SN1987A

[Nabobalis]

And continue to make stuff up.

You have to remember that only true believers can make these interpretations, we mere mortals are just not good enough.

 

[Jamin4422]

God also created a beam of light when he created the star.

I do not think that is his understanding of God Stretched-out the Heavens

[FONT=arial, sans-serif]. Isaiah 40:22. As you know if God stretched out the heavens at warp speed then there would be a corresponding decay rate because of the amount of energy involved in light going one million times the speed of light. I am not a Star Trek fan, so I am not sure how they managed to go warp speed in the movie. Although of course now they are using the Worm Hole Theory. [/FONT]​

 

[CabVet]

I do not think that is his understanding of God Stretched-out the Heavens

I never said it was. What I said was if God created the universe 14,000 years ago and the start is trillions of KM away, the only way we can see this star is if He created a beam of light together with the star.

 

[AV1611VET]

Light-year is as much a unit of time as it is of distance,

Yes ... haven't I been making that point here?

... it does not matter if you call it "away" or "ago".

Yes, it does.

Something like this:

This star is located 1.58940277055609e+18km from earth. At the same time as He created the star, God created a beam of light 1.58940277055609e+18km long.

Now why would I say that?

First of all, even Wikipedia doesn't talk like that. It uses 'kiloparsecs.'

Second of all, God didn't created a 168,000 light year beam of light, when He created the star.

The star was much closer to the earth at the time, remember?

Both the star and the earth are in the hollow of God's hand.

 

[Jamin4422]

I never said it was. What I said was if God created the universe 14,000 years ago and the start is trillions of KM away, the only way we can see this star is if He created a beam of light together with the star.

Ok, that is what you said, now can you give me the science for that? Because I was under the impression we are talking about the parts of the Bible that science is able to verify. There are some YEC people around. But for the most part most Christians have no problem with Science and are for the most part GAP or OEC. Even if they have no idea on how to explain any of that.

 

[CabVet]

Ok, that is what you said, now can you give me the science for that? Because I was under the impression we are talking about the parts of the Bible that science is able to verify. There are some YEC people around. But for the most part most Christians have no problem with Science and are for the most part GAP or OEC. Even if they have no idea on how to explain any of that.

There is no science supporting that or any other part of the Creation myth. It is just AV's interpretation.

 

[CabVet]

First of all, even Wikipedia doesn't talk like that. It uses 'kiloparsecs.'

Second of all, God didn't created a 168,000 light year beam of light, when He created the star.

The star was much closer to the earth at the time, remember?

Both the star and the earth are in the hollow of God's hand.

Wikipedia calls it Kiloparsecs because it does not want to print that many zeros.

Are you even remotely aware of what would be necessary for a star to move 168,000 light years in 14,000 years? Did you know there are stars that are much, much further than that? At the very least it would require stars to move much faster that the speed of light.

Do the math: If, on creation day, God created all stars and they moved to where they are today very quickly, we would not be able to see most of them. The second a star moves away from earth faster than the speed of light, we stop seeing its light. In other words, if God creates a star and it immediately starts moving at a speed of 1,000 light years, in one year it would be 1,000 light years away and we would not be able to see its light.

So, rapid expansion or not, we would still not see the light of stars that are far away. The only way to see them is if a beam of light equal to the distance of the star was created at the same time.

 

[AV1611VET]

Are you even remotely aware of what would be necessary for a star to move 168,000 light years in 14,000 years?

No ... and I really don't care to.

And if you understood the OP correctly, your question would be:

Are you even remotely aware of what would be necessary for a star to be moved 168,000 light years in a moment of time?

Nothing took 14,000 years to do, since this universe has only been in operation for 6015 years; give or take 5 years or so.

Put your science books back on the shelf and concentrate on the OP, will you?

Your science is getting in the way and preventing you from understanding.

 

[Cromulent]

Yes, damn that pesky "evidence" and need for things to have "actually happened".

 

[CabVet]

Put your science books back on the shelf and concentrate on the OP, will you?

Your science is getting in the way and preventing you from understanding.

You are the one that started with the science by saying the stars moved faster "back then". If you give scientific explanations you should expect scientific criticism. Here, in case you forgot:

The star was much closer to the earth at the time, remember?

By saying that "the star was much closer to the earth at the time", you imply that it moved very fast to get where it is now. If you don't want scientific criticism you should just say "God did it".

 

[RickG]

I've given a scenario that I think settles the matter about the light we see from SN1987A; all this other stuff about Magellan and other things are side issues, as far as I'm concerned.

Yup! Just like I said in my previous post. Pick and choose what you want and ignore all the other "inconvenient" facts.

