Does Science Agree With the Bible?

[ScottA]

I missed nothing. The Bible is the words of men. Try to cover up that fact all you want, but the fact remains. You are free to put your faith in these men, but don't try to fool us into believing that it isn't the words of men.

Don't be dodging the issue, now. No one is claiming that men didn't pen it. But you haven't addressed your real gripe. It has been pointed out to you many times VERY CLEARLY that those words penned by men are not the whole of it. But [you] keep repeating your off-issue rant...like you expect some other answer. And it ain't going to happen.

If you want evidence, then qualify [yourself] to receive the like evidence for the like question you ask. The ball is in your court.

 

[ScottA]

Empirical evidence for what you claim affects the empirical world. If the universe is created, then that puts your claims squarely in the empirical world.

You are wrong. The universe was not created in the universe.

 

[Loudmouth]

Don't be dodging the issue, now.

Says the person dodging the issue.

It has been pointed out to you many times VERY CLEARLY that those words penned by men are not the whole of it.

But you do present it as the whole of it. You said that the "words of God" say X, so we have to believe X. Period.

If you want evidence, then qualify [yourself] to receive the like evidence for the like question you ask. The ball is in your court.

You are making claims about the empirical world, so present the empirical evidence for which I am qualified.

 

[Loudmouth]

You are wrong. The universe was not created in the universe.

God has had no affect on anything that has happened in the Universe, from the Big Bang onward?

 

[ScottA]

Why? Because "you" say so? I'm not lifting anything up in the first place. I simply don't have any "fear" of science as some folks seem to have.

Fine. I am happy to let the fruit of everything that has been discussed here, bear the truth.

 

[ScottA]

God has had no affect on anything that has happened in the Universe, from the Big Bang onward?

What?

 

[Loudmouth]

What?

Pretty straightforward question.

Has God had no discernible effect on the universe around us since the Big Bang?

 

[Edmond Smith]

Why should we take Moses' word as infallible truth?



It is the words of men.



Moses did not witness anything described in the Genesis creation or flood myths.



Not that hard when you read what others have written and make sure your stories fit theirs. It is also not hard to go back through and remove any contradictions.



And yet can't produce any evidence that what you claim is true.

We've had this conversation haven't we, loudmouth, you'll argue that everything can be the truth. Which logically it can't be.

The Bible in of itself is the truth. Because God inspired it. Here, let's check out the logic here.

1. The Bible is inspired by God.
2. God is the truth.
3. Therefore the Bible is the truth.



Your right, Moses didn't witness it. But He was told about it, by those who did, through the main line of communication back in those days. Stories, so important to keep them true and accurate, that God allowed them to remember them exact.
Plus, God told Him what to write...He was there.
Also, just because he didn't witness it, doesn't mean it's not true.

The prove that Moses wrote God's word, is in the historical evidence of the witnesses that were alive during the times Moses writes about.
You see, there weren't that many Jews back in that time. Not like today. Plus most if not all of them ran in small family units...great grandma and pa, grandma and grand pa, mom and dad, sisters, brothers cousins and more cousins....Also back then, they didn't keep a lot of written records...if any. Most was kept and told by word of Mouth.
And because it was so important to keep these stories straight they would only assign a few of the members of the family to keep record and memorize those stories. Stories that God helped them to remember. Stories of family members and the whole Israel nation.
When time came, these people would pass those stories down to a younger man or woman...most likely men, women weren't considered very highly back then. And these men would get the new stories, plus the old ones and memorize them, exactly as they had been told since the first time it happened.
Remember they didn't have tv, radio and such. Entertainment was usually a great meal with the family some music, dancing and the storyteller.
Well, God told Moses, write this down and He did.

And your right, the bible is written by men. Just as you write your name down on a piece of paper with a pen.
Is it you writing the name or the pen? of course it's you. The pen is just the instrument you use to place the words onto the paper.

Well, God inspired the Word, he used men to be the instrument to place His words onto paper. Just as if he had written them himself.

