The Jewish passover is not for the church.

[SpiritPsalmist]

I agree that the modern "communion" is off base. I think, as stated in my communion thread, that most churches don't emphasize the ordinance enough. Perhaps it is even more than that. I envision early "Lord's Suppers" or love feasts as festive events where people celebrated over food and fellowshipped heartily with each other. Not pass the wafer bowl and take your ounce of grape juice...

That goes along with Paul further telling people in 1 Cor 11 "17 In the following directives I have no praise for you, for your meetings do more harm than good. 18 In the first place, I hear that when you come together as a church, there are divisions among you, and to some extent I believe it. 19 No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which of you have God’s approval. 20 So then, when you come together, it is not the Lord’s Supper you eat, 21 for when you are eating, some of you go ahead with your own private suppers. As a result, one person remains hungry and another gets drunk. 22 Don’t you have homes to eat and drink in? Or do you despise the church of God by humiliating those who have nothing? What shall I say to you? Shall I praise you? Certainly not in this matter! 23 For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, “This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.
27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29 For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 30 That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. 31 But if we were more discerning with regard to ourselves, we would not come under such judgment. 32 Nevertheless, when we are judged in this way by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be finally condemned with the world.
33 So then, my brothers and sisters, when you gather to eat, you should all eat together. 34 Anyone who is hungry should eat something at home, so that when you meet together it may not result in judgment. And when I come I will give further directions.
​

They were getting together, at the very least, once a year, maybe more to celebrate the Lords Supper but they were not considering one another. They were just making sure they and theirs was taken care of partying it up but bringing shame to other attendees who had less and could not party it up as gloriously. Then Paul further tells us how we are to examine our hearts before we partake of the bread and wine. Many are sick due to not being disciplined and not caring for one another.

 

[Frogster]

That goes along with Paul further telling people in 1 Cor 11 "17 In the following directives I have no praise for you, for your meetings do more harm than good. 18 In the first place, I hear that when you come together as a church, there are divisions among you, and to some extent I believe it. 19 No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which of you have God’s approval. 20 So then, when you come together, it is not the Lord’s Supper you eat, 21 for when you are eating, some of you go ahead with your own private suppers. As a result, one person remains hungry and another gets drunk. 22 Don’t you have homes to eat and drink in? Or do you despise the church of God by humiliating those who have nothing? What shall I say to you? Shall I praise you? Certainly not in this matter! 23 For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, “This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes.
27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29 For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 30 That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. 31 But if we were more discerning with regard to ourselves, we would not come under such judgment. 32 Nevertheless, when we are judged in this way by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be finally condemned with the world.
33 So then, my brothers and sisters, when you gather to eat, you should all eat together. 34 Anyone who is hungry should eat something at home, so that when you meet together it may not result in judgment. And when I come I will give further directions.
​

They were getting together, at the very least, once a year, maybe more to celebrate the Lords Supper but they were not considering one another. They were just making sure they and theirs was taken care of partying it up but bringing shame to other attendees who had less and could not party it up as gloriously. Then Paul further tells us how we are to examine our hearts before we partake of the bread and wine. Many are sick due to not being disciplined and not caring for one another.

red above, meetings were more than once a year.

The came together alot, they took the table alot, it was not the passover, they were in the new cov, it says new cov right in your passage.

17 But in the following instructions I do not commend you, because when you come together it is not for the better but for the worse. 18 For, in the first place, when you come together as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you. And I believe it in part,[d]

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Hi,
1 Timothy 1:7, Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. Toss in verse 6. It says it all.

Here we go again, taking a verse out of it's context

3 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain people not to teach false doctrines any longer 4 or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God’s work—which is by faith. 5 The goal of this command is love, which comes from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. 6 Some have departed from these and have turned to meaningless talk. 7 They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, 10 for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine 11 that conforms to the gospel concerning the glory of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

​

It's meaningless to tell people they are "free from the law" to do whatever they please? Telling them it "does not matter if they sin because the blood of Jesus covers everything you did and ever will do?" Within our churches we have lawbreakers, and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, those who kill their parents, murders, the sexually immoral, those practicing homosexuality, slave traders and liars and perjurers and whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine...I think we can add retrofit pagan traditions with "christian" meanings". Of course I think that would also fit into lawbreakers, rebels, ungodly, sinful, unholy, irreligious, liars (the easter bunny and santa clause) perjurers contrary to sound doctrine.

