Is the bible's portrayal of hell, literal?

[SlightlyMad]

Is 'The lake of fire' as portrayed in the bible, literal? or is it merely symbolic? I'm just really confused.

 

[JHM]

Well, I think of "The Lake Of Fire" as lying 20 miles below your feet. And when the greatest earthquake since man has been on the earth splits Babylon in three parts, a fair number of people are going to wind up in said "Lake Of Fire".

 

[TheMightyTurtle]

Is 'The lake of fire' as portrayed in the bible, literal? or is it merely symbolic? I'm just really confused.

Symbolic. The book of Revelations is not to be taken literally.

 

[thesunisout]

Is 'The lake of fire' as portrayed in the bible, literal? or is it merely symbolic? I'm just really confused.

Jesus said it is eternal fire:

Matthew 25:41

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels.

It is a place of eternal conscious torment. It was created for Satan and his angels but those who follow his ways and refuse to repent will end up there as well.

 

[Laura Phillips]

symbolic

 

[Laura Phillips]

and in heaven it doesn't exist at all




______________________________
The kingdom of heaven is in your hearts

 

[tackattack]

Another thread about hell? Ok my opinion from the scriptures already read, studied and shared by many on here is this. I agree with sunisout that Jesus said it was eternal fire, but I don't believe it is eternal conscious torment. I think whether figurative or literal is unimportant. I don't think we should go around fearing punishment or seeking reward from God.

 

[VCViking]

Literal and eternal torment. This dead horse has been beaten too many times around here.

To teach otherwise is heretical and unorthodox,


http://www.christianforums.com/faq/?...l&titlesonly=0

Sin Has a Penalty

"For the wages of sin is death." --Romans 6:23 (NIV)

Just as criminals must pay the penalty for their crimes, sinners must pay the penalty for their sins. If you continue to sin, you will pay the penalty of spiritual death: You will not only die physically; you will also be separated from our holy God for all eternity. The Bible teaches that those who choose to remain separated from God will spend eternity in a place called hell.

 

[thesunisout]

Another thread about hell? Ok my opinion from the scriptures already read, studied and shared by many on here is this. I agree with sunisout that Jesus said it was eternal fire, but I don't believe it is eternal conscious torment. I think whether figurative or literal is unimportant. I don't think we should go around fearing punishment or seeking reward from God.

Revelation 14:11

And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

I believe it is eternal and conscious based on this scripture, and a few others, so I am not just pulling it out of a hat. I can also think of a good reason for it being that way, which is compatible with the love of God.

I think you'll agree with me that eternal conscious torment in hell is the worst punishment anyone could ever conceive of. I think you'll also agree with me that if God allows us to have free will, He must do something to discourage sin as much as possible in His Universe without violating that free will. Well, I can think of nothing that would discourage sin more than the sentence of eternal punishment in hell. If God punished sin with a lesser punishment, such as annihiliation, then you could actually make an argument against the love of God by saying that God was not doing everything he could to discourage sin in the world. I've met more than a few people who have told me they would vastly prefer that their existence was wiped out permanently, so for some people, this wouldn't even be a punishment. There are probably quite a few people who would enjoy the proposition of doing whatever they wanted in this life even if it meant they would be destroyed forever in the next. So in that manner annihiliation will actually encourage sin. Since a loving God would discourage sin as much as possible, the idea of eternal conscious torment in hell is not incompatible with the love of God, since God would actually be less loving for ordaining a lesser punishment for sin.

 

[Timothew]

Is 'The lake of fire' as portrayed in the bible, literal? or is it merely symbolic? I'm just really confused.

John (who wrote the Book of Revelation) said what he meant by the Lake of Fire. He said "The Lake of Fire is the second death." So the Lake of Fire is symbolic of the second death. The Lake of Fire is NOT eternal conscious torment, because it is death. Dead people can't be tormented. The Bible says that the wages of sin is death. Death means death, not eternal torment in hell.

 

[Timothew]

Literal and eternal torment. To teach otherwise is heretical and unorthodox,

Why do you think it's heretical?
The Bible says that the wages of sin is death. Don't you believe the Bible?
It is heretical to quote the bible?

Actually the doctrine of eternal torture in hell is heretical because it contradicts what the bible says. "Whoever believes in him will not perish but will have eternal life." That's written in John 3:16.

 

[VCViking]

Why do you think it's heretical?
The Bible says that the wages of sin is death. Don't you believe the Bible?
It is heretical to quote the bible?

Actually the doctrine of eternal torture in hell is heretical because it contradicts what the bible says. "Whoever believes in him will not perish but will have eternal life." That's written in John 3:16.

