did Judas actually cast out demons

[Clare73]

Yes, He did. But at what point did the LORD harden Pharoah's heart?

At the point he withheld his softening grace.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Lion King]

No, they are the few whose love will not grow cold.

The most would be like those in Mt 7:21-22. Do you think they believed they loved Jesus?
Yet he said to them, "I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

In the faith,
Clare

Interesting. How do explain this passage in Revelation:


“To the angel of the church in Ephesus write:

These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands. I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked people, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary.

Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. But you have this in your favor: You hate the practices of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.

Whoever has ears, let them hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To the one who is victorious, I will give the right to eat from the tree of life, which is in the paradise of God. Revelation 2:1-7


Are you saying that those people in the Church in Ephesus being warned by Christ are not His children? Im only asking, since you claim that those who are born of God never cease loving.

 

[Clare73]

Are you saying Saul was never a child of God?

Saul was not born again.

I'm not too sure why you think a person with the Holy-Spirit in their hearts is always obedient

Now, don't be putting words in my mouth.

For instance, David had the Holy-Spirit dwelling in him, but still went and committed adultery and murder.

Did he give evidence of repentance and obedience in his life?

Both Samson and David had the Holy-Spirit in their hearts.

Then both gave evidence of repentance and obedience in their lives.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Lion King]

At the point he withheld his softening grace.

In the faith,
Clare

When do the Scriptures say that God hardened Pharoah's heart? Was it at the beginning, the middle or the end of the whole ordeal?

 

[Clare73]

I'm still failing to see how John 3:3 and Romans 8:7-8 say that one is born of the holy-Spirit before coming to Christ?

Would you mind expanding on the above verses, or better yet, provide other clear Scriptural passages that say so?

We are born spiritually dead in Adam's sin (Ro 5:18-19), and by nature objects of God's wrath (Eph 2:3), which is removed only by faith in Jesus Christ (Jn 3:36).

We are by our fallen nature hostile and insubordinate to God, as well as spiritually powerless (Ro 8:7).

Being spiritually powerless, we not only cannot, but do not desire to, come to Christ (Ro 8:7).
Being spiritually powerless, we can't even see the kingdom of God (Jn 3:3), much less seek it.
We must be raised from spiritual death and reborn into eternal life by the Holy Spirit before we can do anything
spiritually pleasing to God.

Does that answer your question?

This still doesn't answer my question.

But it does.

Scripture states we cannot come to Jesus, repent, believe or anything else apart from the Holy Spirit enabling us.

The Scriptures say that the LORD gifts a person the Holy-Spirit, ONCE they believe in Jesus Christ, and NOT before as you are claiming.

When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and said to Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?”

Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. The promise is for you and your children and for all who are far off—for all whom the Lord our God will call.” Acts 2:37-39

In receiving the "gift" of the Holy Spirit, was Peter speaking of the indwelling, or of an outward manifestion of the Spirit in gifts, such as tongues, when they repented and were baptized?

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Lion King]

Saul was not born again.

Again, interesting.

After Saul returned from pursuing the Philistines, he was told, “David is in the Desert of En Gedi.” So Saul took three thousand able young men from all Israel and set out to look for David and his men near the Crags of the Wild Goats.

He came to the sheep pens along the way; a cave was there, and Saul went in to relieve himself. David and his men were far back in the cave. The men said, “This is the day the Lord spoke of when he said to you, ‘I will give your enemy into your hands for you to deal with as you wish.’” Then David crept up unnoticed and cut off a corner of Saul’s robe.

Afterward, David was conscience-stricken for having cut off a corner of his robe. He said to his men, “The Lord forbid that I should do such a thing to my master, the Lord’s anointed, or lay my hand on him; for he is the anointed of the Lord.” With these words David sharply rebuked his men and did not allow them to attack Saul. And Saul left the cave and went his way.

Then David went out of the cave and called out to Saul, “My lord the king!” When Saul looked behind him, David bowed down and prostrated himself with his face to the ground. 1 Samuel 24:1-8


Why did David claim that Saul was the LORD's anointed?

Now, don't be putting words in my mouth.

I apologize.

Did he give evidence of repentance and obedience in his life?

Then both gave evidence of repentance and obedience in their lives.

Were Samson and David always obedient?

 

[Lion King]

Yes, their lamps were without the oil of the Holy Spirit (see Zec 4).

The born again are the light of the world whose lamps are fueled by the oil of the Holy Spirit.

In Rev 1:13-20, the churches are lamps.

In the faith,
Clare

I'm not sure I understand?