Paul is pushing love above everything. It's not love to let them believe the false doctrine that it does not matter how you live after you ask Jesus into your heart. The false doctrine that everything God set up is no longer in place because Jesus died on the cross so that we can eat a pig. These are not "speculations" they are truth set forth by God Himself. And we've got people saying they are "Christians" and thumbing their nose at God and with their fist flailing at Him say it does not matter anymore what HE said, it's all been done away with.

That's why Paul says we need to examine ourselves. Are these things going on in our lives? If they are, Paul says, "that is why you are sick". "You are partaking of the Lords blood and body and your sins have made you unworthy of it".

 

[ToBeBlessed]

Hi,
1 Timothy 1:7, Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm. Toss in verse 6. It says it all.

Here we go again, taking a verse out of it's context

3 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia, stay there in Ephesus so that you may command certain people not to teach false doctrines any longer 4 or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God’s work—which is by faith. 5 The goal of this command is love, which comes from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. 6 Some have departed from these and have turned to meaningless talk. 7 They want to be teachers of the law, but they do not know what they are talking about or what they so confidently affirm.
8 We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.9 We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, 10 for the sexually immoral, for those practicing homosexuality, for slave traders and liars and perjurers—and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine 11 that conforms to the gospel concerning the glory of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

​

It's meaningless to tell people they are "free from the law" to do whatever they please? Telling them it "does not matter if they sin because the blood of Jesus covers everything you did and ever will do?" Within our churches we have lawbreakers, and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, those who kill their parents, murders, the sexually immoral, those practicing homosexuality, slave traders and liars and perjurers and whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine...I think we can add retrofit pagan traditions with "christian" meanings". Of course I think that would also fit into lawbreakers, rebels, ungodly, sinful, unholy, irreligious, liars (the easter bunny and santa clause) perjurers contrary to sound doctrine.

Paul is pushing love above everything. It's not love to let them believe the false doctrine that it does not matter how you live after you ask Jesus into your heart. The false doctrine that everything God set up is no longer in place because Jesus died on the cross so that we can eat a pig. These are not "speculations" they are truth set forth by God Himself. And we've got people saying they are "Christians" and thumbing their nose at God and with their fist flailing at Him say it does not matter anymore what HE said, it's all been done away with.

That's why Paul says we need to examine ourselves. Are these things going on in our lives? If they are, Paul says, "that is why you are sick". "You are partaking of the Lords blood and body and your sins have made you unworthy of it".

First of all, those people who are lawbreakers, and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, those who kill their parents, murders, the sexually immoral, those practicing homosexuality, slave traders and liars and perjurers and whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine are in the church and will be probably until Jesus comes back. There are all kinds of people in our churches, some I'm not all that fond of myself, but they will have their judgment day, just as we will have ours.

God is perfectly just and perfectly holy. There is no need for 'us' to worry about who is doing what or where their heart is, because we aren't perfect and aren't holy. We need to stop worrying about everyone else. We need to try to edify them, try to help them, and pray for them, but their does come a point when it's all in His hands, as it should be.

The gospel of grace is exactly that, grace. Paul was the first one to chastise the early churches. Paul called all those churches to the carpet when they were wrong. No one I believe here teaches that we are saved and should go off an sin... sin... sin... That's ludacris.

Jesus said Himself that many on judgment day will cry Lord, Lord and He will tell them He never knew them.

We cannot however, preach a gospel other than grace, for we ourselves are saved by grace. Jesus, alone will decide who He advocates for. If He advocates for them, then I love my Lord and let His will be done.

But it is grace, the gospel is grace!

Who will have His grace on judgement day, as well as today, that is for Him to decide.

