Is it wrong to ignore a beggar?

[Laureate]

Most people who are homeless tend to find means to wash up every once in a while. The whole dirty sock, haven't shaved in a month thing is 'old homeless'. The 'new homeless' has slightly more opportunities. It doesn't mean they don't need charity, nonetheless.

Also, did you know that's a Wiccan pentagram under that cross on your signature? Just giving you the heads up

From one Laurel unto another, I can see evidence of you living up to your name, yet I will remind you, the Wiccan did not create anything, they can only exploit, mishandle, or miss represent what is;

Just the same like your flow!

 

[DaisyDay]

Mr Abbott used his speech to condemn the scourge of people fleeing war torn countries, insisting: “We must be careful of misguided altruism, as any altruism will misguide us from the path of ignoring the suffering of others for our own personal gain".

http://theunaustralian.net/2015/10/...d-turning-back-boats-off-englands-coast-line/

 

[Laureate]

I think we have a moral obligation to ignore "beggars."

Scripture says those who will not work should go hungry. I don't have a problem with that. Second, you really know nothing about the beggar, whether he's just found an easy way to make tax-free money or if he's really in need. Third, by giving them money, you encourage people to engage in that shameless lifestyle, and that degrades the quality of all our lives, unless you enjoy seeing people beg for money.

We live in a welfare nation, where all poor people qualify for debit cards to buy food. We live in a nation where all poor people get free medical care. We live in a nation were all disabled people qualify for monthly government checks. We live in a nation where "poor" women with children get more free money than most hardworking Americans are able to earn.

So, why are you giving that bum money?

If you really want to help those in need, look for charities that serve the homeless. If you really want to help, visit the lonely. If you really want to help, be ready to do the little things when someone is in momentary need, like when someone's car needs a jump start. If you really want to help, ask your church what you can do.

I really, really like your finish!

And I agree, who wants to promote inappropriate codependants?

However giving to a charity that you personally do not have first hand knowledge that there is no misappropriations, (for there are many) then one is being lazy, and gambling that someone is representing their tithes appropriately;

For what is worse, to give to the poor crook, (who is already wailing, and gnashing his teeth), or the rich crook who steals from the poor, and those who give gullibly, and without regard to the wolves Y'shua fore warned us of;

 

[Deidre32]

I think it is wrong to ignore them. They are people and deserve acknowledgment. Even if you can't/don't give them any money, you can say, 'no, sorry', or give them a referral to a shelter. If you don't want to give cash, but believe they really do need help, how about taking them to lunch/dinner? I've actually done this, and it's been appreciated. Can you imagine how dehumanizing it must feel to stand and be ignored most of the day? I would get so depressed.

This.

 

[Deidre32]

I think we have a moral obligation to ignore "beggars."

Scripture says those who will not work should go hungry. I don't have a problem with that. Second, you really know nothing about the beggar, whether he's just found an easy way to make tax-free money or if he's really in need. Third, by giving them money, you encourage people to engage in that shameless lifestyle, and that degrades the quality of all our lives, unless you enjoy seeing people beg for money.

We live in a welfare nation, where all poor people qualify for debit cards to buy food. We live in a nation where all poor people get free medical care. We live in a nation were all disabled people qualify for monthly government checks. We live in a nation where "poor" women with children get more free money than most hardworking Americans are able to earn.

So, why are you giving that bum money?

If you really want to help those in need, look for charities that serve the homeless. If you really want to help, visit the lonely. If you really want to help, be ready to do the little things when someone is in momentary need, like when someone's car needs a jump start. If you really want to help, ask your church what you can do.

While what you say has merit, Jesus told us to help those who need help, and He didn't say...''only if they meet your standards as to who needs help...''

 

[Laureate]

I think that there is s big difference between one or two rogues in suits begging and the majority of homeless.

If you don't want to give: don't. Rationalising your choice on a website seems pointless.

Oh my is this a website, I wish someone would have told me sooner, I thought this was a place for fellowship, silly me!

 

[Laureate]

I think it is wrong to ignore them. They are people and deserve acknowledgment. Even if you can't/don't give them any money, you can say, 'no, sorry', or give them a referral to a shelter. If you don't want to give cash, but believe they really do need help, how about taking them to lunch/dinner? I've actually done this, and it's been appreciated. Can you imagine how dehumanizing it must feel to stand and be ignored most of the day? I would get so depressed.

Currently here in Hawaii we are shamelessly dealing with our homeless, instead of seeing a problem, and trying to fix it, they see the homeless as being the problem, this kind of ignorance I can not reason with!

 

[LoyalToGod]

Depends on the beggar, in my humble opinion. When I usually see beggars (or panhandlers), and I have a minimum of $10 USD, I usually tend to offer them something to eat and/or drink, and surprisingly (in my experience) nearly everyone accepts the food and drink here in NYC. Just my two cents.

