LDS Joseph Smith's Claim of an Apostasy is a Lie

[ToBeLoved]

So you dismiss the parts of the Bible which don't fit your doctrine??

See I can accept the whole Bible. The priesthood is the power to act in the name of God. Jesus is the head of the Order of Melchizedek. A man holding this priesthood acts in the name of Jesus when he bestows the gift of the Holy Ghost. It's just like at our baptisms which are done in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, the man standing in the water with us acts in their name.

Correction: Jesus and Melchezedek are the ONLY members of the Melchezedek priesthood. Melchezedek was a foreshadow of Christ.

This is not an open party that everyone and anyone can come too. Contrary to some opinions.

 

[Jane_Doe]

Earlier in this thread we had a good four pages on this topic. Look back for the scripture and answers.

I am not going to have that conversation all over again. I provided detailed answers, so if your really interested you will check that out.

*Shrug* I feel like you never really answered the question.

 

[Jane_Doe]

Correction: Jesus and Melchezedek are the ONLY members of the Melchezedek priesthood.

The Bible doesn't say that.

 

[mmksparbud]

*Shrug* I feel like you never really answered the question.

I know exactly how you feel!!!------I'm still waiting for an answer to my questions!

 

[mmksparbud]

The Bible doesn't say that.

It certainly doesn't say anyone else is a member!!

 

[Jane_Doe]

I know exactly how you feel!!!------I'm still waiting for an answer to my questions!

Here, I'll give you a full work up later (sorry, time is short right now).

In the mean time, could you explain to me how the references in Acts about the Holy Spirit being bestowed via the laying on of hands fit into your theology?

 

[ToBeLoved]

*Shrug* I feel like you never really answered the question.

*shrug* but I gave you several links to Got Questions answers about the Holy Spirit that are very thorough, besides the time I personally took to answer.

Phoebe and several others explained it too. I think that you want to 'catch' us saying something rather than learning. I hope I am wrong about that but it seems you drill each one of us about the same things.

 

[ToBeLoved]

The Bible doesn't say that.

Why don't you prove me wrong?

Who else was part of that priesthood? Support with scripture.

 

[mmksparbud]

Here, I'll give you a full work up later (sorry, time is short right now).

In the mean time, could you explain to me how the references in Acts about the Holy Spirit being bestowed via the laying on of hands fit into your theology?

Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Act 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.


These gentiles had received the Holy Ghost already---no laying on of hands, they were baptized was all. And please do no tell me that in order for them to be baptized they had to lay hands on them!!!! The laying on of hands for the Holy Ghost was different then baptism.

Act 4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Act 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
Act 10:48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.


These gentiles had received the Holy Ghost already---no laying on of hands, they were baptized was all. And please do no tell me that in order for them to be baptized they had to lay hands on them!!!! The laying on of hands for the Holy Ghost was different then baptism.

Act 4:31 And when they had prayed, the place was shaken where they were assembled together; and they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and they spake the word of God with boldness.
Act 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

Great scripture support and point!

 

[Jane_Doe]

*shrug* but I gave you several links to Got Questions answers about the Holy Spirit that are very thorough, besides the time I personally took to answer.

My question is "Why does ToBeLoved spend her time on the sub-forum trying to teach people spiritual things, while simultaneously claiming that it's impossible for a human to teach spiritual things?"

I don't think that answer is on Got Questions. I think the only person who can provide that answer is ToBeLoved. As I have not yet received an answer from ToBeLoved, I keep asking.

 

[ToBeLoved]

My question is "Why does ToBeLoved spend her time on the sub-forum trying to teach people spiritual things, while simultaneously claiming that it's impossible for a human to teach spiritual things?"

I don't think that answer is on Got Questions. I think the only person who can provide that answer is ToBeLoved. As I have not yet received an answer from ToBeLoved, I keep asking.

Ok, I'll bite.

ToBeLoved tries to show (on this specific thread) to those who do not seem to understand the things of the Spirit, that they are lacking something. Something very important to their faith that they should seek to have. Something that cannot be fully explained by me, but that you should seek on your own, followed by scripture that explains it.

I am also on a lot of other threads Jane. Christian threads of many topics. I enjoy talking and learning myself about my Lord and Savior.

Do you need any other clarification?