Do you believe God is a holy, righteous and just God? If you do, do you not think that He will continue to be holy, righteous and just? Does His Word say that He is the same today, yesterday and forever? Why would you think that anyone will get away with anything? He see's all, He knows all, He is righteous.

Nothing slips by Him. All who think they are slipping a fast one by God deceive themselves.

How smart are they who think they deceive the one, the only creator of heaven and earth?

Whomever has an issue with the gospel of grace needs to take it up with the Lord. Let's stop accusing each other of falsely leading each other. Read the bible. It's all in there.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

First of all, those people who are lawbreakers, and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, those who kill their parents, murders, the sexually immoral, those practicing homosexuality, slave traders and liars and perjurers and whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine are in the church and will be probably until Jesus comes back. There are all kinds of people in our churches, some I'm not all that fond of myself, but they will have their judgment day, just as we will have ours.

God is perfectly just and perfectly holy. There is no need for 'us' to worry about who is doing what or where their heart is, because we aren't perfect and aren't holy. We need to stop worrying about everyone else. We need to try to edify them, try to help them, and pray for them, but their does come a point when it's all in His hands, as it should be.

The gospel of grace is exactly that, grace. Paul was the first one to chastise the early churches. Paul called all those churches to the carpet when they were wrong. No one I believe here teaches that we are saved and should go off an sin... sin... sin... That's ludacris.

Jesus said Himself that many on judgment day will cry Lord, Lord and He will tell them He never knew them.

We cannot however, preach a gospel other than grace, for we ourselves are saved by grace. Jesus, alone will decide who He advocates for. If He advocates for them, then it is not my business. But it is grace, the gospel is grace!

Who will have His grace on judgement day, as well as today, that is for Him to decide.

I do not disagree. It's by grace alone that we are saved. But if we don't teach how being lawless etc, effects our walk and our life, how will they know. Teaching that the law no longer applies is false doctrine. According to Paul, it does still apply and that is why they were sick and some even died when they partook of the Lords Supper being unworthy...Those are Pauls words.

Seriously, I'm not talking about screaming and pounding people over their sins. Paul was not yelling and screaming but they were still strong words that he knew they needed to hear and he wrote them so that they could be heard. He did not just say "well it's all for the Lord to deal with".

The law is there for a reason. To show and guide (in the Holy Spirits love) people where they are missing it. I know that no one is saying "go sin, sin, sin". However, many in todays church just throw the guide book out the window. Like Jesus told the woman caught in adultery, "go AND SIN NO MORE" Of course we stumble and fall, but we are told to "go (get up) and sin no more". There is no condemnation for those who are putting their faith and trust in Christ Jesus to mold them into images of Him. Our goal is to be like Jesus.

Really, I'm all about mercy and grace, but people (everybody, including me) need to hear the strong stuff too.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

I do not disagree. It's by grace alone that we are saved. But if we don't teach how being lawless etc, effects our walk and our life, how will they know. Teaching that the law no longer applies is false doctrine. According to Paul, it does still apply and that is why they were sick and some even died when they partook of the Lords Supper being unworthy...Those are Pauls words.

Seriously, I'm not talking about screaming and pounding people over their sins. Paul was not yelling and screaming but they were still strong words that he knew they needed to hear and he wrote them so that they could be heard. He did not just say "well it's all for the Lord to deal with".

The law is there for a reason. To show and guide (in the Holy Spirits love) people where they are missing it. I know that no one is saying "go sin, sin, sin". However, many in todays church just throw the guide book out the window. Like Jesus told the woman caught in adultery, "go AND SIN NO MORE" Of course we stumble and fall, but we are told to "go (get up) and sin no more". There is no condemnation for those who are putting their faith and trust in Christ Jesus to mold them into images of Him. Our goal is to be like Jesus.

Really, I'm all about mercy and grace, but people (everybody, including me) need to hear the strong stuff too.

I am, as Paul did, saying that we are saved by grace. Just as Christ died to sin, those who have salvation also died, because of Christ's gift, to sin. Jesus fulfilled the law. Sin has no dominion over us because we are dead to sin, in Christ Jesus.

