What is the Good News to a Secular World?

[Anguspure]

I have recently been challenged over the question of our mandate to spread the good news to all the world, and whether some of us are active enough in meeting that mandate in our daily lives. But it occurs to me that so very little of what I have to offer anybody (from the point of view of being a Beleiver), is in fact good news.

To a secular world that dislikes and distrusts religion in any form, doubts the very existence of our God or any god and that just wants to get on with day to day life without any mumbo jumbo; what is good about the news that we have to offer?

 

[redleghunter]

I have recently been challenged over the question of our mandate to spread the good news to all the world, and whether some of us are active enough in meeting that mandate in our daily lives. But it occurs to me that so very little of what I have to offer anybody (from the point of view of being a Beleiver), is in fact good news.

To a secular world that dislikes and distrusts religion in any form, doubts the very existence of our God or any god and that just wants to get on with day to day life without any mumbo jumbo; what is good about the news that we have to offer?

We are in the same position the Apostle Paul was in. Under severe persecution God reassured Paul to continue preaching.

Acts 18: NASB

5But when Silas and Timothy came down from Macedonia, Paul begandevoting himself completely to the word, solemnly testifying to the Jews that Jesus was the Christ. 6But when they resisted and blasphemed, he shook out his garments and said to them, “Your blood be on your own heads! I am clean. From now on I will go to the Gentiles.” 7Then he left there and went to the house of a man named Titius Justus, a worshiper of God, whose house was next to the synagogue. 8Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized. 9And the Lord said to Paul in the night by a vision, “Do not be afraid any longer, but go on speaking and do not be silent; 10for I am with you, and no man will attack you in order to harm you, for I have many people in this city.” 11And he settled therea year and six months, teaching the word of God among them.

 

[timothyu]

I suppose reminding the world that they have it all backwards might be a bit of a downer for them, but for those who are oppressed or are unhappy with the deteriorating state of the world, a counter-culture of the Kingdom that reverses the woes might go over well.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I have recently been challenged over the question of our mandate to spread the good news to all the world, and whether some of us are active enough in meeting that mandate in our daily lives. But it occurs to me that so very little of what I have to offer anybody (from the point of view of being a Beleiver), is in fact good news.

To a secular world that dislikes and distrusts religion in any form, doubts the very existence of our God or any god and that just wants to get on with day to day life without any mumbo jumbo; what is good about the news that we have to offer?

The good news is the Kingdom of God. All the ills of mankind will be reversed totally for those who become Kingdom of God citizens. The alternative is to remain dead in trespass and sin, a prisoner of the Prince of Darkness and a vessel of God's wrath. Imagine if there was a tsunami headed for the beach that you were enjoying. Would you run for shelter and ignore the people on the beach? Or would you warn them? People will reject you. The western world especially is getting harder and harder in heart.
When I was given the gospel, there was no mention of as wonderful plan for my life. I had wonderful plans for my life. God was nowhere in those plans. I was told of God's absolute holiness and righteousness. I was made well aware that I was not going to make it into heaven when I died. I knew nothing much about hell. Yet my heart sank, and I asked the same question as the crowd on the day of Pentecost. "What can I do?" The good news is that Lord Jesus died and rose again, taking the punishment for my sin and rising to give me new life. There is much more, of course. That was 48 years ago. My life has gone nothing like my 20 year old self imagined. There have been great times and impossible times. I've proven Lord Jesus as my Deliverer, Protector, Provider and Friend, over and over again. Life means nothing with Christ at the centre. How many of the rich, the famous, the successful, those who have everything commit suicide? They get everything and it is still not enough. Those who are born again have the riches that endure forever. Christ does not disappoint. God's will is infinitely better than anything I could imagine. Just tell them. Let God do His job and save them.

 

[Anguspure]

We are in the same position the Apostle Paul was in. Under severe persecution God reassured Paul to continue preaching.

