Requirements of Salvation

[Gr8Grace]

Faith means absolutely nothing without obedience unto God.

Faith means absolutely nothing without the Lord Jesus Christ and what He did for us the Cross.

The Jews have faith in God and are arguably the best law followers out there.......are they saved?

The whole Bible is about righteousness and sin. Good vs bad. The devil fell because of disobedience. Adam and Eve fell because of disobedience. Now we are all being tested whether we will obey God or disobey Him, our eternal fate is at stake.

You left out Christ crucified and His cross...........What the WHOLE bible is about.

 

[Gr8Grace]

Faith without works is dead. What works do you need to do have a living faith?

The works are the will of God.
"He that doeth the will of God abideth forever."

If you think you can live however you want, doing whatever you want and still be counted worthy, you should read
Matthew 7:14 that warns us that few will be saved.

The only reason I trust in God is because I have a good conscience towards Him and I only have a good conscience toward Him because I obey Him.

Remember even the devils believe. But they have no faith (trust/confidence in God) because they have chosen to live contrary to His will.

The path is narrow and you are teaching contrary to it. You must obey God otherwise your trust (faith) in Him is a dead faith. Just as we are told in James 2:26 faith without works is dead. The works are the will of God, the commandments and precepts taught in the Holy Bible, they instruct us to a live a Holy and sanctified life in strict obedience unto His will.

1 John 2:17 "...he that doeth the will of God abideth forever..."

Acts 5:32 "
And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him."

Why do you think Jesus himself tells us that the lukewarm, hypocrites and unprofitable servants will be cast out into outer darkness? You have to do the works God wants you to to be saved, you must obey Him.

It's really not confusing at all.

If you obey God you can trust in Him. If you don't obey Him and live contrary to His will, you cant.

Have you ever studied what the Lord Jesus Christ suffered on your behalf? False trials. Mocked. Spit upon. Beard plucked out. Whipped to the bone. Crown of thorns pushed on His head. Nails pounded through His wrists and feet. Lifted up on His tree, with those nails as pressure point's to hold His body weight........And worst of ALL, forsaken by His Father as He has the sins of the world put upon Him as our substitute.

This seems to be missing in all your posts.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Faith means absolutely nothing without obedience unto God.

Do you know that the Bible directly contradicts your claims?

Heb 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.

Not only does this verse NOT even mention obedience, there are verses that do.

Heb 10:5-8
5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said:
“Sacrifice and offering you did not desire,
but a body you prepared for me;
6 with burnt offerings and sin offerings
you were not pleased.
7 I said, ‘Here I am—it is written about me in the scroll —
I have come to do your will, my God.’”
8 First he said, “Sacrifices and offerings, burnt offerings and sin offerings you did not desire, nor were you pleased with them” —though they were offered in accordance with the law.

The red words in v.5,6, and 8 refer to obedience to the Law, which God gave to Israel. Yet, He wasn't pleased with any of them.

So, what is He pleased with? Heb 11:6 - faith.

The whole Bible is about righteousness and sin. Good vs bad. The devil fell because of disobedience. Adam and Eve fell because of disobedience. Now we are all being tested whether we will obey God or disobey Him, our eternal fate is at stake.

Your insistence on making "good" a requirement for salvation is misplaced.

Why did Christ die on the cross? Please be specific.

 

[BlessedCreator]

Forgiveness of sins and salvation are two different things.

 

[Gr8Grace]

Why did Christ die on the cross? Please be specific.

It's always the same isn't it? Religion, worker's, losers always focus on how they have crucified their flesh!!!!! And nary a word about the Lord Jesus Christ and what He did for us.

 

[Gr8Grace]

Forgiveness of sins and salvation are two different things.

Why did Christ die on the cross? Please be specific.

 

[BobRyan]

I made this because there are people preaching in these final years of the world, teaching that
just by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ you can be saved. If it was that easy we wouldn't have scriptures
warning us that few will be saved and that the path to eternal life is narrow, of which few be there that find it.

You make some very good points in your thread.

The New Covenant of Jer 31:31-34 and Hebrews 8:6-12 say that the new creation, the new heart, has the law "written on heart and mind" so at the moment we are justified - we have our new nature 2 Cor 5:17 "Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come. "

Gal 2:20 "no longer I who live but Jesus Christ who lives in me".

