" for remission of sins and sin offerings, the Levitical Priesthood the earthly Sanctuary all pointed to Jesus as Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world once for all (John 1:29; 36; Hebrews 10:10), and his role in the new covenant as our great High Priest *Hebrews 7:1-25 in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man of which the earthly was only a copy based on better promises of the new covenant *Hebrews 8:1-6. Jesus did not "fulfill" these laws like many teach today so that we do not have to. That is a false teaching and a denial of the very words of Jesus in Matthew 5:17-20 and Matthew 5 where Jesus magnifies the requirements of Gods' 10 commandments to our very thoughts and feelings in Matthew 5:21-22 and Matthew 5:27-28.

Jesus came to magnify God’s 10 commandment from the inside out quoting Matthew 5:17-32 (applying adultery and murder to our thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *Isaiah 42:21. This is to show that unless our righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. Evil (moral wrong doing) begins in the heart. Breaking God's 10 commandments from the heart according to Jesus is what defiles a man in Matthew 15:18-19. Jesus is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *Matthew 23:27-28.

Jesus magnified the law to the inside out. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Savior and that sin originates in the heart (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have God’s new covenant promise to of a new heart to love and why we need to be born again by faith in God's Word for salvation to be free from sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *Hebrews 8:10-12; 1 John 3:3-10.

This is leading to the new covenant promise of a new heart to love *Hebrews 8:10-12; John 5:42; 1 John 5:17-19; 1 John 4:16; 1 John 5:3; 1 John 4:8.

Without Jesus we do not have the love of God in us *John 5:42. We need to be born of God to love *1 John 4:7 and partake of the new covenant promise. This is why Jesus teaches in *John 3:3-7 that unless we are made clean from the inside out and born again to love we cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven. This is what Jesus is talking about in Matthew 5:20 when discussing the Scribes and the Pharisees teaching the application of God's law from the inside out and applying God’s 10 commandments to our very thoughts.

Whosoever is born of god to love in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12 does not commit sin according to the scriptures in 1 John 3:9; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; Romans 3:31; Matthew 22:36-40. This is the good news of the gospel in the new covenant. We have a Savior to save us from sin (not in sin) but we have to be made new to walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:1-4.

1 John 3:3-10 is talking about all those who are born again to love and it is love that fulfills God's law in all those who believe and follow god's word in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10. This results in a people that keep God’s law (10 commandments) from the inside out. *Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14; 1 John 2:3-4; 1 John 3:3-10; Romans 13:8-10; Romans 3:31; Hebrews 8:10-12. Unless we are born again to love we cannot enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7.

..................


CONCLUSION: Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: FEAR GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: FOR THIS IS THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN. God’s LAW (10 commandments) are not abolished they are fulfilled and established in the life of a believer as they believe God’s Word and abide in Christ and are born again to walk in God’s Spirit *1 John 3:6-9; Galatians 5:16; Romans 3:31; Romans 8:4.

Hope this is helpful

 

[Leaf473]

Your response here...

Thanks Leaf, Yes this answers my question. Thanks for being honest. Jesus does not teach anywhere in the bible that he fulfilled Gods' law so that we no longer have to. This teaching is against the very Words of Jesus in Matthew 5 and the opposite of what Jesus and all the Apostles in the new covenant taught and does not agree with the scriptures at all and the purpose of Gods' law in the new covenant.

What Jesus actually said was "Think not that I have come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy but to fulfill them. Jesus goes on to say not one jot or tittle shall pass from the law till Heaven and earth pass away and all be fulfilled and that whosoever breaks one of the least of these commandments shall be called the least in God's Kingdom and that unless our righteousness exceeds that of the external appearance of the Scribes and the Pharisees we shall in no wise enter into Gods' kingdom. - Matthew 5:17-20.

