My rock challenge

[Kylie]

Your question is interesting primarily because of your motive. It seems the point is to suggest that if Young Earth creationism is right and God just made it look like rocks are old, then God is a deceiver, the argument then being essentially, therefore there either is no God or God is deceptive.


So as is often the case, it's flaws in your approach that are a big part of the problem.


Only a minority of Christians claim the earth is young. One of the egregious errors of their mistaken interpretation is what you suggest: Would their God then been a swindler? A deceiver? Why did He make the earth look old?


I encourage you to try creating just one rock ex nihilo (out of nothing).


Go ahead, KTS, try.


Anybody else think they can create like God? O. K.: Show me your one rock.







ahhhhhh ....




Couldn't do it could you?


So maybe ... you are not God, after all?





Since you are not God, and have demonstrated this, how about taking a different approach, and cease focusing on the Christians who've got the age of the earth wrong.



The far better question is: Do you have the answer to whether God exists--right?




I've got a Rock who created out of nothing.

I think you missed the point I was trying to make...

God God makes a thing that looks to be one thing but is in actuality another, is it deceptive? That's all I'm asking.

And if you're not a YEC, that's fine. But there are quite a few here, and the question is particularly aimed at AV's idea of embedded age.

 

[Kylie]

ok so I got a question for you !

since you brought it up.. please tell us what would it take to make a young rock look like it had
"Embedded age" ? right there in those laws lies the secret to appearances.
and how appearance can be complete lies.

You'll have to speak to AV, it's his idea.

why don't they explain eyewitnesses and recorded history first? why did their fables start billions of years ago ? but they can't tell you about 3200 years ago?. or 2000 years ago? or 2800 years ago? or 4300 years ago .

but they pretend to tell you about billions and billions of years ago with completely 'indisputable' certainty they claim and teach that as facts to little children.

You do realise that it is different fields of science entirely, yes?

 

[Kylie]

No, thanks.

Whether I can or not, it doesn't excuse this doosey of a mistake:

So you can't describe it in any meaningful way? Why does this not surprise me? Gotta keep it vague so its easy for you to move the goalposts?

You seem to miss the simple point that if something has existed for 6000 years, then it is 6000 years old, and no older.

That's what "old" means - how long something has been around.

 

[AV1611VET]

You seem to miss the simple point that if something has existed for 6000 years, then it is 6000 years old, and no older.

That's what "old" means - how long something has been around.

If I cut a 150 year old tree down and hollow it out, can I sell it as a brand new canoe?

If I bake a loaf of raisin bread, can I claim it is new, despite the fact that it has aged grapes in it?

 

[NannaNae]

"why don't they explain eyewitnesses and recorded history first? why did their fables start billions of years ago ? but they can't tell you about 3200 years ago?. or 2000 years ago? or 2800 years ago? or 4300 years ago ."



Embedded age is about what man thinks he sees.
nothing else!
it is only what he thinks..
it is about him, not about the rocks .
it is not about the earth or it's history .
'embedded age' is only about what man thinks..
someone here was acting like carbon dating was fact and a reproducible 'real science' . that is lie!
not even close. dude you need to find out about what happened after the Tunguska event.

here is some clues!

Radiocarbon Dating
""
The surrounding environment can also influence radiocarbon ages. The introduction of "old" or "artificial" carbon into the atmosphere (i.e., the "Suess Effect" and "Atom Bomb Effect", respectively) can influence the ages of dates making them appear older or younger than they actually are. This is a major concern for bone dates where pretreatment procedures must be employed to isolate protein or a specific amino acid such as hydroxyproline (known to occur almost exclusively in bone collagen) to ensure accurate age assessments of bone specimens. Alone, or in concert, these factors can lead to inaccuracies and misinterpretations by archaeologists without proper investigation of the potential problems associated with sampling and dating."

so send your bones in for something not unlike voodoo and crystal ball gazing .


so NO radiocarbon dating isn't accurate in the face of cosmic radioactive events .. AT Least 4 (maybe 5)events of which not any part of scientism has bothered question much less had the cojones to explain.
much less calibrate their own special knowledge, or magic radiocarbon dating voodoo that always seems it tells them exactly what they want to hear. not much different than tea leaves!!

even if they understood the laws of each event they haven't explained ..... which they don't ! they just don't know the laws of even one of those events. So they don't know what they don't know and won't admit that ! They don't know what they don't want to know and what they don't want to ask or answer.




Scientism is about what men think.
' embedded age' is what men think age is .

it is not about history!

 

[biggles53]

Good grief....!
Are you related to Donald Rumsfeld...!?

 

[theophilus777]

Ok, but where does your faith in the supposed truth of the bible come from?

He already said that. Post 262

 

[theophilus777]

Where it actually comes from is unconscious hypnosis. He has been hypnotized, although without awareness of what they were doing, by his faith community. Now he resists using reason to understand things such as evolution in the manner any hypnotized subject clings to the suggestion ordered by the hypnotist. That is why he resorts to such transparently clueless dodges as citing scripture to justify depending on scripture - patently circular reasoning. He is merely acting out the post-hypnotic suggestions from his faith community.