And yet we still have the old nature -- a nature that is driven towards rebellion against the Word, the Word of God , Jesus Christ.

So then as Paul says in 1 Cor 9: 27 but I discipline my body and make it my slave, lest after I have preached the gospel to others, I myself will not be disqualified..

We die to self daily and by the Spirit of Christ reject rebellion and embrace obedience.

 

[Athanasius377]

Faith means absolutely nothing without obedience unto God. The whole Bible is about righteousness and sin. Good vs bad. The devil fell because of disobedience. Adam and Eve fell because of disobedience. Now we are all being tested whether we will obey God or disobey Him, our eternal fate is at stake.

Question: Who is responsible for your salvation?

 

[redleghunter]

If works don't matter why did Jesus warn us that the lukewarm, hypocrites and unprofitable servants would be cast into out darkness where there would be weeping and gnashing of teeth?

And why did Jesus say that if any did not forsake all that he had and pick up his cross and follow Him they could not be His disciple.

Or why does Matthew 7:14 tell us that few will be saved if all we have to do is believe?

Or why are we warned in the book of Revelation about the church of Ephesus that had left their first love (Christ) and how that if they did repent and do the first works their candlestick would be removed. Meaning if they did not rekindle their love and passion for Christ and His cause as they once had and return with the same zeal (endure unto the end) that their candlestick would be removed.

Or why does James 2:26 specifically say that faith without works is dead.

The works are the will of God.

1 John 2:17 "...he that doeth the will of God abideth forever."

Salvation is not as easy as many would have us believe.

First I think proof texts isolated from the context end up saying what we want them to say. Which is eisegesis.

Most importantly I think you are creating an unnecessary dichotomy. Meaning you are putting a tension between salvation being of some agreement between God and man. God does something if we do something. Or we do something if God has done something.

This is the doctrine of all world religions outside of Christianity.

The tension I see in your comments is that of “we have God’s Grace and we have man’s response in works.” Not a bad proposition at all but it must be seen that the works which save us is the Finished Work of Christ Jesus.

The other most important point in this matter is that what Christ has done for us living a perfect obedient life, dying for our sins redeeming us, rising from the dead justifying us, He is our Righteousness. Nothing we can do can add to this. Nothing.

This is why one cannot separate faith and works. Why? Because we were made new creations. And as a result of our regeneration by the Grace of God. Notice that within the entire context of the following passage, we see the Grace of God in saving us and transforming us into creatures to do His will.

Ephesians 2: NASB

1And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience.3Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.​

All consistent and all powerfully under God’s Sovereign design. Notice I bolded verses 8-10. Then I underlined verse 10. Notice the good works mentioned in verse 10 are directly related to God’s workmanship, meaning those He has saved. It says “created.” This means not only does wipe away our sins but makes us a new creation. A new creation which God prepared beforehand who will walk in them. This reminds me of the promise of the New Covenant in Ezekiel 36:22-32

Now to the question of a previous post you made. I believe your post stated people can not just call on the Name of Jesus and be saved and just go about sinning with impunity. I would consider that a logical fallacy considering Ephesians chapter 2.

Here’s why. There is no separation of saved by Grace by faith and good works. Both as I showed above are works of God.

But you will ask “what if!” I would answer with something more concrete and frankly concerning.

What if the person proclaiming to be a believer is not?

Now I’m not denying there is an element out there which promotes what is called “easy believism.” It exists and you see it in the “seeker friendly” churches. What is as dangerous is the impassioned response to easy believism. That would be the “works keep you saved” crowd. Both groups fail to see there is no separation of faith and good works. The workmanship of God makes this clear. As your quoted from James 2 show.

“Thus, it is just as impossible to separate faith and works as it is to separate heat and light from fire!”

 

[redleghunter]

Forgiveness of sins and salvation are two different things.

Let’s break that down.

We are saved from the Wrath of God. What exactly is the root cause of the Wrath of God?

 

[BlessedCreator]

First answer me and I will tell you.

Why if we aren't supposed to be doing God's will to be saved does Jesus Himself tell us that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30)?

 

[redleghunter]

First answer me and I will tell you.

Why if we aren't supposed to be doing God's will to be saved does Jesus Himself tell us that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30)?

Who or what are you responding to?