Jesus fulfilled and obeyed all the law and the prophets. He obeyed Gods' 10 commandments and the "shadow laws" for remission of sins and sin offerings, the Levitical Priesthood the earthly Sanctuary all pointed to Jesus as Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world once for all (John 1:29; 36; Hebrews 10:10), and his role in the new covenant as our great High Priest *Hebrews 7:1-25 in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man of which the earthly was only a copy based on better promises of the new covenant *Hebrews 8:1-6. Jesus did not "fulfill" these laws like many teach today so that we do not have to. That is a false teaching and a denial of the very words of Jesus in Matthew 5:17-20 and Matthew 5 where Jesus magnifies the requirements of Gods' 10 commandments to our very thoughts and feelings in Matthew 5:21-22 and Matthew 5:27-28.

Jesus came to magnify God’s 10 commandment from the inside out quoting Matthew 5:17-32 (applying adultery and murder to our thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *Isaiah 42:21. This is to show that unless our righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. Evil (moral wrong doing) begins in the heart. Breaking God's 10 commandments from the heart according to Jesus is what defiles a man in Matthew 15:18-19. Jesus is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *Matthew 23:27-28.

Jesus magnified the law to the inside out. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Savior and that sin originates in the heart (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have God’s new covenant promise to of a new heart to love and why we need to be born again by faith in God's Word for salvation to be free from sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *Hebrews 8:10-12; 1 John 3:3-10.

This is leading to the new covenant promise of a new heart to love *Hebrews 8:10-12; John 5:42; 1 John 5:17-19; 1 John 4:16; 1 John 5:3; 1 John 4:8.

Without Jesus we do not have the love of God in us *John 5:42. We need to be born of God to love *1 John 4:7 and partake of the new covenant promise. This is why Jesus teaches in *John 3:3-7 that unless we are made clean from the inside out and born again to love we cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven. This is what Jesus is talking about in Matthew 5:20 when discussing the Scribes and the Pharisees teaching the application of God's law from the inside out and applying God’s 10 commandments to our very thoughts.

Whosoever is born of god to love in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12 does not commit sin according to the scriptures in 1 John 3:9; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; Romans 3:31; Matthew 22:36-40. This is the good news of the gospel in the new covenant. We have a Savior to save us from sin (not in sin) but we have to be made new to walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:1-4.

1 John 3:3-10 is talking about all those who are born again to love and it is love that fulfills God's law in all those who believe and follow god's word in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10. This results in a people that keep God’s law (10 commandments) from the inside out. *Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14; 1 John 2:3-4; 1 John 3:3-10; Romans 13:8-10; Romans 3:31; Hebrews 8:10-12. Unless we are born again to love we cannot enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7.

..................


CONCLUSION: Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: FEAR GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: FOR THIS IS THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN. God’s LAW (10 commandments) are not abolished they are fulfilled and established in the life of a believer as they believe God’s Word and abide in Christ and are born again to walk in God’s Spirit *1 John 3:6-9; Galatians 5:16; Romans 3:31; Romans 8:4.

Hope this is helpful

Let's start here.

Jesus does not teach anywhere in the bible that he fulfilled Gods' law so that we no longer have to.

Jesus said he came (aorist tense) to fulfill the law and the prophets.

Did he accomplish that?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Your response here...

Thanks Leaf, Yes this answers my question. Thanks for being honest. Jesus does not teach anywhere in the bible that he fulfilled Gods' law so that we no longer have to. This teaching is against the very Words of Jesus in Matthew 5 and the opposite of what Jesus and all the Apostles in the new covenant taught and does not agree with the scriptures at all and the purpose of Gods' law in the new covenant.

What Jesus actually said was "Think not that I have come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy the law or the prophets I have not come to destroy but to fulfill them. Jesus goes on to say not one jot or tittle shall pass from the law till Heaven and earth pass away and all be fulfilled and that whosoever breaks one of the least of these commandments shall be called the least in God's Kingdom and that unless our righteousness exceeds that of the external appearance of the Scribes and the Pharisees we shall in no wise enter into Gods' kingdom. - Matthew 5:17-20.

