Halloween and "cultural appropriation".

[muichimotsu]

I know of proud black rednecks... it's a lifestyle not a skin color.
Some of them even fly rebel flags.
And calling us ill mannered just shows your biase. I suppose you think us unintelligent too. I demand compensation for my mental anguish.

And there's an example of internalized racism, or even just outright the systemic racism through historical negationism like the idea that the Confederacy wasn't racist at all or that the Confederate battle flag can be separated from the racism of the Confederacy or the Dixiecrats that historically utilized it to buck against integration of schools. The more you know!

 

[muichimotsu]

Oh please. Minorities are now the favored class. Look at how the vice president nominee pretends to be black.

Dude..she has mixed ancestry, check your privilege AGAIN. She isn't pretending to be black, she's a minority within a minority, technically, so she's black just by her heritage from her father. Or do you think someone has to look like Wesley Snipes to be black?

 

[muichimotsu]

He's no more black and I am with a good tan.
And she's definitely not black.

Get bent with this purist nonsense: you don't get to define what black is even if you yourself were black, because race isn't something you gatekeep with ridiculous standards like specific skin tone range

 

[Triumvirate]

Your attitude smacks of Dunning Kruger syndrome, like you think you know so much. Everything is a hyperbole in regards to how you deflect away from considering that you might be ignorant about something and, *gasp* want to learn more.

DKS was independently concluded in another recent thread, incidentally.

 

[Aldebaran]

It's colonialist, you don't know what you're talking about because, again, I'm pretty sure you're white and thus may not be able to see past your own privileged status in society. the idea that any culture's style of dress, especially that which is not just something interchangeable, like a "Western" suit and tie, is just something you can wear is the very attitude that is marginalizing in its outcome, because it makes those cultures that stand out feel like they just have accept being objectified.

Hahaha! What the heck are you even talking about here? Do people who wear a suit and tie scare you or something?

Never said that, it's merely more common because of colonialist spread and how whites permeate and create a social bias towards them with the idea that they're civilized, the white savior attitude in part.

And what does rioting and looting push the idea of? Being civilized? Clearly, society favors one over the other for very good reason. If you don't like civilized, then what do you want? Barbarism?

And there's your systemic racism, the idea that black people are entitled or will always loot and rob because that's just "how they are", rather than it being an unfortunate response to a culture that continues to marginalize them even when there is the appearance of "equality".

Well, the latest instance of a black guy with a knife trying to stab police officers and getting shot as a result then turning into them rioting and looting shows a lack of "civilization" in their thinking (or at least the advocacy groups that claim to speak for them). If it's not "how they are", then how about "what they keep doing"?

Segregation ring a bell? Othering of black people is part of the issue and them getting a specialty TV channel or a magazine doesn't mean there isn't still internalized racism from black people towards themselves in the expectations of conforming to what white culture thinks is "black"

It does indicate that they get to do what whites cannot, or at least society wouldn't accept as being "hateful" for doing the same thing. That indicates a presence of black privilege or entitlement. So much for the equality they talk about.

 

[muichimotsu]

My concern is that if you keep insisting certain things are offensive and will always be offensive, it removes the ability of progress and society overcoming them.

Something doesn't go away just because we forget or even legitimately don't know in general and progress is not erasure, it's acknowledging the bad aspects and moving past them. We can innovate cultural traditions without stepping on minorities

 

[Triumvirate]

Dude..she has mixed ancestry, check your privilege AGAIN. She isn't pretending to be black, she's a minority within a minority, technically, so she's black just by her heritage from her father. Or do you think someone has to look like Wesley Snipes to be black?

Funny how this silly chap performatively freaked out when he misread my post and thought I was insisting rednecks had to be white. And then he turns around and says that Harris isn't black.

Racists are funny sometimes.

 

[Aldebaran]

Get bent with this purist nonsense: you don't get to define what black is even if you yourself were black, because race isn't something you gatekeep with ridiculous standards like specific skin tone range

Tell that to the racial antagonists that keep telling us that it's an identity and must be respected, just like gender.

 

[Triumvirate]

Tell that to the racial antagonists that keep telling us that it's an identity and must be respected, just like gender.

That's...literally the opposite of what happens. Noone gave Rachel Dolezal the time of day.

Well, apart from people making arguments like this because they thought they were catching the other side out.

 

[muichimotsu]

Hahaha! What the heck are you even talking about here? Do people who wear a suit and tie scare you or something?

Way to be condescending again and quote mine me to focus on something that was not intended remotely the way you're spinning it to degrade me

And what does rioting and looting push the idea of? Being civilized? Clearly, society favors one over the other for very good reason. If you don't like civilized, then what do you want? Barbarism?

Society doesn't favor barbarism, it enables it because it refuses to confront the issues and act like the status quo is what makes things "civilized", where white people are still given more favored treatment in terms of various things

Well, the latest instance of a black guy with a knife trying to stab police officers and getting shot as a result then turning into them rioting and looting shows a lack of "civilization" in their thinking (or at least the advocacy groups that claim to speak for them). If it's not "how they are", then how about "what they keep doing"?

