WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

[1stcenturylady]

I think you miss the point of LOVE and how you cannot separate LOVE from OBEDIENCE to God's LAW because God's 10 Commandments are the very expression of what LOVE is.

* If you LOVE your neighbore will you steal from them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you lie to them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you kill them?

etc etc...

*If you LOVE God will you have other God's?
*If you LOVE God will you make other God's and bow down to them?
*If you LOVE God will you use his name in vain?

We can go through all the 10 Commandments which are our duty of LOVE to GOD and our fellow man.

Let's look at the scriptures...

What does Jesus say when he talk about the commandments. Jesus is quoting from Old testament scriptures of Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18.

MATTHEW 22:36-40
[36], Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
[37], Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
[38], This is the first and great commandment.
[39], And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
[40], ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

Let's get clearer...

MATTHEW 19:16-21
[16], And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
[17], And he said unto him, Why call thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: BUT IF YOU WILL ENTER INTO LIFE KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.
[18], He saith unto him, WHICH? JESUS SAID, THOU SHALT NOT MURDER, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, HONOR YOU MOTHER AND FATHER AND THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF
[20], The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
[21], Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. <Jesus showed him that he may have fulfilled His duty of love to his neighbor but not to God breaking commandment 1 and 2 loving riches more than God>

Well Jesus makes it very clear that what he is talking about it is the 10 commandments of God's Law.

What about James...

JAMES 2:8-12
[8], If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF, ye do well:
[9], But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
[10], FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE SHALL BE GUILTY OF ALL.
[11], FOR HE THAT SAID, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY SAID ALSO DO NOT KILL. NOW IF YOU DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY AND YOU KILL, YOU HAVE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW.
[12], So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Well James makes it very clear what he is talking about when he talks about the Royal Law of love. He is talking about the 10 commandments. So Jesus and James both agree that they are talking about God's 10 commandments which also include the 4th commandment which is one of the ten.

What about Paul? He wrote a lot of books in God's Word...........................

ROMANS 13:8-10
[8], Owe no man anything, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
[9], For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
[10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

Paul makes it very clear what he is talking about as well when he is talking about God's Law. It seems like Jesus, James and Paul all agree together what it is they are referring to when talking about God's Law. They are all referring to God's 10 commandments which includes the 4th commandment which is one of the ten (Exodus 20:1-17)

So now that God's Word shows us what it is referring to. No need to guess, what we are talking about, God’s Law of Love is God's 10 commandments. It is only through Faith that works by love that anyone can walk in the Spirit which produces the fruit of obedience because love is the fulfilling of God’s Law in those that walk by faith and not by sight.

Hope this helps.

To you James is talking about the Ten Commandments, and not the Law of Liberty.

Do you know what the Law of Liberty is about?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

To you James is talking about the Ten Commandments, and not the Law of Liberty.

Do you know what the Law of Liberty is about?

Not really. The LAW of Liberty is LOVE and LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

ROMANS 13:8-10
[8], Owe no man anything, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
[9], For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
[10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

You cannot separate God's 10 commandments from LOVE because God's 10 commandments are how LOVE is expressed. That is why JESUS says; ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS [LOVE to God and LOVE to man] HANG ALL THE LAW and the prophets *MATTHEW 22:36-40.

* If you LOVE your neighbore will you steal from them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you lie to them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you kill them?

etc etc...

*If you LOVE God will you have other God's?
*If you LOVE God will you make other God's and bow down to them?
*If you LOVE God will you use his name in vain?

We can go through all the 10 Commandments which are our duty of LOVE to GOD and our fellow man which will give us the same outcome.

 

[Albion]

Got it. In fact,"Got it" several hundred posts ago. Actually, several threads ago.

What's the next topic??

 

[1stcenturylady]

Not really. The LAW of Liberty is LOVE and LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

ROMANS 13:8-10
[8], Owe no man anything, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
[9], For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
[10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

You cannot separate God's 10 commandments from LOVE because God's 10 commandments are how LOVE is expressed. That is why JESUS says; ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS [LOVE to God and LOVE to man] HANG ALL THE LAW and the prophets *MATTHEW 22:36-40.

