Madagascar and Australia, a question for creationists.

[JD16]

We have a saying:

Born once, die twice. *
Born twice, die once. **

* Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

** Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

So what does it actually means to be 'born again'?

 

[AV1611VET]

So what does it actually means to be 'born again'?

It means to be birthed (translated) into the kingdom of God.

Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

 

[JD16]

It means to be birthed (translated) into the kingdom of God.

Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Does that happened at baptism? Or is there another process to it?

 

[Colter]

Is that the same thing when Christians says that they are "born again Christians"? Never understood what's that born again thing means....

Yes. I grew up in a moderate Methodist church, I used to find that "born again" term really annoying. At 21 I hit a crisis due to alcoholism and drug addiction. One morning without planning on it, I had a spiritual experience sort of like Paul. I didn't see Jesus or here voices or anything like that, but I did have a radical change. Now I know what "born again" means.

 

[Colter]

"The very claim of materialism implies a supermaterial consciousness of the mind which presumes to assert such dogmas. A mechanism might deteriorate, but it could never progress. Machines do not think, create, dream, aspire, idealize, hunger for truth, or thirst for righteousness. They do not motivate their lives with the passion to serve other machines and to choose as their goal of eternal progression the sublime task of finding God and striving to be like him. Machines are never intellectual, emotional, aesthetic, ethical, moral, or spiritual." UB 55'

 

[Skreeper]

Atheist promote the theory that mind emerged from matter? So why can't spirit emerge from spirit ........if you are going to be consistent?

Atheism does not address how minds emerged. And I don't even know what a spirit is supposed to be or how you would demonstrate the existence of such things.

 

[The Stamp]

Atheist promote the theory that mind emerged from matter? So why can't spirit emerge from spirit ........if you are going to be consistent?

They are consistent, all religions and spirits originate in matter (the brain), if your brain is damaged your God and all the spirits could easily disappear (and we are not just talking about Alzheimer's and dementia) which tells us that Gods exist only in our minds.

Please make of this what you will: An old woman came into my sons Auto shop and ask if her car as ready, when asked what car it was she couldn't tell him, she looked a little confused so the receptionist asked her to sit down and asked her where she lived but the old woman she didn't know, the receptionist asked if she had a phone or a number she could ring and the woman gave her her handbag, the receptionist found a number and called it, it was her sons number who answered and said he would come and pick her up, when he arrived he told my son that his mother had not owned a car for five years, he also told him she had been very religious but did not talk about it now because she had forgotten she was religious.

 

[Armoured]

Wa Wat now? The earth is 10 million years old, but created in 4004 BCE??? ....I'm the the twilight zone I swear! lolz

Please don't get him started. Are you familiar with the story of Brere Rabbit an the Tar Baby?

 

[AV1611VET]

Does that happened at baptism?

No.

Or is there another process to it?

Jesus does it when we repent and ask Him for forgiveness of sins.

 

[Colter]

Atheism does not address how minds emerged. And I don't even know what a spirit is supposed to be or how you would demonstrate the existence of such things.

When one experiences spirit then they know it. The only real revelation or demonstration of the spirit is in the lives believers live. Jesus for example, lived a God revealing life.

 

[Colter]

They are consistent, all religions and spirits originate in matter (the brain), if your brain is damaged your God and all the spirits could easily disappear (and we are not just talking about Alzheimer's and dementia) which tells us that Gods exist only in our minds.

Please make of this what you will: An old woman came into my sons Auto shop and ask if her car as ready, when asked what car it was she couldn't tell him, she looked a little confused so the receptionist asked her to sit down and asked her where she lived but the old woman she didn't know, the receptionist asked if she had a phone or a number she could ring and the woman gave her her handbag, the receptionist found a number and called it, it was her sons number who answered and said he would come and pick her up, when he arrived he told my son that his mother had not owned a car for five years, he also told him she had been very religious but did not talk about it now because she had forgotten she was religious.

Once the brain of a spirit born person is damaged to that point, they are technically dead. Their soul is kept by the internal spirit until the death of the body and the subsiquent resurrection role call when they will receive the new body on the mansion worlds. Jesus for example allowed his material body to be destroyed, he then returned in a new form.

The material mind and body are like a cell phone, when it is damaged to a point it can no longer receive or transmit the signal.

 

[The Stamp]

Once the brain of a spirit born person is damaged to that point, they are technically dead. Their soul is kept by the internal spirit until the death of the body and the subsiquent resurrection role call when they will receive the new body on the mansion worlds. Jesus for example allowed his material body to be destroyed, he then returned in a new form.
The material mind and body are like a cell phone, when it is damaged to a point it can no longer receive or transmit the signal.

Phew, just where would you draw the line and say, that's just ridiculous I can't believe that?

 

[Skreeper]

When one experiences spirit then they know it. The only real revelation or demonstration of the spirit is in the lives believers live. Jesus for example, lived a God revealing life.

Then you can't blame me that I don't believe it since I have not experienced spirits so far.
And Jesus said some things I consider immoral so I don't really agree with your assessment of his character.

 

[Colter]

Phew, just where would you draw the line and say, that's just ridiculous I can't believe that?

Then you can't blame me that I don't believe it since I have not experienced spirits so far.
And Jesus said some things I consider immoral so I don't really agree with your assessment of his character.

immoral? If you don't believe that spirit can exist then how do you believe moral values exist? And what immoral things did Jesus do?

 

[Colter]

Phew, just where would you draw the line and say, that's just ridiculous I can't believe that?

If one if my kids became brain damaged I wouldn't abandon them, you can believe that.

 

[Skreeper]

If you don't believe that spirit can exist then how do you believe moral values exist?

The following pretty much summarizes my moral system I subscribe to if you have 30 minutes of spare time:

And what immoral things did Jesus do?