If people do not take the time to read their bibles, that I cannot change. I will however, not write about any other gospel than the saving grace of Jesus Christ.

Too many on this forum do think they do not sin (yes it's crazy, but they think it), or that if they sin they are not saved (yes it's crazy, but they think it) or that their doing good works will lead to or earn their salvation (yes it's crazy, but they think it). I cannot contribute in any way to that.

You will see for yourself if you hang around here, the heresy that is spoken of.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

What I would disagree with is the idea that the Galatians were not falling back into Law keeping/legalism. That whole book is ripe full of references to the Law and it's destructive hold over people. Sure the Galatians were Gentile by and large, but it's well documented in scripture (mainly Acts) that everywhere Paul went to preach, a group of Jews would follow and try to pervert his message of grace with their own message of circumcision and law keeping. The Galatians were merely falling to the trap. If estimates are true and Galatians was Paul's first letter, then that would explain why he mentioned the practice little in other letters. He was fiercely opposed to the idea of works for salvation, or even works being needed to complete salvation.

The Galatians were not falling back into idol worship or false pagan god worship, rather law keeping because the local Jews were perverting the true gospel message.

I'm open to what you're saying, but how can they "fall back" into something they were never part of? My main point, that they were not "falling back into celebrating Passover, or Sabbath, or studying Moses and the Prophets". If they were being deceived into getting circumcised in order to complete their salvation that is totally different, but even that is still not a "falling back" since they did not do circumcision anyway.

I'm fiercely opposed to the idea of works for salvation, or even works being needed to complete salvation too. We are saved by grace through faith. The laws of God are a guide in how to live our salvation out. It's a searchlight to show us where we're missing it and the way out when we can't see it. Following it does not get us to heaven, but will make our journey smoother.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

I am, as Paul did, saying that we are saved by grace. Just as Christ died to sin, those who have salvation also died, because of Christ's gift, to sin. Jesus fulfilled the law. Sin has no dominion over us because we are dead to sin, in Christ Jesus.

If people do not take the time to read their bibles, that I cannot change. I will however, not write about any other gospel than the saving grace of Jesus Christ.

Too many on this forum do think they do not sin (yes it's crazy, but they think it), or that if they sin they are not saved (yes it's crazy, but they think it) or that their doing good works will lead to or earn their salvation (yes it's crazy, but they think it). I cannot contribute in any way to that.

You will see for yourself if you hang around here, the heresy that is spoken of.

I've been in this forum over 10 years...I know the little member icon thingy says 5 but it's been over 10.

Anyway, God's instructions to a happy and prosperous life are full of grace and mercy. Without those instructions, we're like sheep wandering in a desert without a shepherd. God's instructions go hand in hand with grace. One cannot be without the other. I wish my new windows 8 computer had come with instructions, it would make my life a lot simpler (I did get a dummys for windows 8 book). That's what grace without the instructions would be like. Grace is preached to draw people to His forgiveness. The stronger stuff comes after they've come to the Lord and want to know how it all works.

I believe Paul taught both. He did not teach grace and then leave without giving further instruction.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

I've been in this forum over 10 years...I know the little member icon thingy says 5 but it's been over 10.

Anyway, God's instructions to a happy and prosperous life are full of grace and mercy. Without those instructions, we're like sheep wandering in a desert without a shepherd. God's instructions go hand in hand with grace. One cannot be without the other. I wish my new windows 8 computer had come with instructions, it would make my life a lot simpler (I did get a dummys for windows 8 book). That's what grace without the instructions would be like.

My opinion anyway. I believe Paul taught both. He did not teach grace without God's instructions.

We are not bound to the law, Christ fulfilled the law. The law only existed as instructions until Christ came. In fulfilling the law, it did NOT make the law obsolete, a sin is still a sin. However, repentance is how we deal with that sin. Upon repentance, we are called to not keep sinning that same sin, but to use the strength of Jesus Christ and the power of the Holy Spirit in us to try not to keep doing the same as we did before we repented.

