Sola Scripturists guide on the authority of the Bible

[sunlover1]

You still are trusting man: yourself.

Not really. But thanks for your opinion.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

You still are trusting man: yourself.

Doesn't she read the same Bible as you do

 

[Heavens]

Not to be disagreeable but when you say we "have to trust that the Holy
Spirit guided the church in the ..."
Well.. since I trust no man blush and the church is made up OF men...
I could not do that. And so quite a few years ago, I decided that I wasn't
going to just take someone's word for it, but rather would study it out
myself... prayerfully.

As only a son or daughter of God would

 

[heymikey80]

You still are trusting man: yourself.

Hm. So if I were to think that someone else thought something, well yes, I would be listening to the meaning I could determine about that person's attempt to communicate with me.

But that's not the same as superimposing my ideas on top of that person's thoughts and asserting they're his.

The question really comes to a variety of expressions.

Does some human need to intervene between you & God for God to get through to you? That is, an authority, not simply an expert.

Are your skills at reading and comprehension capable of determining what God has to say? And is Scripture telling you enough to exercise those skills and conclude what God has to say?

So tell me, non-solas: what're the answers from your church?

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

As only a son or daughter of God would

Isn't the LORD just wonderful

Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for YNG
("sons and daughters")
occurs in 28 verses in the YNG

Phrase used only 1 time in NT:

Search for 'Genesis 1:1' in the version

2 Corin 6:18 'And I shall be to ye as a Father and ye shall be to Me as sons and daughters' is saying Lord Almighty.

Textus Rec.) 2 Corinthians 6:18 kai esomai umin eiV patera kai umeiV esesqe moi eiV uiouV kai qugateraV legei kurioV pantokratwr

 

[Philothei]

Hm. So if I were to think that someone else thought something, well yes, I would be listening to the meaning I could determine about that person's attempt to communicate with me.

But that's not the same as superimposing my ideas on top of that person's thoughts and asserting they're his.

The question really comes to a variety of expressions.

Does some human need to intervene between you & God for God to get through to you? That is, an authority, not simply an expert.

Are your skills at reading and comprehension capable of determining what God has to say? And is Scripture telling you enough to exercise those skills and conclude what God has to say?

So tell me, non-solas: what're the answers from your church?

So when it says "go to the chruch for disputes" it meant to superimpose ideas?

 

[Philothei]

Not really. But thanks for your opinion.

How is different ? Trusting your self than trusting the Church? It is just a matter of interpretation. And anyhow it says in the Bible when you have disputes (or points you do not agree) to go to the church not to stay and self -intepret the Bible

 

[Standing Up]

How is different ? Trusting your self than trusting the Church? It is just a matter of interpretation. And anyhow it says in the Bible when you have disputes (or points you do not agree) to go to the church not to stay and self -intepret the Bible

Leaving ss or the Church out of things a moment because they vary by definition from different groups ...

We all recognize that different groups have different interpretations of scripture, tradition, etc. The question is can any of us to it off to apostles? Surely that is the point. Did this tradition arise from an apostle? Did this canon arise from an apostle? Foundation of OT prophets and NT apostles. Built on that. So, it's fairly easy. Can we trace scripture or tradition back to an apostle? If yes, we are in agreement. If no, we jettison the book or tradition.

 

[sunlover1]

How is different ? Trusting your self than trusting the Church?

Because I'm not trusting myself over men.
I'm trusting God,.. and as I have said before,
God does USE men.. but bottom line, I need
to hear from God,.. kwim?

It is just a matter of interpretation. And anyhow it says in the Bible when you have disputes (or points you do not agree) to go to the church not to stay and self -intepret the Bible

What passage do you refer to?
I can't answer your question because I am not familiar
with such a doctrine that says if you have points you
don't agree on you take it to "the church".
Thanks

 

[Ortho_Cat]

Leaving ss or the Church out of things a moment because they vary by definition from different groups ...

We all recognize that different groups have different interpretations of scripture, tradition, etc. The question is can any of us to it off to apostles? Surely that is the point. Did this tradition arise from an apostle? Did this canon arise from an apostle? Foundation of OT prophets and NT apostles. Built on that. So, it's fairly easy. Can we trace scripture or tradition back to an apostle? If yes, we are in agreement. If no, we jettison the book or tradition.

Very well then!

Sola Scriptura? *throws it out*

Sola Fide? *throws it out*

"Sinner's prayer"? *throws it out*

"Altar call"? *throws it out*

Serving grape juice at communion? *replaces with wine*

Is the eucharist is a mere symbol? *throws it out*

Not blessing the Virgin mother? (as scripture calls for) *adds it*

Absence of bishops,priests, deacons? *adds it*

Not confessing sins to another? *adds it*

Guitars and drums in worship service? *throws it out*

Rapture theology? *throws it out*

"Age of accountability"? *throws it out*

The idea of "Invisible church"? *throws it out*

Not anointing the sick with oil? *adds it*

etc. etc.