 

[His Disciple]

While what you say has merit, Jesus told us to help those who need help, and He didn't say...''only if they meet your standards as to who needs help...''

I go by God's standard, "If a man will not work, he shall not eat."

Or, "No widow may be put on the list of widows [to be helped] unless she is over sixty, has been faithful to her husband and is well known for her good deeds, such as bringing up children, showing hospitality, washing the feet of the Lord’s people, helping those in trouble and devoting herself to all kinds of good deeds." (BTW, 60 back then is like 80 today) That chapter also says that if that old godly widow has family, the family should help her, not the church. That was back before there was Social Security and other programs to take care of the needy (which, seems to me, fill the role of family).

Do you know of a time Jesus ever gave money to anyone poor? I don't. I remember a time when a son of Hell, Judas, told Jesus to give money to the poor and Jesus rebuked him. (Judas wanted to keep the money for himself, but he tried to cover his wickedness with a pretense of charity.)

Maybe its you who is making up your own standards? There's nothing Christian about being a doormat or about being an enabler of immorality, sloth and other causes of poverty. Most Christians giving to charity, out of their excess, cause more harm than good, what an abominable misuse of money and is wicked self-righteousness.

Yes, Christians should be kind and help he needy. But, you need to exercise some righteous discernment about who really is deserving of your aid. And, that's not the panhandler at the street corner, unless you want to volunteer to take him to homeless shelter or to a government office to get a food debit card, which I don't recommend for your safety (but, he'd decline your offer, anyway). Its also not the big charity that will spend 90% of your donation on itself and the remaining 10% on people who don't really need it.

Our society is rich. Your time is needed more than your money. Are you going to volunteer your time?

 

[Deidre32]

I go by God's standard, "If a man will not work, he shall not eat."

Or, "No widow may be put on the list of widows [to be helped] unless she is over sixty, has been faithful to her husband and is well known for her good deeds, such as bringing up children, showing hospitality, washing the feet of the Lord’s people, helping those in trouble and devoting herself to all kinds of good deeds." (BTW, 60 back then is like 80 today) That chapter also says that if that old godly widow has family, the family should help her, not the church. That was back before there was Social Security and other programs to take care of the needy (which, seems to me, fill the role of family).

Do you know of a time Jesus ever gave money to anyone poor? I don't. I remember a time when a son of Hell, Judas, told Jesus to give money to the poor and Jesus rebuked him. (Judas wanted to keep the money for himself, but he tried to cover his wickedness with a pretense of charity.)

Maybe its you who is making up your own standards? There's nothing Christian about being a doormat or about being an enabler of immorality, sloth and other causes of poverty. Most Christians giving to charity, out of their excess, cause more harm than good, what an abominable misuse of money and is wicked self-righteousness.

Yes, Christians should be kind and help he needy. But, you need to exercise some righteous discernment about who really is deserving of your aid. And, that's not the panhandler at the street corner, unless you want to volunteer to take him to homeless shelter or to a government office to get a food debit card, which I don't recommend for your safety (but, he'd decline your offer, anyway). Its also not the big charity that will spend 90% of your donation on itself and the remaining 10% on people who don't really need it.

Our society is rich. Your time is needed more than your money. Are you going to volunteer your time?

I dunno...Jesus gave up His life for you and me. And we were undeserving.

 

[morningstar2651]

Also, did you know that's a Wiccan pentagram under that cross on your signature? Just giving you the heads up

The pentagram has also been used as a Christian symbol.

 

[sahjimira]

Let the Lord lead you. That's what I do. As said that " gut feeling " He will lead you. I'm on disability and have little to spare but as the Lord leads I will give some people money. When I lived in Boston constantly getting hit on. Worst were Gypsies posing as Native Americans.

 

[sahjimira]

Getting aid is not as easy as its made out to be. I was virtually without health insurance for almost a year. Because I supposedly make too much money I get $16.00 a month in food stamps and yes I do go to food banks God bless them. I'm not as bad off as some but when you get kicked down it's not that easy to get up. I tried all kinds of places to get help. A lot of time you call get a voicemail leave a message and never get an answer. Or maybe get on a list. Once in awhile someone will call back and you're not qualified for some reason or other. I could go on but I won't. Maybe I'm not poor enough to qualify and do not receive enough to afford things I need like food.. my old truck needs repair etc..all I'm saying is it's not that easy..least not for me or others I've known.

 

[DaisyDay]

Oh my is this a website, I wish someone would have told me sooner, I thought this was a place for fellowship, silly me!

This is a complex website. This particular forum is for debate, but there are others here which are for fellowship.

We all know what Christ said to the rich, young man who would follow Him. We also know how we First Worlders compare to Third Worlders.

 

[durangodawood]

....Do you know of a time Jesus ever gave money to anyone poor? I don't.....

Curious. How much money did Jesus have?
Probably some when he worked as a carpenter. But then he stopped working.

