Kids in Aus. schools Don't know who Jesus is

[HasAnswers]

http://au.christiantoday.com/article/jesus-the-best-kept-secret-in-australian-schools/16620.htm

It's about sharing the gospel with kids here and now and how SRE in schools can only go so far.

 

[madaz]

Jesus – The best kept secret in Australian schools

It's about sharing the gospel with kids here and now and how SRE in schools can only go so far.

Why should children know who Mohammed, Jesus or Vishnu is? They're children!
Children are very impressionable and gullible so it is very easy for parents and/or teachers to take advantage of them and persuede them to believe in anything. Children should get a brief overview of the various religions found in society as part of their social studies but proselytizing one particular religion to children is just wrong! Especially if it is implied that this one religion is the one and only true religion. School is not the place for preaching religion, that sort of practice is for adults in temples, churches and mosques. Anybody preaching religion to school children at a public school should (at very least) be banned permanently from all public schools! IMO the choice of which religion one chooses should be made by the child themselves when they are old enough to make such decisions.

 

[ebia]

Why should children know who Mohammed, Jesus or Vishnu is? They're children! Children are very impressionable and gullible so it is very easy for parents and/or teachers to take advantage of them and persuede them to believe in anything. Children should get a brief overview of the various religions found in society as part of their social studies but proselytizing one particular religion to children is just wrong! Especially if it is implied that this one religion is the one and only true religion. School is not the place for preaching religion, that sort of practice is for adults in temples, churches and mosques. Anybody preaching religion to school children at a public school should (at very least) be banned permanently from all public schools! IMO the choice of which religion one chooses should be made by the child themselves when they are old enough to make such decisions.

An education that doesn't include a religious dimension is as much a particular choice as any other; the promotion of one particular worldview. There is no neutral place to stand; what is not said is as loud and as influential as anything that might be said.

Apart from that, Mohammad and Jesus are both still enormously influential figures on the current world - every child ought to know the basics of their stories. To celebrate Christmas without knowing the story (whether or not its historical) is culturally bizarre. When we get to the point where it's culturally unacceptable to even tell the nativity story and equally unacceptable to not pretend Santa its real is really bizarre.

 

[madaz]

To celebrate Christmas without knowing the story (whether or not its historical) is culturally bizarre.

I wholeheartedly agree, children should be taught that decorating tree's, santa clause, mistletoes, giving of gifts, having holidays, Dec 25th etc etc have absolutely nothing to do with christianity.

 

[ebia]

I wholeheartedly agree, children should be taught that decorating tree's, santa clause, mistletoes, giving of gifts, having holidays, Dec 25th etc etc have absolutely nothing to do with christianity.

Well, Santa does derive from the legend about st Nicholas, and that does involve gift bringing. (To say those things have nothing to do with Christianity is to ignore the history that produced where we are.) But at least in England it seems to have become a serious offence to let children know that. They should know the story that gives us Christmas, just as they should know what the other religous and non religious holidays and festivals celebrated in their communities are actually about. If hannakah is big they should know the Maccabees story, if Ramadan and eid are big they should know what they are about, if we celebrate invasion day (otherwise known as Australia Day) they should know what story that commemorates,...

 

[madaz]

Well, Santa does derive from the legend about st Nicholas, and that does involve gift bringing. (To say those things have nothing to do with Christianity is to ignore the history that produced where we are.)

What do you mean by "ignore the history that produced where we are"?

But at least in England it seems to have become a serious offence to let children know that.

I'm sorry I don't quite understand, what is a serious offence in England?

They should know the story that gives us Christmas, just as they should know what the other religous and non religious holidays and festivals celebrated in their communities are actually about. If hannakah is big they should know the Maccabees story, if Ramadan and eid are big they should know what they are about, if we celebrate invasion day (otherwise known as Australia Day) they should know what story that commemorates,...

I agree, but only briefly in the context of social studies.

 

[ebia]

What do you mean by "ignore the history that produced where we are"?

Most of those are part of modern celebrations of Christmas via Christianity adopting them.

I'm sorry I don't quite understand, what is a serious offence in England?

