Ten Commandments still valid so says Bible and pro-Sunday Scholars

[EastCoastRemnant]

Saturday is considered to be the Sabbath. There are certain duties connected to the Sabbath. My church holds its primary worship services on Sunday because that's the day the Lord rose from the dead--the single most important event in history. The Scripture authorizes this in several places (as I'm sure you've heard before).

The gathering on Sunday, or any day of the week for that matter, is acceptable and desirable as long we are not violating what He has asked us first. Our group tries to fellowship every day but in reality we get together 5-6 nights a week... but we never, never miss Sabbath time together as we seem to receive a greater blessing than on the other days. I think it's something that God does to show us His pleasure for our obedience. Sabbath time, rightly enjoyed, is incomparable.

Try to separate the Sabbath Commandment from the Mosaic requirements of the ordinances. The Sabbath is the day that God wants to spend special, one on one time that He has not Sanctified another day for. Therefore, if you just rest in His presence for that 24 hour period doing anything with an eye to Him on that day, then you have kept the Sabbath perfectly... crazy, right. Albion, I know you love our Lord with all your heart and that He is pleased with your devotion to Him but we must not be found with any stains on our garments when we come before judgement. We are not held accountable to light we never received... only to that which we did.

I know my personality is aggressive (I identify with John and James) but my heart is rooted in God's Love. Bless you for putting up with this tenacious SOB.

 

[BobRyan]

there is a Holy Law of faith, in other words, there are Holy Commandments of faith, and, as it is known, there are special rules everywhere, for example the police officers have to comply with special rules that apply only to the police officers, the doctors have to comply with special rules of the medicine that apply only to them, the employees/workers of one company have to comply with the requirements of their boss/chief, the inhabitants of this world have to comply with the universal moral principles for coexistence with their cohabitants, and in a similar way the believers/worshipers/spiritual servants also have to comply with Holy rules of faith that apply only to them, because they should not cause evil/harm/affliction to any person, neither spiritually nor physically, yes, unfortunately, there has been a spiritual iniquity and exactly it has turned out to be the cause of all other iniquities and evils, that is why there are special commandments of faith, but in order for a man to (be able to) understand them, he has to penetrate the essence of the things of God, otherwise it is very possible that he speculate...

Blessings

Then you may also agree with this -

Rom 8
He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

 

[BobRyan]

Saturday is considered to be the Sabbath. There are certain duties connected to the Sabbath. My church holds its primary worship services on Sunday because that's the day the Lord rose from the dead--the single most important event in history. The Scripture authorizes this in several places (as I'm sure you've heard before).

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.

 

[bugkiller]

The gathering on Sunday, or any day of the week for that matter, is acceptable and desirable as long we are not violating what He has asked us first. Our group tries to fellowship every day but in reality we get together 5-6 nights a week... but we never, never miss Sabbath time together as we seem to receive a greater blessing than on the other days. I think it's something that God does to show us His pleasure for our obedience. Sabbath time, rightly enjoyed, is incomparable.

Try to separate the Sabbath Commandment from the Mosaic requirements of the ordinances. The Sabbath is the day that God wants to spend special, one on one time that He has not Sanctified another day for. Therefore, if you just rest in His presence for that 24 hour period doing anything with an eye to Him on that day, then you have kept the Sabbath perfectly... crazy, right. Albion, I know you love our Lord with all your heart and that He is pleased with your devotion to Him but we must not be found with any stains on our garments when we come before judgement. We are not held accountable to light we never received... only to that which we did.

I know my personality is aggressive (I identify with John and James) but my heart is rooted in God's Love. Bless you for putting up with this tenacious SOB.

Why won't you even read and agree with the contents of the Book of the Law?

You also have Christians placed at the wrong judgment. The judgment you talk about I've already passed as JN 5:24 says.

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.