 

[Jane_Doe]

ToBeLoved tries to show (on this specific thread) to those who do not seem to understand the things of the Spirit, that they are lacking something. Something very important to their faith that they should seek to have. Something that cannot be fully explained by me, but that you should seek on your own, followed by scripture that explains it.

First of all, thank you for actually answering the question.

Do you feel you are very successful in this mission?

 

[ToBeLoved]

First of all, thank you for actually answering the question.

Do you feel you are very successful in this mission?

On this thread, I hope that I have put a thought in your mind. The next weeks as you give countless hours of labor to your church, maybe you'll think about what Christ 'really' wants from us. That is to love Him. To be in relationship with Him. Prayer (not just asking for forgiveness) but quiet time to just cast your cares upon Him. To feel the rest He promises us when we put our faith in Him. Peace that surpasses all understanding. That you will spend more time worshipping Him for all He has done for you, which gives you eternal life with Him in paradise. Singing that next song a little louder (as long as it's about Christ) with your entire soul, thinking about all He has given you right now, during many moments. That He asks very little of us compared to what He has lovingly given.

Realizing that labor for your church is fine, cleaning toilets whatever, but what God says He wants from you is all of you. He paid a high price for you. Desire things of the spirit, to become so close to God that nothing else is more important.

If you and the others think about that even once, I have been successful.

 

[Peter1000]

Correction: Jesus and Melchezedek are the ONLY members of the Melchizedek priesthood. Melchezedek was a foreshadow of Christ.

This is not an open party that everyone and anyone can come too. Contrary to some opinions.

There is no correction, when Peter tells us that we are an holy nation and a "royal priesthood", what order of priesthood (brotherhood of priests) do you think the members of the royal priesthood are under? The Aaronic priesthood, or the Melchisedec priesthood, or no priesthood? In lieu of the word "priesthood" being mentioned several times in the NT, it would be biblically illogical to say there was no priesthood.

So tell me, what priesthood does the "royal priesthood" refer to, the old Aaronic priesthood, or the new Melchisedec priesthood? It does seem obvious.

Jesus is the great High Priest of the Melchisedec priesthood. Does he not need helpers here on earth to accomplish the tasks that are done in the name of the Father and the Son and the HS, when he is in heaven?

Those tasks are accomplished by apostles, and prophets, and bishops, and elders, and pastors, and evangelists, and teachers, and priests (different duties than the Aaronic priests), and deacons. The priesthood having been changed from the priesthood of Aaron to the priesthood of Melchisedec would absolutely look different, hence new covenant, new offices of the priesthood, etc., etc.

The main difference is that the Melchisedec priesthood was expanded from just 1 family tribe (Levites) to all worthy male members of the church, from all the nations of the earth.


The concept that Jesus and Melchisedec are the only members of the Melchisedec priesthood was started by some guy that was trying to argue that the priesthood even exists.

The concept that Jesus and Melchisedec are the only 2 people in the history of the world that are qualified to hold the Meichisedec priesthood was made up by some guy that was trying to figure out how he could deny the priesthood exists.

He got it wrong, and has driven billions of people to know nothing of the Melchisedec priesthood, which is the "royal priesthood" mentioned by Peter in the bible. It is royal because it is the priesthood of our King, Jesus Christ, who is the great High Priest of our priesthood.

 

[mmksparbud]

1Pe_2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Gal_3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.


We all are a chosen generation, a peculiar people, a royal priesthood---we are all one in Christ. No one is making up anything except that there is a separate priesthood now ---it doesn't say that in the bible. The same arguments are being said and the same thing is asked---support your views biblically and you can not.

And I am still waiting for my answers on the Holy Spirit!!

 

[ToBeLoved]

There is no correction, when Peter tells us that we are an holy nation and a "royal priesthood", what order of priesthood (brotherhood of priests) do you think the members of the royal priesthood are under? The Aaronic priesthood, or the Melchisedec priesthood, or no priesthood? In lieu of the word "priesthood" being mentioned several times in the NT, it would be biblically illogical to say there was no priesthood.

So tell me, what priesthood does the "royal priesthood" refer to, the old Aaronic priesthood, or the new Melchisedec priesthood? It does seem obvious.

Jesus is the great High Priest of the Melchisedec priesthood. Does he not need helpers here on earth to accomplish the tasks that are done in the name of the Father and the Son and the HS, when he is in heaven?

