Does God really *punish* nations based on whether or not they follow Christian values?

[Hetta]

Of course Lot was the one in Sodom. I do read my Bible. And it was Abraham that God spoke to. I copied and pasted the scriptures. Please read them before responding without knowing what was said. And thanks for your personal ideas, but don't waste them on me. The entire city was destroyed because All but four were righteous is the point, don't even try to argue it. Please try to keep up or I will put you on ignore.

You are a very rude person. The last time that I looked, threatening to put people on ignore was considered to be against CF rules.

 

[Winepress777]

I am not one to shirk my responsibility to myself and others to be the person I wish to be and to acknowledge being wrong. for being wrong. Now that I think about it I was wrong in what I said about the sequence of events and doubled down on my wrongness in the way I responded to your post. I wronged you and embarrassed myself. I apologize wholly to you and to the board.

As far as you saying the entire city was destroyed because they couldn't find four righteous men, it doesn't say what they were doing to not be righteous. I didn't argue the point, I simply stated that there was nothing to connect homosexuality to the destruction of either city and that, my friend is not wasted on anybody unless assumptions based on personal interpretations have become the basis of empirical truth.

Thank you for your grace, please, no worries Thank you. However I must say, I really had to do a retake on your suggestion that the destruction of Sodomy wasn't because of the rampant sodomite behavior... whoever told you that was way wrong, but for you to believe that is ten times wrong. Scriptures is quite clear about it, and as you know, a contrariwise argument can only come from big huge assumptions, which, are blatantly wrong.
And again, if you'd read the verses, Abraham only got down as far as asking for mercy on the city if there were ten righteous. God cut Him off after promising;

(Gen 18:32) And he said, Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak yet but this once: Peradventure ten shall be found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for ten's sake.

Abraham probably would have asked down to five hehe... he was a wonderful man, but even then, the answer would have been the same. God destroyed Sodom, because of the rampant "sodomy". You might ask where the Word "Sodom" came from, what it means, and why that wicked city was named that hehe. THEN you'll see why God destroyed it, and why it is soon coming upon this disgusting world now as well, as soon as they're numbers significantly increase, which it will as we have been watching in the few short years of our fall into this abomination now on a national level... sigh

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

You are a very rude person. The last time that I looked, threatening to put people on ignore was considered to be against CF rules.

Thank you very much for responding to this, but I deserved his anger for being snotty with him. As far as being ignored, it was my responsibility to respect others and that didn't happen. That being said the promise of being placed on someone's ignore button doesn't detour me from pointing out the wrongness I see in others posts as he did mine.

People don't have t have a button to ignore others on these sites. They just need a closed mind and a irrevokable investment in their ideals.

Thank you for your grace, please, no worries Thank you. However I must say, I really had to do a retake on your suggestion that the destruction of Sodomy wasn't because of the rampant sodomite behavior... whoever told you that was way wrong, but for you to believe that is ten times wrong. Scriptures is quite clear about it, and as you know, a contrariwise argument can only come from big huge assumptions, which, are blatantly wrong.
And again, if you'd read the verses, Abraham only got down as far as asking for mercy on the city if there were ten righteous. God cut Him off after promising;

(Gen 18:32) And he said, Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak yet but this once: Peradventure ten shall be found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for ten's sake.

Abraham probably would have asked down to five hehe... he was a wonderful man, but even then, the answer would have been the same. God destroyed Sodom, because of the rampant "sodomy". You might ask where the Word "Sodom" came from, what it means, and why that wicked city was named that hehe. THEN you'll see why God destroyed it, and why it is soon coming upon this disgusting world now as well, as soon as they're numbers significantly increase, which it will as we have been watching in the few short years of our fall into this abomination now on a national level... sigh

I know where the term Sodomize came from and it doesn't adequatly reflect the gay community, because it doesn't include Lesbians
That is an assumption based on a separate incident. If the Bible spoke about hoards of people combing the city for children to sacrifice that would still be just a snap shot in time which doesn't prove it was the key reason for the destruction of the city. If it was why haven't other gay communities throughout history have been allowed to exist and to thrive?

 

[Winepress777]

Thank you very much for responding to this, but I deserved his anger for being snotty with him. As far as being ignored, it was my responsibility to respect others and that didn't happen. That being said the promise of being placed on someone's ignore button doesn't detour me from pointing out the wrongness I see in others posts as he did mine.

People don't have t have a button to ignore others on these sites. They just need a closed mind and a irrevokable investment in their ideals.