So what. They're wrong.

bugkiller

 

[toLiJC]

Then you may also agree with this -

Rom 8
He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.

yes, it is so, but will it be enough if we only hope the believers/worshipers have the Spirit of the true One?!, even i personally met many believers/worshipers who had exercised/practiced the faith wrong(ly) since the beginning of their spiritual lives, i mean they believed in a lot of heresies being so convinced they are supposedly on the right track, for example, in "karma", but karma is rather a metaphysical law of purely mechanical (supposed) world of actions and reactions than a law of responsible God, in other words, karma implies that each soul of the universe is doomed to suffer eternally without there being any sensible/rational reason for that but only because they are souls, so i can hope that every believer/worshiper (will) have the true Holy Spirit, but i cannot promise and guarantee that this will be with each of them only by hoping, yet may it be

Blessings

 

[BobRyan]

for example, in "karma", but karma is rather a metaphysical law of purely mechanical (supposed) world of actions and reactions than a law of responsible God, in other words, karma implies that each soul of the universe is doomed to suffer eternally without there being any sensible/rational reason for that but only because they are souls, so i can hope that every believer/worshiper (will) have the true Holy Spirit, but i cannot promise and guarantee that this will be with each of them only by hoping, yet may it be

Indeed there is much false doctrine in the world - and what does Christ say is one source of false doctrine in Mark 7?

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

 

[BobRyan]

Saturday is considered to be the Sabbath. There are certain duties connected to the Sabbath. My church holds its primary worship services on Sunday because that's the day the Lord rose from the dead--the single most important event in history. The Scripture authorizes this in several places (as I'm sure you've heard before).

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.

So what. They're wrong.
bugkiller

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Your response indicates that you not only differ with them on those first 6 points - but also on their seventh point.

 

[toLiJC]

Indeed there is much false doctrine in the world - and what does Christ say is one source of false doctrine in Mark 7?

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

exactly the same was said in my previous posts above, but nevertheless i can say here i am not quite sure about the so-called conception "sola scriptura", because it kind of appeared to be a human conception too

Blessings

 

[BobRyan]

exactly the same was said in my previous posts above, but nevertheless i can say here i am not quite sure about the so-called conception "sola scriptura", because it kind of appeared to be a human conception too

Blessings

sola-scriptura is the method Christ uses in Mark 7:6-13.

And it is what we see in Acts 17:11.

]Indeed there is much false doctrine in the world - and what does Christ say is one source of false doctrine in Mark 7?

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

 

[bugkiller]

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.



Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Your response indicates that you not only differ with them on those first 6 points - but also on their seventh point.

In what way do you claim they're correct?

bugkiller

 

[toLiJC]

sola-scriptura is the method Christ uses in Mark 7:6-13.

And it is what we see in Acts 17:11.

the systematic reading of scripture is not the recommended way for the human to have the true Lord God at a higher level, but the right exercise of faith, for it is written:

Romans 1:16-17 "I am not ashamed of the gospel(i.e. of the Word/Revelation that comes directly out) of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.",

Romans 2:28-29 "he is not a Jew(i.e. a true religious/righteous man), which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision(i.e. baptism/faith), which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.",

2 Corinthians 3:1-6 "Do we begin again to commend ourselves? or need we, as some others, epistles(i.e. scriptures) of commendation to you, or letters of commendation from you? Ye are our epistle(i.e. you are our scripture) written in our hearts, known and read of all men: Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart. And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward: Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God; Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.",

James 2:15-23 "If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit? Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God."

Abraham Who had never had a scripture written with ink or on stone for all his life(time) in this world, and did Jesus ever teach any of His disciples to read the Bible systematically while He was here two millennia ago?!, but it is even written:

Romans 3:20-31 "by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe(i.e. that are faithful):... Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Is he the God of the Jews(i.e. of believers) only? is he not also of the Gentiles(i.e. of the disbelievers)? Yes, of the Gentiles also: Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith(i.e. the righteous believer because of their right faith), and uncircumcision through faith(i.e. and the disbeliever by believing in them instead of them, in other words, by taking care of them). Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law."

