Who are you worshiping???

[dlamberth]

That's a great observation. Jesus asked his disciples a similar question.
“Who do people say I am?” To which Peter answered, “You are the Messiah.”

I know you won't like what I'm about to say, but I think that's a shallow answer with not much insight into the reach and depth of the Light of God. If you reach deeper, do you have anything more than "Messiah"?

 

[dlamberth]

Where do those standards come from?

It's the kind of things that a more human, Human Being would be doing. It's what I believe Jesus spent most of His earthly time teaching.

 

[Saint Steven]

Frankly, I think this whole idea of a religion being judged according to its adherents is not taking into account the idea that there are two opposing spiritual forces at work in the universe.

Say for instance that one particular religion was at odds with the dark spiritual force and all others were not at odds. Wouldn't it make sense that the one religion that was at odds with the dark spiritual forces was the one most under attack and therefore not appearing to be superior based on the additional difficulty?

It would seem that the other religions had an unfair advantage in this comparison.

 

[Saint Steven]

I know you won't like what I'm about to say, but I think that's a shallow answer with not much insight into the reach and depth of the Light of God. If you reach deeper, do you have anything more than "Messiah"?

No problem. In another passage peter says:
“You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.”
But maybe we need to get beyond that passage.

On the road to Damascus the man named Saul (later know as the Apostle Paul)
was blinded by a light. In that moment he asked, “Who are you, Lord?”, to which the Lord replied, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,”

 

[dlamberth]

Frankly, I think this whole idea of a religion being judged according to its adherents is not taking into account the idea that there are two opposing spiritual forces at work in the universe.

Say for instance that one particular religion was at odds with the dark spiritual force and all others were not at odds. Wouldn't it make sense that the one religion that was at odds with the dark spiritual forces was the one most under attack and therefore not appearing to be superior based on the additional difficulty?

It would seem that the other religions had an unfair advantage in this comparison.

When God is one's "reality"...none of that matters any longer.

 

[Saint Steven]

It's the kind of things that a more human, Human Being would be doing. It's what I believe Jesus spent most of His earthly time teaching.

This is an assumptive question, but on what basis have you rejected Christianity?

 

[Saint Steven]

When God is one's "reality"...none of that matters any longer.

Which kingdom supports that idea?

 

[Tutorman]

Christians take bread and wine to remember Jesus as He instructed

Many do not just do the Eucharist in mere memorial but that Christ is present within the elements, how is a mystery.

 

[dlamberth]

[Saint Steven]
The first part of my question back in post# 35 asked:
What does it mean to "See Me"?
That was in reference to your quoted John 14:8-9.
So I ask, what do you see?
Is "Messiah" the total sum of your vision of Jesus?

 

[dlamberth]

Which kingdom supports that idea?

One where God is a person's reality.

 

[Lost4words]

Not true. Christians are very much eating bread (or a cracker) and drinking the cup. (wine or grape juice) Which symbolize the body broken for us and the blood shed on our behalf.

Disagree. In the Eucharist we are indeed eating His flesh and drinking His blood. You see it as symbolic, i dont. But lets not argue about it.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

The word gospel means good news.
Where is the vicarious atonement in any religion other than Christianity?
The vicarious atonement means that Christ paid the penalty for our sin so that we don't have to. Where is that in Islam, for example?

Do you mock me with an Optimistic post rating?

You are optimistic that the Bible is exclusively the Word of God. I see that the Quran is also the Word of God as are the writings of the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

You could also show where Christ said that vicarious atonement is a teaching of His and not of that man has made from scripture.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Good try again - Jesus was raised from the dead in the Flesh.
If the same Spirit was behind all messengers they would agree. Jesus says He is the only way to salvation I don't see any other 'messengers' agreeing to that.

Except Jesus the Christ said about flesh;

John 6:63 "The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you--they are full of the Spirit and life."

All Messengers agree that it is the Spirit that gives life.

Regards Tony

 

[Carl Emerson]

You are mixing two definitions of flesh here...

Jesus was raised up from death in his physical bodily flesh...

This is not the flesh referred to when addressing the unredeemed nature.

 

[Saint Steven]

One where God is a person's reality.

Did you make that up? Sounds like a pretend reality.

 

[Saint Steven]

[Saint Steven]
The first part of my question back in post# 35 asked:
What does it mean to "See Me"?
That was in reference to your quoted John 14:8-9.
So I ask, what do you see?
Is "Messiah" the total sum of your vision of Jesus?

He is the Savior. The one sent to restore fellowship between humankind and God. He came down from heaven to be a man himself. He left his godhead status to be born of a woman. Father God directed him in his activates. When he went to a town all diseases were healed, blind eyes were opened, the dead were raised to life. He took the capital punishment we deserved and then rose from the dead. And now intercedes for us at the right hand of God the Father. On a personal level, his hand is on my life. I have a personal relationship with the Messiah.