I know where the term Sodomize came from and it doesn't adequatly reflect the gay community, because it doesn't include Lesbians
That is an assumption based on a separate incident. If the Bible spoke about hoards of people combing the city for children to sacrifice that would still be just a snap shot in time which doesn't prove it was the key reason for the destruction of the city. If it was why haven't other gay communities throughout history have been allowed to exist and to thrive?

Yes, the homosexual behaviors of the sodomites, whether they were men or women, was the reason God destroyed them, and will destroy them continually. Maybe not in the same way of course, but destroy them He will. And a righteous King will ALWAYS clear them away out of their lands, as HISTORY shows...

No righteous kings have EVER allowed sodomites to infest their lands. Remember what I said about assumptions?

(1Ki 15:11) And Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD, as did David his father.


(1Ki 15:12) And he took away the sodomites out of the land, and removed all the idols that his fathers had made.

(1Ki 22:45) Now the rest of the acts of Jehoshaphat, and his might that he shewed, and how he warred, are they not written in the book of the chronicles of the kings of Judah?


(1Ki 22:46) And the remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land.

Do you see how meaningless it is to attempt to argue against scriptures, when your point of view is totally opposite? You can't win against God...

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

Yes, the homosexual behaviors of the sodomites, whether they were men or women, was the reason God destroyed them, and will destroy them continually. Maybe not in the same way of course, but destroy them He will. And a righteous King will ALWAYS clear them away out of their lands, as HISTORY shows...

No righteous kings have EVER allowed sodomites to infest their lands. Remember what I said about assumptions?

(1Ki 15:11) And Asa did that which was right in the eyes of the LORD, as did David his father.


(1Ki 15:12) And he took away the sodomites out of the land, and removed all the idols that his fathers had made.

(1Ki 22:45) Now the rest of the acts of Jehoshaphat, and his might that he shewed, and how he warred, are they not written in the book of the chronicles of the kings of Judah?


(1Ki 22:46) And the remnant of the sodomites, which remained in the days of his father Asa, he took out of the land.

Do you see how meaningless it is to attempt to argue against scriptures, when your point of view is totally opposite? You can't win against God...

It is never meaningless to state what was actually written. Interpretation is ours to justify as we will. The rest of these scriptures are separate thought.s The idea that Asa did what was right in the eyes of the Lord may not have anything to do with removing Sodomites from Israel any more than Jackson's interpretation of the will of the people justified the Trail of tears.

 

[Winepress777]

It is never meaningless to state what was actually written. Interpretation is ours to justify as we will. The rest of these scriptures are separate thought.s The idea that Asa did what was right in the eyes of the Lord may not have anything to do with removing Sodomites from Israel any more than Jackson's interpretation of the will of the people justified the Trail of tears.

No, it is not yours to interpret and justify as you will. No, the rest of the scriptures were not separate thoughts. Yes, Asa was righteous for removing the homosexual sodomites out of the land. You can deny, you can argue, you can make stuff up and be your own lust driven authority even, but you have no substance. Good luck with your choice.

 

[AHH who-stole-my-name]

No, it is not yours to interpret and justify as you will. No, the rest of the scriptures were not separate thoughts. Yes, Asa was righteous for removing the homosexual sodomites out of the land. You can deny, you can argue, you can make stuff up and be your own lust driven authority even, but you have no substance. Good luck with your choice.

Interpretation is interpretation. What makes your interpretation any more important than mine?
That being siad, I can only wish that you afford the same dignity of choice to Homosexuals than you do me here?

 

[Cearbhall]

It's a bit of a bizarre concept, as the evidence does not correlate at all.

I agree. Obviously the idea that entire civilizations are punished from above is not the truth, but I can't even think of any historical precedent for this, or any way that a person would arrive at this conclusion unless it was predetermined.

 

[GoingByzantine]

Remember that God sent Joseph to save Egypt, a un-Godly place at the time, from famine.

 

[Chicken Little]

"Does God really *punish* nations based on whether or not they follow Christian values?"

well no.....NO he doesn't have too punish. At the tribulations is when he punishes the nations for what they have done for their sins .

