POLL: Which of these elements of the creation story do you believe?

[rakovsky]

Really? What post numbers are those?

The poll numbers at the topic of this topic thread. Why didn't you notice that?

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1%
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3%

 

[rakovsky]

The sun was created in Genesis 1:1. How do you not know this or not see it?

Which word in verse 1 of Genesis 1 says something like "sun" or "great light that illumines the sky"?

Now go to day 4:

16 Then God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He made the stars also. 17 God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 So the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

What do you think "the greater light to rule the day" means?

Why do I need to explain this?

 

[StanJ]

I was talking about the verse on Firmament. Strong's says it means something beaten out:
http://biblehub.com/hebrew/7549.htm
"1 (flat) expanse (as if of ice,
2. the vault of heaven, or 'firmament,' regarded by Hebrews as solid, and supporting 'waters' above it,"
Why did you point me to a section of Strong's on Yom/Day and then said that Strong's does not agree with what I just said, that the firmament implies something solid ?

Well I was talking about day and sky, so why you came back with firmament is beyond me, but I dealt with it anyway.
Regardless of what it appeared like to those ancient people it was in fact 'sky' and modern science can definitely support the fact that there was a canopy of water that surrounded the atmosphere which gave us the greenhouse effect which is why people lived so long in the beginning. It is also a contributing factor to how the world was flooded in Noah's day.

 

[StanJ]

The poll numbers at the topic of this topic thread. Why didn't you notice that?

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1%
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3%

I said, what posts confirmed your assertion that you made in post 139? The above are just Numbers and overall percentages.

 

[rakovsky]

Well I was talking about day and sky, so why you came back with firmament is beyond me, but I dealt with it anyway.
Regardless of what it appeared like to those ancient people it was in fact 'sky' and modern science can definitely support the fact that there was a canopy of water that surrounded the atmosphere which gave us the greenhouse effect which is why people lived so long in the beginning. It is also a contributing factor to how the world was flooded in Noah's day.

Genesis 1 says that the waters were ABOVE the heavens, but that the stars are IN the heavens. This Biblical idea is not the same thing as saying that it was a canopy directly above the earth's own "atmosphere" but BELOW the stars.

 

[rakovsky]

I said, what posts confirmed your assertion that you made in post 139? The above are just Numbers and overall percentages.

Post 139: "Based on the poll half of people who think Adam came directly from clay say it was not necessarily 24 hours."

POLL RESULTS:

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS
   
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3% OF AL RESPONDANTS

Why do you not understand?

 

[StanJ]

Which word in verse 1 of Genesis 1 says something like "sun" or "great light that illumines the sky"?
Now go to day 4:
16 Then God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He made the stars also. 17 God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 So the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
What do you think "the greater light to rule the day" means?
Why do I need to explain this?

That would be the word universe. V3 would be God giving power to that universe and all the stars in the universe that created light.
v16-19 comes after the creation of the canopy of water in v7. What God did in v16-19 was to allow those bodies of light to shine through the canopy of water.
I think the greater light to Rule the Day means exactly what it says. Why do I need to explain this?

 

[StanJ]

Genesis 1 says that the waters were ABOVE the heavens, but that the stars are IN the heavens. This Biblical idea is not the same thing as saying that it was a canopy directly above the earth's own "atmosphere" but BELOW the stars.

It is if you're able to understand it. Again how exactly do you think the Earth flooded if it did not have more water added to it?

 

[StanJ]

Post 139: "Based on the poll half of people who think Adam came directly from clay say it was not necessarily 24 hours."

POLL RESULTS:

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS
   
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3% OF AL RESPONDANTS

Why do you not understand?

Is English your primary language? Because if it is you should understand the above. If it isn't let me know and I'll try to dummie it down for you. Read #5 carefully, It says INSTEAD OF USING EVOLUTION. Where exactly does this say 'not necessarily' 24 hours?

 

[rakovsky]

That would be the word universe. V3 would be God giving power to that universe and all the stars in the universe that created light.
v16-19 comes after the creation of the canopy of water in v7. What God did in v16-19 was to allow those bodies of light to shine through the canopy of water.
I think the greater light to Rule the Day means exactly what it says. Why do I need to explain this?

The verse says God made on day 4: "the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night."
What is (A) the greater light ruling the day and what is (B) the one ruling the night.

Your answer in both cases is "the universe"?

Feel free to check the answer in the Bible commentaries:
http://biblehub.com/commentaries/genesis/1-16.htm

 

[rakovsky]

Is English your primary language? Because if it is you should understand the above. If it isn't let me know and I'll try to dummie it down for you. Read #5 carefully, It says INSTEAD OF USING EVOLUTION. Where exactly does this say 'not necessarily' 24 hours?

