The role of the Devil

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Tariki

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I am interested in hearing what role people here see the "devil" as having in their faith.

Any aspect.

In Buddhism, such a role is played by Mara, and I would see that role as being the various forces - both inner and outer - that would seem, or seek to, paralyze our innate wisdom, freedom and empathy.....and block our opening to such.
 

dlamberth

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I am interested in hearing what role people here see the "devil" as having in their faith.
In the spiritual path I follow, the devil provides a type of duality between good and evil that can be used for inner reflection. Along with all of the Divine qualities, every human being also has all of the devil types of qualities in them as well. When we can see the contrast between the holy and evil qualities that are in us, it's easer to choose which ones we want to take on as ours.

.
 
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linssue55

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This only scratches the surface of who and what Satan is..... I have much more.

Satan....Ruler of Darkness


[FONT=arial,courier new]I see Satan as the epitome of contradiction; Beautiful, scintillating, charismatic, genius, yet evil, corrupt, dishonorable, unscrupulous and arrogant.

An odd mixture, is it not? Yes, and ironically, it frames the very essence of reality in our world, for things in this dark place are not what they seem, just as the ruler of this cosmos is far from what he seems, and this statement works in two opposing directions. Let me explain.

To those who know Satan well, the angelic creation, he is awesome in countenance and accomplishment. His power was, at one time, second to none. Now there are several elect angels that exceed his prestige, but there was a time when he was the supreme angel, a cherub, "The Covering Angel", Guardian of the Throne of God. He is the most beautiful creature ever to come from the hand of God....and yet he has become the lowest of the low, the arch enemy of his Creator, and a creature bent upon destroying God and all He stands for. Swept away in a tidal wave of arrogance, Satan has initiated the first ever rebellion to unseat God as the Supreme Being, and we are very much a part of this conflagration.

He will take billions of angels to Gehenna with him for their foolish choice of serving him over their Sovereign, not to mention billions of homosapiens.

Then there is the human perception of Satan, and the contrast...what he really is.

To those who even believe he exists, he is the legendary devil with the red epidermis and forked tail, a grotesque gargoyle who commits only foul deeds in this kingdom. All manner of fiendish activities are attributed to him, and indeed, he is responsible for violence, evil and malfeasance, but this is far from the true nature of the devil.

Satan encourages this fantasy, for it beguiles human beings into believing he is the Super Demon, a miscalculation which renders them vulnerable, receptive to the true Satan and his base designs.

In a nutshell; Satan is in the business of imitating God, and he's very good at it, at least from the standpoint of the lowly creature, man. That is to say, most men, believer and unbeliever alike, are immersed in one Satanic scheme or another, yet completely unaware that they serve the devil.

Lets examine a few of Satan's more effective ploys;

Counterfeit Good:

What if I told you that the United Way and the environmentalist movement were evil to the core? Would this raise your hackles? Defy your view of these entities? Perhaps offend your tender feelings? You may be taken aback because you have supported one or both of these Satanic institutions in spirit if not in deed.

What am I driving at? What insane gesture am I making here? Well, before you succumb to rage or indignation, hear me out!

Even a stupid homosapien can grasp the principle of warfare, or determined opposition, that states the most effective means of defeating an enemy is to stage a brilliant diversion, get his attention focused on a bogus point, and then attack at the point of his most threatening strength.

This is one of Satan's tactics....get people thinking he is a dastard, while in reality he is sponsoring every do-gooder cause on the planet. Take guns away from citizens, stop every unhealthy practice, banish bigotry, save the trees, save the whales, stop abortion, ban capital punishment, ad nauseam.

These causes appear to be noble and above suspicion, do they not? Of course they do, they are designed by a mufti-faceted super genius to appear that way. But what really lies beneath the surface?

There is one answer....destruction of freedom!

Such is the brilliant strategy of the devil, to have you think he's a stinker, while he massages your good will with syrupy good intent. But all of these, and countless other ploys of the devil, lead to the usurpation and destruction of human freedom. It is this environment from God, liberty, which guarantees the evangelization of the lost, and the free worship of our God. As such, freedom is as essential to the plan of God as oxygen to our life here, or food. Thus, Satan attacks freedom in many diverse and ingenious ways.

Look for a moment at just one of the aforementioned causes; environmentalism.

It seems virtuous enough, and plain sense, that we protect the animals and natural resources on our planet, does it not? Of course it does, and so far as that concept goes, it IS a desirable objective. But Satan's intentions exceed moderation, and produce tyranny rather than the desired effect. Satan garnishes an issue with truth and humanitarianism to hide evil.

