Why do people hate easy believism?

[Bible Highlighter]

In Matthew 19 you cut the part the lord said. For God there is no impossible.

God is holy and He it is impossible for God to act contrary to His holy will in agreeing with anyone in justifying sin on any level. What Jesus meant by with God nothing is impossible is that God can help to change the heart of the rich man to forsake his riches, or give Him power to overcome if he is willing to change.

All of our works are filthy rags and have no value in the finish work in the cross.

You are the second person to misquote this verse out of context in this thread.

5 “Thou meetest him that rejoiceth and worketh righteousness, those that remember thee in thy ways: behold, thou art wroth; for we have sinned: in those is continuance, and we shall be saved.
6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.
7 And there is none that calleth upon thy name, that stirreth up himself to take hold of thee: for thou hast hid thy face from us, and hast consumed us, because of our iniquities.” (Isaiah 64:5-7).​

Obviously you are not reading verses 5 and 7 in the above passage and you are ripping those words out of context to make your belief that justifies sin in some way work.

Do you even recall when Jesus condemned the Pharisees for their man made traditions? This would be their own righteousness. That is what verse 6 is referring to. God gave commands for Israel to obey. It would not be their own righteousness if they were to obey the commands God gave them. They would be obeying God.

Where does the Bible talk about trusting in the finished work of the cross alone? It doesn't. It is simply a phrase men have invented.

You are not honoring God,

We honor God by obeying Him. We do not honor God by justifying sin by turning His grace into a license for immorality according to Jude 1:4. What does Jude 1:4 even mean to you? What does 2 Timothy 3:1-9 even mean to you?

but dishonoring him rejecting his grace with works.

I believe in God's grace for salvation just fine. You just fail to understand that the Bible teaches that we also need to enter the Sanctification Process as a part of salvation, too. Don't believe me? Just check out these verses below.

1. We are justified by works and not by faith alone (James 2:24).
   
   
2. Faith without works is dead (James 2:17).
   
   
3. A person can deny God by a lack of works (Titus 1:16).
   
   
4. Jesus agreed with the lawyer that to love God, and to love your neighbor is a part of inheriting eternal life (Luke 10:25-28).
   
   
5. Those who have done good, shall come forth unto the resurrection of life; and those who have done evil, shall come forth unto the resurrection of damnation (John 5:29).
   
   
6. We have to continue in His goodness, otherwise we can be cut off [just like the Jews were cut off] (Romans 11:21-22).
   
   
7. Helping the poor, and the unfortunate relates to inheriting the Kingdom (Matthew 25:34-40), and not helping the poor, and the unfortunate relates to going away into everlasting punishment (Matthew 25:41-46).
   
   
8. Whoever does not righteousness or does not love his brother is not of God (1 John 3:10).
   
   
9. Whoever does what Jesus says is likened unto a wise man who built his house upon the rock, and when a storm came, it did not fall, (Matthew 7:24-25), but the person who does not do what Jesus says is likened unto a fool who built his house upon the sand, and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house (Matthew 7:26-27).
   
   
10. Abiding in Jesus will bear much fruit, but if a person does not abide in Jesus [thereby being unfruitful], they are cast out [or cut off] like a branch to be burned in the fire (John 15:5-6).
    
    
11. If the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing (1 Peter 4:18-19).
    
    
12. Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14) (NKJV).

Tell me then, where in the bible it teaches about losing your salvation when you have faith?

You fail to understand that those in the kingdom can be cast out because of their sin.

We see this truth expressed in Matthew 13:41-42.

41 “The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.”
(Matthew 13:41-42).​

To put it to you another way, Matthew 13:41-42 is saying that the Son of man (i.e. Jesus) will one day send forth His angels and they will gather out of HIS KINGDOM all things that “offend” (i.e. anything that makes others to sin - see Matthew 18:6 in the NKJV and the KJV), and those people who do iniquity (i.e. sin or wrongdoing), and they will be thrown (cast) into the furnace of fire (i.e. the Lake of Fire) where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth (Note: Gnashing of teeth is what wolves do when they growl sometimes).