Fact is, the layman would see nothing more than a dim star for a few months. He would not be able to recognize its appearance or disappearance without significant visual aid. Probably the closest thing to compare it with it by the naked eye is the galaxy Andromeda, which looks like a dim star without significant magnification. Without vigilant astronomers searching for such events, no one would have known it occurred.

But you know what? A very significant fact was learned from SN1987A, 168,000 light years away. Astronomers observed gamma ray burst in which radionuclides were identified and observed decaying. You know what? Those decay rates that were observed that occurred 168,000 years ago are exactly the same as those measured decay rates of radionuclides today. That means young earthers are dead wrong when they claim decay rates were different in the past. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yup! Just like I said in my previous post. Pick and choose what you want and ignore all the other "inconvenient" facts.

I have to ... else I'd still be debating the Flood, which has more side issues than Carter has liver pills.

Fact is, the layman would see nothing more than a dim star for a few months. He would not be able to recognize its appearance or disappearance without significant visual aid.

I gave the date it was discovered in my OP; probably the exact date God wanted it discovered.

Remember?

God then destroys Sanduleak's home (the supergiant star), circa 2345 B.C. and moves the light from its destruction across space for "discovery" on 23 February 1987.

As I said, it's an end-times thing.

Probably the closest thing to compare it with it by the naked eye is the galaxy Andromeda, which looks like a dim star without significant magnification.

If you say so, I won't dispute it.

Without vigilant astronomers searching for such events, no one would have known it occurred.

Then let's hear it for vigilant astronomers.

But you know what?

A side issue is about to rear its head?

A very significant fact was learned from SN1987A, 168,000 light years away. Astronomers observed gamma ray burst in which radionuclides were identified and observed decaying. You know what? Those decay rates that were observed that occurred 168,000 years ago are exactly the same as those measured decay rates of radionuclides today.

Oh, my ... looks like "168,000 years ago" is going to make its way into this thread again.

Suit yourself ... just don't expect me to play along.

That means young earthers are dead wrong when they claim decay rates were different in the past.

I wouldn't know.

 

[JustMeSee]

Not sure how God would feel about you creating stuff on your own.
Seems one is using science to rewrite the Bible, and sharing these fantasies.

 

[RickG]

I have to ... else I'd still be debating the Flood, which has more side issues than Carter has liver pills.

Yeah! Keep ignoring all the facts that are inconvenient.

I gave the date it was discovered in my OP; probably the exact date God wanted it discovered.

What separates it out from all the other observed supernovae's? Or are you just picking one out and running with it. Wouldn't one that could be seen from the northern hemisphere and by anyone looking up in the sky have a bit more significance? SN1987A is only significant to scientists. The layman has no clue it ever occurred or exists.

 

[AV1611VET]

Not sure how God would feel about you creating stuff on your own.
Seems one is using science to rewrite the Bible, and sharing these fantasies.

For your information, I am not 'creating stuff on my own.'

 

[NGC 6712]

Chuck Missler shows 14 passages from the Scriptures pertaining to the universe being stretched.

Chuck Missler - LOL LOL LOL

He'd show you 83 passages that imply you should donate money to his incompetent backside.

 

[Split Rock]

Just my thoughts on SN1987A, FWIW:

SN1987A: A blue supergiant star, created in BC4004 in the hollow of God's hand for the angel Sanduleak, i.e. his home. SN1987A was then 'ballooned' to the distance of 168,000 light years distance from the earth, with its starlight kept intact on the earth, when God stretched the universe.

Psalm 104:2b who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain:

Circa 2300 B.C., Sanduleak leaves his home and comes to earth and marries a woman here; settling down and having [giant] children.

God destroys the world with a global flood and confines Sanduleak to:

Jude 6: And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

God then destroys Sanduleak's home (the supergiant star), circa 2345 B.C. and moves the light from its destruction across space for "discovery" on 23 February 1987.

And all the while, science took hikes as necessary.

Who is this Sanduleak fallen angel dude???

 

[AV1611VET]

Who is this Sanduleak fallen angel dude???

A name I made up, after the name of the star.

It's just a made-up name for reference purposes.

Sanduleak -69° 202 was a magnitude 12 blue supergiant star, located on the outskirts of the Trantula Nebula in the Large Magellanic Cloud. The star was discovered by the Romanian-American astronomer Nicholas Sanduleak.

SOURCE

 

[variant]

Welcome to the next edition of AV makes stuff up to suit his world-view and cherry picks the bible for some unconvincing support.

 

[AV1611VET]

Welcome to the next edition of AV makes stuff up to suit his world-view and cherry picks the bible for some unconvincing support.

As long as you guys stop harping on SN1987A, I'll be happy; at least now I have a thread to QV you guys to, when you want an explanation.