2 more school (college) shootings right now. Texas and Arizona.

[tadoflamb]

How? If a criminal wants a gun, all they got to do is steal one.

Say what? Who are they going to steal one from? Since all firearms were produced and purchased legally (in theory at least) how did they get in the hands of the people who shouldn't have them? They must have been stolen from legal and responsible gun owners. While it begs to question how responsible is a gun owner who allows his weapon to be stolen the other glaring contradiction is that gun ownership doesn't protect you, it makes you a target. Criminals want to steal your guns and responsible gun owners haven't been very good at stopping them.

 

[tadoflamb]

How free can a person feel if (s)he is surrounded by gun-toting strangers wherever (s)he goes? How free can a gun-carrying person feel if (s)he feels compelled to be armed because (s)he is surrounded with gun-toting strangers wherever (s)he goes?

How free a country do we have when so many Americans have been brainwashed into thinking that they need to carry guns to be safe?

So I have a response: If you feel that you have to be your own one-man police department and army, perhaps you should have been born in another century.

Personally, I'd like freedom from everyone else's guns. I don't need some scrawny kid with a massive sidearm strapped to his side to defend me in my store or in any situation.

 

[MikeK]

Exactly. I am a responsible gun owner. My guns are on my person or in my safe. My guns are not being stolen and used in crimes. Why so many paranoid gun owners resist common sense, life-saving legislation is beyond me.

 

[OGM]

Exactly. I am a responsible gun owner. My guns are on my person or in my safe. My guns are not being stolen and used in crimes. Why so many paranoid gun owners resist common sense, life-saving legislation is beyond me.

They believe that any legislation would be a "foot in the door" to confiscation. If you tried to adapt policies from any other country...they say "but we have the 2nd amendment."

They see the only way is to arm more people. So in a theater you might have a few hundred people armed. In a school the teachers would have guns. In a university the students would be armed too. In a church, the parishioners and staff would be armed...basically an armed society where people have their guns on them 24/7.

To them, that would improve safety and prevent the government from taking over.

 

[Cos-play]

[QUOTE="tadoflamb, post: 68708872, member: 179255"

.[/QUOTE]

Hey, do you know how I know the above pic isn't an NRA rally ?

!!!!!!! THE NRA DOESN'T ALLOW GUNS AT IT'S MEETINGS !!!!!!!!!

(or it's headquarter)
Irony, huh ?

 

[heatedmonk]

Maybe America's problem is too many gun-carrying "Christians" and not enough peace-loving Buddhists...

No wonder why online courses have become so popular!

You're not aware that "his holiness" the Dali Lama raised a revolt of Buddhist monks, armed Buddhist monks, against the Chinese government?

 

[OGM]

[QUOTE="tadoflamb, post: 68708872, member: 179255"

.

Hey, do you know how I know the above pic isn't an NRA rally ?

!!!!!!! THE NRA DOESN'T ALLOW GUNS AT IT'S MEETINGS !!!!!!!!!

(or it's headquarter)
Irony, huh ?[/QUOTE]
They don't allow guns at their meeting? Why is that?

 

[Cos-play]

Hey, do you know how I know the above pic isn't an NRA rally ?


They don't allow guns at their meeting? Why is that?

I don't know and they don't talk about it.

Ever.

But it speaks volumes. They want everyone armed everywhere so good guys can take down bad guys. But at an NRA meeting ?

Everyone's dead because the meeting was a "gun free" zone

 

[heatedmonk]

I don't know and they don't talk about it.

Ever.

But it speaks volumes. They want everyone armed everywhere so good guys can take down bad guys. But at an NRA meeting ?

Everyone's dead because the meeting was a "gun free" zone

Especially relevant at an NRA meeting. Where else would someone who wants to shoot down legal gun owners go if they were of a mind to take out pro-2nd amendment political activists? Thinking they're unarmed simply because it is a meeting.