Now Christ does not expect us to keep on sinning. Far from that. We are justified by Christ at salvation, we are sanctified and in the process of sanctification for our ENTIRE earthly life time. The sanctification of us is where the obedience comes in.

Many here do not read what you write, they browse. They read 'selectively'. After they have 'selectively' read, they will respond back to you what they 'think' you said, which is not what you said, but will say what they 'think' you said when they 'selectively' read what you said. So 'clarity' when readers browse and choose 'selectively' requires shorter answers with less words to 'selectively' misunderstand.

 

[cyberlizard]

have you people ever thought that maybe the symbolism is more important than the details?


Steve

 

[ToBeBlessed]

have you people ever thought that maybe the symbolism is more important than the details?


Steve

What symbolism are you referring to?

 

[Joy]

I've been in this forum over 10 years...I know the little member icon thingy says 5 but it's been over 10.

Anyway, God's instructions to a happy and prosperous life are full of grace and mercy. Without those instructions, we're like sheep wandering in a desert without a shepherd. God's instructions go hand in hand with grace. One cannot be without the other. I wish my new windows 8 computer had come with instructions, it would make my life a lot simpler (I did get a dummys for windows 8 book). That's what grace without the instructions would be like. Grace is preached to draw people to His forgiveness. The stronger stuff comes after they've come to the Lord and want to know how it all works.

I believe Paul taught both. He did not teach grace and then leave without giving further instruction.

Take no notice what others write I for one like reading your posts i am tired of those who seem to dominate here who write continually about Grace but do not allow discussion of issues such as obedience or allow you to share about Passover without jumping in to say you are wrong. Please keep writing.`

 

[ToBeBlessed]

Take no notice what others write I for one like reading your posts i am tired of those who seem to dominate here who write continually about Grace but do not allow discussion of issues such as obedience or allow you to share about Passover without jumping in to say you are wrong. Please keep writing.`

Just to clarify: Grace is that you are NOT SAVED by your obedience,
NOR by any good work.

Grace is NOT against obedience.


We are justified (our justification ) through the blood of Christ, which is our salvation.

We are sanctified (our sanctification) through obedience and following the will of God.

 

[Alithis]

Just to clarify: Grace is that you are NOT SAVED by your obedience,
NOR by any good work.

Grace is NOT against obedience.


We are justified (our justification ) through the blood of Christ, which is our salvation.

We are sanctified (our sanctification) through obedience and following the will of God.

it is notable that the "grace" people seldom promote obedience either.
nor do they speak of the consequence of disobedience,which is sin.
by omitting reference to its necessity in the process of sanctification,they unwittingly allow the false impression that ,because there is Grace ,there is no consequence for unrepentant disobedience.which is not so.(there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth-Jesus)

while the opposite extreme of works only to attain that which is unattainable by works, is like a sect of book worshipers that appear to have little comprehension of relationship with God through the Holy spirit or what it means to walk and talk with the lord and obey him as the living word that he is.
(You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me- Jesus )

i'll go for the middle-
i am saved by grace through faith
-and now that i am,i am free to obey my savior and LORD and do what he tells me to do(his work not mine)
as i obey, his will is established continually and increasingly (process of sanctification)in me,transforming me into his own image.
but if i then disobey and by disobedience cease abiding in him, i become a fruitless branch and if i do not repent will be cut out,gathered up and cast in the fire.-resulting Consequence of willful disobedience according to our
lord-whose word is faithful and true.

this is the Gospel.... love and life laid down
, grace and cross.
if you try to separate them one ends up at opposing extremes of half the truth.

....................................

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

We are not bound to the law, Christ fulfilled the law.

True, we are not bound to the law. By Jesus fulfilling the law that means He lived it out as an example of how to walk in faith and succeed at it Fulfill has never meant "end". I disagree that the law only existed until Christ came. Else why would HE say "if you love, keep my commands"?

The law only existed as instructions until Christ came. In fulfilling the law, it did NOT make the law obsolete, a sin is still a sin.