Acts 18: NASB

5But when Silas and Timothy came down from Macedonia, Paul begandevoting himself completely to the word, solemnly testifying to the Jews that Jesus was the Christ. 6But when they resisted and blasphemed, he shook out his garments and said to them, “Your blood be on your own heads! I am clean. From now on I will go to the Gentiles.” 7Then he left there and went to the house of a man named Titius Justus, a worshiper of God, whose house was next to the synagogue. 8Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized. 9And the Lord said to Paul in the night by a vision, “Do not be afraid any longer, but go on speaking and do not be silent; 10for I am with you, and no man will attack you in order to harm you, for I have many people in this city.” 11And he settled therea year and six months, teaching the word of God among them.

Persecution is one thing.
I am just wondering what it is that I am offering that is "good news". It seems to me that most of the opposition is because people do not want to hear the "bad news" and then when they are offered the "good news" it doesn't look a whole lot better.
For example if I was to tell them that we all become a part of the family of God, that might be true but then they would point to my life and laugh.

 

[Anguspure]

I suppose reminding the world that they have it all backwards might be a bit of a downer for them, but for those who are oppressed or are unhappy with the deteriorating state of the world, a counter-culture of the Kingdom that reverses the woes might go over well.

What counter culture? There is a whole lot of talk about a Kingdom of Love but the reality is that to the secular people, at least, it is no where to be seen.

 

[Anguspure]

The good news is the Kingdom of God. All the ills of mankind will be reversed totally for those who become Kingdom of God citizens. The alternative is to remain dead in trespass and sin, a prisoner of the Prince of Darkness and a vessel of God's wrath. Imagine if there was a tsunami headed for the beach that you were enjoying. Would you run for shelter and ignore the people on the beach? Or would you warn them? People will reject you. The western world especially is getting harder and harder in heart.
When I was given the gospel, there was no mention of as wonderful plan for my life. I had wonderful plans for my life. God was nowhere in those plans. I was told of God's absolute holiness and righteousness. I was made well aware that I was not going to make it into heaven when I died. I knew nothing much about hell. Yet my heart sank, and I asked the same question as the crowd on the day of Pentecost. "What can I do?" The good news is that Lord Jesus died and rose again, taking the punishment for my sin and rising to give me new life. There is much more, of course. That was 48 years ago. My life has gone nothing like my 20 year old self imagined. There have been great times and impossible times. I've proven Lord Jesus as my Deliverer, Protector, Provider and Friend, over and over again. Life means nothing with Christ at the centre. How many of the rich, the famous, the successful, those who have everything commit suicide? They get everything and it is still not enough. Those who are born again have the riches that endure forever. Christ does not disappoint. God's will is infinitely better than anything I could imagine. Just tell them. Let God do His job and save them.

These people consider that God is an imaginary sky fairy for the deluded and then they point to the reality of religious groups and the way they live and treat one another. Surely if God (supposing He exists) was of any influence, at least those who believe in Him and claim to follow Him would display a different way of living, similar to the way that Jesus lived.

The attitude I have faced (from those who look at religion) was summed up by Bara Dada (Indian Philosopher): Jesus is ideal and wonderful, but you Christians, you are not like him.

 

[redleghunter]

Persecution is one thing.
I am just wondering what it is that I am offering that is "good news". It seems to me that most of the opposition is because people do not want to hear the "bad news" and then when they are offered the "good news" it doesn't look a whole lot better.
For example if I was to tell them that we all become a part of the family of God, that might be true but then they would point to my life and laugh.

Is the focus on how ones life is in this world, meaning how well one lives?

 

[Aussie Pete]

These people consider that God is an imaginary sky fairy for the deluded and then they point to the reality of religious groups and the way they live and treat one another. Surely if God (supposing He exists) was of any influence, at least those who believe in Him and claim to follow Him would display a different way of living, similar to the way that Jesus lived.

The attitude I have faced (from those who look at religion) was summed up by Bara Dada (Indian Philosopher): Jesus is ideal and wonderful, but you Christians, you are not like him.