No contradictions in God's word...Because God is perfect

 

[Loudmouth]

We've had this conversation haven't we, loudmouth, you'll argue that everything can be the truth. Which logically it can't be.

The Bible in of itself is the truth. Because God inspired it. Here, let's check out the logic here.

1. The Bible is inspired by God.

I challenge that premise. That is the claims of men.

Your right, Moses didn't witness it. But He was told about it, by those who did, through the main line of communication back in those days.

According to whom? More men?

Stories, so important to keep them true and accurate, that God allowed them to remember them exact.

Yet another claim made by men.

Plus, God told Him what to write...He was there.

According to whom? Moses?

Also, just because he didn't witness it, doesn't mean it's not true.

What evidence is there that it is true?

The prove that Moses wrote God's word, is in the historical evidence of the witnesses that were alive during the times Moses writes about.

Those are stories, not evidence. The evidence is in the world around us. It tells us how things came about.

Well, God told Moses, write this down and He did.

According to whom? Yet more men?

And your right, the bible is written by men. Just as you write your name down on a piece of paper with a pen.
Is it you writing the name or the pen? of course it's you. The pen is just the instrument you use to place the words onto the paper.

The difference is that I can provide evidence that I exist independent of any words written on a page.

Well, God inspired the Word, he used men to be the instrument to place His words onto paper. Just as if he had written them himself.

A claim made by men.

No contradictions in God's word...Because God is perfect

Unless we find contradictions, and then they no longer count, right?

 

[ScottA]

Pretty straightforward question.

Has God had no discernible effect on the universe around us since the Big Bang?

Ah..."discernible"...you left out discernible. That is the "enigma" part you also left out.

Yes, and No. Yes, God has given ultimate discernible effect, natural and supernatural. But, No, except for what should be obvious in the natural world, everything else (including what is written) must be discerned spiritually.

 

[Loudmouth]

Ah..."discernible"...you left out discernible. That is the "enigma" part you also left out.

Yes, and No. Yes, God has given ultimate discernible effect, natural and supernatural. But, No, except for what should be obvious in the natural world, everything else (including what is written) must be discerned spiritually.

You claim it is obvious, yet can't produce one piece of this obvious evidence.

 

[Astrophile]

is it only flat objects that has corners?

The only three-dimensional figure that has four corners is a tetrahedron.

 

[ScottA]

You claim it is obvious, yet can't produce one piece of this obvious evidence.

The evidence is your whole world...which has been explained, and you cannot prove otherwise. But since you do not receive that physical evidence, the only evidence remaining is spiritual, and it is available, but you have also refused the terms of receiving it. The choice is yours. It is free for the asking, but you have not agreed to the terms. So, if you choose to pass on it, then drop it. Why do you persist at doing nothing to help yourself in this matter?

 

[Kylie]

"In the twinkling of an eye."

So then why is there still evil? Why hasn't he carried out his plan yet?

 

[AV1611VET]

So then why is there still evil? Why hasn't he carried out his plan yet?

Maybe He's waiting for you to get saved first?

 

[ScottA]

So then why is there still evil? Why hasn't he carried out his plan yet?

Some are just getting to their part in the story...and God is no spoiler.

But to understand, the truth is, we can look objectively at our experience here and believe it in the present tense terms it was told in, or, sorry, often only eluded to...and see it as a finished work. Or we can pick it up and go chapter by chapter and scene by scene and get into the details of our lives. But if we never pick up on the facts that have been told to us, and simply go on about our lives as they play out in the story...then, such is life.

 

[dad]

Android and Microsoft's Windows. Each of these operating systems is going to have to do similar things. They're all going to need to be able to deal with phone calls, text messages, blue tooth, wifi, etc. So there are going to be some similarities, just as there are similarities between sharks and dolphins.

But when we actually take a close look at HOW the different operating systems work, we understand that even though they may look outwardly similar, the actual way they work is different. That's why I can't take the bit of programming that runs Facebook on an iPhone and get it to work on my Android phone. The operating systems have developed their own unique ways of handling the tasks they need to perform, and what works on one system won't necessarily work on another. It's like how a shark's network of blood vessels won't work in a dolphin. The shark needs a blood supply to its gills, and a dolphin doesn't have any. Put the shark blood vessels in a dolphin and they'd be supplying blood to gills that aren't there, while the lungs that ARE there have no blood supply at all.