* If you LOVE your neighbore will you steal from them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you lie to them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you kill them?

etc etc...

*If you LOVE God will you have other God's?
*If you LOVE God will you make other God's and bow down to them?
*If you LOVE God will you use his name in vain?

We can go through all the 10 Commandments which are our duty of LOVE to GOD and our fellow man which will give us the same outcome.

Until Jesus changed it, you could lust and still not commit adultery under the commandment against adultery?

The Ten Commandments were only until Jesus. Then Jesus brought in a higher standard than the bottom line.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Until Jesus changed it, you could lust and still not commit adultery under the commandment against adultery?

The Ten Commandments were only until Jesus. Then Jesus brought in a higher standard than the bottom line.

Jesus changed what? In MATTHEW 5 Jesus is showing us that we need a new heart to LOVE and need to be born again. God's 10 Commandments give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172. They make nothing perfect. They lead us to the Cross so that we can be FORGIVEN by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25.

*If you have no law you do not know what sin is.
*If you do not know what sin is you do not know that you are a sinner.
*If you do not know you are a sinner you have no need of a Saviour.
*If you do not know your a sinner and need of a Saviour you have no salvation.
*If you have no salvation then you are lost and still in your sins.

And the scripture is fulfilled...

ROMANS 2:12-13
[12], For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
[13], For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

I am sure you do not believe God's LAW is ABOLISHED now do you 1stcenturylady?

Hope this helps

 

[marineimaging]

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

Firstly I believe God has his people in EVERY CHURCH as long as they are living up to all the KNOWLEDGE God has revealed to them through his WORD.

JOHN 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

However God is calling his people out from following man made traditions to worship God in Spirit and in truth.

JOHN 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

WHO IS GOD'S CHURCH?

IS GOD'S CHURCH A BUILDING or a CHURCH ORGANISATION?

Before we look at who God's WORD says is God's true Church let's start off by looking at the GREEK meaning of the word Church which is ἐκκλησία which means a calling out or meeting.

This links in very nicely with

MATTHEW 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

A Church therefore is the people the BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD. They are the called out and Jesus is in the midst of them.

WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH ACCORDING TO GOD'S WORD?

1 JOHN 2:3-4
3, And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep <ALL> his commandments. 4, He that saith, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

REVELATION 12:17
And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

REVELATION 14:12
Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

REVELATION 22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Notice God's people keep ALL of God's Commandments through FAITH in Christ?

NOTE: God's saints keep ALL THE COMMANDMENTS of God. It is these people that are a remnant that the devil is making war with. They are called God's saints and these are the ones that have right to the tree of life.

How many Church's do you see keeping all of God's Commandments?

What are your thoughts?

My church is the church of Noah. The one he attended when the waters receded. Seriously though, every Christian is THE church. The rest are just buildings and organizations that some people need to identify with. Those who claim that all the others are wrong and only theirs is right, they will know the truth when God wants them to know.

 

[Johnny4ChristJesus]

Just wondering, in introducing myself as Sir Francis Drake, do you think I inspire terror?
After all my name sake was known by Catholic Spain as El Draque, the dragon.

Funny. I think you missed the point. the guy was concerned about people saying they were born again, because they might be offended, so I asked why he called himself "saint," since people could easily be offended at that, too.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Jesus changed what? In MATTHEW 5 Jesus is showing us that we need a new heart to LOVE and need to be born again. God's 10 Commandments give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172. They make nothing perfect. They lead us to the Cross so that we can be FORGIVEN by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25.

*If you have no law you do not know what sin is.
*If you do not know what sin is you do not know that you are a sinner.
*If you do not know you are a sinner you have no need of a Saviour.
*If you do not know your a sinner and need of a Saviour you have no salvation.
*If you have no salvation then you are lost and still in your sins.

And the scripture is fulfilled...