Telling primary school children that st Nicholas is the origin of Father Christmas/Santa.

I agree, but only briefly in the context of social studies.

Why only briefly. People need to understand the culture they live in.

 

[madaz]

Telling primary school children that st Nicholas is the origin of Father Christmas/Santa.

I don't understand why that is a serious offence.

Why only briefly. People need to understand the culture they live in.

Yes people need to understand the culture they live in, but I feel they dont need a comprehensive course on cultures they dont live in.

 

[ebia]

I don't understand why that is a serious offence.

Apparently lots of parents got very heated about their child working out that Santa isn't real.

Yes people need to understand the culture they live in, but I feel they dont need a comprehensive course on cultures they dont live in.

Well, it would help a lot if people had a better understanding of the rest of the world, but that wasn't what I was talking about.

I any western country Christianity is a significant part of the culture, and for most now so is Islam. For some places Judaism. For others various Asian cultures.

 

[madaz]

Apparently lots of parents got very heated about their child working out that Santa isn't real.

Some parents need to get a life, anyway so when you say serious offence you didn't actually mean legal repercussions?

Well, it would help a lot if people had a better understanding of the rest of the world, but that wasn't what I was talking about.

I any western country Christianity is a significant part of the culture, and for most now so is Islam. For some places Judaism. For others various Asian cultures.

When I mean briefly I meant that we dont need to spend weeks/months teaching children about cultures that are not really applicable to them.

 

[ebia]

Some parents need to get a life, anyway so when you say serious offence you didn't actually mean legal repercussions?

No, I didn't mean legal repercussions. But required to apologise to the school.

[quite]
When I mean briefly I meant that we dont need to spend weeks/months teaching children about cultures that are not really applicable to them.[/QUOTE]

 

[AnthonyB]

There are so many references and allusions to the story of Jesus and Christianity in our culture that anyone without a reasonable understanding of them is certainly poorer from it. As a parallel example you can read Animal Farm without knowing Soviet history but it would not resonate as it would to one with some knowledge, or the Iliad without some knowledge of the Hellenistic pantheon. Les Miserable, U2 songs, Handle's Messiah, Tale of Two Cities, I could go on for pages, but so much of Western culture is immersed or derived from a Christian worldview. Gandhi can admire Jesus (but not Christians) but modern leftist elites so despise the culture that spawned them that they are busy culturally sawing the branch from the tree they have climbed from.

 

[Galilee63]

I wholeheartedly agree, children should be taught that decorating tree's, santa clause, mistletoes, giving of gifts, having holidays, Dec 25th etc etc have absolutely nothing to do with christianity.

Ah, but it does, given it is ALL through Jesus Christ our Saviour's Holy Blessings and Gifts given to mankind, including Children, every one of his 'good' Blessings including the Blessing of having holidays particularly on His Holy Birthday being Christ-mas Day.

Further, 'every' Gift yourself, others and myself have received through our lives is directly from Jesus through others that Jesus has chosen by His Will.

This is where sinners/mankind until coming closer to Jesus, are oblivious.

...to Jesus Christ our Saviour's Holy Blessings that we as sinners, take for granted and His Loving Light has not dawned in our minds and bodies, yet deep down in our Souls, we 'know' until Jesus triggers His awakening in us, usually through His Signs to pray and repent.

However, given the busy lives led by us all, many of us, fail to 'see' His Holy Signs to pray repent in order to come closer to Him, to acknowledge, know, feel and receive His Holy Messages and often through Our Heavenly Mother Mary given to us, 'speaking to our Hearts' and flowing His divine Loving Discernment through us which includes His knowledge on just how many Gifts and Blessings throughout our whole lives, He has given us through His Apostles and through our Heavenly Mother,

Merry Christ-mas and a happy new year.

Not about religion.

Not about brainwashing either; believing in our Creator is not a religion.

 

[Galilee63]

God is our Creator which is Jesus as 'One' in being with Him and the Holy Spirit.

As such, of course Jesus' Life and Teachings from God should always be taught in every one of His schools throughout Australia and throughout His world.

Merry Christ-mas and a happy New Year.

