Ask God for Me

[Oncedeceived]

Says you. Other Christians have different takes on it. Look up red letter Christians and you will see they are Christians with different views about doctrine. Just show me that your interpretation is correct and that will be the end of it, until then, how do I know they are incorrect or you are correct?

No, says the Bible. This is not a different view about doctrine, it is a complete heresey.

I never said it does. Take that up with people that believe he didn't and still call themselves Christians. Just demonstrate that your beliefs are true and this can all be cleared up pronto.

Anyone can call themselves Christian I suppose, but again the Bible makes it clear that the foundation of Christianity is that Jesus died for our sins and rose again. Period.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I agree. They are liberal minded as well. But they still call themselves Christians and promote the teachings of Jesus (at least the ones they agree with). I guess my point is that who has the authority to call someone a christian or not?

God, God has the authority to call someone a Christian or not.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

.

See the following post of mine for a further reference:

Providing Grist for the Christian Forum's Mill ...

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

No, says the Bible. This is not a different view about doctrine, it is a complete heresey.


Anyone can call themselves Christian I suppose, but again the Bible makes it clear that the foundation of Christianity is that Jesus died for our sins and rose again. Period.

I know this is what you believe but until you can demonstrate you are correct then there is no way to know. I agree with you that the bible says Jesus died to forgive our sins. The problem you have is providing evidence it is true. Until then, people that believe he did not and call themselves Christians have just as valid a belief.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

God, God has the authority to call someone a Christian or not.

See my previous post.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I know this is what you believe but until you can demonstrate you are correct then there is no way to know. I agree with you that the bible says Jesus died to forgive our sins. The problem you have is providing evidence it is true. Until then, people that believe he did not and call themselves Christians have just as valid a belief.

Which Christians are saying Jesus didn't die for our sins? Who? Who?! Where?!

 

[Silmarien]

I know this is what you believe but until you can demonstrate you are correct then there is no way to know. I agree with you that the bible says Jesus died to forgive our sins. The problem you have is providing evidence it is true. Until then, people that believe he did not and call themselves Christians have just as valid a belief.

This is a little bit silly, honestly. If someone believes that Jesus was a super important messenger sent by God, that the New Testament is sort of, mostly true, but that Jesus did not die on the cross but there was some sort of case of mistaken identity, and then (I think) ascended into heaven, and then that Mohammed showed up 600 years later to correct everyone, they can call themselves a real Christian, if they want, but they're not. They're a Muslim, even if they have the sincere belief that they have the correct form of Christianity and everyone else is wrong.

Defining doctrine is how we distinguish between different religions. Having a free-for-all where someone can claim that Jesus was the avatar of the Abrahamic aspect of Brahman and qualify as a Christian instead of a Hindu doesn't make any sense.

 

[miknik5]

Thereś a difference between the inward and outward church...

 

[Oncedeceived]

I know this is what you believe but until you can demonstrate you are correct then there is no way to know. I agree with you that the bible says Jesus died to forgive our sins. The problem you have is providing evidence it is true. Until then, people that believe he did not and call themselves Christians have just as valid a belief.

Really, they have just as valid of a belief? What do they base it upon? The Bible is the manual so to speak for the Christian faith. The Bible claims that Jesus did die for our sins and rose again. I don't have to provide evidence as the Bible is the set point for Christianity. If someone doesn't believe the foundation upon which Christianity exists, they do not have a valid Christian belief.

 

[Oncedeceived]

See my previous post.

Doesn't change a thing.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Which Christians are saying Jesus didn't die for our sins? Who? Who?! Where?!

Look up Brian McClaren or Rob Bell or these people:

Confronting Atonement Theology

The United Methodist Church does not seem to believe Jesus had to die on the cross for God to forgive sins.

 

[Oncedeceived]

This is a little bit silly, honestly. If someone believes that Jesus was a super important messenger sent by God, that the New Testament is sort of, mostly true, but that Jesus did not die on the cross but there was some sort of case of mistaken identity, and then (I think) ascended into heaven, and then that Mohammed showed up 600 years later to correct everyone, they can call themselves a real Christian, if they want, but they're not. They're a Muslim, even if they have the sincere belief that they have the correct form of Christianity and everyone else is wrong.

