Racism, sexism, xenophobia and generalisations

[Zoii]

This morning I was riding on the train to my class and a woman had a large bag beside her that took up two seats. I moved it so I could sit. Another woman came along so I pointed out her bag was taking up a seat… and it started – think of every name you can be called and I got it, and she was getting more and more elevated.

So the point of this – This woman was aboriginal. I am wary of aboriginals because it seems so frequently I have seen them get elevated, or intoxicated and have seen they have a propensity to abuse or get violent. So with thoughts like this – where does one switch from having feelings and caution about a group, to simply being racist, or sexist or xenophobic in some way.

Ive been thinking that to generalize about peoples can be protective, but can also be xenophobic. Eg I generalize that when I walk home, especially if its dark, and I see men, I am immediately hyper-alert because I fear that men can be dangerous to women.

So my questions to you are – where are your lines drawn on this?

 

[tstor]

No harm in being safe. I would say it is wise to avoid men at night as a woman. I would also say it is wise to anticipate the actions of someone, even if those actions are anticipated based on something like race.

 

[Zoii]

No harm in being safe. I would say it is wise to avoid men at night as a woman. I would also say it is wise to anticipate the actions of someone, even if those actions are anticipated based on something like race.

I also wrote this because I have seen frequent threads here about police drawing their weapons and discharging them against a black american. Could this be part of the same thing?

 

[Zoii]

Ive also seen frequent threads about women's incapcity to lead. Where does such a remark move from testimony from what perhaps that person has seen from several women in their life, to simply being sexist.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Always keep in mind that the Spirit of the Lord inside ANYONE can turn even the most awful human being into a beautiful person, so it is not the flesh but the Spirit inside that flesh that counts.

Certainly you want to be cautious, only in being cautious always be ready to see others with an open mind. Moreover, just because someone is ugly today doesn't mean they couldn't become filled with the Spirit of God tomorrow.

 

[Hidden In Him]

I also wrote this because I have seen frequent threads here about police drawing their weapons and discharging them against a black american. Could this be part of the same thing?

Yes.

I've also seen frequent threads about women's incapcity to lead. Where does such a remark move from testimony from what perhaps that person has seen from several women in their life, to simply being sexist.

Correct. Many, of course, argue from scripture that God commands against it, which is a separate thing. But for those who come to their positions through "experience," they have essentially been tricked by the Devil into judging others by appearances rather than purely on their own merits.

 

[alsughasoughaiuyfygh]

.

 

[samir]

This morning I was riding on the train to my class and a woman had a large bag beside her that took up two seats. I moved it so I could sit. Another woman came along so I pointed out her bag was taking up a seat… and it started – think of every name you can be called and I got it, and she was getting more and more elevated.

So the point of this – This woman was aboriginal. I am wary of aboriginals because it seems so frequently I have seen them get elevated, or intoxicated and have seen they have a propensity to abuse or get violent. So with thoughts like this – where does one switch from having feelings and caution about a group, to simply being racist, or sexist or xenophobic in some way.

Ive been thinking that to generalize about peoples can be protective, but can also be xenophobic. Eg I generalize that when I walk home, especially if its dark, and I see men, I am immediately hyper-alert because I fear that men can be dangerous to women.

So my questions to you are – where are your lines drawn on this?

If you read enough scripture you'll see plenty of what many people now consider racism, sexism, xenophobia, and generalizations so I wouldn't worry about it as there is nothing wrong with any of those things.

 

[tstor]

I also wrote this because I have seen frequent threads here about police drawing their weapons and discharging them against a black american. Could this be part of the same thing?

It very well could.Though I would not limit such a consideration to only black Americans.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

See, here's the thing. When we experience a negative impact from the behavior of a group we are a part of - we are more likely to see that as the bad behavior of an individual. When that negative impact is a result of someone in a group we are NOT a part of- it taints how we see that group.

I can understand being cautious when you are concerned about physical harm, but I draw the line at causing harm to those who do not warrant it with their behavior.

So, for example, I have been sexually assaulted several times; however, I don't defensively tase or pepper spray men that pass too close to me. I also don't deny employment opportunities to folks of Caucasian descent, despite the many examples I have of rudeness and the repeated attempts to treat me as a mental subordinate.

 

[Dave-W]

I also wrote this because I have seen frequent threads here about police drawing their weapons and discharging them against a black american. Could this be part of the same thing?

Yes. It is ascribing to an entire people group that all of them are problematic in some way.

 

[iLove]

This morning I was riding on the train to my class and a woman had a large bag beside her that took up two seats. I moved it so I could sit. Another woman came along so I pointed out her bag was taking up a seat… and it started – think of every name you can be called and I got it, and she was getting more and more elevated.

