Yes, that they're different. Tell me though, how many Gods did Abraham worship?
I'd like to see one of those Scriptures, if by Scripture you mean the same thing Jesus meant by Scripture.
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Are Allah and Yaweh the same God?
- Thread starter PT Calvinist
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Yes, that they're different. Tell me though, how many Gods did Abraham worship?
I'd like to see one of those Scriptures, if by Scripture you mean the same thing Jesus meant by Scripture.
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The Jews worship a god who doesn't have a son.
The Muslims worship a god who doesn't have a son.
The Christians worship a god who has a son.
If the difference between Christians and Muslims on this point imply that they worship different gods, then that exact same difference between Christians and Jews implies that they too worship different gods.
Jews and Muslims possibly worship the same god, but from the basis you have established for who worships what god, it follows that neither of them worship the same god that Christians do.
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The Jews worship the God of Abraham, whose grandson Jacob, and was re-named "Israel".
The Jews believe the Messiah has not yet come. I believe He has. We both believe in the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jacob (Israel).
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Yeah, I read the post that I quoted, thank you very much. It answers neither of the questions I asked.
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Didn't Yahweh refer to Israel as His son?
Young) Hosea 11:1 Because Israel [is] a youth and I love him,
Out of Egypt I have called for My Son.
Young) Matthew 2:15 and He was there till the death of Herod, that it might be fulfilled that was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, `Out of Egypt I did call My Son.'
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FredVB
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Didn't Yahweh refer to Israel as His son?
Young) Hosea 11:1 Because Israel [is] a youth and I love him,
Out of Egypt I have called for My Son.
Young) Matthew 2:15 and He was there till the death of Herod, that it might be fulfilled that was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, `Out of Egypt I did call My Son.'
Yahweh has called Israel, and several individuals in a few places in the Bible his son, as well as calling those of us he redeemed his sons (and daughters) through his adoption. Jesus is specifically the only begotten Son of Yahweh (meaning he is, in the flesh, the incarnation of God among us), and in this was fulfilling the future sense of what was said in Hosea quoted above.
Jews believing their scripture and believing Christians all believe in agreement the true God is God as revealed in the Bible. Those who are not believing Christians have missed understanding Jesus as the prophesied one and the Son, the revelation of Yahweh in human presence. But there is still the prophecies that are fulfilled in him in what they believe.
What Muslims believe as Allah to them is something else, not conforming to God as portrayed through revelation in the Bible, Yahweh. But there is use of the word Allah outside of Islam. In that use it just has meaning of the one God, "Allah" is Arabic in origin and so Arabic speaking Christians use it, and it can be conforming to God as revealed in the Bible. "Allah" is Arabic in origin meaning the God. Arabic Christians are using it for the true living God. Muslims on the other hand have a very different understanding of who and what is God. It is specifically the Muslim Allah that is not the same.
I remind believing Christians Yahweh God said his name was for all generations, and so it must be, if he is to be believed, and he would know.
http://www.christianforums.com/t7439802-22/#post56823080
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Just like Muslims do. It's settled then, Muslims and Jews worship the same god.
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xDenax
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Jews believe the same way when it comes to Jesus as the Muslim. Actually, the Muslim give Jesus more reverence. They do believe he was a prophet and a special person on earth. Jews really don't care and don't give him much thought at all. And yet, the Muslim view of Jesus is used to determine you don't have the same god...but you and the Jew do. So, this is confusing? Are there other reasons because the one about Jesus doesn't make sense.
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Perhaps.
They also believe Jesus will come a 2nd time to defeat the "anti-christ", as the Christians also believe
http://www.christianforums.com/t5615012-46/#post36126961
Jesus Christ, was he sent for all mankind?
Hello.We muslims believe he was sent to the sons of Israel not for all mankind.
This doesnt mean the one who follows Him in real does a wrong job but this is God's plan for He sent Muhammed-aleyhissalam-to all mankind.
Which proofs do christians have to claim that Jesus was sent to entire humanity and not only to the israelites?
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Well, there are other reasons. Most prominently that she dislikes Islam, and therefore doesn't want to recognize that we worship the same god. Which is a predetermined conclusion in need of supporting arguments. Which is why they accept any argument that sounds like it supports that conclusion, clueless how the assumptions needed to make that argument backfire dramatically and lead to implications she doesn't like at all, such as the one about Jews and Christians not worshiping the same god.
Well, here's to the God of Abraham. I worship him. Do you too, brinny?
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razeontherock
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Against my better judgment, let me try sticking my toe in this water:
Jews and C's differ only in our perspective of Messiah. It is right to call C a sect within Judaism as that's how it started, but it's an awkward concept because we outnumber you by so many.
