Is Calvinism a false denomination?

[Hammster]

It is one of the first Calvinist sites on the web.

Are their definitions different than your beliefs?

It’s pretty simplistic.

you might want check this one out.

The New “No Straw Man” challenge

 

[K Watt]

It’s pretty simplistic.

you might want check this one out.

The New “No Straw Man” challenge

Can you tell me how your views differ?

 

[Hammster]

Can you tell me how your views differ?

First off, the terms are not accurate. Most Reformed Theology don’t like them, but will use them since they are well known.

Second, when you don’t start off with God’s sovereignty, and a correct understanding of the depravity of man, those statements will not be an accurate representation of how things work.

 

[K Watt]

First off, the terms are not accurate. Most Reformed Theology don’t like them, but will use them since they are well known.

Second, when you don’t start off with God’s sovereignty, and a correct understanding of the depravity of man, those statements will not be an accurate representation of how things work.

That's an evasion.

Do you think a sovereign God is capable of creating an intelligent being with the power to choose right and wrong? I know that answer is yes. My point is, you can't end the argument by claiming that those who believe in free will are somehow denying God's sovereignty.

Does God want everyone to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth? That's what the bible says. That doesn't seem to be what Reformed doctrine teaches.

 

[Hammster]

That's an evasion.

Do you think a sovereign God is capable of creating an intelligent being with the power to choose right and wrong? I know that answer is yes. My point is, you can't end the argument by claiming that those who believe in free will are somehow denying God's sovereignty.

Does God want everyone to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth? That's what the bible says. That doesn't seem to be what Reformed doctrine teaches.

It’s not an evasion and I explained why. There’s another Calvinist thread going on where a member keeps taking things out of context. So I’d like to avoid that here.

 

[Hammster]

Do you think a sovereign God is capable of creating an intelligent being with the power to choose right and wrong? I know that answer is yes. My point is, you can't end the argument by claiming that those who believe in free will are somehow denying God's sovereignty.

If I take your answer at face value, I’d say you hold to Pelagianism, which is a heresy. Is that what you want me to do, or is there more to your answer?

 

[K Watt]

If I take your answer at face value, I’d say you hold to Pelagianism, which is a heresy. Is that what you want me to do, or is there more to your answer?

Another evasion.

Quoting scripture is not heresy. Nothing in my post even hinted at Pelagianism.

I think it would be great if you could just answer basic questions.

Do you believe that God wants everyone to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth?

 

[Hammster]

Another evasion.

Quoting scripture is not heresy. Nothing in my post even hinted at Pelagianism.

I think it would be great if you could just answer basic questions.

Do you believe that God wants everyone to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth?

You didn’t quote scripture.

 

[K Watt]

You didn’t quote scripture.

Yes I did.

3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

 

[Hammster]

Yes I did.

3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Now you have, but you didn’t before.


“I know that You can do all things,
And that no purpose of Yours can be thwarted.
— Job 42:2

So if nothing God wants can be thwarted, then your assumed understanding must be incorrect.

 

[BBAS 64]

Yes I did.

3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Good Day, K Watt

What is the THIS referring to seeing you ripped this verse out of context.

So your God desires something that he can not have and is powerless to achieve, do you really think that kind of God that is portrayed in the Scripture.

Or could it be that your own interpretation of this verse so incorrect?

1Ti 2:1 First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time.

Does Jesus mediate for all men ( with out distinction) also... did he pay the ransom for all men (with out distinction) as well

In Him,

Bill

 

[K Watt]

Now you have, but you didn’t before.


“I know that You can do all things,
And that no purpose of Yours can be thwarted.
— Job 42:2

So if nothing God wants can be thwarted, then your assumed understanding must be incorrect.

For the record, here's where I quoted scripture before:
Also, 5 points Calvinists deny that God wants all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth.

God can choose to allow us to make choices. That is his sovereign will. Without freedom to choose there can be no love. What is the most important commandment?

 

[K Watt]

Good Day, K Watt

What is the THIS referring to seeing you ripped this verse out of context.

So your God desires something that he can not have and is powerless to achieve, do you really think that kind of God that is portrayed in the Scripture.

Or could it be that your own interpretation of this verse so incorrect?

1Ti 2:1 First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all, which is the testimony given at the proper time.

Does Jesus mediate for all men ( with out distinction) also... did he pay the ransom for all men (with out distinction) as well

In Him,

Bill

Above all else, God wants us to love him and to love each other.

God cannot force us to love. This must be a choice.

God chooses to make love possible and therefore he chooses to allow us to decide.

That's what the bible clearly teaches. You are going to great lengths to claim something contrary to what the bible teaches.

 

[Hammster]

For the record, here's where I quoted scripture before:
Also, 5 points Calvinists deny that God wants all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth.

God can choose to allow us to make choices. That is his sovereign will. Without freedom to choose there can be no love. What is the most important commandment?

That’s not quoting scripture.

 

[K Watt]

Does Jesus mediate for all men ( with out distinction) also... did he pay the ransom for all men (with out distinction) as well

In Him,

Yes.

2 Cor 5:15
And he died for all, that those who live should no longer live for themselves but for him who died for them and was raised again.

1 Cor 15 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

John 12:32
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."

1 Tim 4:10
For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers.

 

[Hammster]

God cannot force us to love.

Can He change our hearts?

 

[K Watt]

I used the exact same words as scripture. What do you call that?

 

[K Watt]

Can He change our hearts?

Yes. His grace reaches out to all men.

1 Cor 15 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

 

[Hammster]

I used the exact same words as scripture. What do you call that?

No context, and making it say what you want.

 

[Hammster]

Yes. His grace reaches out to all men.

1 Cor 15 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive.

So I guess He can make us love.