Those tasks are accomplished by apostles, and prophets, and bishops, and elders, and pastors, and evangelists, and teachers, and priests (different duties than the Aaronic priests), and deacons. The priesthood having been changed from the priesthood of Aaron to the priesthood of Melchisedec would absolutely look different, hence new covenant, new offices of the priesthood, etc., etc.

The main difference is that the Melchisedec priesthood was expanded from just 1 family tribe (Levites) to all worthy male members of the church, from all the nations of the earth.


The concept that Jesus and Melchisedec are the only members of the Melchisedec priesthood was started by some guy that was trying to argue that the priesthood even exists.

The concept that Jesus and Melchisedec are the only 2 people in the history of the world that are qualified to hold the Meichisedec priesthood was made up by some guy that was trying to figure out how he could deny the priesthood exists.

He got it wrong, and has driven billions of people to know nothing of the Melchisedec priesthood, which is the "royal priesthood" mentioned by Peter in the bible. It is royal because it is the priesthood of our King, Jesus Christ, who is the great High Priest of our priesthood.

Try not to mix up priesthoods.

Melchezedek priesthood
Aaronic priesthood
Levitical priesthood

Know that ALL of these are OT priesthoods.

That we are all individually and collectively a priesthood, think about that. Why would that be?

I don't think you have any idea what's the difference in the above priesthoods or that we are now part of the priesthood with Christ as the High Priest.

You need to build upon concepts. That's how Christianity is.

So you tell me why these three are different?
What changed that OT priesthoods are no longer valid?
Why is each person part of Christ's royal priesthood now, but not then?

Answer these questions and I'll answer any other questions about this that you have.

 

[Peter1000]

On this thread, I hope that I have put a thought in your mind. The next weeks as you give countless hours of labor to your church, maybe you'll think about what Christ 'really' wants from us. That is to love Him. To be in relationship with Him. Prayer (not just asking for forgiveness) but quiet time to just cast your cares upon Him. To feel the rest He promises us when we put our faith in Him. Peace that surpasses all understanding. That you will spend more time worshipping Him for all He has done for you, which gives you eternal life with Him in paradise. Singing that next song a little louder (as long as it's about Christ) with your entire soul, thinking about all He has given you right now, during many moments. That He asks very little of us compared to what He has lovingly given.

Realizing that labor for your church is fine, cleaning toilets whatever, but what God says He wants from you is all of you. He paid a high price for you. Desire things of the spirit, to become so close to God that nothing else is more important.

If you and the others think about that even once, I have been successful.

You have been successful, and you are right, sometimes we as people, not just Mormons, get caught up doing things of a religious nature or not, and temporarily lose sight of our Lord and Savior. We must guard against that. Jesus is our very reason to live. He is everything and he wishes that we worship him and he does want all of us.
Thank you for the reminder.

 

[tickingclocker]

Ok, I'll bite.

ToBeLoved tries to show (on this specific thread) to those who do not seem to understand the things of the Spirit, that they are lacking something. Something very important to their faith that they should seek to have. Something that cannot be fully explained by me, but that you should seek on your own, followed by scripture that explains it.

I am also on a lot of other threads Jane. Christian threads of many topics. I enjoy talking and learning myself about my Lord and Savior.

Do you need any other clarification?

Thank you for allowing the Spirit to teach through you, TBL! It's what He does best!

 

[tickingclocker]

On this thread, I hope that I have put a thought in your mind. The next weeks as you give countless hours of labor to your church, maybe you'll think about what Christ 'really' wants from us. That is to love Him. To be in relationship with Him. Prayer (not just asking for forgiveness) but quiet time to just cast your cares upon Him. To feel the rest He promises us when we put our faith in Him. Peace that surpasses all understanding. That you will spend more time worshipping Him for all He has done for you, which gives you eternal life with Him in paradise. Singing that next song a little louder (as long as it's about Christ) with your entire soul, thinking about all He has given you right now, during many moments. That He asks very little of us compared to what He has lovingly given.

Realizing that labor for your church is fine, cleaning toilets whatever, but what God says He wants from you is all of you. He paid a high price for you. Desire things of the spirit, to become so close to God that nothing else is more important.

If you and the others think about that even once, I have been successful.

God doesn't ask us for "success". That spiritual fruit comes entirely from His Will. He only asks us to be faithful and available for the Holy Spirit to do as HE sees fit through us. Right, TBL?!

I love Christianity. It's so simple a child can understand it. No more series of endless hoops to jump through!