In other words, the angels of Jesus are going to gather out of HIS kingdom all those who justify sin in some way and they will be thrown into the Lake of Fire. So a person can be in the kingdom and later they are cast out.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It's actually you who has twisted these verses above in order to promote "type 2 works salvation." Since you fail to interpret scripture within it's intended context and fail to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture, you will inevitably misinterpret these passages of scripture above and continue to peddle "performance based works salvation."

As for belief alone/salvation through faith (rightly understood) in Christ alone, the Bible clearly states in many passages of scripture that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (Luke 7:50; 8:12; John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 11:17; 13:39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5; 5:1; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-8; Ephesians 2:8; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

You don't need to add the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of these passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus works? NO. So then it's faith (rightly understood) IN CHRIST ALONE.

So if no works are required as a part of salvation, then one does not have to lift a finger for God. They can go back to their old life and eat the vomit again.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It's actually you who has twisted these verses above in order to promote "type 2 works salvation." Since you fail to interpret scripture within it's intended context and fail to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture, you will inevitably misinterpret these passages of scripture above and continue to peddle "performance based works salvation."

As for belief alone/salvation through faith (rightly understood) in Christ alone, the Bible clearly states in many passages of scripture that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (Luke 7:50; 8:12; John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 11:17; 13:39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5; 5:1; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-8; Ephesians 2:8; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

You don't need to add the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of these passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus works? NO. So then it's faith (rightly understood) IN CHRIST ALONE.

How long can a Christian abide in a mortal sin before they are unsaved? What if a Christian struggles with porn every day? Are they saved? What if they struggle with stealing things? Yet, they don't change. Are they saved? What if they think they cannot help but to hate others on occasion because they are not perfect? Are they saved even if they don't confess and forsake these sins? See, the moment you remove any level of holy living from the salvation equation is the moment a person opens the door to justifying sin and evil.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It's actually you who has twisted these verses above in order to promote "type 2 works salvation." Since you fail to interpret scripture within it's intended context and fail to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching your conclusion on doctrine and confuse descriptive passages of scripture with prescriptive passages of scripture, you will inevitably misinterpret these passages of scripture above and continue to peddle "performance based works salvation."

As for belief alone/salvation through faith (rightly understood) in Christ alone, the Bible clearly states in many passages of scripture that we are saved through belief/faith "apart from additions or modifications." (Luke 7:50; 8:12; John 1:12; 3:15,16,18,36; 6:40,47; 11:25,26; Acts 10:43; 11:17; 13:39; 15:7-9; 16:31; 26:18; Romans 1:16; 3:22-28; 4:5; 5:1; 10:4; 1 Corinthians 1:21; Galatians 2:16; 3:6-8; Ephesians 2:8; Philippians 3:9; 2 Timothy 3:15; Hebrews 10:39; 1 John 5:13 etc..).

You don't need to add the word "alone" next to "belief/faith" in each of these passages of scripture in order to figure out that the words "belief/faith" stand alone in connection with receiving eternal life/salvation. Do these many passages of scripture say belief/faith "plus something else?" Plus works? NO. So then it's faith (rightly understood) IN CHRIST ALONE.

You obviously need to read the Parable of the Talents again. Matthew 25:21 makes it clear that the one who was faithful over a few things was told to enter the joy of their Lord, and the other who was unprofitable was cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30).

 

[anna ~ grace]

The only reason why someone would dislike the fact that salvation is easy is because they are prideful. Think about this. Whenever you do something that isn't easy, don't you become prideful? It was not easy for me to do my first job interview. But after I was done I was proud about the fact that I managed to do it anyway. I was prideful because I did something that was not easy. But that's not salvation. Salvation is the easiest thing in the world. You don't get saved by accomplishing anything (let alone something that isn't easy), you get saved by receiving a free gift that is freely given to everyone. The only way to get saved is by believing in Jesus, not by believing in yourself. That's why it's impossible for prideful people to get saved.

Whenever someone dislikes the term "easy believism", that is a sign that you are dealing with a prideful person. The more prideful you are, the more you hate easy believism. The prideful person delights in the fact that they earned their salvation by their own efforts, and hates the idea that salvation could be easy. The prideful person gives glory to himself rather than giving glory to God.

But the truly humble person loves it. He loves the fact that salvation is so easy and so simple. They don't mind the fact that they can't take any glory out of their own salvation, but that God takes all the glory.

