A Pondering of the Peculiar (3)

[PsychoSarah]

Your postings claim higher ground without evidence of it?

Pretty much what he does.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Nothing complex forms out of something simple without
complex instructions.

Not necessarily. Also, many people overestimate how complex people are.

 

[GenemZ]

I am not suggesting that you are going to get anything complex developing; in fact, I would argue against that. However, very simple entities, such as some protobacterium, could form in certain conditions.

Spontaneously? Before there were any proteobacterium bacteria existing? Just spontaneously form into a living entity? HOW?

 

[GenemZ]

..... deleted. You'll never know!

 

[PsychoSarah]

Have you ever studied biological function in detail? People can spend their lifetime studying the intricacies of the liver alone. You're just making excuses. No medical scientist would take you seriously.

I have studied biological functions, from individual cells to the complete human body. Frankly, they aren't studying how the liver works at this point; they are mostly seeing how it reacts to disease and repairs itself, amongst a few other things. Overall, the liver and most other organs in the human body are pretty well understood and surprisingly simple.

I am not making excuses, if you like, I can explain the basics of how the liver works to you.

 

[PsychoSarah]

..... deleted. You'll never know!

Wrong, I read it before you deleted it

 

[GenemZ]

I have studied biological functions, from individual cells to the complete human body. Frankly, they aren't studying how the liver works at this point; they are mostly seeing how it reacts to disease and repairs itself, amongst a few other things. Overall, the liver and most other organs in the human body are pretty well understood and surprisingly simple.

I am not making excuses, if you like, I can explain the basics of how the liver works to you.

The liver is not simple. Its purpose is simply understood. Its a complex chemical factory.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Spontaneously? Before there were any proteobacterium bacteria existing? Just spontaneously form into a living entity? HOW?

Abiogenesis is the process by which nonliving organic molecules collect together into patterns matching up with those of living entities.

Proteins naturally occur in nature outside of living beings; some happen to be attracted to each other. Given the opportunity, they can form spherical shapes resembling hollowed out bacteria. This is as far as the process has been observed, and while it would be untrue to suggest these protein rings were alive, it is definitely an interesting development.

 

[PsychoSarah]

The liver is not simple. Its purpose is simply understood. Its a complex chemical factory.

Liver: blood goes in, detects toxins, releases enzymes to break down toxins, cleaner blood exits.

How it detects: proteins on the surface of liver cells set off a response when specific chemicals come into contact with them, instigating the release of the correct enzyme for breaking down the detected chemical.

 

[GenemZ]

Abiogenesis is the process by which nonliving organic molecules collect together into patterns matching up with those of living entities.

Do it! Show how its done then...

But, make sure you are being stupid when you arrange for it to happen.

Otherwise, someone may accuse you of intelligent design.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Do it! Show how its done then...

But, make sure you are being stupid when you arrange for it to happen.

Otherwise, someone may accuse you of intelligent design.

I don't need to, the experiment has already been done decades ago. And the experiment only imitated naturally occurring events, none that nature itself couldn't repeat randomly.

 

[GenemZ]

I don't need to, the experiment has already been done decades ago. And the experiment only imitated naturally occurring events, none that nature itself couldn't repeat randomly.

Documentation please... Don't tell me about it. Show me the documentation, please. I think I remember hearing about this before, and it was not what I was told.

 

[GenemZ]

I don't need to, the experiment has already been done decades ago. And the experiment only imitated naturally occurring events, none that nature itself couldn't repeat randomly.

So we all ultimately came from the proteobacterium bacteria.

 

[Subduction Zone]

So we all ultimately came from the proteobacterium bacteria.

It might be better to call it a single celled organism. I am not sure if it qualifies as a bacteria or not.

But then why is that so hard to believe? You started as a one celled organism, or do you believe in the stork along with creationism?

 

[GenemZ]

deleted ..Duplicate... forum malfunction.

 

[GenemZ]

Liver: blood goes in, detects toxins, releases enzymes to break down toxins, cleaner blood exits.

How it detects: proteins on the surface of liver cells set off a response when specific chemicals come into contact with them, instigating the release of the correct enzyme for breaking down the detected chemical.

That's toxins. It has many other functions. Your hormones would be out of whack if it were not for your liver.