So the point of this – This woman was aboriginal. I am wary of aboriginals because it seems so frequently I have seen them get elevated, or intoxicated and have seen they have a propensity to abuse or get violent. So with thoughts like this – where does one switch from having feelings and caution about a group, to simply being racist, or sexist or xenophobic in some way.

Ive been thinking that to generalize about peoples can be protective, but can also be xenophobic. Eg I generalize that when I walk home, especially if its dark, and I see men, I am immediately hyper-alert because I fear that men can be dangerous to women.

So my questions to you are – where are your lines drawn on this?

Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves (Matthew 10:16 NKJV). When you understand the providence of God and His sovereignty, nothing comes to you that does not pass through God's fingers first; without Him knowing about it, allowing it, or sometimes sending it. Romans 8:28 says, "Good and evil works together". Yes, this secular world we live in can be evil. That's why God sends ambassadors, to show folk and tell folk what love looks like from above.

The scripture says, "Until the time came to fulfill his dreams, the LORD tested Joseph's character. Psalm 105:19 NLT"

Behold, I have refined you, but not with silver; I have tested you in the furnace of affliction. Isaiah 48:10 NKJV

All disciples who follow Jesus Christ, character will be tested prior to the LORD fulfilling the dreams the LORD has given us. God will test our faith with prophetic words He has spoken over us. He test our character with THE LITERAL WORD (the bible).

Everything that happens to a Believer is caused or allowed by God. It has purpose. God's timing is just as important as His will. We must be tried and tested to be refined. For the Holy Spirit to make something out of you we must be stripped.

The name Joseph in the Hebrew means Jehovah will add. The Egyptian King changed Joseph name to Zaphenath-paneah. Which means life more abundantly. As I stated God has purpose and timing. When you add those two names together it reads, Jehovah will add life more abundantly. And we no Joseph went from the jailhouse to the penthouse. Why? Because the Lord with Joseph. And not only is He with us Believers, He lives inside of us.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I honestly don't blame you. I'm the same way with Natives now because the Natives in my town have a well earned reputation for being lazy, entitled, alcoholic troublemakers who provide my town with many horror stories. On the other side of the coin, I've had friends and awesome co-workers who were Native and my ex girlfriend was also Native so it's a little complicated. I'm also wary of men of any race who wear hoodie jackets and baseball caps because they often act like they're on steroids and would love to have a fight with me if I made eye contact with them for too long.

There's no harm in being wary because there's a chance you could be in the right, especially if a very noticeable percentage of trouble comes from a certain demographic. I say it's better to be safe from physical harm than to be safe from criticism.

Congratulations, you are now considered a racist by many who post here (been there, been that).

 

[Wolfe]

All of my favorite things in one post, wow.

Obviously, I'm a straight white man.

 

[Sketcher]

This morning I was riding on the train to my class and a woman had a large bag beside her that took up two seats. I moved it so I could sit. Another woman came along so I pointed out her bag was taking up a seat… and it started – think of every name you can be called and I got it, and she was getting more and more elevated.

So the point of this – This woman was aboriginal. I am wary of aboriginals because it seems so frequently I have seen them get elevated, or intoxicated and have seen they have a propensity to abuse or get violent. So with thoughts like this – where does one switch from having feelings and caution about a group, to simply being racist, or sexist or xenophobic in some way.

Ive been thinking that to generalize about peoples can be protective, but can also be xenophobic. Eg I generalize that when I walk home, especially if its dark, and I see men, I am immediately hyper-alert because I fear that men can be dangerous to women.

So my questions to you are – where are your lines drawn on this?

For your example - how do you believe a white woman with that same bag taking up the seat next to her would have acted differently?

 

[Zoii]

For your example - how do you believe a white woman with that same bag taking up the seat next to her would have acted differently?

I can't answer that as each person is different. Which is why I wrote what i did. I've built up perceptions and generalised them. This is what I was getting at.... What's the line between generalising about a group for whatever reason, and straight out racism. Is it one of the same? For me riding a train i see arguments, people abusing, or intoxication in the Aboriginal group on my train line, which makes me wary around them. I'm the same around men especially at night because of how I know they can be.

 

[Sketcher]

I can't answer that as each person is different. Which is why I wrote what i did. I've built up perceptions and generalised them. This is what I was getting at.... What's the line between generalising about a group for whatever reason, and straight out racism. Is it one of the same? For me riding a train i see arguments, people abusing, or intoxication in the Aboriginal group on my train line, which makes me wary around them. I'm the same around men especially at night because of how I know they can be.