Defining doctrine is how we distinguish between different religions. Having a free-for-all where someone can claim that Jesus was the avatar of the Abrahamic aspect of Brahman and qualify as a Christian instead of a Hindu doesn't make any sense.

Eloquently said.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Look up Brian McClaren or Rob Bell or these people:

Confronting Atonement Theology

The United Methodist Church does not seem to believe Jesus had to die on the cross for God to forgive sins.

We believe that Jesus Christ is the unique Son of God – 100% God and 100% Man. He was born of a virgin. He lived a sinless human life and died on the cross as our substitute taking upon Himself the penalty for our sins, and He rose from the dead and ascended to heaven where He sits today at the right hand of God.
Welcome | Christ United Methodist Church

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

This is a little bit silly, honestly. If someone believes that Jesus was a super important messenger sent by God, that the New Testament is sort of, mostly true, but that Jesus did not die on the cross but there was some sort of case of mistaken identity, and then (I think) ascended into heaven, and then that Mohammed showed up 600 years later to correct everyone, they can call themselves a real Christian, if they want, but they're not. They're a Muslim, even if they have the sincere belief that they have the correct form of Christianity and everyone else is wrong.

Defining doctrine is how we distinguish between different religions. Having a free-for-all where someone can claim that Jesus was the avatar of the Abrahamic aspect of Brahman and qualify as a Christian instead of a Hindu doesn't make any sense.

I said nothing about Muslim or Hindu beliefs. I said people who call themselves Christians. If someone asked me to describe my mom and I said she is a tall, Asian lady with a quick temper and my sister describer her as a short white lady that is slow to anger how would someone know what she is really like? We can both call her our mother but others will not really know what she is like. Just like Christians, they describe a different aspects of a God so for non believers it is hard to know what Christians believe about who god is.

Also, I can have them meet my mom and they can decide for themselves what she is really like, for the Christian God we cannot, so we are left with confusion.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Really, they have just as valid of a belief? What do they base it upon? The Bible is the manual so to speak for the Christian faith. The Bible claims that Jesus did die for our sins and rose again. I don't have to provide evidence as the Bible is the set point for Christianity. If someone doesn't believe the foundation upon which Christianity exists, they do not have a valid Christian belief.

That is just your assertion that the bible is the foundation of Christianity. Were the first Christians not real Christians for the first 300 years?

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

We believe that Jesus Christ is the unique Son of God – 100% God and 100% Man. He was born of a virgin. He lived a sinless human life and died on the cross as our substitute taking upon Himself the penalty for our sins, and He rose from the dead and ascended to heaven where He sits today at the right hand of God.
Welcome | Christ United Methodist Church

Yeah, that is not the United Methodist Church. Read my link above.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I said nothing about Muslim or Hindu beliefs. I said people who call themselves Christians. If someone asked me to describe my mom and I said she is a tall, Asian lady with a quick temper and my sister describer her as a short white lady that is slow to anger how would someone know what she is really like? We can both call her our mother but others will not really know what she is like. Just like Christians, they describe a different aspects of a God so for non believers it is hard to know what Christians believe about who god is.

I would hope one of you was right, even if we couldn't see for ourselves. Not both of you are right.

Also, I can have them meet my mom and they can decide for themselves what she is really like, for the Christian God we cannot, so we are left with confusion.

That is why the Bible is important.

 

[Oncedeceived]

That is just your assertion that the bible is the foundation of Christianity. Were the first Christians not real Christians for the first 300 years?

Show me in the first three hundred years that the Church didn't believe Jesus died for our sins and arose again.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Yeah, that is not the United Methodist Church. Read my link above.

What? They say they are.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

I said nothing about Muslim or Hindu beliefs. I said people who call themselves Christians. If someone asked me to describe my mom and I said she is a tall, Asian lady with a quick temper and my sister describer her as a short white lady that is slow to anger how would someone know what she is really like? We can both call her our mother but others will not really know what she is like. Just like Christians, they describe a different aspects of a God so for non believers it is hard to know what Christians believe about who god is.

Also, I can have them meet my mom and they can decide for themselves what she is really like, for the Christian God we cannot, so we are left with confusion.

That's funny! I don't feel all that confused by the ongoing developments of thought in the Christian Church (i.e. 1st Century / Catholic / Orthodox / Anglican / Various Protestants) for the last 2,000 years.
....Granted, I'm dazed a little by it all, but not confused !!