Post 139: "Based on the poll half of people who think Adam came directly from clay say it [the length of each day in Gen. 1] was not necessarily 24 hours."
​

I admit I am now off by a bit - it's not "half" , but 61.5%. Earlier in the poll results, it was half though (5 out of ten people who chose #5 chose #2).

POLL RESULTS:

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS
   
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3% OF AL RESPONDANTS

Maybe email a close friend and ask them to explain it to you?​

 

[StanJ]

The verse says God made on day 4: "the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night."
What is (A) the greater light ruling the day and what is (B) the one ruling the night.
Your answer in both cases is "the universe"?

My answer is in Post #147. Please read it carefully.

 

[rakovsky]

My answer is in Post #147. Please read it carefully.

OK. I am carefully reading your answer:
QUESTION: "What do you think "the greater light to rule the day" means?"
STANJ IN POST #147: "That would be the word universe."

QUESTION: What is (A) the greater light ruling the day and what is (B) the one ruling the night. Your answer in both cases is "the universe"?
STANJ: My answer is in Post #147.


Alrighty then. When Genesis says "God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night."

You read it as: "God made two great lights: the universe to rule the day, and the universe to rule the night."

 

[StanJ]

Post 139: "Based on the poll half of people who think Adam came directly from clay say it [the length of each day in Gen. 1] was not necessarily 24 hours."​

I admit I am now off by a bit - it's not "half" , but 61.5%. Earlier in the poll results, it was half though (5 out of ten people who chose #5 chose #2).

POLL RESULTS:

1. 2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
   16 vote(s)
   29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS
   
2. 5. God made man directly out of the earth instead of using Evolution through lower mammalian classes
   26 vote(s)
   47.3% OF AL RESPONDANTS

Maybe email a close friend and ask them to explain it to you?​

It is obviously not me that's having comprehension problems, even though you apparently authored the poll. Questions 2 and 5 are consistent with YEC. How are you not seeing this?

 

[rakovsky]

Questions 2 and 5 are consistent with YEC. How are you not seeing this?

POLL RESULTS:
2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
16 vote(s)
29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS


I think you are just playing games with me at this point. This kind of thing has happened before.

 

[StanJ]

OK. I am carefully reading your answer:
QUESTION: What is (A) the greater light ruling the day and what is (B) the one ruling the night. Your answer in both cases is "the universe"?
STANJ: My answer is in Post #147.
Alrighty then. When Genesis says "God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night."
You read it as: "God made two great lights: the universe to rule the day, and the universe to rule the night."

Nope, apparently not carefully enough.
My answer was; "What God did in v16-19 was to allow those bodies of light to shine through the canopy of water".
Again I don't have a problem with english comprehension, but you apparently do? It would sure explain a lot about your confusion in this matter.

 

[OzSpen]

Day in ancient times is 24 hours just like they are today, that hasn't changed. While I recognize there might be a considerable length of time between original creation and creation week day means day in Genesis 1. I really never understood the audacity of modernism to redefine things just because they don't like the obvious meaning. Frankly, I think it's dishonest.

Have a nice day
Mark

Please don't place the blame at the feet of modernists (I'm not a modernist or postmodernist supporter). Take St Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430) as an example:

Augustine in connection with the days of Genesis 1 stated: 'What kind of days these were it is extremely difficult, or perhaps impossible for us to conceive' (The City of God, Book 11, chap.6).

Oz

 

[StanJ]

POLL RESULTS:
2. The earth's age is under 10,000 years old, or the 7 days of creation were in c.24 hour periods.
16 vote(s)
29.1% OF ALL RESPONDANTS
I think you are just playing games with me at this point. This kind of thing has happened before.

Yes the earth's age is under 10,000 years old and the days were 7 x 24 hour days. The only person playing games right now is you.

 

[rakovsky]

Nope, apparently not carefully enough.
My answer was; "What God did in v16-19 was to allow those bodies of light to shine through the canopy of water".
Again I don't have a problem with english comprehension, but you apparently do? It would sure explain a lot about your confusion in this matter.

It says in those verses that on day 4 "God made two lights", not "God allowed the two lights to shine through".
This is what someone says when they are doing a great job playing games with me.
If you are for real, go read the commentaries I linked to saying what those terms mean.

 

[rakovsky]

Please don't place the blame at the feet of modernists (I'm not a modernist or postmodernist supporter). Take St Augustine of Hippo (AD 354-430) as an example:

Augustine in connection with the days of Genesis 1 stated: 'What kind of days these were it is extremely difficult, or perhaps impossible for us to conceive' (The City of God, Book 11, chap.6).

Oz

Wow, great job, Oz. You accepted that the Bible does not specify the length of days AND you proved your view using a foundational Christian theologian.