I disagree heavily with some of the statements he made in the sermon on the mount, I don't want to go into details in this thread though.

 

[dad]

I disagree heavily with some of the statements he made in the sermon on the mount, I don't want to go into details in this thread though.

??

 

[The Stamp]

If one if my kids became brain damaged I wouldn't abandon them, you can believe that.

I think if the word God was attached to something you would believe it.

 

[Colter]

The following pretty much summarizes my moral system I subscribe to if you have 30 minutes of spare time:

I disagree heavily with some of the statements he made in the sermon on the mount, I don't want to go into details in this thread though.

I watched the video from beginning to end.

Morality, virtue, is indigenous to human personality

Religion isn't the source of morality, innate morality is the source of religion. Morality is an innate endowment of the cosmic mind in all personality as personality is from God, the first cause. One can be moral and deny God, your Father. It's a form of plagerism to say consciousness of morality is simply a phenomenon apart from a moral first cause.


102:7.2 "God is the one and only self-caused fact in the universe. He is the secret of the order, plan, and purpose of the whole creation of things and beings. The everywhere-changing universe is regulated and stabilized by absolutely unchanging laws, the habits of an unchanging God. The fact of God, the divine law, is changeless; the truth of God, his relation to the universe, is a relative revelation which is ever adaptable to the constantly evolving universe.

102:7.3 Those who would invent a religion without God are like those who would gather fruit without trees, have children without parents. You cannot have effects without causes; only the I AM is causeless. The fact of religious experience implies God, and such a God of personal experience must be a personal Deity. You cannot pray to a chemical formula, supplicate a mathematical equation, worship a hypothesis, confide in a postulate, commune with a process, serve an abstraction, or hold loving fellowship with a law.


102:7.4 True, many apparently religious traits can grow out of nonreligious roots. Man can, intellectually, deny God and yet be morally good, loyal, filial, honest, and even idealistic. Man may graft many purely humanistic branches onto his basic spiritual nature and thus apparently prove his contentions in behalf of a godless religion, but such an experience is devoid of survival values, God-knowingness and God- ascension. In such a mortal experience only social fruits are forthcoming, not spiritual. The graft determines the nature of the fruit, notwithstanding that the living sustenance is drawn from the roots of original divine endowment of both mind and spirit.

102:7.5 The intellectual earmark of religion is certainty; the philosophical characteristic is consistency; the social fruits are love and service.


102:7.6 The God-knowing individual is not one who is blind to the difficulties or unmindful of the obstacles which stand in the way of finding God in the maze of superstition, tradition, and materialistic tendencies of modern times. He has encountered all these deterrents and triumphed over them, surmounted them by living faith, and attained the highlands of spiritual experience in spite of them. But it is true that many who are inwardly sure about God fear to assert such feelings of certainty because of the multiplicity and cleverness of those who assemble objections and magnify difficulties about believing in God. It requires no great depth of intellect to pick flaws, ask questions, or raise objections. But it does require brilliance of mind to answer these questions and solve these difficulties; faith certainty is the greatest technique for dealing with all such superficial contentions.

 

[Skreeper]

I watched the video from beginning to end.

Religion isn't the source of morality, innate morality is the source of religion. Morality is an innate endowment of the cosmic mind in all personality as personality is from God, the first cause. One can be moral and deny God, your Father. It's a form of plagerism to say consciousness of morality is simply a phenomenon apart from a moral first cause.


102:7.2 "God is the one and only self-caused fact in the universe. He is the secret of the order, plan, and purpose of the whole creation of things and beings. The everywhere-changing universe is regulated and stabilized by absolutely unchanging laws, the habits of an unchanging God. The fact of God, the divine law, is changeless; the truth of God, his relation to the universe, is a relative revelation which is ever adaptable to the constantly evolving universe.

102:7.3 Those who would invent a religion without God are like those who would gather fruit without trees, have children without parents. You cannot have effects without causes; only the I AM is causeless. The fact of religious experience implies God, and such a God of personal experience must be a personal Deity. You cannot pray to a chemical formula, supplicate a mathematical equation, worship a hypothesis, confide in a postulate, commune with a process, serve an abstraction, or hold loving fellowship with a law.


102:7.4 True, many apparently religious traits can grow out of nonreligious roots. Man can, intellectually, deny God and yet be morally good, loyal, filial, honest, and even idealistic. Man may graft many purely humanistic branches onto his basic spiritual nature and thus apparently prove his contentions in behalf of a godless religion, but such an experience is devoid of survival values, God-knowingness and God- ascension. In such a mortal experience only social fruits are forthcoming, not spiritual. The graft determines the nature of the fruit, notwithstanding that the living sustenance is drawn from the roots of original divine endowment of both mind and spirit.

102:7.5 The intellectual earmark of religion is certainty; the philosophical characteristic is consistency; the social fruits are love and service.


102:7.6 The God-knowing individual is not one who is blind to the difficulties or unmindful of the obstacles which stand in the way of finding God in the maze of superstition, tradition, and materialistic tendencies of modern times. He has encountered all these deterrents and triumphed over them, surmounted them by living faith, and attained the highlands of spiritual experience in spite of them. But it is true that many who are inwardly sure about God fear to assert such feelings of certainty because of the multiplicity and cleverness of those who assemble objections and magnify difficulties about believing in God. It requires no great depth of intellect to pick flaws, ask questions, or raise objections. But it does require brilliance of mind to answer these questions and solve these difficulties; faith certainty is the greatest technique for dealing with all such superficial contentions.

I don't agree and apparently you didn't understand the lecture on secular morality.
Also, you don't need to quote random verses to me since I don't care what a dusty old book has to say on morality.