 

[BlessedCreator]

To your previous post @redleghunter

 

[redleghunter]

To your previous post @redleghunter

I have two. Hit “post reply” toggle so I know which post.

 

[BlessedCreator]

The shorter one @redleghunter

 

[redleghunter]

The shorter one @redleghunter

This one?

Let’s break that down.

We are saved from the Wrath of God. What exactly is the root cause of the Wrath of God?

Which would make this your response:

Why if we aren't supposed to be doing God's will to be saved does Jesus Himself tell us that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30)?

Don’t see what you are getting at.

 

[Gr8Grace]

First answer me and I will tell you.

Why if we aren't supposed to be doing God's will to be saved does Jesus Himself tell us that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30)?

Here is a good start for you. "outer darkness" does not mean hell or the LoF in this passage. John 10:28 clearly says we will never perish and have eternal life.




1 Cor 10~~ 1For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea; 2and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3and all ate the same spiritual food; 4and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them; and the rock was Christ. 5Nevertheless, with most of them God was not well-pleased; for they were laid low in the wilderness.

6Now these things happened as examples for us, so that we would not crave evil things as they also craved. 7Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written, “THE PEOPLE SAT DOWN TO EAT AND DRINK, AND STOOD UP TO PLAY.” 8Nor let us act immorally, as some of them did, and twenty-three thousand fell in one day. 9Nor let us try the Lord, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the serpents. 10Nor grumble, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the destroyer. 11Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.

He deal's with His Children very harshly if need be........Even physical death at times. It no laughing or light matter...........But our salvation and eternal life are preserved in Him and His power.

 

[BlessedCreator]

You're wrong. The outer darkness is indeed the final place of the wicked.

Benson commentary on Matthew 25:30
"And cast ye the unprofitable servant — Who has so wickedly abused my goodness; into outer darkness — The darkness which is without the heavenly city, even the horrible darkness of hell. There, instead of the light and joy possessed by those who are admitted to the marriage- supper of the Lamb, shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth — Through the worm that dieth not, and the fire that is not quenched."

 

[Danthemailman]

First answer me and I will tell you.

Why if we aren't supposed to be doing God's will to be saved does Jesus Himself tell us that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30)?

In the parable of the unprofitable servant, the talents represent monetary value and are distributed according to ability (Matthew 25:15). The requirement is to invest in Christ. The first two servants deposited their money with the bankers (Matthew 25:27) but the third servant buried his money in the ground (vs. 25). The third servant had been given one talent and the opportunity to believe and bear fruit in accordance, but had chosen to reject it.

The fact that the latter man in this parable is called wicked and lazy and an unprofitable servant (Matthew 25:30) who is cast out into outer darkness, certainly indicates that he was not a true disciple of the master. The idea of this illustrative parable is that all true believers will produce fruit in varying degress. All genuine believers are fruitful, but not all are equally fruitful (Matthew 13:23). Those who produce no results at all demonstrate they are not truly converted.

This man's characterization of the master maligns him as "reaping and gathering" what he had no right to claim as his own. This wicked, lazy, unprofitable so-called servant does not represent a genuine believer, for it's obvious that this man had no true knowledge of the master. Two of these servants were children of God, but not the third. Children of God are not cast out into outer darkness.

The fact that this man is called a "servant" does not necessarily mean that he was saved. In Leviticus 25:55, we read - For the children of Israel are servants to Me; they are My servants whom I brought out of the land of Egypt: I am the Lord your God. YET THEY WERE NOT ALL SAVED.

When referencing Israel in Isaiah 43:10, we read - You are My witnesses," says the Lord, "And My servant whom I have chosen..

 

[FreeGrace2]

You're wrong. The outer darkness is indeed the final place of the wicked.

Benson commentary on Matthew 25:30
"And cast ye the unprofitable servant — Who has so wickedly abused my goodness; into outer darkness — The darkness which is without the heavenly city, even the horrible darkness of hell. There, instead of the light and joy possessed by those who are admitted to the marriage- supper of the Lamb, shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth — Through the worm that dieth not, and the fire that is not quenched."

Who cares what Benson thinks any verse means? Here's the verse again:

" And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’"

There is NOTHING mentioned about hell or the LoF. Just darkness and crying and teeth grinding. The "weeping/gnashing of teeth" is a phrase used to indicate grief.

This verse does NOT support your claims.
You haven't yet provided any verse that supports your claims.