Ask any midwestern rancher, logger, miner, wildcatter, or a score of other Americans who have fallen prey to the juggernaut called "environmentalism". They have lost their jobs, had their private property seized, or the value of their property cut in half by impossible restrictions that become necessary when the milieu of an "endangered species" is near at hand.

Let's take another, a charitable organization. Here again, on the face of it, what could possibly be evil about an organization that helps others?

Well, it isn't necessarily their charitable function that is Satan's thrust, but the subtle politics of intimidation. Did you "give at the office" this year? Is the annual charity drive at your office like the one at mine? I'll bet a million bucks it is, because it is orchestrated by the same evil policy.

Does this sound familiar?

Your company designates some poor slob to oversee the money collecting campaign. They are usually highly motivated, or at best, of the opinion that is a worthy enough cause. So each department is assigned a quota. Email's or memoranda go throughout the business informing us of the drive and some rah-rah-rah nonsense about exceeding their donations from last year.

In effect, every person is put on the spot by the insinuation that if you don't give you are a low life, stingy bastard. Some departments have supervisors that also get involved, encourage department employees to shell out the dough, and make the issue of 100% compliance a big deal.

The fact is, people become accustomed to slavery by subtle and indirect means, being forced into a small compromises, which makes the objective of slavery more easily attained; the ultimate banishment of self-determination. Bit by bit, they submit to intimidation until they are cowed by tyranny, and it's just a matter of time until the powerful expand the regions of bondage to include higher taxes, mandatory this and that, surrendering our firearms, yada, yada, yada.

20 years ago if you had told me that there would be a day when we would have to wear seat belt, by law, and insurance would be mandatory for my car, I'd have laughed in your face. These, and many other issues, are rightly left to my own good judgement, not the elitist in political office who supposes that we are too damned stupid to make sound decisions for ourselves. That, or to pay off a political debt.

How much does car insurance cost you? How many times have you caused an accident? In all the years I've been driving I can't recall one single person of my acquaintance who was shafted by an uninsured driver. Oh sure, a few were hit by someone, but they paid to have the car repaired.

Think about it....all the thousands of dollars you have paid, we've all paid, to insure our cars, and most of us haven't been in a major accident all of our lives. Can you see how subtle tyranny is in this issue? If we aren't good boys and girls our insurance gets bumped. Run a red light, get a speeding ticket, and now use a cell phone....You see, once they have their foot in the door, it's too late to demand rights.

As for me, I'll take my chances! If I do smack someone, ok, I'll shell out the dough, but give me freedom to make that choice for myself.

Religion:

Shocker!

This is Satan's "ace trump". What better phalanx to attack God than in His own stronghold? While His worshippers are preoccupied with the illusion of propriety, sew the seeds of tyranny.

Perhaps the biggest Christian organization on earth is a many-faceted example;

Commit a sin, and you must utter it before a man, albeit within a private enclosure. He is a designated agent of God, and therefore privileged to hear your confession. Once you spill the beans, he prescribes various antidotes to your transgression, to make things right with God, and usually closes with an admonition to pitch some moolah into the plate on Sunday.

This procedure ignores the Royal Priesthood of every believer. We are all entitled to represent ourselves before God, and this is a very personal matter, and not anyone else's damned business.

This same outfit claims that they can ban you from their church, which results in condemning you to hell fire.

Oh really? How quaint! This is man's most arrogant and blasphemous contention, that a mere man, any man, has the power to send another human being to hell...for any reason! God has not extended this prerogative to any human being, period. The matter of salvation rests squarely upon the work of Christ, and we appropriate that saving grace by faith in Him, not obeying the inane demands of a black-robed holy Joe!

Christ says that "...I give to them eternal life and none shall pluck them out of my hand".

Where does it say, even indirectly, in this verse, that some bunch of pious morons have the fiat to deny us salvation? Seems clear enough to me that our Lord is clarifying the very claim made by this organization.

So many are the illustrations in this legalistic regime that I hardly know where to jump next; so I'll just rattle off a slew of offenses to God;

1. Praying to a human being, even if she is the mother of Christ's humanity.

2. You can get out of hell if someone lights candles for you.

3. There is a fat old man with the power to alter the Word of God, if he so desires.

4. Priests cannot marry, or women dedicated to God's service must be dowdy old maids all their lives.

5. You must be splashed with water to be saved.

I could go on, but I tire of so fertile a subject.

But there is more evidence that Satan is the High Prefect of religion....Who was instrumental in crucifying Christ? The most holy bunch of malpractors in Israel, the San Hedron.

In prophecy, the church of Rome will be the "scarlet harlot" that allies with The Beast, the Anti-Christ.