Expect nothing else from unbelievers. The god of this world has blinded the eyes of those who are perishing. Lord Jesus warned us that we would be rejected and hated - just as He was. The world seeks any excused not to believe. Sadly, Christians (so-called much of the time) give the world many excuses. If we preach the gospel of the Kingdom, quit trying to make it palatable, quit compromising, we will see people get genuinely born again. The church is flourishing in many Muslim countries because it costs to be a Christian there. Unbelievers see something that people are willing to die for. In the west, it's near impossible to get Christians to live for Christ, let alone die for Him.

 

[Anguspure]

Is the focus on how ones life is in this world, meaning how well one lives?

The focus is on what we have to offer. Supposing (and I am looking through the eyes of the people around me here) God really does exist and Jesus really did die and rise from the dead, what good does this do? If there is no real difference in life, especially in terms of the things we claim to be particular to the Kingdom (Love, Joy, Peace, Patience etc etc), then what use is there in the religion?
So what do we have to offer that is any different or any better from any other secular support group or club?
I am at a loss because having been a believer for over 30 years, I have nothing that I can point to. At least nothing that doesn't seem overly mystical or would get me branded as a loony with an imaginary friend.
There have been 2 very short periods of time during that 30 years that I could honestly point to as something different (and I still wear the Polo shirt I was given as a uniform during that time). When I returned from those times I had something that I could talk about that was positive and good, and I still talk about them and recommend people experience it, but one of those is 22 years ago now and the other 5 years ago.
But for the most part I can honestly say that there is no positive difference between the Kingdom and the secular world, and in some areas there is strong negatives in the Kingdom.

 

[Anguspure]

Expect nothing else from unbelievers. The god of this world has blinded the eyes of those who are perishing. Lord Jesus warned us that we would be rejected and hated - just as He was. The world seeks any excused not to believe. Sadly, Christians (so-called much of the time) give the world many excuses. If we preach the gospel of the Kingdom, quit trying to make it palatable, quit compromising, we will see people get genuinely born again. The church is flourishing in many Muslim countries because it costs to be a Christian there. Unbelievers see something that people are willing to die for. In the west, it's near impossible to get Christians to live for Christ, let alone die for Him.

I'm not sure if they are so blind. Certainly they see keenly the lack of real Love in the Church, and the love of many Church groups for ostentatious buildings and high overheads.

Further to this they can see that for many we can also expect nothing from believers.

 

[redleghunter]

The focus is on what we have to offer. Supposing (and I am looking through the eyes of the people around me here) God really does exist and Jesus really did die and rise from the dead, what good does this do? If there is no real difference in life, especially in terms of the things we claim to be particular to the Kingdom (Love, Joy, Peace, Patience etc etc), then what use is there in the religion?
So what do we have to offer that is any different or any better from any other secular support group or club.
I am at a loss because having been a believer for over 30 years, I have nothing that I can point to. At least nothing that doesn't seem overly mystical or would get me branded as a loony with an imaginary friend.
There have been 2 very short periods of time during that 30 years that I could honestly point to as something different (and I still wear the Polo shirt I was given as a uniform during that time). When I returned from those times I had something that I could talk about that was positive and good, and I still talk about them and recommend people experience it, but one of those is 22 years ago now and the other 5 years ago.
But for the most part I can honestly say that there is no positive difference between the Kingdom and the secular world, and in some areas there is strong negatives in the Kingdom.

Yes it’s called eternal life. Christ redeemed us and we are being restored ultimately in Resurrection. Our King wore a crown of thorns while here on earth and He never promised us a rose garden.

Jesus assured His disciples they would be hated, would suffer and lose family ties over following Him. All things the comfortable world wants to avoid. What you are encountering is what’s called practical atheism.

What Is Practical Atheism?

Read the above. The salve is the same as it was in 33AD. The Gospel. Which is not worldly happiness but unspeakable Joy that never flames out. Why? Because the Joy is in Christ and He never fails.