ROMANS 2:12-13
[12], For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
[13], For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

I am sure you do not believe God's LAW is ABOLISHED now do you 1stcenturylady?

Hope this helps

The point is the 10C were to show us our sin. Jesus took away our sin and gave us His Spirit to lead us.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

The point is the 10C were to show us our sin. Jesus took away our sin and gave us His Spirit to lead us.

Well good I am glad we are in agreement. Although this does not change the role of God's 10 Commandments. Although now once forgiven we are no longer under the condemnation of it because be faith we accept the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.

God's LAW has same role it always had and that is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172.

No one has God's Spirit however while living a life of known unrepentant sin *ACTS 2:38; 3:19; HEBREWS 10:26-27. OBEDIENCE is the fruit of faith that works by LOVE *ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 13:8-10; JAMES 2:18-20; 26. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12 and why we need to be Born again to love *1 JOHN 3:3-10.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Well good I am glad we are in agreement. Although this does not change the role of God's 10 Commandments. Although now once forgiven we are no longer under the condemnation of it because be faith we accept the gift of God's dear son *ROMANS 6:23.

God's LAW has same role it always had and that is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172.

No one has God's Spirit however while living a life of known unrepentant sin *ACTS 2:38; 3:19; HEBREWS 10:26-27. OBEDIENCE is the fruit of faith that works by LOVE *ROMANS 3:31; ROMANS 13:8-10; JAMES 2:18-20; 26. This is the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12 and why we need to be Born again to love *1 JOHN 3:3-10.

You're cutting and pasting again, and you know how much I hate going over old territory.

24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

What was our tutor?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

You're cutting and pasting again, and you know how much I hate going over old territory.

24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.

What was our tutor?

Cutting and pasting? Nope I wrote the post out. Of course we are no longer under a tutor when we have been forgiven. Your only UNDER the LAW if you are guilty before God of breaking it.

As posted earlier God's LAW has same role it always had and that is to give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172.

If your have received God's FORGIVENESS by faith in God's WORD then you are no longer under the law and condemned by it. If you are breaking it however then you are still in your sins.

 

[JLB777]

Loving your neighbor covers those AND MORE. The "and more" is why the 10C are obsolete and don't quite "cut it" anymore. In the old covenant you couldn't murder, but you could still hate and no one knew. In the New you can't hate which never gets to murder. Even the Pharisees kept the 10C, but Jesus said our righteousness must exceed that of the Pharisees.

The 10C are the bottom line commandments, of which there was no sacrifice in the Old Testament.

Please, carefully read what the scripture says.


Here is the biblical text book definition of the love of God.


For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1 John 5:3


Loving God by loving His children.


The way we love God, is by loving our neighbor.


If someone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen? And this commandment we have from Him: that he who loves God must love his brother also.
1 John 4:20-21


Our course just because we keep His commandments doesn’t make us righteous, however we know for sure that if we don’t we are unrighteous.


Example: just because I don’t steal from my neighbor who is poor, doesn’t necessarily mean I’m righteous, if I don’t give him food if he is hungry.


Now we can discuss loving our enemy




JLB

 

[ViaCrucis]

My friend why make up things no one is saying to you? Where have I ever posted and said that anyone is justified or made righteous by the LAW? Please post the link. If you cannot are you only spreading misinformation. I will leave that between you and God.

Didn't say you did, I was simply stating the Lutheran position on what the Law is, and why justification occurs entirely apart from all human effort.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[ViaCrucis]

Why not? The 10 commandments are a part of God's LAW are they not?

Part of God's Law, yes. Specifically they are part of the Torah which God gave as part of the Covenant He made with the descendants of Jacob. A covenant which does not apply to those who are in Christ, for those in Christ have a new and better covenant.

Which is why Christians are under no obligation to observe the Sabbath.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Part of God's Law, yes. Specifically they are part of the Torah which God gave as part of the Covenant He made with the descendants of Jacob. A Covenant which does not apply to those who belong to Christ.