Christ called the pharisees "White washed tombstones, filled with dead men's bones". They looked great in their drab habits, and talked a good fight, but they were petty malingers who haunted the Lord every time He spoke in public, criticized His every act and word, yet most of them were going to hell.

Such are just two major areas of Satan's most effective penetration of the human race.

The most difficult understanding I had to grapple with as a "baby beliver" was the concept that the good of this world is part of Satan's realm, steeped in self-righteous motives, and aimed at diminishing God's influence among men. At best, Satan is out to disorient believers, for they are the forces that can send him to his dubious end. He fears and hates us, and uses his brilliance to intimidate, mislead, propagandize, and enslave us.

It is interesting that the basis for man's fall from grace was "The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil". Did it ever occur to you that those two terms, "good and evil", are used as synonyms? Adam and Eve already knew good! So what is the name for this tree all about?

Simple enough....man in a state of sin would learn another form of "good", both human good and Satan's counterfeit good. Don't buy it? What was the first thing Adam and the woman did after they fell? The covered their nakedness with assorted foliage...an act of GOOD!

To be most effective in this objective, his primary and mostly effective tactic is to raise the banner of good and truth, and once the faithful draw near, infiltrate their thinking with legalism and bias.

Another very destructive strategy, and prevalent in our time, is Christian activism. This is the flagship of Satan's policy which evokes such emotional response from Christians that many are compelled to commit crime, even murder, in the name of their cause.

In the name of this bogus issue people burn legitimate businesses, parade around with signs and assault the privacy and freedom of individuals, threaten medical professionals, even murder. In their intransigent arrogance they usurp the power of God, supposing that He agrees with their evil campaign.

The destruction of freedom is his highest priority!

Those who commit acts of good, apart from the filling of The Holy Spirit, are either minions of Satan, or guilty of human good, which amounts to self-righteous, and will be the "wood, hay and stubble" that is burned at the Judgement Seat of Christ.

Our stay in this place is one of great peril so long as we remain divorced from God's Word, for humanity is no match for Lucifer, Son of the Morning, "The Covering Angel". On our best day even the most astute and intelligent among us is putty in Satan's hands. Only God can reveal his brilliant tactics to us, and thus protect us from his wiles.

Remember, this is cosmos diabolicus, the realm of Satan, and all that is in it is tainted by his policies, save one, the local church under the authority of a prepared Pastor-Teacher. God has "fenced off" this one safe zone for the teaching of His Word to the elect. It is possible to escape Satan's all encompassing influence, but only by means of the truth as it resides in our souls.


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linssue55

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linssue55 said....

I could go on, but I tire of so fertile a subject.

I wish you had tired earlier.


Oh well....

then I quess you just aren't interested in what the Lord has to say about the very thing you reqested. :o
 
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chris4243

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I'm not really sure what the Devil's role is. In Job, he seems to be on better terms with God than I am, being invited to visit God in person at some sort of heavenly meeting, openly disagreeing with God and being allowed to try to show he was right. But in Revelations, the Devil gets cast into Hell to be tormented forever. In Daniel, someone was detaining one of God's angels for three weeks, though that may not have been the Devil.

Whether at God's request, at God's allowance, or by forcefully resisting God, it seems that the Devil's purpose is to tempt us into doing wrong -- yet James says we're tempted by our own evil desires, and in particular that God has nothing to do with that.

The issue is further complicated by the fact that several mythologies have been mixed together to form Satan, so much so that most Christians would swear it's from the Bible -- and consequently many have non-biblical, though not necessarily inaccurate, ideas about him.
 
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Arthra

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I am interested in hearing what role people here see the "devil" as having in their faith.

Any aspect.

In Buddhism, such a role is played by Mara, and I would see that role as being the various forces - both inner and outer - that would seem, or seek to, paralyze our innate wisdom, freedom and empathy.....and block our opening to such.

Here are some excerpts from the Baha'i sources:

Regarding your question relative to the condition of those people who are described in the Gospel as being possessed of devils; this should be interpreted figuratively; devil or Satan is symbolic of evil and dark forces yielding to temptation."

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer, November 2, 1938: Spiritualism, Psychic Phenomena and Related Subjects, p. 4)

(Compilations, Lights of Guidance, p. 513)

The Bahá'í Teachings inform us that there is no independent force of evil in creation, but terms such as "devil" or Satan" are used in sacred books as symbols of the promptings of the lower nature of man.

