It appears Trump is offically under investigation for obstruction

[dgiharris]

.....We have wasted so much time, resources just within the last two administrations on what? We have had zero results. Nada. Nothing. What we did get was given by the departments that is suppose to do this work. Meanwhile, those politicians could be in their office doing their job of serving US the citizens that sent them there.

If they have anything besides rumor or speculation on Trump or anyone connected to him? They need to nail them. At this point they don't, and want to spend tax dollars - once again - on a fishing trip hoping they will. Meanwhile, let's tear the country apart a little bit more. I mean didn't they do a good enough job with the last administration?

Have to admit, your post above is pretty solid. Sometimes in an argument I like to take a step back and ask myself to look at the core of my beliefs regarding an argument.

When Bush/Cheney were in office, I did not like them, I hated them... yet the thought never crossed my mind to try to impeach them. Why? Well, despite me hating them, they were "Presidential". They understood the office and the politics and I felt they were within the "acceptable" bounds of the office despite their mistakes.

Trump is something different. With Trump, I honestly do not feel he has the mental aptitude or emotional aptitude to do the job. I also feel he doesn't even want the job, that he ran on a lark. He also doesn't understand the gravitas of the job and his ego is actually bigger than the office...

Okay? so does that mean we get rid of a president just because we don't like him?

No. It's more than that. He isn't fit for the office and he demonstrates this fact almost every single time you put a camera in front of him. It is painful to watch.

But.... there is something that I feel he has done and I feel he Obstructed Justice.
If what Comey said is true, and I believe Comey 100% word for word... that is obstruction of justice.

You can word smith "hope" all you like. When Trump cleared the room then said what he said to Comey, that is Obstruction of Justice. And then Trump fired Comey.

The FBI director is not some line cook at Dennys you fire on a whim. That is a serious offense and as an American it scares the bleep out of me that the FBI director's job is now viewed as "he serves at the pleasure of the President" sorta job. It should not be. Comey was a bonafide boyscout.

Add all of the above up, ... and sadly, it is probably not enough to Impeach Trump.

as a nation, we are just screwed. you are probably right

 

[jgarden]

It appears Trump is offically under investigation for obstruction

Given that it was The Washington Post that made the investigation of the President public, based on unnamed sources, why wouldn't "The Donald" and his motley crew of supporters use it as an opportunity to dismiss it as nothing more than "fake news?"

It was the President's own tweets that have provided the "fake media" with all the confirmation they needed that this President was under investigation for obstruction - which says it all as to why no reputable law firm wants to represent him!

 

[JGG]

It appears Trump is offically under investigation for obstruction

Given that it was The Washington Post that made this public based on unnamed sources, why haven't "The Donald" and his motley crew of supporters dismissed it as nothing more than "fake news?"

Of course, it's fake news. "The Donald" has done nothing wrong, there's no reason to investigate him.

 

[HannahT]

But.... there is something that I feel he has done and I feel he Obstructed Justice.
If what Comey said is true, and I believe Comey 100% word for word... that is obstruction of justice.

You can word smith "hope" all you like. When Trump cleared the room then said what he said to Comey, that is Obstruction of Justice. And then Trump fired Comey.

The FBI director is not some line cook at Dennys you fire on a whim. That is a serious offense and as an American it scares the bleep out of me that the FBI director's job is now viewed as "he serves at the pleasure of the President" sorta job. It should not be. Comey was a bonafide boyscout.

Add all of the above up, ... and sadly, it is probably not enough to Impeach Trump.

as a nation, we are just screwed. you are probably right

I didn't like what I heard either. Don't get me wrong here!

Yet, they did point out in the hearing - no one has been charged and found guilty on 'hope'. Even Comey admitted that.

It was mentioned in the hearings that Comey told Trump more than once he wasn't under investigation. The rumor mills in the press were flying around, and Trump asked him to clear that up more than once. Comey didn't do it.

Come to find out later than people on the investigation committee knew he wasn't, and they didn't even stop the rumors from flying. So, most people knew this...and allowed the press to go nuts. This did impede Trump, and I would bet he resented it. I'm not sure I can name one person that wouldn't. Meanwhile, all the people that claim they want the country to come together? Didn't have a problem allowing this to tear it apart. lol I mean what Trump doesn't have enough TRUE material to go on?

Now, how does the FBI handle that setting that straight? I don't know. Normally, they are closed lipped about stuff. Yet, Comey has been not so much about other issues in the past. Now, that could be because the dynamics were different behind the scenes that we didn't know about. Who knows!