-CryptoLutheran

We are under the new Covenant now but you mix up the Shadow laws from the MOSIAC BOOK of the COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 with God's eternal law that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172.
They make nothing perfect. They lead us to the Cross so that we can be FORGIVEN by faith *GALATIANS 3:22-25.

*If you have no law you do not know what sin is.
*If you do not know what sin is you do not know that you are a sinner.
*If you do not know you are a sinner you have no need of a Saviour.
*If you do not know your a sinner and need of a Saviour you have no salvation.
*If you have no salvation then you are lost and still in your sins.

And the scripture is fulfilled...

ROMANS 2:12-13
[12], For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;
[13], For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

I am sure you do not believe God's LAW is ABOLISHED now do you ViaCrucis?

 

[DennisTate]

The OP is only scripture and the GREEK definition of the word Church. What is it that you disagree with?

Personally..... I am certain that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus observed the Jewish Sabbath which was from Friday at sunset to Saturday at sunset.

I am amazed how many more Christians are discovering that doctrine at this time. Within a couple of centuries....... the majority of people will probably be observing Saturday as the Sabbath..... but of course getting together to worship on Sunday with family and friends who have not yet been shown this..... is not wrong.

 

[ViaCrucis]

We are under the new Covenant now but you mix up the Shadow laws from the MOSIAC BOOK of the COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 with God's eternal law that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS

All 613 mitzvot, including the Decalogue, are the "Law of Moses", i.e. the Torah which God gave the children of Jacob at Mt. Horeb.

Trying to twist this into an accusation of antinomianism isn't a game you'll find I'm going to play along with. I've already stated the Lutheran position, and that has not changed since I posted it earlier.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Neogaia777]

Not really. The LAW of Liberty is LOVE and LOVE is the fulfilling of God's LAW in all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD.

ROMANS 13:8-10
[8], Owe no man anything, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
[9], For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
[10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

You cannot separate God's 10 commandments from LOVE because God's 10 commandments are how LOVE is expressed. That is why JESUS says; ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS [LOVE to God and LOVE to man] HANG ALL THE LAW and the prophets *MATTHEW 22:36-40.

* If you LOVE your neighbore will you steal from them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you lie to them?
* If you LOVE your neighbore will you kill them?

etc etc...

*If you LOVE God will you have other God's?
*If you LOVE God will you make other God's and bow down to them?
*If you LOVE God will you use his name in vain?

We can go through all the 10 Commandments which are our duty of LOVE to GOD and our fellow man which will give us the same outcome.

You cannot attain to what you seek by or through the letter of the law, or by any written code... And neither can others or anyone else either... That's just the facts of "reality"...

So, why are you teaching/preaching it...?

God Bless!

 

[LoveGodsWord]

All 613 mitzvot, including the Decalogue, are the "Law of Moses", i.e. the Torah which God gave the children of Jacob at Mt. Horeb.

Trying to twist this into an accusation of antinomianism isn't a game you'll find I'm going to play along with. I've already stated the Lutheran position, and that has not changed since I posted it earlier.

-CryptoLutheran

Please provide the scripture that says 613 mitzvots? How many commandment are there in the God's 10 Commandments that he spoke and wrote on two tables of stone 613, 9 or 10? *EXODUS 34:28; DEUTERONOMY 4:13; DEUTERONOMY 10:4.

Did MOSES make the 10 Commandments or did God alone? *EXODUS 32:16.

We are under the new Covenant now but you mix up the Shadow laws from the MOSIAC BOOK of the COVENANT *EXODUS 24:7 with God's eternal law that give us the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL; SIN and RIGHTOEUSNESS *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; JAMES 2:10-11; PSALMS 119:172.

Hope this helps

 

[LoveGodsWord]

You cannot attain to what you seek by or through the letter of the law, or by any written code... And neither can others or anyone else either... That's just the facts of "reality"...

So, why are you teaching/preaching it...?

God Bless!

Now Neogaia777, where have I ever posted that we can attain to what we seek by the letter of the LAW or any code? If I have never said such things why pretend that I have? Is this being honest in your view or is it bearing false witness?