But what does happen is he no longer can protect us and thus it can look like a punishment kind of because it will look like a curse or just be wrote off as just bad luck has come to that nation . just ugly and "unlucky" rules.
Because there is no reason to protect that nation or to make any sort of bubble around it as a country. like he did in the desert after Egypt where he placed a bubble around them , he had a bubble of divine protection over what has been given to him the right to protect . so the shields fall down the storms don't go around the earth quakes to hit in populated areas etc. they would have hit anyway but where it hit is how he protected... when a nation isn't 'blessed' because they don't want him in their business he can't protect it . the bubble moves to protect the individuals from the surrounding "unlucky' and those all consuming black holes of greedy in those nations.
Because If it doesn't protect what he loves , so he has too ! so he lets what would be be, mostly because no one is praying and asking him to save it or protect it either !! they are too busy trying to just live and protect their own from the "unlucky" people of that nation.

 

[bhsmte]

But I'm saying a lot of civilizations have been very successful without being Christian.

If you look at studies, many of the nations with the least amount of Christians, have the lowest crime rates and highest standards of living.

You can extend the same to the United States and you see the same pattern in certain states.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...ation-and-facts-about-secularism-and-religion

 

[brinny]

Remember that God sent Joseph to save Egypt, a un-Godly place at the time, from famine.

Would you care to elaborate?

Thank you kindly.

 

[bhsmte]

You are a very rude person. The last time that I looked, threatening to put people on ignore was considered to be against CF rules.

It does help to ward off cognitive dissonance though.

 

[Hetta]

It does help to ward off cognitive dissonance though.

Oh I agree. I have blocked people who simply exhaust me mentally, but it's the threatening or announcing of a block that is considered goading - from what I understand.

 

[Chicken Little]

only time to work out his understanding does that !
or
if we can't figure out what he is doing we can't fart with it either ( even me !)

 

[Hetta]

well no.....NO he doesn't have too punish. At the tribulations is when he punishes the nations for what they have done for their sins .

But what does happen is he no longer can protect us and thus it can look like a punishment kind of because it will look like a curse or just be wrote off as just bad luck has come to that nation . just ugly and "unlucky" rules.
Because there is no reason to protect that nation or to make any sort of bubble around it as a country. like he did in the desert after Egypt where he placed a bubble around them , he had a bubble of divine protection over what has been given to him the right to protect . so the shields fall down the storms don't go around the earth quakes to hit in populated areas etc. they would have hit anyway but where it hit is how he protected... when a nation isn't 'blessed' because they don't want him in their business he can't protect it . the bubble moves to protect the individuals from the surrounding "unlucky' and those all consuming black holes of greedy in those nations.
Because If it doesn't protect what he loves , so he has too ! so he lets what would be be, mostly because no one is praying and asking him to save it or protect it either !! they are too busy trying to just live and protect their own from the "unlucky" people of that nation.

Can you list for me the countries that are inside of God's bubble and that he protects?

 

[GoingByzantine]

Would you care to elaborate?

Thank you kindly.

Well as you know, Joseph (as in Joseph, son of Jacob) was sold into slavery by his brothers and sent to Egypt. This horrible act was actually part of God's plan to save the Egyptians from certain death. Joseph endured being falsely accused of a crime, imprisonment and broken trust while he was Egpyt. God rewarded his faith by elevating him to a position of power, where he could save people. The Egyptians worshiped false Gods, yet God gave Joseph to them to save them from famine.

In Genesis 50:20, Joseph says to his brothers:

But as for you, you meant evil against me; but God meant it for good, in order to bring it about as it is this day, to save many people alive.

God, through his worker Joseph, saved an ungodly people.

 

[bhsmte]

Can you list for me the countries that are inside of God's bubble and that he protects?

This should be interesting.

 

[brinny]

Well as you know, Joseph (as in Joseph, son of Jacob) was sold into slavery by his brothers and sent to Egypt. This horrible act was actually part of God's plan to save the Egyptians from certain death. Joseph endured being falsely accused of a crime, imprisonment and broken trust while he was Egpyt. God rewarded his faith by elevating him to a position of pwer, where he could save people. The Egyptians worshiped false Gods, yet God gave Joseph to them to save them from famine.

In Genesis 50:20, Joseph says to his brothers:

But as for you, you meant evil against me; but God meant it for good, in order to bring it about as it is this day, to save many people alive.

God, through his worker Joseph, saved an ungodly people. God loves all his children.

God's focus was on saving the Egyptians through all of this?

Thank you kindly.

 

[GoingByzantine]

God's focus was on saving the Egyptians through all of this?

Thank you kindly.

God has many reasons for doing what he does, but that was clearly one of them. Genesis 50:20 says that Egypt not succumbing to famine was God's work. Genesis 45:7-8 reveals that it was God's plan to save the Isrealites, and Egpytians.