Aliens go to hell?

[Hikarifuru]

Ken Ham says space travel may be pointless because aliens cant be redeemed. What do you think?

http://mobile.rawstory.com/all/2014...ram-because-aliens-are-going-to-hell-anyway#1

 

[ebia]

Ken Ham says space travel may be pointless because aliens cant be redeemed. What do you think? http://mobile.rawstory.com/all/2014-07-21-creationist-ken-ham-calls-to-end-space-program-because-aliens-are-going-to-hell-anyway#1

The suggestion (that it's pointless) and the reason, seem to be completely disconnected.

Of course the historic Christian claim is that all creation is being redeemed.

 

[Hikarifuru]

The suggestion (that it's pointless) and the reason, seem to be completely disconnected.

Of course the historic Christian claim is that all creation is being redeemed.

Well he said we shouldnt search for intelligent* life because obviously aliens are sinners and cannot be saved.

 

[lesliedellow]

I think Ken Ham is an idiot.

1.) The question is a theological one.

2.) As a Protestant, he is supposed to believe that the Bible is the ultimate and final authority for settling theological questions.

3.) The Bible says nothing at all about aliens.

4.) Therefore Ken Ham should have nothing to say about aliens - or, at least, nothing of a theological nature.

 

[Hikarifuru]

Well he thinks genesis says the universe is corrupted by sin

 

[NannaNae]

even if Inner dimensional travelers were really aliens...
Jesus died for man

he did not die for demons or fallen angels or aliens or unfallen humans or or un-eve- d humans .. undefiled demigods or " the sons of God" or whatever they might wish to be called or thought of.
NO there is no salvation by his blood for any of them.
salvation is by faith . but they knew him and so had no excuse ..
they were envious and selfish and looked upon us as evil little monkey and some of you believe them and act as such ... now that is sad that some want to prove them right....NO the fallen ones ( or whatever they pretend to be ) they have no right to his life in the next ages.

the very things that man calls hell was created to contain lawless immortals. God help the soul who is renewed/saved and then falls again with a new immortal body.

so yes in his mercy he will not
save those who will not overcome and fall after being made immortal.
because he loves us more than we will ever understand.
and yes like Ham I think the seen universe is fallen ( I have no clue about who owns which dimensions) , I think that mankind sold what we see of it ( the inheritance of it ) and thus submitted all of the universe to hell.

 

[Hikarifuru]

You know and faith supposedly saves you. Faith saved people AFTER the law informed them, it isnt just for the ignorant. To say faith is only for people with an excuse would imply that god destroys and tortures people who have an excuse and that he is not just. To say an excuse is what seperates you from demons is to say that you arent really guilty of sin and dont deserve hellfire yourself. You told a horrifying story and acted liks it was a story of justice and mercy... i never become accustumed to this.

 

[Angelquill]

Cute.

First of all, Ken Ham is not God, whatever he may think.

Secondly, I don't see anything in God's Word that says aliens are doomed to hell.

Come to think of it, I don't recall seeing anything at all about aliens...

Okay, here we go...
The universe definitely had a beginning. Since nothing can come from nothing, there had to be a source....or Source, which we call "God".
God created the entire universe, not just this one tiny solar system, and it seems likely that He peopled it with life.
Now, we have no way of knowing this, so I am assuming, here.
If I'm right, then surely a loving God would not focus on this one planet and leave all the rest of His creation behind.
My personal belief is that every single planet that boasts intelligent life has also had its visit from the Lord Jesus Christ...in whatever form that life might take.

However, I digress.
To answer your question, Ken Ham has no idea whether or not aliens even exist, and yet he is willing to consign them to hell.

Doesn't say much for his Christianity, does it?

 

[Hikarifuru]

Angelquill

Well christians regularly consign their dearest loved ones to hell, how much easier is it to do the same with beings that couldnt concern us?

No i dont think hes thinking very well, he thinks deepspace exploration is an antitheist agenda in itself.

 

[Targaryen]

Ken Ham says space travel may be pointless because aliens cant be redeemed. What do you think?

http://mobile.rawstory.com/all/2014...ram-because-aliens-are-going-to-hell-anyway#1

Ken Ham is an uneducated moron.