 

[Saint Steven]

You are optimistic that the Bible is exclusively the Word of God. I see that the Quran is also the Word of God as are the writings of the Bab and Baha'u'llah.

You could also show where Christ said that vicarious atonement is a teaching of His and not of that man has made from scripture.

Regards Tony

If all these different religious texts are the Word of God, then they are in conflict with each other. For instance the God of the Bible is a personal God that cares about humanity. This is not the case in Islam. Obviously a different god.

 

[JosephZ]

For instance the God of the Bible is a personal God that cares about humanity. This is not the case in Islam. Obviously a different god.

It's impossible to come to the conclusion that Muslims worship a different god if one reads the Qur'an and/or talks to Muslims about their faith and what they believe.

Below is what Muslims believe:

“We believe in God; and in what was revealed to us; and in what was revealed to Abraham, and Ishmael, and Isaac, and Jacob, and the Patriarchs; and in what was given to Moses and Jesus; and in what was given to the prophets—from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him we surrender.” (Qur'an 2:136)

"...there is no god but He, the Living, the Eternal. He sent down to you the Book with the Truth, confirming what came before it; and He sent down the Torah and the Gospel." (Qur'an 3:2-3)

And here's another verse from the Qur'an:

"So if you are in doubt about that which We have revealed to you, then ask those (The Jews and Christians) who have been reading the Scripture (The Torah and the Injeel/Gospel) before you. The truth has certainly come to you from your Lord, so never be among the doubters". (Qur'an 10:94)

Islam is a progressive religion and in the view of Muslims simply a continuation of Judaism and Christianity. If you ever have the opportunity to listen to an Islamic sermon or witness to Muslims you will find that they not only teach and learn from what Muhammad said, but also Moses, David, Jesus, etc.. Islam recognizes the same prophets as Christians.

In this verse the Torah is referred to in the Qur'an:

All food was permissible to the Children of Israel, except what Israel forbade for himself before the Torah was revealed. Say, “Bring the Torah, and read it, if you are truthful.” Whoever forges lies about God after that—these are the unjust. Say, “God has spoken the truth, so follow the religion of Abraham... (Qur'an 3:93-95)

In the following verse the Torah and the Gospel are mentioned and how Jesus fulfilled what is written in the Torah:

In their footsteps, We sent Jesus son of Mary, fulfilling the Torah that preceded him; and We gave him the Gospel, wherein is guidance and light, and confirming the Torah that preceded him, and guidance and counsel for the righteous. So let the people of the Gospel rule according to what God revealed in it. Those who do not rule according to what God revealed are the sinners. (Qur'an 5:46-47)

Once again, Muslims believe in the God of Abraham:

"We will worship thy God, the God of our forefathers Abraham and Ishmael and Isaac, the One God; and unto Him will we surrender ourselves." (Qur'an 2:133)

As you can see from the above verses, there can be no doubt that Muslims are worshiping the same God as Christians and Jews. The Qur'an even tells Muslims to follow the religion of Abraham, and as we we know, Abraham worshiped the one true God.

Here is what Islam teaches about Jesus:

His mother, Mary, was a virgin; Jesus was the "Word" of God; Jesus was the Messiah sent to the children of Israel; Jesus confirmed the validity of the Torah; Jesus lived a righteous life; Jesus performed miracles. Healed the blind, the sick, and raised the dead; Jesus removed some of the law of Moses; Jesus was raised into heaven currently sits with God, and will return at the day of the Resurrection (Judgement Day); and Jesus is the only living profit in Islam

Muslims of course miss the most important aspect of Jesus. That He is the Way, the Truth, and the Life; and the importance of Him being crucified and resurrected as a sacrifice for our sins, but they do acknowledge Jesus and respect Him and His teachings.

Since Muslims do not know Jesus, if you ever plan to witness to a Muslim and you start out by trying to convince them that they are not worshiping the same God, you will push them even further away from Christ than they already are.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Christians are NOT "drinking blood and eating flesh". So much for your conclusion.

From the historic perspective, we most certainly are. In the Eucharist we receive the very flesh and blood of Jesus Christ. The symbolic or memorialist view is a modern one that goes back to Ulrich Zwingli; Catholics, Orthodox, Lutherans, Anglicans, and others all adhere to the doctrine of the Real Presence. That, in some way, here in the Lord's Supper is Christ truly, actually, present: His real body and real blood.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[dlamberth]

Did you make that up? Sounds like a pretend reality.

No, it's not made up. Do you read the Christian Mystics at all?

If your unable to see Christ around you, just how real IS Christ to you? It sounds some what limited.