Are you claiming the 5 foolish virgins lamps had different oil as compared to the 5 wise virgins? I thought the 5 foolish virgins simply ran out of oil, unlike the other five virgins who carried oil in their jars also.

No?

 

[Clare73]

So, you do admit that the sheep can go astray?

No more than anyone can snatch them from Jesus' or the Father's hand (Jn 10:28-29).

They are kept from going astray by the power of the Holy Spirit through warnings, admonitions and commands, which they heed because of the indwelling Holy Spirit.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Lion King]

No more than anyone can snatch them from Jesus' or the Father's hand (Jn 10:28-29).

They are kept from going astray by the power of the Holy Spirit through warnings, admonitions and commands, which they heed because of the indwelling Holy Spirit.

In the faith,
Clare

Did Jesus Christ lose Judas Iscariot?

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in your name: those that you gave me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. John 17:12

 

[Clare73]

Interesting. How do explain this passage in Revelation:

“To the angel of the church in Ephesus write:

These are the words of him who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven golden lampstands. I know your deeds, your hard work and your perseverance. I know that you cannot tolerate wicked people, that you have tested those who claim to be apostles but are not, and have found them false. You have persevered and have endured hardships for my name, and have not grown weary.

Yet I hold this against you: You have forsaken the love you had at first. Consider how far you have fallen! Repent and do the things you did at first. If you do not repent, I will come to you and remove your lampstand from its place. But you have this in your favor: You hate the practices of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate.

An excellent example of Jesus keeping the sheep from fatally going astray through warning and admonition.

Those in the church of Ephesus who were sheep heard him loud and clear.
I suspect even the goats did also, but without the power of the Holy Spirit, they would eventually return to that state again.

Are you saying that those people in the Church in Ephesus being warned by Christ are not His children? Im only asking, since you claim that those who are born of God never cease loving.

They have fallen out of their first love, the lively, responsive, deeply-felt love, into a less responsive, lively, and felt love.
'Tis what fallen human nature can do.

Jesus' warnings will move the sheep, by the power of the Holy Spirit, to return to their discipleship.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Clare73]

When do the Scriptures say that God hardened Pharoah's heart? Was it at the beginning, the middle or the end of the whole ordeal?

At the beginning (Ex 4:21), before he ever sent Moses to Pharoah.

And it is repeated in the course of events, as well as Pharoah hardening his own heart, which is what all are born with.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Clare73]

Again, interesting.

After Saul returned from pursuing the Philistines, he was told, “David is in the Desert of En Gedi.” So Saul took three thousand able young men from all Israel and set out to look for David and his men near the Crags of the Wild Goats.

He came to the sheep pens along the way; a cave was there, and Saul went in to relieve himself. David and his men were far back in the cave. The men said, “This is the day the Lord spoke of when he said to you, ‘I will give your enemy into your hands for you to deal with as you wish.’” Then David crept up unnoticed and cut off a corner of Saul’s robe.

Afterward, David was conscience-stricken for having cut off a corner of his robe. He said to his men, “The Lord forbid that I should do such a thing to my master, the Lord’s anointed, or lay my hand on him; for he is the anointed of the Lord.” With these words David sharply rebuked his men and did not allow them to attack Saul. And Saul left the cave and went his way.

Then David went out of the cave and called out to Saul, “My lord the king!” When Saul looked behind him, David bowed down and prostrated himself with his face to the ground. 1 Samuel 24:1-8

Why did David claim that Saul was the LORD's anointed?

Because he was appointed king by God.

But anointing is not rebirth.

Were Samson and David always obedient?

Are any of the reborn always obedient?

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Clare73]

I'm not sure I understand?

Are you claiming the 5 foolish virgins lamps had different oil as compared to the 5 wise virgins? I thought the 5 foolish virgins simply ran out of oil, unlike the other five virgins who carried oil in their jars also.

No?

Saul also "ran out of oil."

It's a parable, an analogy.

The oil is faith. The foolish virgins had a different faith which was counterfeit, while the wise virgins had true saving faith.
The wise virgins could not give them their saving faith, for the foolish virgins must receive it from the provider of faith,
the Holy Spirit (Jn 3:5).

The foolish virgins ran out of faith because it was counterfeit faith, as did those in Lk 8:13,
who received the word with joy but had no root (saving faith).
They believe for a while, but in the time of testing they fall away, because their faith is counterfeit (their soil is shallow--Mk 4:5).

The wise virgins did not "run out of" faith because it was the true saving faith of rebirth.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Clare73]

Did Jesus Christ lose Judas Iscariot?

While I was with them in the world, I kept them in your name: those that you gave me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled. John 17:12

Judas was never really saved, he was always lost.