Personally, as I said before I didn't like the last minute 'Clinton' email stuff with laptop. It was to close to the election, and he should have waited to see if there was anything THERE. I mean it only took them a couple of days after it happened - from memory here - to find nothing. That was outrageous, and I'm not Hillary fan! It wasn't fair to the nation overall. Although, I will admit even before that happen I'm sure most people at that point made up their minds on who they were voting for. That doesn't minimize the stupid thing he did.

The Trump/Russia personal connection, and the Clinton Email deal were tearing the country apart. Both issues it seems to me he really handled badly. The President can fire the director at will, and if I was in his place? He would have been gone long before he was. Yet, that's just me. I found him irresponsible prior to the election.

 

[Hank77]

It was the President's own tweets that have provided the "fake media" with all the confirmation they needed that this President was under investigation for obstruction -

I wasn't convinced that he was under investigation until he tweeted it himself. Sometimes Trump is his own worst enemy. His lack of judgement and self-control is scary in a person with his power.

 

[camille70]

I wasn't convinced that he was under investigation until he tweeted it himself. Sometimes Trump is his own worst enemy. His lack of judgement and self-control is scary in a person with his power.

His poor judgment and lack of self control was evident all during the election though, and he still got votes. Short of an intervention form God, he isn't going to change at his age. Being brash and crass, threatening and intimidating people to get what he wants, has worked for so many years he doesn't even see the need to change.

He is surrounded by people who only want him there to sign off on their agenda. As soon as sticking with him to get their agenda passed puts 2018 or their own job, since there is so much gerrymandering going on, in jeopardy they are going to drop him like a hot potato.

Right now everyone including Pence, staff and Trump's personal lawyers are lawyering up. No one does that if they believe the investigations are going to clear them and not recommend criminal charges.

 

[Hank77]

Right now everyone including Pence, staff and Trump's personal lawyers are lawyering up. No one does that if they believe the investigations are going to clear them and not recommend criminal charges.

I agree with everything you said except this.
Lawyering up does not mean someone knows or thinks that they personally have done something wrong. If you are going to be called to an interview, deposed, by a top prosecuting attorney, it is only wise to have your own attorney to advise you. You could incriminate yourself, even when you didn't do anything wrong, and not realize it.

 

[JGG]

I didn't like what I heard either. Don't get me wrong here!

Yet, they did point out in the hearing - no one has been charged and found guilty on 'hope'. Even Comey admitted that.

I prefer the explanation that Trump was wistfully wishing on a star out the window. "Oh magic star, how so I hope that my pal Comey won't continue the investigation on Flynn. Oh Comey, what are you doing here?"

 

[camille70]

I prefer the explanation that Trump was wistfully wishing on a star out the window. "Oh magic star, how so I hope that my pal Comey won't continue the investigation on Flynn. Oh Comey, what are you doing here?"

If say to you "you have a nice wife and daughter, I hope nothing bad happens to them," is that a regular statement or a threat? Context matters.

 

[Rion]

Robert Mueller hasn't decided whether to actually investigate Trump: Report

 

[camille70]

Robert Mueller hasn't decided whether to actually investigate Trump: Report

I'd really love to believe this, but unfortunately the sources were not named.

 

[Go Braves]

Robert Mueller hasn't decided whether to actually investigate Trump: Report

So then was Trump writing fake news about himself?
Donald J. Trump on Twitter

 

[mark kennedy]

He is under investigation but so far nothing all that bad, at least nothing that can be nailed down. The investigations probably wouldn't have involved the Trump administration had they been more honest, denial about the Russian interference in our election and simply not being forthcoming with contacts with the Russian ambassador started a feeding frenzy. Trump should have divested himself from all private holdings and release his tax returns, which technically isn't malfeasance, but he has a nerve to act like he didn't know this was going to raise suspicions and be used politically.

He wouldn't be under investigation if he could use a little more restraint and be more transparent. I see some good things coming out of the administration; illegal immigration is down, the wall is on the agenda but appropriations are still tentative. Health care is still doable but there is only so much time and it will come down to what the Senate can actually accomplish.

Yes he is under investigation but they are proceeding with extreme caution which is as it should be. I don't think collusion will stick, obstruction isn't as easily dismissed but I don't see criminal intent just yet. His financial dealing are a bit iffy but still no smoking gun. Trump and his supporters need to turn that ship into the wind and stop denying the obvious. He is under investigation but he could ride this out if he just says, I sure hope so because I want to put these allegations behind us. Ranting about witch hunts and fake news is just going to hurt him.

 

[FanthatSpark]

Trump and Nixon are two separate animals. Nixon resigned to save the staff. Trump will through all staff under the bus. Thus, no impeachment.

