My Graduate Challenge

[JustMeSee]

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/bias-against-creationism-in-biology.7854335/

 

[AV1611VET]

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/bias-against-creationism-in-biology.7854335/

 

[Mr Strawberry]

Your problem is, you don't read for understanding and learning, you read for talking points instead. It leads you to think you have something that you don't have.

That's a great quote. In a few words it encapsulates the majority of creationist posts on this forum.

 

[Loudmouth]

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/bias-against-creationism-in-biology.7854335/

Can you outline what a graduate level research project would look like for a study on creationism? What experiments would the graduate student do? What are the hypotheses?

 

[HitchSlap]

Can you outline what a graduate level research project would look like for a study on creationism? What experiments would the graduate student do? What are the hypotheses?

I imagine it might look like this:

https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2014/06/23/wikileaks-released-kent-hovinds-doctoral-thesis/

 

[Loudmouth]

I imagine it might look like this:

https://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2014/06/23/wikileaks-released-kent-hovinds-doctoral-thesis/

That would be completely different from what current graduate students do. Most of the time, their thesis is just a bound copy of 3-5 peer reviewed papers that they published while working under a professor in the department. Hovind has zero peer reviewed papers and no research experience that I am aware of. And yes, I know, I am preaching to the choir.

I think creationists have this really misinformed view of what goes on in graduate schools in the biological sciences. They seem to think that graduate school is just like undergrad where you just attend classes and take tests. What they may not realize is that the bulk of your work in grad school is working in a lab on actual research under the guidance of one of your professors. That is the problem with creationism, it produces no research. The reason that you don't find creationism in grad schools is that it is a scientific dead end. Creationism is purely indoctrination.

 

[HitchSlap]

That would be completely different from what current graduate students do. Most of the time, their thesis is just a bound copy of 3-5 peer reviewed papers that they published while working under a professor in the department. Hovind has zero peer reviewed papers and no research experience that I am aware of. And yes, I know, I am preaching to the choir.

I think creationists have this really misinformed view of what goes on in graduate schools in the biological sciences. They seem to think that graduate school is just like undergrad where you just attend classes and take tests. What they may not realize is that the bulk of your work in grad school is working in a lab on actual research under the guidance of one of your professors. That is the problem with creationism, it produces no research. The reason that you don't find creationism in grad schools is that it is a scientific dead end. Creationism is purely indoctrination.

Creationism might better be classified as a cult, actually.

 

[Loudmouth]

Creationism might better be classified as a cult, actually.

I have found that the only difference between a cult and a religion is popularity.

My family is quite religious, and I have had moments where I bit my tongue to keep from laughing. For example, my grandmother started on a rant on Mormonism one time, about how the stories and claims were completely unbelievable. All I could think about was the verse on straining gnats and swallowing camels.

 

[HitchSlap]

I have found that the only difference between a cult and a religion is popularity.

My family is quite religious, and I have had moments where I bit my tongue to keep from laughing. For example, my grandmother started on a rant on Mormonism one time, about how the stories and claims were completely unbelievable. All I could think about was the verse on straining gnats and swallowing camels.

I was the same way at the height of my hubris as a Christian. I was so adept at pointing out why all other belief systems were wrong, but whoa, if you attempted to point out the fallacies in mine.

 

[Ada Lovelace]

I was the same way at the height of my hubris as a Christian. I was so adept at pointing out why all other belief systems were wrong, but whoa, if you attempted to point out the fallacies in mine.

Out of curiosity how old were you when your faith in Christianity began to fade, and was there any particular catalyst?

 

[HitchSlap]

Out of curiosity how old were you when your faith in Christianity began to fade, and was there any particular catalyst?

Early thirties, and no particular reason. I decided to apply the "outsiders" test to my faith, and over the course of the next ten years my beliefs slowly faded.

 

[AV1611VET]

I decided to apply the "outsiders" test to my faith, and over the course of the next ten years my beliefs slowly faded.

Like opening all the doors up and letting the ecumenicals in, then finding yourself on the outside as well?

 

[HitchSlap]

Like opening all the doors up and letting the ecumenicals in, then finding yourself on the outside as well?

Ok.

 

[AV1611VET]

Ok.

Just saying.

 

[Bradly Capel]

Like opening all the doors up and letting the ecumenicals in, then finding yourself on the outside as well?

Don't you ever try doing that, what would believers be without their religion?
Happy like Hitchslap.

 

[AV1611VET]

what would believers be without their religion?

Christians.

Happy like Hitchslap.

Anyone can be happy.

Does Hitchslap have the joy of the LORD?

Nehemiah 8:10c ... for the joy of the LORD is your strength.

 

[JacksBratt]

Don't you ever try doing that, what would believers be without their religion?
Happy like Hitchslap.

Probably the same as evolutionists, without their religion.

 

[Zosimus]

Probably the same as evolutionists, without their religion.

They'd probably pick some new religion to take its place. Something with apocalyptic end-of-the-world scenarios, atonement rituals, lots of guilt, holy days, food restrictions, etc.

Environmentalism, perhaps. It has all of this. You get to feel really guilty just because you breathe CO2, get to engage in meaningless penance rituals such as recycling, and you even have holy days like Earth Day. Plus you get to look at other people, cluck your tongue, and shun them for failing to believe in the nonsense you do.

 

[Justatruthseeker]

They'd probably pick some new religion to take its place. Something with apocalyptic end-of-the-world scenarios, atonement rituals, lots of guilt, holy days, food restrictions, etc.

Environmentalism, perhaps. It has all of this. You get to feel really guilty just because you breathe CO2, get to engage in meaningless penance rituals such as recycling, and you even have holy days like Earth Day. Plus you get to look at other people, cluck your tongue, and shun them for failing to believe in the nonsense you do.

Like evolutionists do with Christians? Look at them and cluck their tongue, shun them for failing to believe in the nonsense you do?

And the funny thing is I believe in your apocalyptic end-of-the-world scenarios and the possibility of a future one...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction_event

"8The second angel sounded, and something like a great mountain burning with fire was thrown into the sea; and a third of the sea became blood, 9and a third of the creatures which were in the sea and had life, died; and a third of the ships were destroyed. 10The third angel sounded, and a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of waters. 11The name of the star is called Wormwood; and a third of the waters became wormwood, and many men died from the waters, because they were made bitter.…"

Meteors and comets - the same thing that extincted the dinosaurs....

 

[Zosimus]

Like evolutionists do with Christians? Look at them and cluck their tongue, shun them for failing to believe in the nonsense you do?

And the funny thing is I believe in your apocalyptic end-of-the-world scenarios and the possibility of a future one...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction_event

"8The second angel sounded, and something like a great mountain burning with fire was thrown into the sea; and a third of the sea became blood, 9and a third of the creatures which were in the sea and had life, died; and a third of the ships were destroyed. 10The third angel sounded, and a great star fell from heaven, burning like a torch, and it fell on a third of the rivers and on the springs of waters. 11The name of the star is called Wormwood; and a third of the waters became wormwood, and many men died from the waters, because they were made bitter.…"

Meteors and comets - the same thing that extincted the dinosaurs....

I don't believe that "extincted" is a word. Of course, your entire post is riddled with inaccuracies. You said, "Like evolutionists do with Christians?" – do you know the difference between like and as? When you say "Look at them and cluck their tongue" are you suggesting that all evolutionists share one single tongue? Or are you using "tongue" to mean language – as though all evolutionists have a common tongue? Or what?

Take a moment and reign in the chaos that rages within your mind. Then, take a deep breath, and say something coherent.