Jesus fulfilled and obeyed all the law and the prophets. He obeyed Gods' 10 commandments and the "shadow laws" for remission of sins and sin offerings, the Levitical Priesthood the earthly Sanctuary all pointed to Jesus as Gods' sacrifice for the sins of the world once for all (John 1:29; 36; Hebrews 10:10), and his role in the new covenant as our great High Priest *Hebrews 7:1-25 in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man of which the earthly was only a copy based on better promises of the new covenant *Hebrews 8:1-6. Jesus did not "fulfill" these laws like many teach today so that we do not have to. That is a false teaching and a denial of the very words of Jesus in Matthew 5:17-20 and Matthew 5 where Jesus magnifies the requirements of Gods' 10 commandments to our very thoughts and feelings in Matthew 5:21-22 and Matthew 5:27-28.

Jesus came to magnify God’s 10 commandment from the inside out quoting Matthew 5:17-32 (applying adultery and murder to our thoughts and feelings) in fulfillment of *Isaiah 42:21. This is to show that unless our righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees we can in no way enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. Jesus is saying the problem runs deeper then outward observance to the 10 Commandments. Evil (moral wrong doing) begins in the heart. Breaking God's 10 commandments from the heart according to Jesus is what defiles a man in Matthew 15:18-19. Jesus is saying we can be outwardly perfect and blameless like the Scribes and Pharisee but inwardly like dead mans bones *Matthew 23:27-28.

Jesus magnified the law to the inside out. To show us that we are all sinners in need of a Savior and that sin originates in the heart (thoughts and feelings). That is why we have God’s new covenant promise to of a new heart to love and why we need to be born again by faith in God's Word for salvation to be free from sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *Hebrews 8:10-12; 1 John 3:3-10.

This is leading to the new covenant promise of a new heart to love *Hebrews 8:10-12; John 5:42; 1 John 5:17-19; 1 John 4:16; 1 John 5:3; 1 John 4:8.

Without Jesus we do not have the love of God in us *John 5:42. We need to be born of God to love *1 John 4:7 and partake of the new covenant promise. This is why Jesus teaches in *John 3:3-7 that unless we are made clean from the inside out and born again to love we cannot enter the Kingdom of Heaven. This is what Jesus is talking about in Matthew 5:20 when discussing the Scribes and the Pharisees teaching the application of God's law from the inside out and applying God’s 10 commandments to our very thoughts.

Whosoever is born of god to love in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12 does not commit sin according to the scriptures in 1 John 3:9; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; Romans 3:31; Matthew 22:36-40. This is the good news of the gospel in the new covenant. We have a Savior to save us from sin (not in sin) but we have to be made new to walk in God's Spirit *Galatians 5:16; Romans 8:1-4.

1 John 3:3-10 is talking about all those who are born again to love and it is love that fulfills God's law in all those who believe and follow god's word in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12; Romans 13:8-10. This results in a people that keep God’s law (10 commandments) from the inside out. *Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14; 1 John 2:3-4; 1 John 3:3-10; Romans 13:8-10; Romans 3:31; Hebrews 8:10-12. Unless we are born again to love we cannot enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN *JOHN 3:3-7.

..................


CONCLUSION: Ecclesiastes 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: FEAR GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS: FOR THIS IS THE WHOLE DUTY OF MAN.
God’s LAW (10 commandments) are not abolished they are fulfilled and established in the life of a believer as they believe God’s Word and abide in Christ and are born again to walk in God’s Spirit *1 John 3:6-9; Galatians 5:16; Romans 3:31; Romans 8:4.

Hope this is helpful

I wish there was a double winner icon! Well said @LoveGodsWord.

God bless and Happy Sabbath!

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Hi SabbathBlessings,
Nice to meet you!

By way of explaining how I see things, let's start with one of the quotes you put in your post from Jesus, "Anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven."

I think Jesus is referring to the entire law there. Do we agree?

And he's referring to the entire law here as well, do we agree?
"You tithe mint and rue and every herb, but you bypass justice and the love of God. You ought to have done these, and not to have left the other undone."

One of those "least commandments" is found here in Numbers, "Make fringes in the borders of your garments throughout your generations, and put on the fringe of each border a cord of blue."

Do you make those fringes? If not, why not?

Looking forward to a great discussion!

Hi Leaf,

It’s imge, I just updated my user name.

Just curious do you know why tassels were required during the Old Covenant? Or why this statement was made? "You tithe mint and rue and every herb, but you bypass justice and the love of God. You ought to have done these, and not to have left the other undone."