This actually has nothing to do with hypnosis.

 

[PsychoSarah]

If I cut a 150 year old tree down and hollow it out, can I sell it as a brand new canoe?

If I bake a loaf of raisin bread, can I claim it is new, despite the fact that it has aged grapes in it?

You do realize that dating methods we use for fossils and the like only track the age of stuff after it is dead, right? Thus, all fossils are a tad older than we date them to be, not significantly so, given that things don't generally live so long as to make a big difference. But that canoe, it would date as new, even though the tree it was made if was already 150 years old. But this doesn't bode well for you, that just shows dating methods to err slightly on the YOUNGER side, meaning the objects in question are even OLDER.

 

[theophilus777]

Congratulations. All you've done is illustrate the point that there is no evidence of anything ever being created ex nihilo. Now you can graduate from believing in creation mythology as if it were reality.

Highly illogical.

Not sure if this is a grammar fail or what, but if it isn't, then you're saying you have a rock that made something out of nothing. I hadn't realized rocks were capable of this.

You should go back to your public education system and complain they never taught you a proper noun is capitalized. Come back once you have this corrected.

 

[theophilus777]

It doesn't, I'm just messing with AV because he does stuff like that all the time. I feel trolly today

Its not so much trolling, as it is tra-la-la-la-laling ...

 

[Paul of Eugene OR]

This actually has nothing to do with hypnosis.

Hypnosis is the artificial use of something that has a natural basis in human life, and the YEC mind set is a wonderful example of the power of that natural embodiment of the way hypnosis works. Non rational behavior coming about through previous "suggestion", immune to the actual current situation.

 

[theophilus777]

What you're referring to is not behavior. This isn't really the way hypnosis works, neither is that a good definition. While there may be some similarities - no cigar.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Paul of Eugene OR

Where it actually comes from is unconscious hypnosis.
​

This actually has nothing to do with hypnosis.

Tis all a mystery to me.
Can it also mean "trance"?

A+ Hypnosis - Articles

THE BIBLICAL BASIS OF HYPNOSIS:​

In the original Greek Bible, Matthew l:24, the Greek word, "hypnos" is used...............


Mat 1:
20 But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying,
24 Then Joseph being raised from sleep G5258 did as the angel of the Lord had bidden him, and took unto him his wife:

Hypnosis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The term "hypnosis" (Greek: ὕπνωσι&#962 comes from the Greek word hypnos, "sleep", and the suffix -osis, or from hypnoō, "(I) put to sleep" (stem of aorist hypnōs-) and the suffix -is.[7][8]

A person under hypnosis is said to have heightened focus and concentration with the ability to concentrate intensely on a specific thought or memory, while blocking out sources of distraction.[5]
Hypnosis is usually induced by a procedure known as a hypnotic induction involving a series of preliminary instructions and suggestions.[6]

The use of hypnotism for therapeutic purposes is referred to as "hypnotherapy", while its use as a form of entertainment for an audience is known as "stage hypnosis".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ZeTlMpnfHk

 

[NannaNae]

"As we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don’t know we don’t know. "

( yep I understood that perfectly didn't you 'good grief '? .........so " good grief" bet you didn't actually read that site before commenting ! so you really didn't want to know what you didn't to know right? )

 

[PsychoSarah]

"As we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don’t know we don’t know. "

( yep I understood that perfectly didn't you 'good grief '? .........so " good grief" bet you didn't actually read that site before commenting ! so you really didn't want to know what you didn't to know right? )

Ha, I took communications, this is very much like the "4 selves", the open self, which is what you know about yourself and what other people know about you, the blind self, what you don't know about yourself but other people do, and it goes on to a self you only know about, and a self no one knows about.

Btw, does it give you a fit of giggles to try to confuse people?

 

[AV1611VET]

Ha, I took communications, this is very much like the "4 selves", the open self, which is what you know about yourself and what other people know about you, the blind self, what you don't know about yourself but other people do, and it goes on to a self you only know about, and a self no one knows about.

Btw, does it give you a fit of giggles to try to confuse people?

QV please: Johari window.

 

[NannaNae]

by the way that was me quoting Rumsfeld.

Btw, does it give you a fit of giggles to try to confuse people?

You and
"good grief" assume your my audience.

gee I'm sorry , but I do talk in short hand...
but really anyone wanting to know what I am talking about are those in this world who Ask , Knock, and seek for the truth and they will look and search it out themselves.. they will go to the link and search out things for themselves. They don't need to be told by anyone what to think.
that person is who I am talking too .

 

[PsychoSarah]

by the way that was me quoting Rumsfeld.



You and
"good grief" assume your my audience.

gee I'm sorry , but I do talk in short hand...
but really anyone wanting to know what I am talking about are those in this world who Ask , Knock, and seek for the truth and they will look and search it out themselves.. they will go to the link and search out things for themselves. They don't need to be told by anyone what to think.
that person is who I am talking too .

If they don't need to be told anything, then why post such a thing, hmm?

 

[PsychoSarah]

QV please: Johari window.

Thanks for that, couldn't remember the name.