Tiktaalik ha ha

[Subduction Zone]

I used to be into flood geology. The problem is that once one starts to look at the vast amount of evidences in different areas the position becomes unsupportable.

I am shocked!!

Perhaps there is some hope for dad after all

 

[Subduction Zone]

Define a lot. How many species of animals did we have then? How many humans were there in Noah's day?

On the other hand.....

Millions of years of human evolution with populations of say 100,000 people would leave lots of fossil evidence. How many do we have today? A couple hundred? Maybe a bit more if you count the ones they say are part ape but are just humans. But not that much.

Not sure where you are in terms of what is the correct view of the past.

Why do you believe that? Just because animals exist does not mean that they will be fossilized. They do have to be preserved somehow or other and that is not the norm.

The "holes" in the fossil record were predicted by people who understood fossilization.

 

[Loudmouth]

Define a lot. How many species of animals did we have then? How many humans were there in Noah's day?

On the other hand.....

Millions of years of human evolution with populations of say 100,000 people would leave lots of fossil evidence. How many do we have today? A couple hundred? Maybe a bit more if you count the ones they say are part ape but are just humans. But not that much.

In Devonian strata we are missing entire Orders of animals and plants, not just a few species. In the Devonian there are no mammals even though we see 5,000 species of mammals today. There are no birds even though there are 10,000 species of birds living today, not to mention the number that have lived through history. There are no dinosaurs in the Devonian, and who knows how many species of dinosaur there were. There were no grasses or flowering plants in the Devonian, and those are more numerous than the animal species discussed so far.

How do you explain this?

 

[BaconWizard]

How do you explain this?

By all the things which you mention and which occur much later, evolving from something previous(ie whatever survived the Devonian Extinction event)

 

[EternalDragon]

In Devonian strata we are missing entire Orders of animals and plants, not just a few species. In the Devonian there are no mammals even though we see 5,000 species of mammals today. There are no birds even though there are 10,000 species of birds living today, not to mention the number that have lived through history. There are no dinosaurs in the Devonian, and who knows how many species of dinosaur there were. There were no grasses or flowering plants in the Devonian, and those are more numerous than the animal species discussed so far.

How do you explain this?

Why would birds be at the bottom of water with trilobites? I think I explained by postulating that the Devonian is an environment, not a time period.

 

[Loudmouth]

Why would birds be at the bottom of water with trilobites?

Why would grasses be at the top with birds? Why would whales be above birds in the fossil record?

 

[BaconWizard]

Don't. Rely instead on evidence. Evidence says it is what we already understand the word to mean, despite it not suiting your argument.

 

[Black Akuma]

Don't. Rely instead on evidence. Evidence says it is what we already understand the word to mean, despite it not suiting your argument.

Why do flightless birds show up higher than flying birds? Why are pterosaurs below them?

 

[EternalDragon]

Why do flightless birds show up higher than flying birds? Why are pterosaurs below them?

Well, I ran across some research that suggests most flightless birds came about AFTER flying birds as they had less predation to worry about (in my view, after the flood wiped everything out) and lost the ability to fly.

It also explains how flightless birds managed to get across marine barriers.

Birds Got Too Fat to Fly After Dinosaurs Vanished?

Theory of Flightless Birds Shot Down | LiveScience

I seem to recall some birds being in the Jurassic period.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Well, I ran across some research that suggests most flightless birds came about AFTER flying birds as they had less predation to worry about (in my view, after the flood wiped everything out) and lost the ability to fly.

It also explains how flightless birds managed to get across marine barriers.

Birds Got Too Fat to Fly After Dinosaurs Vanished?

Theory of Flightless Birds Shot Down | LiveScience

I seem to recall some birds being in the Jurassic period.

But there was no flood. That has been demonstrated countless times here. There is no Santa Claus there was no Flood. These two statements are equal.

Why on Earth do you persist in a belief that has been shown to be wrong.

Did you ever explains away the terrible lack of population bottlenecks? Did you ever explain away the fact that there are no Flood deposits or Flood landforms?