And with that, it's good night.

In the faith,
Clare

 

[Lion King]

Good night, and thank you for the time and patience.

May the LORD bless you.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Since Scripture doesn't say one way or the other, it's really not ours to know one way or the other what Judas may or may not have done that has not been written for us.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[miamited]

what is the counterfeit faith when those you call counterfeit declare that Jesus is the Son of God who died on the cross for the remission of our sins, was buried and raised to life three days later who now sits at the right hand of God the Father

Hi t2tw,

I would ask you, in light of this comment and several that followed in your subsequent posts to consider this event and and ask yourself the followup questions:

Jesus spoke to his disciples about that great and terrible day of God's judgment. He said to them: "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,'http://www.biblestudytools.com/matthew/7.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-15 will enter the kingdom of heaven,http://www.biblestudytools.com/matthew/7.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-16 but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day,http://www.biblestudytools.com/matthew/7.html#cr-descriptionAnchor-18 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'

Here are the questions: Do you believe that these people that Jesus is speaking to, if asked when they were alive if Jesus was the Son of God, they would have responded, "yes"? Do you believe if these people had been asked when they were alive if Jesus had died on the cross, would they have responded, "yes"? What about if Jesus was raised in three days or is now at the right hand of God? Do you further believe that any of them would have believed these things?

Clare is correct. One must be born again and when one is born again, all truth is revealed to them by the Holy Spirit. It is his job according to our Lord and Savior, Jesus. Now, you might ask, "Well, how do we know if one is born again or not?" Friend, that's a little more difficult. Jesus likened the work of the Holy Spirit upon the earth as a wind. You cannot see it or know where it's going.

Consider and ponder and pray over these things.

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted

 

[Lion King]

Hi t2tw,

Here are the questions: Do you believe that these people that Jesus is speaking to, if asked when they were alive if Jesus was the Son of God, they would have responded, "yes"? Do you believe if these people had been asked when they were alive if Jesus had died on the cross, would they have responded, "yes"? What about if Jesus was raised in three days or is now at the right hand of God? Do you further believe that any of them would have believed these things?

To be honest, no one knows the answers to those questions, except God.

Clare is correct. One must be born again and when one is born again, all truth is revealed to them by the Holy Spirit. It is his job according to our Lord and Savior, Jesus. Now, you might ask, "Well, how do we know if one is born again or not?" Friend, that's a little more difficult. Jesus likened the work of the Holy Spirit upon the earth as a wind. You cannot see it or know where it's going.

Consider and ponder and pray over these things.

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted

Personally, I don't think it's that difficult to know if one is born again or not as you make it out to be. After all, the Scriptures do say:

Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. Matthew 12:33



As I asked Clare73 before, how is one born of God? Is it not by believing in Jesus Christ? Is it not by believing Christ is the Son of God? Is it not by believing that He died for our sins? Is it not by believing that Christ rose again?

 

[true2theword]

No, they are the few whose love will not grow cold.

The "most" would be like those in Mt 7:21-23. Do you think they believed that they loved Jesus?
Yet he said to them, "I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

In the faith,
Clare

I would NOTequate these people in Mathew 7:21-23 to be Christians whose faith grew cold, on the contrary! these folks were boasting in all the works they did under the power of the Holy Spirit and in the NAME of Jesus...................yet we see from scripture none of it was the will of the Father but they were working in they're own will and direction

 

[true2theword]

Yes, I think we see that from symbolism in several Scriptures.

In Rev 1:13-20, the churches, people of God, are lamps.

And the born again are the light of the world whose lamps are fueled by the oil of the Holy Spirit.

The foolish virgins are lamps without oil of the Holy Spirit (see Zec 4).

In the faith,
Clare

sister do you not see what you are saying? read very carefully what the virgins said "give us some of your oil, FOR OUR LAMPS ARE GOING OUT!"

these five foolish virgins had lamps that were LIT (they had the Holy Spirit) if we are to interpret the scripture to mean the oil represents the Holy Spirit........which I strongly disagree considering what happens next

as the foolish virgins are told to go buy some (Holy Spirit) oil from someone who sells the (Holy Spirit) oil then after purchasing (Holy Spirit) and they now have their lamps filled with (Holy Spirit) they are to late and the door has been shut


your interpretation says that after the bridegroom comes people will still be getting the Holy Spirit, but this filling of the Holy Spirit will not be any good to them because it will be to late to inherit eternal life


where in all of biblical theology do you see God pouring out His Spirit after the return of the bridegroom Jesus

a better interpretation would be half of all Christians will not be looking and prepared for the second return of Jesus