You have been warned of this heresy on other recent threads. For me to continue this debate would violate Scripture.

It also violates the SOF of CF.

 

[jtjesuslover]

The book of Revelation may have a lot of symbolism, that doesn't take away from the fact that Jesus Christ Himself teaches on the subject of eternal punishment or eternal salvation. What about Matthew 25:46?

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."


You see, the words "death" and "grave" are also symbolic and have different meanings in the bible. The Second Death doesn't take away from the fact that those who face the Lord's judgement and are sent into the lake of fire are going to face "eternal" pain, suffering and punishment.

Read your bibles, friends................ that's all I got to say about that.

 

[Timothew]

You have been warned of this heresy on other recent threads. For me to continue this debate would violate Scripture.

Which Scripture would that be? Thou Shalt not have a bible discussion? I haven't heard of that one.

It also violates the SOF of CF.

The SOF of CF is the Nicene Creed which says NOTHING about eternal torture in hell.

If you don't know why you believe in eternal torture in hell, that's Okay.
We don't have to discuss it. I know it makes you nervous.

 

[Timothew]

"And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal."

Read your bibles, friends................ that's all I got to say about that.

The righteous go into life eternal. And the unrighteous, they go into eternal life as well? If a person is tortured forever in hell, they must also have eternal life.

Read your bibles.

 

[jtjesuslover]

The righteous go into life eternal. And the unrighteous, they go into eternal life as well? If a person is tortured forever in hell, they must also have eternal life.

Read your bibles.

You're a smart guy and I respect your individual opinion. Eternal punishment is one aspect. Eternal "life" and glory and happiness with the Father is another.

It really blows me away when people on these forums get so caught up on words. Let us not take things out of context. "Life" has a special meaning to Christ. HE gives LIFE, not eternal punishment. You are so caught up on the words "life" and "death".

If Christ says those who disobey God and remain unrepentant until death will perish and suffer eternal torment and punishment, then I'll believe just that. Just because you "die" or "perish" doesn't necessarily mean you will not suffer in the lake of fire for all of eternity (because that's what the bible says). Whether that makes you feel uncomfortable or not I don't know, all I'm saying is we CANNOT sit here and argue over things we clearly cannot fully comprehend while we are still mere human beings, using human logic.

Those who get the chance to be among the angels and the Father will then and only then know eternal truth and have "all the answers".

Once again, I know you're set in your own belief, I just wanted to stress the fact that the bible clearly says "eternal punishment". I respect your opinion and mean no harm, brother.

 

[Timothew]

You're a smart guy and I respect your individual opinion. Eternal punishment is one aspect. Eternal "life" and glory and happiness with the Father is another.

It really blows me away when people on these forums get so caught up on words. Let us not take things out of context. "Life" has a special meaning to Christ. HE gives LIFE, not eternal punishment. You are so caught up on the words "life" and "death".

If Christ says those who disobey God and remain unrepentant until death will perish and suffer eternal torment and punishment, then I'll believe just that. Just because you "die" or "perish" doesn't necessarily mean you will not suffer in the lake of fire for all of eternity (because that's what the bible says). Whether that makes you feel uncomfortable or not I don't know, all I'm saying is we CANNOT sit here and argue over things we clearly cannot fully comprehend while we are still mere human beings, using human logic.

Those who get the chance to be among the angels and the Father will then and only then know eternal truth and have "all the answers".

Once again, I know you're set in your own belief, I just wanted to stress the fact that the bible clearly says "eternal punishment". I respect your opinion and mean no harm, brother.

Clearly "death" is the eternal punishment. I'm not "caught up on the words life and death", I just don't assign a meaning to "death" that means the complete opposite of death, "eternal life in hell." You can comprehend these things if you read what the writers of the bible wrote without assigning different meanings to all of the words. I'm just saying what the bible says. You can hold on to your beliefs if you want to. I don't care. I believe the bible. Whosoever believes in him will not perish but will have eternal life. The wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life. These pay the penalty of eternal destruction. Unless you repent, you will likewise perish. The person who sins will die. Whoever overcomes will not be affected by the second death.

Psalm 1:4-6
Not so the wicked!
They are like chaff
that the wind blows away.
Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment,
nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous.
For the Lord watches over the way of the righteous,
but the way of the wicked will perish.

Psalm 2:12
Kiss the Son, lest he be angry
and you be destroyed in your way,

Psalm 5:8
You destroy those who tell lies;
bloodthirsty and deceitful men
the Lord abhors

In order to hang on to the doctrine of eternal torment, Tormentalists have to ignore all of these passages and many many more. I could go on and on quoting bible verses that say the wicked are destroyed, they perish, they are consumed, they are no more. There really is no reason to hang on to the false doctrine or eternal torment. Tradition, maybe, but no BIBLICAL reason.