Do you know why Paul made this statement?

1 Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.

 

[Leaf473]

Hi Leaf,

It’s imge, I just updated my user name.

Good to see you again.

If you've been following my conversation with @LoveGodsWord , you know that I'm just doing short posts now, because long posts aren't healthy for me on this cell phone.

Of course, you are welcome to write posts of any length. If a post contains multiple points or questions, I will probably just pick one, usually the first.

Just curious do you know why tassels were required during the Old Covenant?

I think it was to help the Israelites remember all the other commandments.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Good to see you again.

If you've been following my conversation with @LoveGodsWord , you know that I'm just doing short posts now, because long posts aren't healthy for me on this cell phone.

Of course, you are welcome to write posts of any length. If a post contains multiple points or questions, I will probably just pick one, usually the first.


I think it was to help the Israelites remember all the other commandments.

That’s right Leaf here is the whole passage for your reference:

Numbers 15:37 Again the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 38 “Speak to the children of Israel: Tell them to make tassels on the corners of their garments throughout their generations, and to put a blue thread in the tassels of the corners. 39 And you shall have the tassel, that you may look upon it and remember all the commandments of the Lord and do them, and that you may not follow the harlotry to which your own heart and your own eyes are inclined, 40 and that you may remember and do all My commandments, and be holy for your God

God’s laws are now written on the heart in the New Covenant. Jeremiah 31:33 When we obey God’s commandments we are fulfilling what is written in our hearts (His laws) out of love. Do you believe we show God love when we obey Him or disobey?

 

[HIM]

Let's start here.

Jesus said he came (aorist tense) to fulfill the law and the prophets.

Did he accomplish that?

Context my friend. If the Law and the prophets is fulfilled in the sense that you are putting forth then heaven and earth have passed away and Jesus has come again and we are in eternity living.
Because within the same passage Jesus also said until heaven and pass away not one jot or tittle shall pass from the Law until ALL IS FULFILLED.

Correct?

 

[Leaf473]

That’s right Leaf here is the whole passage for your reference:

Numbers 15:37 Again the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 38 “Speak to the children of Israel: Tell them to make tassels on the corners of their garments throughout their generations, and to put a blue thread in the tassels of the corners. 39 And you shall have the tassel, that you may look upon it and remember all the commandments of the Lord and do them, and that you may not follow the harlotry to which your own heart and your own eyes are inclined, 40 and that you may remember and do all My commandments, and be holy for your God

God’s laws are now written on the heart in the New Covenant. Jeremiah 31:33 When we obey God’s commandments we are fulfilling what is written in our hearts (His laws) out of love. Do you believe we show God love when we obey Him or disobey?

We show God love when we obey him. That is, following all of his directions.

 

[Leaf473]

Context my friend. If the Law and the prophets is fulfilled in the sense that you are putting forth...

In the sense that Jesus used it, did he accomplish that?

...then heaven and earth have passed away and Jesus has come again and we are in eternity living.
Because within the same passage Jesus also said until heaven and pass away not one jot or tittle shall pass from the Law until ALL IS FULFILLED.

Correct?

 

[HIM]

In the sense that Jesus used it, did he accomplish that?

The context does not support that. He is speaking in reference to us and the people He was speaking to not Himself and His Ministry.

Jesus says not one jot or tittle shall pass away from the Law until all is fulfilled. Then says Therefore, because of what I just said, whosoever shall break one of these least commandments and teach man so shall be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven.

How shall they be called least?

They shall in no case enter into the Kingdom of Heaven verse 20 says within the same context.

Why?

Because their righteousness had not exceeded the righteousness of the Scribes and Pharisees. For they say and do not.

Matt 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Matt 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Matt 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Matt 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Leaf473]

The context does not support that.

???
Do you mean that the context does not support the sense that Jesus used it?
Or the context does not support that he accomplished something?

 

[HIM]

???
Do you mean that the context does not support the sense that Jesus used it?
Or the context does not support that he accomplished something?

Read the post please

 

[Leaf473]

Read the post please

I reread your post.

But I'm not sure if you're saying that Jesus came to fulfill the law and the prophets but was unsuccessful,

or if you're saying that Jesus did not come to fulfill the law and the prophets and instead fulfilled something else.