These two sentences seem to contradict each other.

However, repentance is how we deal with that sin. Upon repentance, we are called to not keep sinning that same sin, but to use the strength of Jesus Christ and the power of the Holy Spirit in us to try not to keep doing the same as we did before we repented.

True, however repentance usually does not come until we know that we've gone against God's instructions and are compelled to repent.

Now Christ does not expect us to keep on sinning. Far from that. We are justified by Christ at salvation, we are sanctified and in the process of sanctification for our ENTIRE earthly life time. The sanctification of us is where the obedience comes in.

Yes, obedience is important. If we don't obey the convictions that come as a result of the law showing us how rebellious we are, there is no repentance.

Many here do not read what you write, they browse. They read 'selectively'. After they have 'selectively' read, they will respond back to you what they 'think' you said, which is not what you said, but will say what they 'think' you said when they 'selectively' read what you said. So 'clarity' when readers browse and choose 'selectively' requires shorter answers with less words to 'selectively' misunderstand.

Understood.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

True, we are not bound to the law. By Jesus fulfilling the law that means He lived it out as an example of how to walk in faith and succeed at it Fulfill has never meant "end". I disagree that the law only existed until Christ came. Else why would HE say "if you love, keep my commands"?

I don't know how to mulitquote. In post #108 of this thread you referred to the law as instructions, I was kind of riffing off that same verbage.

I do not believe that the law only existed until Christ.

I meant to say that burnt offerings/blood sacrifices of animals were done for sin transgressions up until Christ died. Once Christ died for our sins, there was no further atonement (burnt offerings/blood sacrifices) needed for our sin. Christ conquered sin. We, in Christ, conquered sin and are not bound by it. After Jesus died for our sins, we are called to repentance.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

In fulfilling the law, it did NOT make the law obsolete, a sin is still a sin.​

These two sentences seem to contradict each other.

In the OT the consequence of sin is death. In Christ, who died for all of our sins, He has conquered death, by conquering the sin that came into the world. Because we are crucified with Christ when we have salvation, we, through Christ are also dead to sin. The consequence of sin is death, however through Christ dying to sin, through Him, we are also crucified to sin. Because we have been crucified to sin, in Christ, sin no longer has dominion over us and the penalty of sin is death. This is why we are new creatures in Christ. The law, which transgression against is sin, Christ fulfilled the law because He is the perfect sacrifice. I don't know if I'm explaining that right, so I'll include the verses.

Romans 5:8-21
"For when we were yet without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die:yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die. But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: (For until the law sin was in the world:but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come. But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many. And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift:for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification. For if by one man's offence death reigned by one; much more they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ.)

Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.'

Romans 6;1-14
"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein? Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death? Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death:that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin. For he that is dead is freed from sin. Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him: Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him. For in that he died, he died unto sin once:but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God. Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin:but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. For sin shall not have dominion over you:for ye are not under the law, but under grace"

 

[ToBeBlessed]

True, however repentance usually does not come until we know that we've gone against God's instructions and are compelled to repent.

We are always able to repent. Acknowledging sin is important.

 

[ToBeBlessed]

Y If we don't obey the convictions that come as a result of the law showing us how rebellious we are, there is no repentance.

This is not true. We are justified through the death of Christ. No one can remove our justification through Him, that is the new covenant, He died for our sins, to justify us blameless and without sin, His blood atones for us. No one can remove us from Christ and the new covenant. We are always able to repent.

 

[psalms 91]

Take no notice what others write I for one like reading your posts i am tired of those who seem to dominate here who write continually about Grace but do not allow discussion of issues such as obedience or allow you to share about Passover without jumping in to say you are wrong. Please keep writing.`

Yes, they try to weary people with longwinded posts and many posts as opposed to just presenting in a post or two their thoughts and beliefs. I for one am not swayed by their repitition and while I believe in grace I also know that Christ fulfilled the law and did not do away with it nor do I believe that all are washed clean by the blood. What of those who never accept Christ or those who knowingly continue in sin with no repentance? Seems to me that the bible is clear about that