Here: Liver - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Physiology

The various functions of the liver are carried out by the liver cells or hepatocytes. Currently, there is no artificial organ or device capable of emulating all the functions of the liver. Some functions can be emulated by liver dialysis, an experimental treatment for liver failure. The liver is thought to be responsible for up to 500 separate functions, usually in combination with other systems and organs.
Synthesis

Further information: Proteins produced and secreted by the liver

• A large part of amino acid synthesis
• The liver performs several roles in carbohydrate metabolism:
  • Gluconeogenesis (the synthesis of glucose from certain amino acids, lactate or glycerol)
  • Glycogenolysis (the breakdown of glycogen into glucose)
  • Glycogenesis (the formation of glycogen from glucose)(muscle tissues can also do this)
• The liver is responsible for the mainstay of protein metabolism, synthesis as well as degradation.
• The liver also performs several roles in lipid metabolism:
  • Cholesterol synthesis
  • Lipogenesis, the production of triglycerides (fats).
  • A bulk of the lipoproteins are synthesized in the liver.
• The liver produces coagulation factors I (fibrinogen), II (prothrombin), V, VII, IX, X and XI, as well as protein C, protein S and antithrombin.
• In the first trimester fetus, the liver is the main site of red blood cell production. By the 32nd week of gestation, the bone marrow has almost completely taken over that task.
• The liver produces and excretes bile (a yellowish liquid) required for emulsifying fats and help the absorption of vitamin K from the diet. Some of the bile drains directly into the duodenum, and some is stored in the gallbladder.
• The liver also produces insulin-like growth factor 1 (IGF-1), a polypeptide protein hormone that plays an important role in childhood growth and continues to have anabolic effects in adults.
• The liver is a major site of thrombopoietin production. Thrombopoietin is a glycoprotein hormone that regulates the production of platelets by the bone marrow.

Breakdown

• The breakdown of insulin and other hormones
• The liver glucoronidates bilirubin, facilitating its excretion into bile.
• The liver breaks down or modifies toxic substances (e.g., methylation) and most medicinal products in a process called drug metabolism. This sometimes results in toxication, when the metabolite is more toxic than its precursor. Preferably, the toxins are conjugated to avail excretion in bile or urine.
• The liver converts ammonia to urea (urea cycle).

Other functions

• The liver stores a multitude of substances, including glucose (in the form of glycogen), vitamin A (1–2 years' supply), vitamin D (1–4 months' supply)[citation needed], vitamin B12 (1–3 years' supply), vitamin K, iron, and copper.
• The liver is responsible for immunological effects—the mononuclear phagocyte system (MPS) of the liver contains many immunologically active cells, acting as a 'sieve' for antigens carried to it via the portal system.
• The liver produces albumin, the major osmolar component of blood serum.
• The liver synthesizes angiotensinogen, a hormone that is responsible for raising the blood pressure when activated by renin, an enzyme that is released when the kidney senses low blood pressure.

...And, the liver just happened haphazardly along into being, by various random, lucky mutations, over the course of millions and millions of years.

Of course, all the first creatures with livers died because they did not have sufficient liver function. But, we must ignore that factor if we are ever to convince those creationists that evolution did it.

 

[GenemZ]

It might be better to call it a single celled organism. I am not sure if it qualifies as a bacteria or not.

But then why is that so hard to believe? You started as a one celled organism, or do you believe in the stork along with creationism?

Facetiousness and condescension does not negate common sense.

 

[Loudmouth]

What is your definition of nested hierarchy? Define it in your terms, so we can be on the same page.

It is groups within groups. All dogs are mammals. All mammals are amniotes. All amniotes are vertebrates. All vertebrates are deuterostomes. All deuterostomes are eukaryotes. Go to Tree of Life Web Project. Start here:

Eukaryotes

Start clicking on the branches that interest you.

What you will find is that adaptations stay on a branch. For example, only mammals have three middle ear bones, lactation, and fur. Birds have feathers, one middle ear bone, and do not lactate. A designer could mix and match features as it see fits, so if ID/creationism were true then we would expect to see species with feathers, three middle ear bones, and lactation, as one example. Instead, we see adaptations staying in evolutionary lineages, just as we would expect if evolution were true.

 

[Loudmouth]

Nothing complex forms out of something simple without
complex instructions.

Evidence?

 

[Loudmouth]

Facetiousness and condescension does not negate common sense.

The argument from common sense fallacy.

A List Of Fallacious Arguments

Putting, "it's just common sense," at the end of an argument does not make it true.