 

[Leaf473]

There's obviously lots of different ways to translate Matthew 5:17

Matthew 5:17 - Bible Gateway

I think the Contemporary English Version (CEV) gives the sense that goes along with what some of my Christian brothers and sisters have been saying,

"Don’t suppose that I came to do away with the Law and the Prophets. I did not come to do away with them, but to give them their full meaning."

One of the laws given their full meaning was about putting fringes on your clothes.

A common response is that it's a civil or ceremonial law.

What then is the standard, criterion, algorithm, etc that a person uses to decide that?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

There's obviously lots of different ways to translate Matthew 5:17

Matthew 5:17 - Bible Gateway

I think the Contemporary English Version (CEV) gives the sense that goes along with what some of my Christian brothers and sisters have been saying,

"Don’t suppose that I came to do away with the Law and the Prophets. I did not come to do away with them, but to give them their full meaning."

One of the laws given their full meaning was about putting fringes on your clothes.

A common response is that it's a civil or ceremonial law.

What then is the standard, criterion, algorithm, etc that a person uses to decide that?

Hello Leaf, you should really take the time to consider post # 1704 linked. Jesus speaks of all the law in Matthew 5:17-19. That is all the "shadow laws" for remission of sins from the Mosaic book of the old covenant (Exodus 24:7) and the prophets that foretold of His coming (e.g. Isaiah 53:1-12) as well as His obedience to the requirements of Gods' 10 commandments. So Matthew 5 is doing two things. Firstly is it stating that Jesus is the fulfillment of the law and the prophets that foretold of His coming and secondly he fulfilled and obeyed all the righteous requirements of God's law. Obeying God's law he became the perfect spotless lamb of God without blemish (sinless) in order to become God's perfect sacrifice for the sins of the world (Hebrews 4:15; 1 Peter 2:22). Jesus talks specifically in Matthew 5 about Gods' 10 commandments and there real meaning, magnifying their requirements to our very thoughts and feeling giving the examples of anger to murder and adultery by lustful thoughts showing that sin originates in the heart in fulfillment of the scriptures from Isaiah 42:21. You miss out on a lot by ignoring the detail that I spent some time sharing with you in the linked post above that disagrees with your teachings. Anyhow it is up to you. We all stand before God come judgement day for the words of God we accept and those we reject according to Jesus in John 12:47-48.

 

[Leaf473]

Hello Leaf, you should really take the time to consider post # 1704 linked. Jesus speaks of all the law in Matthew 5:17-19. That is all the "shadow laws"...

Basically what I was asking in the post you're responding to is:
What is the standard, criterion, algorithm, etc that a person uses to decide which laws are the "shadow laws"?

I know in the past you've talked about laws relating to remission of sins and sin offerings, the Levitical Priesthood the earthly Sanctuary.

And there's the part from Colossians
"eating, or in drinking, or with respect to a feast day or a new moon or a Sabbath day".

Is that a complete list of "shadow laws"?

...for remission of sins from the Mosaic book of the old covenant (Exodus 24:7) that pointed to Jesus and pointed to him as well as His fulfillment in being obedient to Gods' 10 commandments. Jesus talks specifically in Matthew 5 about Gods' 10 commandments and there real meaning, magnifying their requirements to our very thoughts and feeling giving the examples of anger to murder and adultery by lustful thoughts showing that sin originates in the heart in fulfillment of the scriptures from Isaiah. You miss out on a lot by ignoring the detail that I spent some time sharing with you in the linked post above that disagrees with your teachings. Anyhow it is up to you. We all stand before God come judgement day for the words of God we accept and those we reject according to Jesus in John 12:47-48.

Also, how was your tooth situation doing?

 

[HIM]

There's obviously lots of different ways to translate Matthew 5:17

Matthew 5:17 - Bible Gateway

I think the Contemporary English Version (CEV) gives the sense that goes along with what some of my Christian brothers and sisters have been saying,

"Don’t suppose that I came to do away with the Law and the Prophets. I did not come to do away with them, but to give them their full meaning."

Do you agree?