No one but god speaks for God, even Christians who think it's there peroggative to "save souls".



The question is theologically interesting at least but from a personal stance, I feel God will find a way to save people if they want it, even those that reject Him in thi life based on their own doubts. so the same would apply to an alien race or races.

 

[Joshua260]

Ken Ham says space travel may be pointless because aliens cant be redeemed. What do you think?

http://mobile.rawstory.com/all/2014...ram-because-aliens-are-going-to-hell-anyway#1

From what I saw, he seems to be saying that the search for ET is a "desperate and fruitless search for extraterrestrial life," because "Life did not evolve but was specially created by God, as Genesis clearly teaches" Therefore, "Christians certainly shouldn’t expect alien life to be cropping up across the universe". I don't see where he ever said that aliens would be doomed to hell...an atheist blogger wrote that Ken implied that. Then he [Ken] says "Now the Bible doesn’t say whether there is or is not animal or plant life in outer space. I certainly suspect not." So, he's basically saying that he really doesn't believe that we'll find any intelligent life out there anyway (comparable to man) due to his creationist beliefs, and he suspects that we won't find any plant or animal life either.

So I think what he actually meant is being somewhat misunderstood, and maybe even "spun" a little bit by atheists bloggers. It sounds to me like "much ado about nothing".

 

[pgp_protector]

From what I saw, he seems to be saying that the search for ET is a "desperate and fruitless search for extraterrestrial life," because "Life did not evolve but was specially created by God, as Genesis clearly teaches" Therefore, "Christians certainly shouldn’t expect alien life to be cropping up across the universe". I don't see where he ever said that aliens would be doomed to hell...an atheist blogger wrote that Ken implied that. Then he [Ken] says "Now the Bible doesn’t say whether there is or is not animal or plant life in outer space. I certainly suspect not." So, he's basically saying that he really doesn't believe that we'll find any intelligent life out there anyway (comparable to man) due to his creationist beliefs, and he suspects that we won't find any plant or animal life either.

So I think what he actually meant is being somewhat misunderstood, and maybe even "spun" a little bit by atheists bloggers. It sounds to me like "much ado about nothing".

I think they're getting the "Going to Hell" from this part (From his blog)

And I do believe there can’t be other intelligent beings in outer space because of the meaning of the gospel. You see, the Bible makes it clear that Adam’s sin affected the whole universe. This means that any aliens would also be affected by Adam’s sin, but because they are not Adam’s descendants, they can’t have salvation. One day, the whole universe will be judged by fire, and there will be a new heavens and earth. God’s Son stepped into history to be Jesus Christ, the “Godman,” to be our relative, and to be the perfect sacrifice for sin—the Savior of mankind.

So if they're effected by Adam's sin & can't have salvation, well where do they go ?

ETA: Also from his blog

Jesus did not become the “GodKlingon” or the “GodMartian”! Only descendants of Adam can be saved. God’s Son remains the “Godman” as our Savior. In fact, the Bible makes it clear that we see the Father through the Son (and we see the Son through His Word). To suggest that aliens could respond to the gospel is just totally wrong.

http://blogs.answersingenesis.org/blogs/ken-ham/2014/07/20/well-find-a-new-earth-within-20-years/

 

[Targaryen]

Ken ham believes in the literal 4000-to 6000 year old universe though so rather then a concept of how Original sin happened, he thinks Adam did happen...and also that the universe and all scientific finds disproving the creation story as a literal event in the way genesis describes it is again,uneducated

So my point stands

 

[Joshua260]

So if they're effected by Adam's sin & can't have salvation, well where do they go ?

Well, Ken will have to answer for himself, but I try to see where people are coming from...we often do not understand clearly what someone is saying at first. What follows is only my guess at what he might have meant.

So, what does "affected by Adam’s sin" mean? All of creation was "affected" by Adam's sin...trees die, grass dies, mosquitoes die, etc. So, I'm not sure that when Ken says that these aliens were "affected by Adam's sin", that he means that they (these aliens he doesn't even believe in) necessarily have a sinful nature in God's eyes. Did frogs "fall"? What about elephants, dogs, or cats? So, even though these aliens might be "affected by Adam's sin", that doesn't necessarily mean that they fell like the race of man did through Adam.