And yet those who understand that our salvation requires a response from us, far from being proud, often strike me as humbler. I know that the assumption and accusation is often of pride, but what I have seen and heard is the opposite.

 

[Albion]

You obviously need to read the Parable of the Talents again. Matthew 25:21 makes it clear that the one who was faithful over a few things was told to enter the joy of their Lord, and the other who was unprofitable was cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30).

One thing is for sure now. The topic is no longer "Easy Believism." What we are reading now is just a routine defense of "Works Righteousness."

 

[Danthemailman]

One thing is for sure now. The topic is no longer "Easy Believism." What we are reading now is just a routine defense of "Works Righteousness."

You hit the nail on the head!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

One thing is for sure now. The topic is no longer "Easy Believism." What we are reading now is just a routine defense of "Works Righteousness."

Indeed. Jesus does the good work. Both in Justification and in Sanctification. All glory be unto Christ. Most do not have a problem with Justification, but they have a problem with Sanctification.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

One thing is for sure now. The topic is no longer "Easy Believism." What we are reading now is just a routine defense of "Works Righteousness."

If we are not doing good works as a part of God's grace, then one is doing evil works. Are we saved by God's grace even if we do evil works or no works our whole lives? Keep in mind that doing no works means one is not loving their brother or God, etc.; For the true way of expressing love according to God is not by mere words but by our actions (as a result of God working through us).

 

[Albion]

If we are not doing good works as a part of God's grace, then one is doing evil works. Are we saved by God's grace even if we do evil works or no works our whole lives? Keep in mind that doing no works means one is not loving their brother or God, etc.

?? Have we converted you to our thinking on the matter of Easy Believism?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If one is advocating salvation without works, then one is advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation. This means we can be evil or sinful and unloving and still be saved. This is a justification of evil, darkness, and sin. This kind of thinking does not sound like it is from God's kingdom at all. 1 John 3:10 even makes that fact clear.

 

[Albion]

If one is advocating salvation without works, then one is advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation.

Again with the "a part of" equivocating.

Has anyone here done that--advocating in not loving God and not loving others? And how did I miss it?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

?? Have we converted you to our thinking on the matter of Easy Believism?

Easy Believism helps to expose the problem of the belief that says that one only has to trust in the finished work of Christ and nothing else (in its various forms).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes. So?

Has anyone here done that? And how did I miss it?

The cat is out of the bag.

 

[Albion]

Easy Believism helps to expose the problem of the belief that says that one only has to trust in the finished work of Christ and nothing else (in its various forms).

No, it doesn't. It makes a strawman in order to knock down people who believe in Sola Fide, which is to say almost all Protestants.

And if you don't think that's a fair assessment, I'd have expected somewhere in this long exchange that you'd have given us an explicit rejection of that implication.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If one is advocating salvation without works, then one is advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation.

Yes. So?

Wait. Did you just say.... yes? Meaning, do you believe that one is for advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation? If so, then one can be unloving towards God and others and be saved. This means one can sin and still be saved. Where is your defense of holy living then?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

No, it doesn't. It makes a strawman in order to knock down people who believe in Sola Fide, which is to say almost all Protestants.

And if you don't think that's a fair assessment, I'd have expected somewhere in this long exchange that you'd have given us an explicit rejection of that implication.

You are just hitting the disagree button with no real proof or evidence to support you. I see your camp and George Sodini's camp preach the same message that believers trust in the finished work of Christ and nothing else. What distinguishes one from obeying and the other in disobeying?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Can a believer right now watch porn and be saved while doing so?
Can a believer cuss at another person right now and be saved while doing so?
Can a believer right now hate their brother and be saved while doing so?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Questions like these cannot be answered without exposing the darkness.

 

[Albion]

Wait. Did you just say.... yes? Meaning, do you believe that one is for advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation?

I concluded that there was no way to know what you were saying in that post. Again, it's because of the use of imprecise wording that could be taken in different ways by the reader.

Look here, for instance. You wrote:

"If one is advocating salvation without works, then one is advocating in not loving God and not loving others as a part of salvation."

Not only is that convoluted and unclear but what is "advocating salvation without works" supposed to mean?

Does it mean salvation is accomplished without works being a causative factor in the salvation?" Or does it mean "salvation occurs and there are no works in evidence thereafter?"