Remember Chris Kyle, a Navy Seal sniper, was shot dead at a gun range by what I believe was a Muslim terrorist looking to collect the bounty that was still on Mr.Kyle's head. A murder at a gun range. How would it be impossible for someone to think they'd have easy pickings at a mere meeting of the NRA?

Terrorists shoot up schools! They wouldn't seek to take out meetings?

"Gun Free Zone" signs should be illegal. It's stupidity to alert terrorists that there are easy targets on the other side of that sign.
Put up warning signs outside of every school in America.

2013 In Arkansas: Sign Outside Christian School: “Staff Is Armed And Trained”
(subtext-my edit- Dear Terrorist, We'll pray for you after you're dead)

 

[tadoflamb]

Exactly. I am a responsible gun owner. My guns are on my person or in my safe. My guns are not being stolen and used in crimes. Why so many paranoid gun owners resist common sense, life-saving legislation is beyond me.

It is a little odd that some gun enthusiasts have a serious disconnect from their passion for guns and their responsibility to society.

 

[Erose]

Why only mental healthcare? Insufficient physical healthcare takes far more lives than insufficient mental healthcare does. Isn't our goal here to prevent loss of human life where we can?

You have evidence that Europe's healthcare system is significantly better than ours?

What we do know is that the perpetrators of mass murders are almost all have some form of mental illness. Yet for some reason, instead of targeting the root of the issue, people want to punish and/or violate the rights of law-abiding citizens.

It is common sense to fix the root of the problem. Guns aren't the root of the problem. Mental illness is.m so fix that.

 

[Erose]

Personally, I think it's the gun culture that's perpetuating the problem. Before each of these mass murderers became mass murderers, they were simply gun lovers practicing their 2nd Amendment rights. I don't think one needs to consider only mass shootings to realize gun culture is sick. I'll give you a number of personal and local examples.


Last Labor Day weekend while camping in a heavily populated area in the woods at dark, somebody starting discharging a large number of rounds.

In Phoenix, someone is taking pot shots at cars on the freeways.

As I previously reported, our public lands are being trashed by wildcat shooters.

Then there's the poachers.

South of here, in Sierra Vista, a local birder photographed a man assisting his young son in shooting juvenile owls.

Local gun lovers have set up another wildcat shooting site right next to a busy and popular highway. While passing it recently, my wife said startled, "Did I just hear a gunshot?".

Local gun lovers have taken to making a display of arms en masse in local restaurants.

And then this, an armed protest outside an Islamic center in Phoenix:

You see? Behind all these examples of bad behavior is a gun lover.

In the spirit of a well-regulated militia, I think gun lovers need to find a way to regulate themselves.

Out of every law breaker with a gun, there are 1000s of law-abiders with guns. So you establish laws, who are going to follow them? Law breakers or law abiders?

Every person I know personally owns some form of firearm. Every single person. Yet I know no one personally who has killed another person with a gun. I know of no one personally who doesn't follow the hunting laws.

 

[tadoflamb]

[QUOTE="heatedmonk, post: 68709116, member: 380836]"Remember Chris Kyle, a Navy Seal sniper, was shot dead at a gun range by what I believe was a Muslim terrorist looking to collect the bounty that was still on Mr.Kyle's head. A murder at a gun range. How would it be impossible for someone to think they'd have easy pickings at a mere meeting of the NRA?[/QUOTE]

No, but I remember a gun range instructor here in AZ who got shot in the head after giving a 9 year old girl an Uzi.

Now there's some responsible gun handling for you.

 

[Erose]

Say what? Who are they going to steal one from? Since all firearms were produced and purchased legally (in theory at least) how did they get in the hands of the people who shouldn't have them? They must have been stolen from legal and responsible gun owners. While it begs to question how responsible is a gun owner who allows his weapon to be stolen the other glaring contradiction is that gun ownership doesn't protect you, it makes you a target. Criminals want to steal your guns and responsible gun owners haven't been very good at stopping them.

Guns can be stolen like anything else. If there is a will there is a way. To be honest Tad you usually make sense, but now you are claiming that when people get things stolen from them, it's really their fault? If someone breaks into your house and steals everything you own, you gonna tell the police: "My bad"?