Muslims and C's both hold Jesus to be born of a virgin, due to Divine intervention. In fact the way Muslims maintain this occurred seems to be very much in line w/ RC teaching, and why Mary's "ever-virgin" status is so important to them. Yet "the Muslim G-d" disowns his paternity? I don't see how else this can be reconciled, given that the Koran says Allah has no Son.
YHVH never does such a thing, which would indicate 2 different characters.
Either that or Koran misrepresents Allah on this point.
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FredVB
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The agreement on God being the God of Abraham is not all there is to have enough agreement to have the same God. The character is different, with Yahweh shown to be absolute in justice, absolute in mercy, absolute in love, just as well as in all.
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No, the Jews don't worship a different God, they just refuse to see that Jesus as God because they don't follow the New Testament. Even the New Testament showcase this. But they don't disagree with the character of God. If they every quote out of their Tanakh, we also will quote out of our Old Testament, and it just so happened, that they are one in the same.
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I quoted that scripture in my post that you quoted.
John 3:16-18
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
18 He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.
18 He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
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No, there is a clear difference, the Jews worship God as if He doesn't have a Son, as if the Messiah never showed up, they still follow the Old Law. No where in their Tanakh does it say that God doesn't have a Son, they just refuse to believe that Christ was the Messiah. It was the Qu'ran, which was written about 700 years AFTER the Scriptures, did they make the claim that God doesn't have a Son, the Jewish Tanakh never said such a thing. All the prophecies that the Jews were to be looking for to see the Messiah they completely missed. And they are waiting for a Messiah but the sad truth for them is, that it's too late for ANYONE to fulfill the prophecies of the Messiah, if they don't accept that it was Christ. Because the time frame has already passed by.
They too thought that Christ was a prophet and they even let Him speak in their Synagogues, but they refused (not all the Jews) to follow Christ. But there is no difference in the God I serve and the God that the Jews serve, it's the old law that we don't follow because Christ fulfilled all of that....and if you take a look at the Jewish faith, they too don't strictly follow the old law (you can also look at their Tanakh and see that they didn't always follow it then either).
You will find this verse in the Jewish Tanakh which is our Old Testament:
Psalm 2:4-9, Old Testament
He who sits in the heavens shall laugh; the Lord shall hold them in derision. Then He shall speak to them in His wrath, and distress them in His deep displeasure:
"Yet I have set My King
On My holy hill of Zion."
"I will declare the decree; the LORD has said to Me,
'You are My Son,
Today, I have begotten You.
Ask of Me, and I will give You
The nations for Your inheritance,
and the ends of the earth for Your possession.
You shall break them with a rode of iron;
You shall dash them to pieces like a potter's vessel."
He who sits in the heavens shall laugh; the Lord shall hold them in derision. Then He shall speak to them in His wrath, and distress them in His deep displeasure:
"Yet I have set My King
On My holy hill of Zion."
"I will declare the decree; the LORD has said to Me,
'You are My Son,
Today, I have begotten You.
Ask of Me, and I will give You
The nations for Your inheritance,
and the ends of the earth for Your possession.
You shall break them with a rode of iron;
You shall dash them to pieces like a potter's vessel."
and
Psalm 2:4-9 Jewish Tanakh
4 He that sitteth in heaven laugheth, the L-rd hath them in derision.
5 Then will He speak unto them in His wrath, and affright them in His sore displeasure:
6 'Truly it is I that have established My king upon Zion, My holy mountain.'
7 I will tell of the decree: HaShem said unto me: 'Thou art My son, this day have I begotten thee.
8 Ask of Me, and I will give the nations for thine inheritance, and the ends of the earth for thy possession.
9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.'
4 He that sitteth in heaven laugheth, the L-rd hath them in derision.
5 Then will He speak unto them in His wrath, and affright them in His sore displeasure:
6 'Truly it is I that have established My king upon Zion, My holy mountain.'
7 I will tell of the decree: HaShem said unto me: 'Thou art My son, this day have I begotten thee.
8 Ask of Me, and I will give the nations for thine inheritance, and the ends of the earth for thy possession.
9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel.'
So, if the Jews deny that God has a Son, it's only by their own admission not by what the Tanakh said, for their Scripture (Tanakh) does not deny that God has a Son.
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Because the Jews by their own words deny Christ as the Son of God and the Messiah, not your Holy Book the Tanakh. Your Tanakh shows Him to be both the Son of God and the Messiah, for He fulfilled everything given by the Laws and Prophets, but you guys deny Him by your own words. Whereas the Muslim Holy book denies that God ever had a Son. That's the difference.
The Jews deny Christ by their words only not their Holy Book (which is our Old Testament). The Tanakh attest to Christ. The Muslims however deny Christ as God's Son by both their book and their words.
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