Preach the Gospel! Those who God calls will come. Remember what I posted from Acts 18. Paul had nothing to preach to better anyone’s worldly portfolio. He didn’t even preach against the injustice of the Roman Empire. He preached Christ crucified and Risen. That changes everything.

 

[redleghunter]

I'm not sure if they are so blind. Certainly they see keenly the lack of real Love in the Church, and the love of many Church groups for ostentatious buildings and high overheads.

Further to this they can see that for many we can also expect nothing from believers.

So they see excuses for refusing to hear. @Aussie Pete is right.

What is your understanding of the Gospel of Grace as you have made no mention of it.

 

[Anguspure]

So they see excuses for refusing to hear. @Aussie Pete is right.

What is your understanding of the Gospel of Grace as you have made no mention of it.

My understanding is that before a person reaches the good news about Grace, one must first believe that God exists. Then one must believe that because God exists, and that we have all sinned against Him, that we are all perishing.

At that point the Gospel might be offered as good news (to them that are perishing).

To those who I am with, however, all of the above is just religious hoohaa that comes from a group of people who show no evidence of the existence of the God they claim to follow.

So in response what can a person point to? Can I point out the incredible, supernatural, self sacrificial Love that we all have for one another?
Or do I have to listen to a spiel about abuse and betrayal, or just plain indifference not only experienced by the speaker but to which they can also point to in the lives of believers they know? That sort of stuff is not just an excuse to not believe. It comes from deep hurt and the realization that even if they turned to this God they are supposed to believe in that, even then, nothing would help the pain.
Unfortunately in my own position I have nothing to offer in return to such an argument.

So I am at a loss. The only good thing I have to offer is some etheral view of the cosmos and spiritual/moral things that has precious little bearing on day to day life.

 

[redleghunter]

My understanding is that before a person reaches the good news about Grace, one must first believe that God exists. Then one must believe that because God exists, and that we have all sinned against Him, that we are all perishing.

At that point the Gospel might be offered as good news (to them that are perishing).

To those who I am with, however, all of the above is just religious hoohaa that comes from a group of people who show no evidence of the existence of the God they claim to follow.

So in response what can a person point to? Can I point out the incredible, supernatural, self sacrificial Love that we all have for one another?
Or do I have to listen to a spiel about abuse and betrayal, or just plain indifference not only experienced by the speaker but to which they can also point to in the lives of believers they know? That sort of stuff is not just an excuse to not believe. It comes from deep hurt and the realization that even if they turned to this God they are supposed to believe in that, even then, nothing would help the pain.
Unfortunately in my own position I have nothing to offer in return to such an argument.

So I am at a loss. The only good thing I have to offer is some etheral view of the cosmos and spiritual/moral things that has precious little bearing on day to day life.

There’s the problem. There’s no argument that can convince someone dead in their sins that God exists. The Scriptures say that those perishing suppress the truth. No matter of an academic drill will persuade otherwise. That’s where people fail. The Gospel is supernatural. The Holy Spirit calls people and the vehicle is hearing the Gospel the Word of God.

I would read the entire epistle to the Romans before engaging another person in conversation. I would recommend reading Acts as well as it is there we see how people are called and respond in faith.

 

[Anguspure]

There’s the problem. There’s no argument that can convince someone dead in their sins that God exists. The Scriptures say that those perishing suppress the truth. No matter of an academic drill will persuade otherwise. That’s where people fail. The Gospel is supernatural. The Holy Spirit calls people and the vehicle is hearing the Gospel the Word of God.

I would read the entire epistle to the Romans before engaging another person in conversation. I would recommend reading Acts as well as it is there we see how people are called and respond in faith.

I have read and studied all of the above. None of it gives me anything new to offer anybody.
I am not looking for theological understanding, an academic drill or even a mystical experience. I am looking for a testimony of the supernatural (that the writers of the Bible speak of ad infinitum) that will be something to testify to. As it is we cannot even get the basic social needs, that all people have in common, met.
Without a testimony of supernatural Love it is all just head knowledge.