(The Universal House of Justice, 1985 Dec 02, Child Abuse, Psychology and Knowledge of Self)

In answer to those who may ask you what the stand is of your religion on the subject of demons, you can say without hesitation that the concept of Satan or the Devil as an actual being opposed to God is rejected by the Bahá'í teachings but that the term is understood by Bahá'ís to mean the promptings of self and desire and the dark side of human nature.

(13 February 1974, from the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer) [33]

(The Universal House of Justice, 1998 Dec 16, Traditional practices in Africa)
 
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T

Tariki

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Oh well....

then I quess you just aren't interested in what the Lord has to say about the very thing you reqested. :o

I would have been interested in how the "devil" is perceived in respect of Christ, the Word, through Whom all things are made. You have provided some sort of summary of how the "devil" is perceived through the eyes of a follower of Protestant Reform theology.

i.e. that those on the "other side" are in effect the devils spawn, and give only the "illusion of propriety", and "sow seeds of tyranny", that they are "black robed Holy Joes" and "pious morons", that someone somewhere is a "fat old man", and nuns are "dowdy old maids".

I have been running a thread on the Catholic monk/priest Thomas Merton. Perhaps you could give it a read and then offer some reflections on his words. Seriously.

It seems to me, that one part the devil may play in many lives is to put up a barrier against looking at any teaching that would at that moment call into question the current parameters set by that persons mind. Yes, a good trick indeed, one that would stifle spiritual growth very nicely.

Again, another trick he appears to play is deceiving us into thinking, more often than not, that he only deceives others while we ourselves remain immune.

All the best
 
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T

Tariki

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Here are some excerpts from the Baha'i sources:

Regarding your question relative to the condition of those people who are described in the Gospel as being possessed of devils; this should be interpreted figuratively; devil or Satan is symbolic of evil and dark forces yielding to temptation."

(From a letter written on behalf of the Guardian to an individual believer, November 2, 1938: Spiritualism, Psychic Phenomena and Related Subjects, p. 4)

(Compilations, Lights of Guidance, p. 513)

The Bahá'í Teachings inform us that there is no independent force of evil in creation, but terms such as "devil" or Satan" are used in sacred books as symbols of the promptings of the lower nature of man.

(The Universal House of Justice, 1985 Dec 02, Child Abuse, Psychology and Knowledge of Self)

In answer to those who may ask you what the stand is of your religion on the subject of demons, you can say without hesitation that the concept of Satan or the Devil as an actual being opposed to God is rejected by the Bahá'í teachings but that the term is understood by Bahá'ís to mean the promptings of self and desire and the dark side of human nature.

(13 February 1974, from the Universal House of Justice to an individual believer) [33]

(The Universal House of Justice, 1998 Dec 16, Traditional practices in Africa)

Thanks, informative.

:)
 
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Tariki

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I don't have a devil figure in my religious system. Outside of that, he's good for hockey teams and comedy relief.

Hi awitch, why hockey teams?

Anyway, while you ponder that, I would just mention a guy who I once exchanged views with on a Buddhist forum. Though he was a westerner he said he had had virtually no exposure to many Christian ideas. One thing he spoke of that really caught my attention was his speaking of "bodhisattvas" (enlightenment beings) who, according to some Buddhist ways, "people" our reality rather like angels in the Christian cosmology. But the interesting thing was that he knew only of perfect benevolence, that the only "forces" at work were those of "apaya" (the "skilful mean" of Reality-as-is seeking to bring ALL to enlightenment)

Just seemed to me, and still does, a very healthy way of living in our world.

All the best

:)

P.S. Again, why hockey? Surely beach volley ball would come into the equation, particularly on Horse Guards Parade?
 
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Tariki

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God's in charge. Satan can't do a thing unless God allows him to. Satan's plots are weak. Satan doesn't like us very much. Ummm... what else? Too sleepy... I'l see if I can add anything tomorrow.

Salam

JJ, I would be interested. I googled for a take on the Devil in Islam, and really was unable to make much of it. I'm a bit slow at times. You seem to have the knack.......

All the best
:)
 
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Jane_the_Bane

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Remember, this is cosmos diabolicus, the realm of Satan, and all that is in it is tainted by his policies, save one, the local church under the authority of a prepared Pastor-Teacher. God has "fenced off" this one safe zone for the teaching of His Word to the elect. It is possible to escape Satan's all encompassing influence, but only by means of the truth as it resides in our souls.

Has anybody else noticed that this is pure Gnosticism on several counts - and thus utterly heretical?
 
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Has anybody else noticed that this is pure Gnosticism on several counts - and thus utterly heretical?

I think even a small knowledge of Christian history would reveal that there are very few here, if any - Christian or Non-Christian - who would have escaped the charge of heresy at one time or another, in one place or another.
 
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