Then I also wonder what does "they can’t have salvation." mean? Given that he says that "they are not Adam’s descendants", I understand him to mean that since these aliens are not of the human race, then this whole fallen nature and eventual redemption process doesn't apply to them. It's like saying that since I don't have wheels, I can't roll down the street. But hey, I'm NOT a car! So the question is, did this alien race "fall"? BTW, C.S. Lewis wrote a space trilogy in which a fallen man meets an unfallen race. Interesting read.

So let me re-phrase what I think Ken might have meant in the form of a question:

According to the bible, is there any reason to think that elephants will end up going to hell? So far as we know then, the same with these fictional aliens.

 

[Hikarifuru]

Joshua

Ken didnt provide anything that would imply he doubts the existence of aliens, be clearly provided that they cannot be saved. If you think that doesnt mean hell ok... but his words arent being twisted away from his intent.

... you guys have a book that lays out what humans are supposed to think. What hell is is sometimes debated but sinners generally go to hell.

 

[Hikarifuru]

I think they're getting the "Going to Hell" from this part (From his blog)



So if they're effected by Adam's sin & can't have salvation, well where do they go ?

ETA: Also from his blog


“We’ll find a new earth within 20 years” | Around the World with Ken Ham

↑ this

 

[Angelquill]

Angelquill

Well christians regularly consign their dearest loved ones to hell, how much easier is it to do the same with beings that couldnt concern us?

No i dont think hes thinking very well, he thinks deepspace exploration is an antitheist agenda in itself.

Do you actually know Christians who consign their dearest loved ones to hell? How sad!!
Perhaps this would be a good time to point out that Jesus did command us to love one another with a Christ-like love ("as I have loved you" were His exact words, according to John 13:34-35), and He also said that people would know His disciples by that love.
Going by His words, I contend that a person who is devoid of love is not a Christian, no matter what he thinks, or says, or believes. A person who has Christ in him/her cannot help but be full of His love.
Now, remember that God is not willing that anyone should perish, but that all might come to repentance. If God is not willing to consign anyone to hell, then neither should His followers. If they are...well, I think you see where I'm going with this.

I do think that we need to concentrate on solving our problems on this planet first...the fact that there are starving children dying while we spend millions of dollars looking for ET is unacceptable. However, that's an entirely different issue...

 

[pgp_protector]

...snip...
I do think that we need to concentrate on solving our problems on this planet first...the fact that there are starving children dying while we spend millions of dollars looking for ET is unacceptable. However, that's an entirely different issue...

Tell me, how should Radio Astronomers help solve the primary issues that are the cause for starvation, including Poverty, Armed Conflict, Discrimination?

 

[Joshua260]

Joshua

Ken didnt provide anything that would imply he doubts the existence of aliens,

On the Ken's site, he writes "I do believe there can’t be other intelligent beings in outer space..."

he clearly provided that they cannot be saved.

as I said, they are not necessarily fallen creatures. Examples of some other creatures that are not fallen: frogs, horses, elephants, and so forth...even children who die before the age of accountability are not destined to hell.

If you think that doesnt mean hell ok...

see above.

but his words arent being twisted away from his intent.

you cannot possibly know that for sure unless you get Ken to clarify. Frankly, I think I understood him correctly as I've heard similar views expressed from other Christians before.

... you guys have a book that lays out what humans are supposed to think. What hell is is sometimes debated but sinners generally go to hell.

again, it has not been determined that aliens, if they even exist, are fallen creatures.

I'm not convinced of the implications of your OP. I have no reason to believe that aliens will go to hell any faster than a fat dumb elephant.

 

[Hikarifuru]

Joshua

I wasnt trying to determine whether or not he believes in aliens, i was referring tothe article about the blog in particular. He did not provide there that he considered aliens to be fiction.

Ken said the aliens were corrupted by sin and would be judged by fire.