Like but not limited too: I fired Comey as told to do by ____ < Place your staff member there or lawyer. Pence may be thrown under the bus too as a paranoid mind will tape everything and Trump has good reason to be paranoid.

However, the judicial house investigation and the supreme court on the travel ban will defang a presidents executive order status and thats a good thing for the next democratic president that sits in that seat for all decisions made by the supreme court have no 8 year limitations on them.

 

[Rion]

So then was Trump writing fake news about himself?
Donald J. Trump on Twitter

Trump's twitter is like a teenaged girl's. I pretty much assume that the stuff that is written is only vaguely reflective of reality and is mostly woe is me hyperbole.

 

[bhsmte]

Have to admit, your post above is pretty solid. Sometimes in an argument I like to take a step back and ask myself to look at the core of my beliefs regarding an argument.

When Bush/Cheney were in office, I did not like them, I hated them... yet the thought never crossed my mind to try to impeach them. Why? Well, despite me hating them, they were "Presidential". They understood the office and the politics and I felt they were within the "acceptable" bounds of the office despite their mistakes.

Trump is something different. With Trump, I honestly do not feel he has the mental aptitude or emotional aptitude to do the job. I also feel he doesn't even want the job, that he ran on a lark. He also doesn't understand the gravitas of the job and his ego is actually bigger than the office...

Okay? so does that mean we get rid of a president just because we don't like him?

No. It's more than that. He isn't fit for the office and he demonstrates this fact almost every single time you put a camera in front of him. It is painful to watch.

But.... there is something that I feel he has done and I feel he Obstructed Justice.
If what Comey said is true, and I believe Comey 100% word for word... that is obstruction of justice.

You can word smith "hope" all you like. When Trump cleared the room then said what he said to Comey, that is Obstruction of Justice. And then Trump fired Comey.

The FBI director is not some line cook at Dennys you fire on a whim. That is a serious offense and as an American it scares the bleep out of me that the FBI director's job is now viewed as "he serves at the pleasure of the President" sorta job. It should not be. Comey was a bonafide boyscout.

Add all of the above up, ... and sadly, it is probably not enough to Impeach Trump.

as a nation, we are just screwed. you are probably right

I believe a skilled prosecutor could make an argument for obstruction and a skilled attorney could also mount a vigorous defense of that charge as well. What we may have here, is what we had with hillary; being very careless, but no reasonable prosecutor would file charges.

 

[Allandavid]

I believe a skilled prosecutor could make an argument for obstruction and a skilled attorney could also mount a vigorous defense of that charge as well. What we may have here, is what we had with hillary; being very careless, but no reasonable prosecutor would file charges.

I am not familiar with the vagaries of your legal system, but if Trump admits, on video, that he fired the FBI director, specifically to make the Trump/Russia thing go away, how has he not sought to obstruct that investigation...?

 

[bhsmte]

I am not familiar with the vagaries of your legal system, but if Trump admits, on video, that he fired the FBI director, specifically to make the Trump/Russia thing go away, how has he not sought to obstruct that investigation...?

Because comey also quoted trump as saying in a private meeting; it would be good to know if anyone related to the campaign did collude with the russians. Also, comey has also stated, no one has told him to stop any investigation. Any good attorney, would capitalize on those points of fact, that comey acknowledges. Lastly, i read an article last week, authored by an attorney on how he would cross examine comey, based on his testimony. IMO, comey would get eviscerated being cross examined by a skilled attorney.

 

[Hank77]

Also, comey has also stated, no one has told him to stop any investigation.

Not exactly. Comey also said that he did take it as an order but did not do it.
I think that Trump making a point of speaking with Comey privately rather than with the AG or DSG present or going through the AG's office makes his (request) suspicious. Especially the 'loyalty' dinner. At that point Trump should have known that to meet with Comey alone, under these circumstances, was inappropriate. So why did he do it the second time?

 

[mark kennedy]

Not exactly. Comey also said that he did take it as an order but did not do it.
I think that Trump making a point of speaking with Comey privately rather than with the AG or DSG present or going through the AG's office makes his (request) suspicious. Especially the 'loyalty' dinner. At that point Trump should have known that to meet with Comey alone, under these circumstances, was inappropriate. So why did he do it the second time?

Trump is denying that he demanded loyalty, that is a clear consciousness of guilt. Rogers and Coats have both testified in closed session, if Trump attempted to change the course of their investigations the way he did Comey it's clear obstruction.

It defies any reasonable logic to argue Trum is not under investigation. Every investigation specifically and relentlessly demands to know if Trump tried to shut down the investigation into Flynn. We don't know the extent and scope of his involvement but this isn't whitewater, it isn't iran/contra, this is an attempt to get Flynn off the hook.