 

[Erose]

Personally, I'd like freedom from everyone else's guns. I don't need some scrawny kid with a massive sidearm strapped to his side to defend me in my store or in any situation.

There are plenty of countries you can move to get your wish. So move.

 

[Erose]

I don't know and they don't talk about it.

Ever.

But it speaks volumes. They want everyone armed everywhere so good guys can take down bad guys. But at an NRA meeting ?

Everyone's dead because the meeting was a "gun free" zone

Considering that you can buy guns at their symposium, I highly doubt the truth of this assertion.

I have a friend that goes to their bigs symposium in Tennessee the last few years, and he carries, and has bought guns at the symposium.

 

[Erose]

It is a little odd that some gun enthusiasts have a serious disconnect from their passion for guns and their responsibility to society.

No what is a little odd is that anti-gun folks want to take guns out of law abiding hands, while allowing criminals to have all the guns they want.

My duty to society is to take care of my family and protect them. I also filled my duty to this society when I took up weapons to protect it as a Marine. My son is now in the marines to fulfill his duty to society.

 

[Erose]

[QUOTE="heatedmonk, post: 68709116, member: 380836]"Remember Chris Kyle, a Navy Seal sniper, was shot dead at a gun range by what I believe was a Muslim terrorist looking to collect the bounty that was still on Mr.Kyle's head. A murder at a gun range. How would it be impossible for someone to think they'd have easy pickings at a mere meeting of the NRA?

No, but I remember a gun range instructor here in AZ who got shot in the head after giving a 9 year old girl an Uzi.

Now there's some responsible gun handling for you.[/QUOTE]
So are you for banning cars? There are a lot more people killed in this country due to irresponsible driving than from irresponsible gun-handling. So I would assume you are all for banning cars,

 

[WarriorAngel]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/10/0...y-shot-on-campus-gunman-sought/?intcmp=hplnws

http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/09/us/northern-arizona-university-shooting/index.html

Prayers - and prayers.

Ben Carson all the way!
He wants security at schools... some suggested former vets.

I wonder - and of course no real info to base the idea - but i wonder if this isnt a ploy to get ppl to conform to gun banning.
Politicians are weasels... ya never know.

 

[Nikti]

Lord have mercy!

I understand this is a purely political/social opinion, and I sincerely hope not to offend, I'm just perplexed (I've never written about this subject before but I feel safer from the risk of being bombarded in a christian forum)... but as an Australian I don't understand the resistance to restricting guns in America? I don't get how carrying a deadly weapon with the capacity to kill so easily is considered a right?

My country had a tragic mass shooting in the 90s, I think 35 people died and 23 wounded- the Port Arthur Massacre. The government implemented restrictions on automatic weapons, introduced a registry, rolled out a gun buy-back scheme and our homicide by firearm rates when down by 43% in 7 years. And we have amongst the lowest homicide by firearm rates in the world. I'm not a huge fan on PM Howard but I'm proud of that achievement.

I understand that the scale of gun ownership in the US makes the extent of the Australian reforms unviable in the US, but I do believe it goes to prove something. You can blame the mentally ill, environmental triggers, culture, social issues, vulnerable people, etc all you want but problems like those take decades to remedy and in interim more people are going to die, not just in mass shootings but gun homicides in general (which the US has one the highest of).

Forgive me, but it seems crazy, is it because of the NRA influence over politics in US or is gun ownership a generally popular thing amongst the average american? <- real question

I don't understand when I see US news anchors saying "that if more people had guns at 'said mass shooting location' less or no people would have been murdered." That doesn't even make sense on its own, nor does it do anything to address the fact that potential mass killers are getting guns with ease.

The way I see it is, there is no compelling reason (except maybe leisure/hunting, etc which even then I don't agree) that an average person should have a gun.

More deadly weapons in circulation = more deaths by deadly weapons
Less deadly weapons in circulation = less deaths by deadly weapons

Maybe someone could help me understand something I'm missing..

God bless