Blessings

 

[BobRyan]

exactly the same was said in my previous posts above, but nevertheless i can say here i am not quite sure about the so-called conception "sola scriptura", because it kind of appeared to be a human conception too

Blessings

sola-scriptura is the method Christ uses in Mark 7:6-13.

And it is what we see in Acts 17:11.

]Indeed there is much false doctrine in the world - and what does Christ say is one source of false doctrine in Mark 7?

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

the systematic reading of scripture is not the recommended way for the human to have the true Lord God at a higher level, but the right exercise of faith,

You insert an -either-or argument where the Bible uses "Both-and".

Acts 17:11 "They studied the SCRIPTURES daily to SEE if those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul - were So"

it is how we even get to the Protestant Reformation as it sought to correct the many errors introduced into Christianity during the dark ages.

Romans 1:16-17 "I am not ashamed of the gospel(i.e. of the Word/Revelation that comes directly out) of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.",

"The GOSPEL was preached to Abraham" Gal 3:7.
"The GOSPEL was preached to US just as it was to THEM Also" Heb 4:1.
"SCRIPTURES

2 Tim 3
15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

Romans 2:28-29 "he is not a Jew(i.e. a true religious/righteous man), which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision(i.e. baptism/faith), which is outward in the flesh: But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.",

Rom 2
25 For indeed circumcision is of value if you practice the Law; but if you are a transgressor of the Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. 26 So if the uncircumcised man keeps the requirements of the Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? 27 And he who is physically uncircumcised, if he keeps the Law, will he not judge you who though having the letter of the Law and circumcision are a transgressor of the Law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.

 

[BobRyan]

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.



Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Your response indicates that you not only differ with them on those first 6 points - but also on their seventh point

In what way do you claim they're correct?

bugkiller

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

 

[BobRyan]

Bible texts both NT and OT about God's Commandments - Showing that the TEN Commandments are assigned the title "in scripture" as being "Commandments of God" -- and as also being "The Word of God"

10 Commandments are
Commandments of God Neh 10:29
Law of God ; Neh 10:29
Word of God Mark 7:13
Commandment of GodMark 7:6-13
NT ScriptureJames 2:8
NT Law James 2:9-11
NT Commandments Eph 6:2, Rom 13:9, Romans 7:7-10

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

The elders consisting of scribes and pharise es are in fact the "magisterium" even Paul admits to this. And Jesus shows how they claim to "sit in the chair of Moses" as church magisterium .


Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying, The scribes and the Pharisees have taken their seat on the chair of Moses. Therefore, do and observe all things whatsoever they tell you, but do not follow their example. For they preach but they do not practice. (Matthew 23:1-3)

there is a Holy Law of faith, in other words, there are Holy Commandments of faith, and, as it is known, there are special rules everywhere, for example the police officers

Eph 6:2 the 5th commandment is the "FIRST Commandment with a promise".

First commandment in "what unit of LAW" ??

in Christ,

Bob

 

[bugkiller]

Moody, and "The Westminster Confession of Faith" and "The Baptist Confession of Faith" also refer to Sunday as "The Sabbath" - the 4th Commandment Sabbath - because they claim it was "changed to point to week-day-1" after the cross.

so they continue to affirm "Sabbath keeping" because they think they can change it.



Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Your response indicates that you not only differ with them on those first 6 points - but also on their seventh point



Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.


1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

Please cut the c & p spam stuff and answer my question.

bugkiller

 

[toLiJC]

sola-scriptura is the method Christ uses in Mark 7:6-13.

And it is what we see in Acts 17:11.

]Indeed there is much false doctrine in the world - and what does Christ say is one source of false doctrine in Mark 7?

Mark 7

7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the Commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the Word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

That is a case of Christ demonstrating the way that the magisterium is hammered "sola scriptura" in the cases where it's traditions and "doctrines of men" are at odds with scripture.

this does not prove the invalidity of the primary source which is the Word coming directly out of the mouth of the true Lord God, because God first spoke His Word to His Prophets and Holy people and only then some scriptures were written by them

You insert an -either-or argument where the Bible uses "Both-and".

