• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

"Does God exist?" Only someone, already in God, can know!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Gracchus

Senior Veteran
Dec 21, 2002
7,199
821
California
Visit site
✟38,182.00
Faith
Pantheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
[paraphrase] It is a personal experience.
Schizophrenia is more than a personal experience. It is also partly delusion.
And if your personal experience was partly delusional, you wouldn't know it.

:thumbsup:
 
Upvote 0

Gottservant

God loves your words, may men love them also
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2006
11,383
704
46
✟276,687.00
Faith
Messianic
This would eliminate the possibility of there being no God then, in which case the existence of God is certain.

And if the existence of God is certain, then one does not need to be in God to know, rendering your argument flawed beyond recovery.

I find this a quite eloquent use of nervous tension, admittedly circular.

Allow me to demonstrate that you do not retain the point, by the Grace of God.

Certainty is not knowledge.

Certainty is defined by a position within the truth, the knowledge of which (truth) is given by the Peace of God (a balance between pleasure and pain).

If you do not know your position, you cannot be certain. If you cannot be certain you cannot have Peace. If you cannot have Peace you cannot have the Peace of God. If you cannot have the Peace of God, you cannot have the Knowledge of God, since you are not in God or God would give you either. Ergo you have a choice to be in God that would give you certainty, whether or not you had knowledge, given time (which you may exchange for Peace, being sufficiently calm). Therefore if you take God as certainty, and assume it is also knowledge, without exercising your Choice for further Peace or Knowledge, you either want Peace but can't keep it for lack of knowledge or you want knowledge without certainty, since the position you have taken on the Choice that would grant it to you, is that the Certainty which Knowledge should have given you, is now in the Knowledge you continue to want (without position, because you deny God). EDIT: I admit this is dense, but I have made the argument as literal as possible in the event that you do not accept that Certainty is not Knowledge on the basis of common sense (common sense which obviates the need for complicated explanations. Read on! I make it simpler.)

You cannot have position, and deny God.

Also, just because you keep wanting Certainty when you think of Knowledge, does not make the Certainty of knowing God in God, knowledge that is equivalent with Certainty.

If it were true that you could have certainty every time you had knowledge, you would always know your name and never anybody else's.

Ergo Certainty is not knowledge and your argument is false. That is not a problem if you can forget about it.

I forgive.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Gottservant

God loves your words, may men love them also
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2006
11,383
704
46
✟276,687.00
Faith
Messianic
How can anybody be "IN" a deity? It just makes no sense.

Perhaps you may want to define what "in god" means....

You retain resistance to the Devil, for the purpose of remaining where God wants you to be (that you may continue to give his Name Glory).

The fact that you resist the Devil, to whom the Name of God is Death, means that when you come to give Glory to the Name that has brought the Devil to Death (which you want to do because he tried to kill you, or steal from you, or destroy you) you cannot help but love.

If you love, God can be anywhere He wants to be, and if you fear, that means he can be everywhere, and so if He can be everywhere, then you are "in Him".

The rest is belief.
 
Upvote 0

Gottservant

God loves your words, may men love them also
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2006
11,383
704
46
✟276,687.00
Faith
Messianic
Going with first impressions, because that is the only way to answer the question without it falling apart, it is illogical to rely on ideologically immersed believers to disprove a hypothesis. Therefore, the best way to prove the existence of God is with non-believers.

The opposite (believers to non-believers) does not (automatically or otherwise) make the argument (that was opposed, eg. "God exists") a valid dispute (a reason to deny the claim).

I regard your comment about schizophrenia as speculation.
 
Upvote 0

madaz

dyslexic agnostic insomniac
Mar 14, 2012
1,408
26
Gold Coast Australia
✟24,455.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
You retain resistance to the Devil, for the purpose of remaining where God wants you to be (that you may continue to give his Name Glory).

The fact that you resist the Devil, to whom the Name of God is Death, means that when you come to give Glory to the Name that has brought the Devil to Death (which you want to do because he tried to kill you, or steal from you, or destroy you) you cannot help but love.

If you love, God can be anywhere He wants to be, and if you fear, that means he can be everywhere, and so if He can be everywhere, then you are "in Him".

The rest is belief.
Oh my gosh!
Are you on drugs or something? What you have just said is entirely nonsense.
 
Upvote 0

Gottservant

God loves your words, may men love them also
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2006
11,383
704
46
✟276,687.00
Faith
Messianic
Oh my gosh!
Are you on drugs or something? What you have just said is entirely nonsense.

English for english does not equal "answer".

Not only have you tried to explain something that is not rational (my undeclared motivations), you have not mentioned a single thing that would show you are sane (like the concepts I gave you to explain something you have declared you "know" has no meaning).
 
Upvote 0

madaz

dyslexic agnostic insomniac
Mar 14, 2012
1,408
26
Gold Coast Australia
✟24,455.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
English for english does not equal "answer".


Not only have you tried to explain something that is not rational (my undeclared motivations), you have not mentioned a single thing that would show you are sane (like the concepts I gave you to explain something you have declared you "know" has no meaning).

Your answer above fits YOU precisely, are you posting while looking in the mirror?
I have not tried to explain anything, I have simply requested an explanation from you because you continually post nonsense. Obviously you either have a cognitive disability or perhaps maybe you are under the influence of narcotics?
 
Upvote 0

madaz

dyslexic agnostic insomniac
Mar 14, 2012
1,408
26
Gold Coast Australia
✟24,455.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
You have mentioned drugs twice now. A psychiatrist under the influence of the Devil could easily assume you lack self-control.

I can excuse your nonsense on the grounds of intoxication but can not accept it on the grounds of mental disability.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Gottservant

God loves your words, may men love them also
Site Supporter
Aug 3, 2006
11,383
704
46
✟276,687.00
Faith
Messianic
I can excuse your nonsense on the grounds of intoxication but can not accept it on the grounds of mental disability.

What desire do you have to judge me?

Am I a fool that I use your words, with wise structure and yet you understand nothing?
 
Upvote 0

madaz

dyslexic agnostic insomniac
Mar 14, 2012
1,408
26
Gold Coast Australia
✟24,455.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
What desire do you have to judge me?

Am I a fool that I use your words, with wise structure and yet you understand nothing?

You are a fool for not explaining the reason for your apparent delusion. That is why I can only assume intoxication or cognitive malfunction within you. You have failed to answer all my questions and insist on causing more confusion when clarity is requested.
 
Upvote 0

madaz

dyslexic agnostic insomniac
Mar 14, 2012
1,408
26
Gold Coast Australia
✟24,455.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
The question "Does God exist?" has provoked many answers. Perhaps the most simple answer is simply that you have to be in God, before you can know.

There is only one simple answer, yes or no.

Nobody knows.

The first person who knows will be famous indeed.

Until we know we can only believe or in my case lack a belief.

If you really want to believe the answer is yes, then its possible that all sorts of personal experiences may help reinforce your belief to yourself.

I can speak from experience.

What you are explaining is a personal experience that supports your belief, but even an infinite amount of belief will not allow you to know.
 
Upvote 0

Dave Ellis

Contributor
Dec 27, 2011
8,933
821
Toronto, Ontario
✟59,815.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
In Relationship
Politics
CA-Conservatives
No one can deceive as good as Krishna. If Krishna truly wishes to deceive someone, that person can NEVER know the truth. And you do not know the truth.

How do you know Krishna isn't deceiving you and I'm actually right?
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.