Now, the operating systems change over time, and they put out updates. But if the Android programming that handled how the wifi connection works suddenly started looking like the Microsoft version, I'd figure that the new code didn't develop from the previous Android code, but was stolen. This would be like a dolphin suddenly growing gills instead of lungs. It doesn't happen in nature, and if it happened in the operating systems, Microsoft would take Google to court over theft of intellectual property. And how would Microsoft know? Because the characteristics were there. The new Google code wasn't based on earlier versions of the same app. However, if Googles new code DOES have the same characteristics of their earlier code, then Microsoft knows that Google hasn't been using stolen data.

Likewise, we can look at the ways animals bodies work and see what evolutionary lines they have come from. Dolphins have bones in their flipers which are a very close match to the bones that humans have in their arms. Evolutionarily speaking, the reason for this is simple. There was a species of animal that lived before humans and dolphins, and it evolved this bone structure. Then it speciated, and evolved, some following the evolutionary line that would lead to modern dolphins, and others leading to modern Humans. Since both humans and dolphins evolved from this common ancestor, we would expect that many of the traits that it had remained. Changed, due to the need to adapt to different pressures, but the basic architecture is there for all to see.

And that is why we know where the different kinds of animals came from. (There are many other ways as well, so we can check. All the different ways to know where the animals came from all agree.)



So why do dolphins have traits that are very BAD for living in water - like the inability to breathe water?



I submit as evidence all of reality. In addition, I submit that we know for a fact that present state rules work, since we can observe them working. I also submit that the ratios of radioactive materials and decay products we see would be different. Since the only way to explain the ratio we see is by having same state past, then I declare that there was no DSP.



Yes I have. And the opposition you are no doubt going to post to my argument does not change the fact that the ratios of radioactive material and decay product we see would be different.

Ok, so dolphin arms have no relation to man's arms, except in the twisted imagination of fanatics of the evolution instead of creation religion. None. You might as well say a starfish has arms so we came from them. Since you do not know what tge future or formers staes are like, you cannot saybwhat to expect in isotopes.

 

[dad]

Why should we take Moses at his word?

Or you? Jesus confirmed Mo was cool.

 

[dad]

I am thinking that it is far more reasonable to think that "ancient giants" are nothing more than literary hyperbole to make a spiritual point.

Goliath was a giant, was he hyperbole too? Besides dinos could have been the giants referred to.

 

[Kylie]

Matthew 7:21
Mark 10:15
1 Corinthians 6:9
Galatians 5:21
Luke 11:52
Hebrews 3:19
Hebrews 4:3

So these are the evils which God plans to eliminate.

Matthew 7:21 describes the evil of not doing the will of God. But if that is so bad, why do we have free will?

Mark 10:15 is the evil of not indoctrinating little kids. Am I the only one who finds it hard to see indoctrination as a good thing?

1 Corinthians 6:9 is the evil of unrighteousness (a poorly defined evil if ever there was one). It also mentions the evils of fornication, idolatry, adultery, homosexuality and sodomy. Because people shouldn't have the right to have relationships how they want or worship how they want.

Galatians 5:21 mentions the evils of envy, murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like. Because God supports the idea of thoughtcrimes. Murders, I agree with. Being drunk by itself isn't evil. And how many Christians get drunk anyway? Lots. And revelries? God has a problem with celebrations?

Luke 11:52 describes how evil it is to keep knowledge from people. Didn't God try to do that in the Garden of Eden?

Hebrews 3:19 says it is evil to be an unbeliever. Yeah, the religion I don't believe in says I am evil for not believing in it. Since I don't believe it in the first place, it fails to be any convincing argument.

Hewbrews 4:3 says nothing about any evil I can figure out.

However, the evils of child abuse, domestic violence, slavery, exploitation of workers, war...

I guess God has no problem with those...