Acts 17:11 "They studied the SCRIPTURES daily to SEE if those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul - were So"

it is how we even get to the Protestant Reformation as it sought to correct the many errors introduced into Christianity during the dark ages.

Romans 1:16-17 "I am not ashamed of the gospel(i.e. of the Word/Revelation that comes directly out) of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.",

"The GOSPEL was preached to Abraham" Gal 3:7.
"The GOSPEL was preached to US just as it was to THEM Also" Heb 4:1.
"SCRIPTURES

2 Tim 3
15 and that from childhood you have known the sacred writings which are able to give you the wisdom that leads to salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; 17 so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.

yes, there can also be some good scribes in Christ as some of the bereans were two millennia ago, but take notice of the fact that they first heard the Gospel from St. Paul (and Silas) and only then they had a benchmark(basis for comparison), also, it is certain those scribes had a special gift from the Holy Spirit, because most people that read the scripture could not fully understand it, which indicates that not all of them had such a gift, so Abraham had no scripture, but heard the Gospel from the true Saints(including, first of all, the true Lord God Himself), the situation was similar also with the disciples of Jesus, because if the Lord, Jesus, did not preach the Gospel to them, maybe they would hardly understand a lot of it, because the official(prevailing/predominant) clergy in that time was that of the scribes and pharisees of the then jews religion who preached another doctrine

Matthew 23:34 "I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes:"

so here is how the right exercise of faith is more important than the scripture reading

Rom 2
25 For indeed circumcision is of value if you practice the Law; but if you are a transgressor of the Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. 26 So if the uncircumcised man keeps the requirements of the Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? 27 And he who is physically uncircumcised, if he keeps the Law, will he not judge you who though having the letter of the Law and circumcision are a transgressor of the Law? 28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.

yes, the baptism avails the worshiper(s) only if they exercise faith right(ly) i.e. according to the Holy Commandments of faith

Blessings

 

[BobRyan]

Please cut the c & p spam stuff and answer my question.

bugkiller

You asked for the 7 point list of argeement vs the one point - the 7th point where I do differ "Again" as if asking for it - over and over again -helps your argument.

If you now want to explain why you chose that short-path - please do so. I can't be blamed for what you do.

 

[bugkiller]

You asked for the 7 point list of argeement vs the one point - the 7th point where I do differ "Again" as if asking for it - over and over again -helps your argument.

If you now want to explain why you chose that short-path - please do so. I can't be blamed for what you do.

No I didn't. What short path are you talking about?

bugkiller

 

[BobRyan]

this does not prove the invalidity of the primary source which is the Word coming directly out of the mouth of the true Lord God

My post was not about my promoting the logical fallacy of "either-or" -- rather I point to "both and".

Affirming Scripture as the NT authors also did - is not an argument against inspiration from God - it is an argument for it.

Not sure why you are taking this upholding of divine inspiration - as an argument against it.

, because God first spoke His Word to His Prophets and Holy people and only then some scriptures were written by them

IN Acts 17:11 it is the "spoken word" of Paul that is being judged by scripture.
IN Mark 7:6-13 it is the spoken word, the oral traditions that are being hammered "sola scriptura" by Christ.

But that is not an argument against divine inspiration - for as 2Tim 3:15-17 scripture itself is the product of divine inspiration.

yes, there can also be some good scribes in Christ as some of the bereans were two millennia ago, but take notice of the fact that they first heard the Gospel from St. Paul and only then they had a benchmark(basis for comparison)

Acts 17:11 does not say "they listened to Paul and then believed that scripture said and meant whatever he might say" rather they "Studied the scripture daily to SEE IF those things WERE SO" - this is a TEST of Paul - not a test of their ability to read, or a test of scripture.

I am not arguing for the fallacy of "either or" (either have faith - or study the scriptures)... I am arguing for both-and.

in Christ,

Bob