 

[Standing Up]

Very well then!
-snip-

So much for that.



PS. I thought that was pretty much what Irenaeus said.---scripture only and tradition-tied-to apostles. Tertullian---no apostolic succession only by laying on of hands, but because the same faith is preached; that is apostolic.

 

[Ortho_Cat]

So much for that.



PS. I thought that was pretty much what Irenaeus said.---scripture only and tradition-tied-to apostles. Tertullian---no apostolic succession only by laying on of hands, but because the same faith is preached; that is apostolic.

Hmm yes st, irenaeus said alot of things...many which emphasized apostolic succession and the authority of the church as well. As for tertullian, it sounds like what u described is apostolic succession, maybe he didn't use the word...

 

[laconicstudent]

Very well then!

Sola Scriptura? *throws it out*

Sola Fide? *throws it out*

"Sinner's prayer"? *throws it out*

"Altar call"? *throws it out*

Serving grape juice at communion? *replaces with wine*

Is the eucharist is a mere symbol? *throws it out*

Not blessing the Virgin mother? (as scripture calls for) *adds it*

Absence of bishops,priests, deacons? *adds it*

Not confessing sins to another? *adds it*

Guitars and drums in worship service? *throws it out*

Rapture theology? *throws it out*

"Age of accountability"? *throws it out*

The idea of "Invisible church"? *throws it out*

Not anointing the sick with oil? *adds it*

etc. etc.

 

[heymikey80]

So when it says "go to the chruch for disputes" it meant to superimpose ideas?

Actually it says go to the person, first. Jesus also said resolve the dispute quickly.

So yes, even there it definitely means not to superimpose your own ideas about what's being said.

 

[Heavens]

Very well then!

Sola Scriptura? *throws it out*

Sola Fide? *throws it out*

"Sinner's prayer"? *throws it out*

"Altar call"? *throws it out*

Serving grape juice at communion? *replaces with wine*

Is the eucharist is a mere symbol? *throws it out*

Not blessing the Virgin mother? (as scripture calls for) *adds it*

Absence of bishops,priests, deacons? *adds it*

Not confessing sins to another? *adds it*

Guitars and drums in worship service? *throws it out*

Rapture theology? *throws it out*

"Age of accountability"? *throws it out*

The idea of "Invisible church"? *throws it out*

Not anointing the sick with oil? *adds it*

etc. etc.

What a mess.

Did your cat jump onto your keyboard, walk back and forth a couple times then pressed enter?

 

[Philothei]

Leaving ss or the Church out of things a moment because they vary by definition from different groups ...

We all recognize that different groups have different interpretations of scripture, tradition, etc. The question is can any of us to it off to apostles? Surely that is the point. Did this tradition arise from an apostle? Did this canon arise from an apostle? Foundation of OT prophets and NT apostles. Built on that. So, it's fairly easy. Can we trace scripture or tradition back to an apostle? If yes, we are in agreement. If no, we jettison the book or tradition.

How is St. Athanasius sounds to you? since we pick and choose here

 

[Standing Up]

Not quite sure what to make of him. He makes what to me are some interesting comments as regards the death, burial, and resurrection times.

Wasn't he also one who put together a list of OT and NT scripture?

What do you think?

 

[Philothei]

Because I'm not trusting myself over men.
I'm trusting God,.. and as I have said before,
God does USE men.. but bottom line, I need
to hear from God,.. kwim?


What passage do you refer to?
I can't answer your question because I am not familiar
with such a doctrine that says if you have points you
don't agree on you take it to "the church".
Thanks

God talks through people...He talks through you. You are a person you can be wrong just like I can be wrong...So why reject their opinion over yours? Or over mine or over the Pope's? We all have voices that we speak through the Bible....We do not quote the Bible 100% even when we do theological convo KWIM? So what makes the collective consience of let's say the first ecumenical council more valid (the one that ratified the Bible) more valid than the ones following it? Where does it say in the Bible that there will be a council and I(God ) through certain men will give you the Bible... and it will be the ONLY book you will ever need in your Christian Faith and ALL you need is that single Book....?

I quoted it a few posts before hold on... will be happy to post it again

 

[Philothei]

http://www.christianforums.com/passage/?search=Matthew+18:15&version=NIV

Matthew 18:15
[ Dealing With Sin in the Church ] “If your brother or sister sins, go and point out their fault, just between the two of you. If they listen to you, you have won them over.

Matthew 18:17
If they still refuse to listen, tell it to the church; and if they refuse to listen even to the church, treat them as you would a pagan or a tax collector.

http://www.christianforums.com/passage/?search=Matthew+18:15&version=NIVhttp://www.christianforums.com/passage/?search=Matthew+18:15&version=NIVhttp://www.christianforums.com/passage/?search=Matthew+18:15&version=NIV


There it is ^ Actually it justifies the fact that if a brother does not listen to the church then no need to insist....

 

[laconicstudent]

I've always liked the coptic icon of St. Athanasius.

As you can see, Arius is also pictured.