If it's a pervasive problem, then maybe don't blame them, blame the institutions that continue to step all over them

It does indicate that they get to do what whites cannot, or at least society wouldn't accept as being "hateful" for doing the same thing. That indicates a presence of black privilege or entitlement. So much for the equality they talk about.

Whites never lacked it, you slack-jawed moron, we were the dominant culture and still are. How often do black people get anything more than bit parts or fitting into hurtful stereotypes? The fact that black people had to FIGHT for this in any sense, like representation in the 60s that Nichelle Nichols for Star Trek was revolutionary for the time. There was never a lack of white representation and visibility, terms I don't think you even have a grasp on because you're so used to the status quo where black people just weren't working hard enough

No it doesn't, because you still don't understand what societal privilege means, only a spin that is more accommodation that can have potential backlash, but is meant to be a step forward, not a step back.

 

[muichimotsu]

Tell that to the racial antagonists that keep telling us that it's an identity and must be respected, just like gender.

It's an identity in the phenotypal sense, and socially constructed, but not just something anyone can attach to. And the same applies to gender, because it's not just a whim, it's a persistent feeling, like how cis people never really questioned their being that gender while trans struggle

 

[muichimotsu]

Funny how this silly chap performatively freaked out when he misread my post and thought I was insisting rednecks had to be white. And then he turns around and says that Harris isn't black.

Racists are funny sometimes.

Especially when they try to pay lipservice to the idea that "they aren't racist," when having to say that tends to mean you probably are in some manner, even if it isn't like the KKK.

"Not seeing color" is another gem, because it just reinforces the white savior attitude, not to mention takes away that aspect of identity by saying it doesn't matter in any way, rather than saying it shouldn't matter with, say, hiring practices, eligibility for housing, etc.

 

[dzheremi]

That's...literally the opposite of what happens. Noone gave Rachel Dolezal the time of day.

Well, apart from people making arguments like this because they thought they were catching the other side out.

Not that I care to involve myself in this particular conversation you are having with Aldebaran, but it's worth remembering that she was the president of the Spokane, Washington chapter of the NAACP before she it was discovered that she was a white woman. So presumably the other members of the NAACP at that location must've given her the time of day before June 2015, when she resigned from that position in disgrace.

 

[Triumvirate]

Not that I care to involve myself in this particular conversation you are having with Aldebaran, but it's worth remembering that she was the president of the Spokane, Washington chapter of the NAACP before she it was discovered that she was a white woman. So presumably the other members of the NAACP at that location must've given her the time of day before June 2015, when she resigned from that position in disgrace.

Because people thought she was African American or at least mixed. When it became obvious that she wasn't mixed but white, that's when her position became untenable as she'd misled people.

The rest is the usual ignorant comparisons between gender and race, neither of which people can alter on a whim.

 

[renniks]

If her being a vice presidential candidate shows that there's somehow an advantage to being black in America today, then does Vice President Pence being a vice presidential candidate and also the vice president right now likewise show that there's an advantage to being an old white guy? Or does this advantage only work one way, and if so, why

Does Pence emphasize his ethnicity to give himself some political advantage? You are still missing the point. Would she emphasize being black if there was biase among most Americans against blacks as people here are trying to claim. Systemic racism doesn't make any sense unless you can illustrate that minorities have a disadvantage. If it's actually an advantage politically or in getting a job, then there's no biase that can be shown.

 

[renniks]

Your attitude smacks of Dunning Kruger syndrome, like you think you know so much. Everything is a hyperbole in regards to how you deflect away from considering that you might be ignorant about something and, *gasp* want to learn more.

Ok, Freud.

 

[renniks]

And there's an example of internalized racism, or even just outright the systemic racism through historical negationism like the idea that the Confederacy wasn't racist at all or that the Confederate battle flag can be separated from the racism of the Confederacy or the Dixiecrats that historically utilized it to buck against integration of schools. The more you know!

Yeah because those blacks flying confederate flags are obviously racist against themselves!

 

[renniks]

And you show that you don't even understand what marginalization means: the existence of minorities does not mean they cannot be marginalized, because that's regarding societal biases and treatment thereof. Just...educate yourself even a bit on that term alone and we might get somewhere

I didn't say their existence doesn't mean they can't be marginalized. The trouble is, you all claim all these biases that you never illustrate. Implying I don't know what words mean just makes you come across as arrogant, BTW.

 

[renniks]

Dude..she has mixed ancestry, check your privilege AGAIN. She isn't pretending to be black, she's a minority within a minority, technically, so she's black just by her heritage from her father. Or do you think someone has to look like Wesley Snipes to be black?

We are all mixed ancestory. Reminds me of those people coming to pow wows so they can find their 2 percent of Indian blood and proudly go around claiming they are indian.

 

[renniks]

Get bent with this purist nonsense: you don't get to define what black is even if you yourself were black, because race isn't something you gatekeep with ridiculous standards like specific skin tone range

In that case, I'm black too. I'm sure I can find some dark skin in my ancestory if I look hard enough.