 

[madaz]

Ah, but it does,

You are mistaken.

 

[Tenebrae]

There are many Yanks who think that New Zealand is somewhere in Europe.


Which denominations would you like shared in school, anglican, penticostal, baptist, seventh day adventist, catholic, reformed?

The one think that the Yanks got right, separation of church and state

Jesus – The best kept secret in Australian schools

It's about sharing the gospel with kids here and now and how SRE in schools can only go so far.

 

[ebia]

There are many Yanks who think that New Zealand is somewhere in Europe. Which denominations would you like shared in school, anglican, penticostal, baptist, seventh day adventist, catholic, reformed? The one think that the Yanks got right, separation of church and state

That just picks one worldview and imposes that without critical attention on our schools, or fails to offer a coherent education at all. It doesn't really solve the problem, it just hopes that nobody notices the slight of hand.

 

[Observer]

Madaz - if you don't tell a child about any other religions or beliefs and teach them to believe in nothing spiritual, then like you said, children are gullible so that's what they will believe. It's all indoctrination, whether you are teaching your kids to be Christian, Atheist, Wiccan, Muslim or anything else. I was raised in an atheist household. The only supernatural thing I was taught existed was santa claud and the easter bunny, who I was then told never existed. That greatly affects someone's ability to believe in anything as an adult. So if you really want to be neutral, you'd have to teach your kids about ALL beliefs, including beliefs about Jesus, Muhammad etc. But obviously people teach their children about what they believe. It's perfectly natural. I'd teach my children to be vegetarian and only feed them as such. People have told me that's brainwashing, but if that's brainwashing then so is teaching them to eat meat. Everything is taught, a lot of what we take for granted as natural and normal are taught behaviours. We all have the right to teach our children what we believe is correct, providing it doesn't involve sexual, physical or psychological abuse of any kind.

When I was in school, it was all very secular, nothing mentioned about God or spirituality or even philosophy of any kind (in primary school - I don't know what they did in high school because I didn't go to high school). But we did have an OPTIONAL religious education class which parents could enrol or not enrol their children in. That seems fair. As kids get older, into the later high school years, if there are studies relating to philosophy, religion etc then they should have the option to do that. The point is no one should be forced to do anything. Some schools have mandatory bible studies and RE classes but they're not public

 

[madaz]

Madaz - if you don't tell a child about any other religions or beliefs and teach them to believe in nothing spiritual, then like you said, children are gullible so that's what they will believe. It's all indoctrination, whether you are teaching your kids to be Christian, Atheist, Wiccan, Muslim or anything else. I was raised in an atheist household. The only supernatural thing I was taught existed was santa claud and the easter bunny, who I was then told never existed. That greatly affects someone's ability to believe in anything as an adult. So if you really want to be neutral, you'd have to teach your kids about ALL beliefs, including beliefs about Jesus, Muhammad etc.

(Bolded by me)

Observer-That was my point.

But obviously people teach their children about what they believe. It's perfectly natural. I'd teach my children to be vegetarian and only feed them as such. People have told me that's brainwashing, but if that's brainwashing then so is teaching them to eat meat. Everything is taught, a lot of what we take for granted as natural and normal are taught behaviours. We all have the right to teach our children what we believe is correct, providing it doesn't involve sexual, physical or psychological abuse of any kind.

When I was in school, it was all very secular, nothing mentioned about God or spirituality or even philosophy of any kind (in primary school - I don't know what they did in high school because I didn't go to high school). But we did have an OPTIONAL religious education class which parents could enrol or not enrol their children in. That seems fair. As kids get older, into the later high school years, if there are studies relating to philosophy, religion etc then they should have the option to do that. The point is no one should be forced to do anything. Some schools have mandatory bible studies and RE classes but they're not public

Here in Australia RE classes are included in public schools too, government guidelines stipulate that no particular religion is to be taught or preached, yet almost all (99%) RE classes are indeed Christian, government guidlines stipulate that all children by default are not included in RE, parents must opt their children in, yet despite 3 written requests to remove my children from RE they have been placed back into RE. It took a threat of legal action to the principle before she finally removed my children from RE.