 

[Timothew]

The SOF of CF is the Nicene Creed which says NOTHING about eternal torture in hell.

CF supports the following as a statement of faith:


The Nicene Creed (with scriptural references)

We believe in (Romans 10:8-10; 1John 4:15)
ONE God, (Deuteronomy 6:4, Ephesians 4:6)
the Father (Matthew 6:9)
Almighty, (Exodus 6:3)
Maker of Heaven and Earth, (Genesis 1:1)
and of all things visible and invisible. (Colossians 1:15-16)

And in ONE Lord Jesus Christ, (Acts 11:17)
the Son of God, (Mathew 14:33; 16:16)
the Only-Begotten, (John 1:18; 3:16)
Begotten of the Father before all ages. (John 1:2)
Light of Light; (Psalm 27:1; John 8:12; Matthew 17:2,5)
True God of True God; (John 17:1-5)
Begotten, not made; (John 1:18)
of one essence with the Father (John 10:30)
by whom all things were made; (Hebrews 1:1-2)
Who for us men and for our salvation (1Timothy 2:4-5)
came down from Heaven, (John 6:33,35)
and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, (Luke 1:35)
and became man. (John 1:14)
And was crucified for us (Mark 15:25; 1Cointhians 15:3)
under Pontius Pilate, (John 19:6)
and suffered, (Mark 8:31)
and was buried. (Luke 23:53; 1Corinthians 15:4)
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures. (Luke 24:1 1Corinthians 15:4)
And ascended into Heaven, (Luke 24:51; Acts 1:10)
and sits at the right hand of the Father. (Mark 16:19; Acts 7:55)
And He shall come again with glory (Matthew 24:27)
to judge the living and the dead; (Acts 10:42; 2Timothy 4:1)
whose Kingdom shall have no end. (2 Peter 1:11)

And in the Holy Spirit, (John 14:26)
the Lord, (Acts 5:3-4)v
the Giver of Life, (Genesis 1:2)
Who proceeds from the Father; (John 15:26)
Who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified; (Matthew 3:16-17)
Who spoke through the prophets. (1 Samuel 19:20 ; Ezekiel 11:5,13)

In one, (Matthew 16: 18)
holy, (1 Peter 2:5,9)
catholic*, (Mark 16:15)
and apostolic Church. (Acts 2:42; Ephesians 2:19-22)

I acknowledge one baptism for the remission of sins**. (Ephesians 4:5; Acts 2:38)
I look for the resurrection of the dead, (John 11:24; 1Corinthians 15:12-49; Hebrews 6:2; Revelation 20:5)
and the life of the world to come. (Mark 10:29-30)
AMEN. (Psalm 106:48)

*The word "catholic" (literally, "complete," "universal," or "according to the whole") refers to the universal church of the Lord Jesus Christ and not necessarily or exclusively to any particular visible denomination, institution, or doctrine.

**May be interpreted as baptism is a matter of obedience and not a requirement for salvation or as a regenerating ordinance.


The Nicene Creed supports what I've been saying, I affirm the Nicene Creed. If anyone thinks the Nicene Creed supports Eternal Torture in Hell, I'd like to see the proof. According to the Nicene Creed (as well as all of scripture) Jesus Christ died on the cross, He was literally dead, and put into a grave, He literally rose again on the third day, He became alive again, He will return to judge the living and the dead. Those who are alive when he returns are the living, those who died before he returns are the dead. The dead are really truly dead, they are not alive. Jesus will resurrect the dead and give them life, so that they are not dead any longer, then He will judge the living and the dead (Those who were dead), and He will give eternal life to those He deems worthy. He will not give eternal life to those who have rejected him. Those he gives life to on judgment day will obviously have life in the world to come. Those who he has not given eternal life to will obviously NOT have life in the world to come.

The Nicene Creed shows that the early church DID NOT support the false doctrine of eternal torment.

 

[VCViking]

The SOF of CF is the Nicene Creed which says NOTHING about eternal torture in hell.

Post #8 for a quote of the SOF of CF.

http://www.christianforums.com/faq/?do=search&q=statement+of+faith&match=all&titlesonly=0

Do not post in the forums reserved for Christians only, unless you are truly a Nicene Creed, Trinitarian Christian (please see our Statement of Faith to know exactly what that is). If you wish to discuss unorthodox doctrines, you may do so in Unorthodox Theology.

 

[VCViking]

Which Scripture would that be? Thou Shalt not have a bible discussion? I haven't heard of that one.

Titus 3:10, among others.