 

[Black Akuma]

Before we address that, I have to address this odd pattern with you, ED.

Why did you skip over Loudmouth's comment and go straight to my little add-on? Clearly, you see his comment; I even quote him. So, you see what he said, but you're dealing with me instead of him, and this isn't a rare occurrence - you very often pick the low-hanging fruit. You'll skip over several points and address one, even if that comment has very little to do with the actual subject at hand. It gives the impression that you're actively ignoring certain posts. Why?

 

[freezerman2000]

Nothing evolved that did not start out created first. Later, the former nature did allow evolving and adapting, of course. It allowed it to happen in a rapid way unlike we now observe also. In fact, it is possible that the living animal evolved rather than the offspring only! Now that would be fast! Science cannot even address the juicy issues.

care to back up your claim with peer reviewed material?

 

[Black Akuma]

Well, I ran across some research that suggests most flightless birds came about AFTER flying birds as they had less predation to worry about (in my view, after the flood wiped everything out) and lost the ability to fly.

At any rate, addressing this claim.

Yes, that's true, many flightless birds appear after flightless birds in the fossil record. But you're missing a few things.

You'll note that many of these flightless birds only appear on islands. Now, if what you said was true, the lack of predation would explain flightless birds, yes - but it wouldn't explain why we see so many of them on islands. Following your model, the animals could pretty much travel wherever they wanted to after the flood - why did so many birds go to islands and become flightless?

Your model also doesn't explain why only certain birds went flightless and others didn't. Yes, flightless birds appeared after flying birds, but in case you didn't notice, there are still flying birds around. So why was this lack of predation only a thing with certain ones?

And finally...you said this.

I'd have to say there are two kinds of birds. Flightless and able to fly.

In this topic:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7765317-33/

If what you say is true - that flying birds became flightless birds after the flood - then, by your own standards, this is an example of one 'kind' changing into another 'kind'...which I'm fairly certain you don't think can happen. Or have you retracted that stance?

 

[CabVet]

care to back up your claim with peer reviewed material?

You are asking too much, I would settle for plain old evidence.

 

[Loudmouth]

Well, I ran across some research that suggests most flightless birds came about AFTER flying birds as they had less predation to worry about (in my view, after the flood wiped everything out) and lost the ability to fly.

It also explains how flightless birds managed to get across marine barriers.

Birds Got Too Fat to Fly After Dinosaurs Vanished?

Theory of Flightless Birds Shot Down | LiveScience

I seem to recall some birds being in the Jurassic period.

I seem to recall birds not being in the Devonian. Why are entire groups of vertebrates, from dinosaurs to mammals to birds, completely absent from Devonian strata? How do you explain that?

 

[EternalDragon]

In this topic:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7765317-33/

If what you say is true - that flying birds became flightless birds after the flood - then, by your own standards, this is an example of one 'kind' changing into another 'kind'...which I'm fairly certain you don't think can happen. Or have you retracted that stance?

They are still birds.

 

[Loudmouth]

They are still birds.

They are still not found in Devonian strata. How do you explain that?

 

[EternalDragon]

Before we address that, I have to address this odd pattern with you, ED.

Why did you skip over Loudmouth's comment and go straight to my little add-on? Clearly, you see his comment; I even quote him. So, you see what he said, but you're dealing with me instead of him, and this isn't a rare occurrence - you very often pick the low-hanging fruit. You'll skip over several points and address one, even if that comment has very little to do with the actual subject at hand. It gives the impression that you're actively ignoring certain posts. Why?

There is one person I am ignoring. I sometimes miss posts as I am
gone from the computer and at work. Or I just choose not to respond.

 

[Loudmouth]

There is one person I am ignoring.

I guess that's one way to avoid the evidence.

 

[CabVet]

There is one person I am ignoring. I sometimes miss posts as I am
gone from the computer and at work. Or I just choose not to respond.

I will repost one of the questions you ignored:

They are still not found in Devonian strata. How do you explain that?