 

[rturner76]

I go by God's standard, "If a man will not work, he shall not eat."

Or, "No widow may be put on the list of widows [to be helped] unless she is over sixty, has been faithful to her husband and is well known for her good deeds, such as bringing up children, showing hospitality, washing the feet of the Lord’s people, helping those in trouble and devoting herself to all kinds of good deeds." (BTW, 60 back then is like 80 today) That chapter also says that if that old godly widow has family, the family should help her, not the church. That was back before there was Social Security and other programs to take care of the needy (which, seems to me, fill the role of family).

Do you know of a time Jesus ever gave money to anyone poor? I don't. I remember a time when a son of Hell, Judas, told Jesus to give money to the poor and Jesus rebuked him. (Judas wanted to keep the money for himself, but he tried to cover his wickedness with a pretense of charity.)

Maybe its you who is making up your own standards? There's nothing Christian about being a doormat or about being an enabler of immorality, sloth and other causes of poverty. Most Christians giving to charity, out of their excess, cause more harm than good, what an abominable misuse of money and is wicked self-righteousness.

Yes, Christians should be kind and help he needy. But, you need to exercise some righteous discernment about who really is deserving of your aid. And, that's not the panhandler at the street corner, unless you want to volunteer to take him to homeless shelter or to a government office to get a food debit card, which I don't recommend for your safety (but, he'd decline your offer, anyway). Its also not the big charity that will spend 90% of your donation on itself and the remaining 10% on people who don't really need it.

Our society is rich. Your time is needed more than your money. Are you going to volunteer your time?

I disagree with much of this. It's pretty simple, you get blessings for giving alms to the poor and needy. I doesn't matter what they buy with it as we have done our part by giving. I think somewhere in your experiences you have come to the conclusion that sloth and immorality are what drive poverty. I think its a much more complex issue than that. Greed is also a sinful monster and to give alms is to protect ourselves from it. Mental illness and addiction are not laziness. They are real medical conditions that first of all both tell you that you are not sick before they rob you of everything. I believe that begging for alms is what keeps a good many people from committing crime.

 

[His Disciple]

Curious. How much money did Jesus have?
Probably some when he worked as a carpenter. But then he stopped working.

The son of Hell pointed out that Jesus could have sold expensive perfume to raise money for the poor. And, Jesus rebuked him. Jesus had the means to raise money to give to the poor, but not only do we never see Jesus giving money to the poor, we actually see him rebuking someone who offered that idea.

Some people are poor because of disability, but Jesus healed them, removing that as a reason of poverty, leaving only immorality as a cause of poverty. Today, the government gives the disabled Social Security. And, all poor people, regardless of reason of their poverty, qualify for wide variety of government handouts. So, why should Christians misappropriate their money by giving money to panhandlers? There are real issues today that Christians can devote their resources (time and money) to, duplicating indiscriminate government programs isn't one of them.

 

[seashale76]

I think it's wrong to ignore them. Whether they're lying or not isn't your concern. Some of the best dressed people can be starving. We've seen it at our food pantry at church. Some of those folks have lost jobs, are struggling to pay bills, and don't have money left over to eat. Sure, some use it for drugs, alcohol, or cigarettes, but you can't tell by looking on that either.

 

[rturner76]

Here is what Jesus and Timothy had to say:

Matthew 19:21
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

Luke 12:33
Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will never fail, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys.

1Timothy 18-19
18Instruct them to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share,19storing up for themselves the treasure of a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is life indeed.


I think it is pretty clear we are supposed to give to the poor period. General Assistance in my county is $203. That is what you get while waiting 2 years or more for social security. That is nothing. Even if you get SSDI it may only be $750 or even less depending on how much you have worked and when you get it they take away your $265 in food stamps. Why sit in judgement when you can just do what the Bible says? Give to the poor

 

[His Disciple]

Matthew 19:21
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me."

Jesus told the rich man to divest himself of his property. Probably, the rich man was letting materialism interfere with his life. In any case, Jesus gives that instruction to just the one man. I'm not at all a defender of materialism, nor an opponent of helping the needy. The issue I raise is how it's done. What best to do with your time and money. Paying able-bodied people to panhandle on street corners is not a good use of your money. Contributing cash, in our welfare country, to anyone as part that person's lifestyle is a bad, even an immoral, use of our money.

We should be ready to help others with momentary needs. Our charity should be directed at long term concerns where the government is absent, or where the government is part of the problem. Our charity should not be giving cash as part of someone's lifestyle. Our charity should not be supporting charities, fund raising organizations, that spend most of the donations on themselves.

I often feel a great amount of pity and compassion for homeless people I see. But, giving a panhandler cash has no long-term benefit any more than taking a hit on a crack pipe has a long-term benefit. As I've said previously, do something like support a homeless shelter if you want to help the homeless. And, please do help the homeless, except don't give them cash nor otherwise encourage panhandling.