So in other words, the woman blowing up at you was due to being Aboriginal instead of the fact that she was placing her large bag next to her rather than on her lap? The clue isn't in her race, but her body language before you opened your mouth. If she had been a considerate person, she wouldn't have been taking up that extra space, which was at a premium. Yet, you're on about her race. That's racism.

 

[Zoii]

So in other words, the woman blowing up at you was due to being Aboriginal instead of the fact that she was placing her large bag next to her rather than on her lap? The clue isn't in her race, but her body language before you opened your mouth. If she had been a considerate person, she wouldn't have been taking up that extra space, which was at a premium. Yet, you're on about her race. That's racism.

The incident isnt the issue. Its the segway into the issue.... the issue being that Im wary of certain groups because I generalize my fears.... I fear men when Im alone because I see them as potential rapists.... im wary of aborginals especially on the trains because of violence, intoxication and abuse Ive seen them so often levy... its why I stay away from them. So... you think i should have ignored the lady needing a seat n not said anything?

And my question or theory, which im happy to be challenged about, is that generalising everyone does... if your american then maybe there some suburbs you would be wary walking through because its mostly latino or black drug area.... but if you think that way does that make you racist?.... in my case im not saying all men are rapists... i know they are not... but i suspect they could b when im in a vulnerable position. Same with aboriginal groups... most are easy going and mean noone harm..... but when i am on a train im super wary of them. Thats the fine line in my view and I accept you disagree that one should never generalize or have wary thoughts about ethnic groups at any time.

 

[Sketcher]

The incident isnt the issue. Its the segway into the issue.... the issue being that Im wary of certain groups because I generalize my fears.... I fear men when Im alone because I see them as potential rapists.... im wary of aborginals especially on the trains because of violence, intoxication and abuse Ive seen them so often levy... its why I stay away from them. So... you think i should have ignored the lady needing a seat n not said anything?

And my question or theory, which im happy to be challenged about, is that generalising everyone does... if your american then maybe there some suburbs you would be wary walking through because its mostly latino or black drug area.... but if you think that way does that make you racist?.... in my case im not saying all men are rapists... i know they are not... but i suspect they could b when im in a vulnerable position. Same with aboriginal groups... most are easy going and mean noone harm..... but when i am on a train im super wary of them. Thats the fine line in my view and I accept you disagree that one should never generalize or have wary thoughts about ethnic groups at any time.

Its an adequate segue into the issue, because it reveals the issue. The clue should have been her behavior, not her race. The way you described the incident, she was giving off non-verbal cues that she was claiming that space, rightly or wrongly. But you were making it about her race. See the problem?

Now, with high crime areas (they tend to not be suburbs), we tend to avoid them because they are high crime. Many of them happen to contain more black people than other areas that do not have high crime, one can expect to see more black people walking around in those areas. If someone were to be avoiding those areas because of the black people rather than because of the crime, that would be racist. If you avoid black strangers in a nice area of town differently than you avoid white strangers in that same area, that would also be racist.

Now, in the case of strange men late at night, better safe than sorry. That's another animal.

 

[Zoii]

Its an adequate segue into the issue, because it reveals the issue. The clue should have been her behavior, not her race. The way you described the incident, she was giving off non-verbal cues that she was claiming that space, rightly or wrongly. But you were making it about her race. See the problem?

Now, with high crime areas (they tend to not be suburbs), we tend to avoid them because they are high crime. Many of them happen to contain more black people than other areas that do not have high crime, one can expect to see more black people walking around in those areas. If someone were to be avoiding those areas because of the black people rather than because of the crime, that would be racist. If you avoid black strangers in a nice area of town differently than you avoid white strangers in that same area, that would also be racist.

Now, in the case of strange men late at night, better safe than sorry. That's another animal.

Hmmm.... Id have thought it is just profiling. You recognise people by how they look including their ethnicity, clothes, body language and the situation your in. If it was racism that makes you act with caution then no matter how they looked or acted, and regardless of the situation, you'd apply your same degree of thoughts about them. I don't get scared of all men... It just depends on where I am, and same for Aboriginals..... N actually how they look as well..... If its some old Aboriginal guy then I id feel safe. Young Aboriginals..... no keep away, unless you actually know the person. If you wanna call that racism or sexist then fine... I call it profiling so I don't get hurt.

In the case of the woman on the train, I should have acted on my instincts because of her body language, mumbling to herself, and.... Well who puts their bags up on seats to stop people sitting down. That she was Aboriginal should have warned me she might get threatening and of course did.... Very.