 

[Aussie Pete]

You do not know what the Kingdom of God is. It is the place where God's will is done, where people are delivered from demons, where bitter and unforgiving hearts are softened, where stubborn pride is humbled and rebellion is replaced with obedience. I've experienced this myself many times.
If you are looking for some kind of sign or wonder, you are asking for trouble. Satan can counterfeit signs. I've seen demons flee at the mighty name of Jesus, broken people made whole, slaves to lust delivered and marriages restored. We have helped a woman abused by her father, a lay preacher. Her marriage has been saved. I've seen drug addicts and alcoholics set free, smokers set free without any withdrawal symptoms, the sick healed, mentally unstable people have their minds completely freed - is that the sort of thing you seek? I hope so. That is what people desperately need.

Tuesday night I was in hospital. My heart was haywire, atrial fibrillation. I asked our friends to pray. Just before a procedure to restart my heart, it came back to normal. I went home an hour later. I've been healed of a chronic liver problem and numbers of other illnesses. Some have been via the medical profession, others instantaneous.

Onlookers saw Jesus raise the dead. That was not good enough for some of those people. It is not miracles that save people, it is the preaching of the gospel. If they reject the word of God, nothing else will convince them.

 

[Aussie Pete]

What counter culture? There is a whole lot of talk about a Kingdom of Love but the reality is that to the secular people, at least, it is no where to be seen.

Forget trying to debate, argue, justify, prove or demonstrate the Kingdom of God. Preach the gospel. If they are convicted and accept, fine. If not, your obligation finishes at that point. You are not a salesman for God. The gospel is God's power to save.

 

[Anguspure]

Forget trying to debate, argue, justify, prove or demonstrate the Kingdom of God. Preach the gospel. If they are convicted and accept, fine. If not, your obligation finishes at that point. You are not a salesman for God. The gospel is God's power to save.

I have been at that point for most of my life and known that just preaching the Gospel at people is a waste of breath, not to mention extremely destructive to a captive community of people.
What does frustrate me though is that as concession people have encouraged me to display the gospel with my life.

Unfortunately this also has been a failure, my life has been absolutely nothing of any use as far as attracting people to the Gospel. Why would anybody want to take on something that consigns a person to years of loneliness and rejection (at the hands of the so called Loving Family of God), followed by screwed up marriages and more loneliness and rejection? I speak of myself but also quite a number of other people I know.

Where is the testimony that Christ spoke of that we would be known by our Love for one another?

 

[Anguspure]

You do not know what the Kingdom of God is. It is the place where God's will is done, where people are delivered from demons, where bitter and unforgiving hearts are softened, where stubborn pride is humbled and rebellion is replaced with obedience. I've experienced this myself many times.
If you are looking for some kind of sign or wonder, you are asking for trouble. Satan can counterfeit signs. I've seen demons flee at the mighty name of Jesus, broken people made whole, slaves to lust delivered and marriages restored. We have helped a woman abused by her father, a lay preacher. Her marriage has been saved. I've seen drug addicts and alcoholics set free, smokers set free without any withdrawal symptoms, the sick healed, mentally unstable people have their minds completely freed - is that the sort of thing you seek? I hope so. That is what people desperately need.

Tuesday night I was in hospital. My heart was haywire, atrial fibrillation. I asked our friends to pray. Just before a procedure to restart my heart, it came back to normal. I went home an hour later. I've been healed of a chronic liver problem and numbers of other illnesses. Some have been via the medical profession, others instantaneous.

Onlookers saw Jesus raise the dead. That was not good enough for some of those people. It is not miracles that save people, it is the preaching of the gospel. If they reject the word of God, nothing else will convince them.

If that is the Kingdom then I have been rejected from it. I too have tasted what you are talking about, but it was only a taste and I am consigned to darkness. I don't know why.