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Proposition 8 overturned in California

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Cute Tink

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Yes, and it probably most states required one to be 21 to get married, but they don't. If I remember correctly, 49 of the states allow you to get married when you turn 18 without needing parental consent, therefore Mississippi is quite odd is waiting 3 more years. With the handguns, the states can likely show evidence that it is in the states interest to hold off allowing hand guns till one is 21, but I doubt the same can be said of marriage because of how rare such a limit is.

Someone could certainly sue and see how the case comes out. The state would have to justify why someone who is legally an adult cannot get married. It probably wouldn't hold up in the long run, but it can't be causing that much trouble since nobody has sued yet.
 
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Jase

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PreachersWife - Mind if I ask if you believe that it's possible you could be wrong on this issue? Considering only 5 out of 37,000, vague verses that we know have been changed in the past 50 years even mention same-sex behavior - do you believe it's possible, that the authors were not referring to the modern day concept of homosexuality that didn't exist back then?
 
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PreachersWife2004

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PreachersWife - Mind if I ask if you believe that it's possible you could be wrong on this issue? Considering only 5 out of 37,000, vague verses that we know have been changed in the past 50 years even mention same-sex behavior - do you believe it's possible, that the authors were not referring to the modern day concept of homosexuality that didn't exist back then?

Considering there are ZERO passages that give any approval or indication that homosexuality is okay, I'm pretty sure we're reading the texts correctly. The argument that the modern day definition of homosexuality didn't exist back then is a smoke screen and should be an offense to everyone who says that they are born homosexual.
 
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lawtonfogle

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Someone could certainly sue and see how the case comes out. The state would have to justify why someone who is legally an adult cannot get married. It probably wouldn't hold up in the long run, but it can't be causing that much trouble since nobody has sued yet.

That is like saying laws that outlawed homosexuality weren't causing too much trouble till the 21st century when someone finally sued. It can be cause a lot of trouble, but people don't want more trouble by having to do a law suit.
 
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Wiccan_Child

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Considering there are ZERO passages that give any approval or indication that homosexuality is okay, I'm pretty sure we're reading the texts correctly.
There are zero passages that approve of cars, either.
 
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Skaloop

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Considering there are ZERO passages that give any approval or indication that homosexuality is okay, I'm pretty sure we're reading the texts correctly. The argument that the modern day definition of homosexuality didn't exist back then is a smoke screen and should be an offense to everyone who says that they are born homosexual.

Well, there is the whole Jonathon/David partnership. And while I expect you to wave that away with something about how it was just florid language to describe a close platonic bond of friendship, it's certainly possible to interpret it as a homosexual relationship, and since that relationship is spoken of with approval, that would indicate that homosexuality is OK.

And that's not just a few passages here or there, it's one of the longest stories of love in the whole of the Bible.
 
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PreachersWife2004

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Well, there is the whole Jonathon/David partnership. And while I expect you to wave that away with something about how it was just florid language to describe a close platonic bond of friendship, it's certainly possible to interpret it as a homosexual relationship, and since that relationship is spoken of with approval, that would indicate that homosexuality is OK.

And that's not just a few passages here or there, it's one of the longest stories of love in the whole of the Bible.

at the very least, if one were to take a very liberal approach to David and Jonathan's friendship, it would be considered a bisexual relationship. We know that David lusted after women (see Bathsheba) and Jonathan had children. The love that is spoken of between these two men is not that of lovers.

So, still ZERO passages supporting homosexuality in any way. There are, however, numerous passages that talk of homosexuality being an abomination, etc.

Cars and chatting on the internet can certainly be sinful as well...
 
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onemorequestion

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Judge Walker is Gay.

Talk about walking into the Lions den for the defendants.

If he was a "Born Again" Christian and decided to uphold the will of the majority in California, there would be a mass demonstration of such anger as has not been seen since Prop 8 passed.

The Gay Agenda once again has its foundation in reality.

True Alinskyite Judge Walker. By any means necessary.

Christians have no chance against such devious people.
 
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onemorequestion

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at the very least, if one were to take a very liberal approach to David and Jonathan's friendship, it would be considered a bisexual relationship. We know that David lusted after women (see Bathsheba) and Jonathan had children. The love that is spoken of between these two men is not that of lovers.

So, still ZERO passages supporting homosexuality in any way. There are, however, numerous passages that talk of homosexuality being an abomination, etc.

Cars and chatting on the internet can certainly be sinful as well...

Cars and the internet are ways to preach the Gospel to al the world. As Christ commisioned.
 
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Jase

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Would anyone like to inform OMQ that Judge Walker is a conservative judge who was nominated both by Reagan and George H.W. Bush, received absolutely no opposition from the Republicans on the Judiciary Committee, and was praised by Republican lawmakers. And that numerous Republicans have considered him a strong, conservative judge who doesn't care about what's fair, only what the law says.

Could they also remind him that Judge Walker could not uphold the will of the majority without violating his oath of defending the Constitution.

Right-wingers falsely portray judge in Prop 8 trial as out of mainstream | Media Matters for America

It appears to have, once again failed to sink in with all that "Gay Agenda" rambling.
 
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Gishin

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Judge Walker is Gay.

Talk about walking into the Lions den for the defendants.

If he was a "Born Again" Christian and decided to uphold the will of the majority in California, there would be a mass demonstration of such anger as has not been seen since Prop 8 passed.

The Gay Agenda once again has its foundation in reality.

True Alinskyite Judge Walker. By any means necessary.

Christians have no chance against such devious people.
Cry more.
 
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Judge Walker is Gay.

Talk about walking into the Lions den for the defendants.

If he was a "Born Again" Christian and decided to uphold the will of the majority in California, there would be a mass demonstration of such anger as has not been seen since Prop 8 passed.

The Gay Agenda once again has its foundation in reality.

True Alinskyite Judge Walker. By any means necessary.

Christians have no chance against such devious people.

So are you implying that his orientation was the deciding factor and not the well reasoned position that Prop 8 denied equal protection under the law? The arguments offered in favor of Prop 8 were very poor.



T
 
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Skaloop

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at the very least, if one were to take a very liberal approach to David and Jonathan's friendship, it would be considered a bisexual relationship.

Not exactly. David and Jonathan may have been bisexuals (although having children doesn't mean one isn't homosexual) but their relationship with each other would be a homosexual relationship.

One that was approved of Biblically.
 
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Cabal

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The Gay ... Agenda?

I was not aware of such nefarious shenanigans taking root.

Clearly you aren't aware that if you suffix the word "Agenda" (capital a) to something you don't like and manage to scare enough people about it it means it's a real threat.
 
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sbvera13

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So, still ZERO passages supporting homosexuality in any way. There are, however, numerous passages that talk of homosexuality being an abomination, etc.
There are even more passages saying that you should not judge people, whether they are an abomination or not. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone," and all that. That wasn't said by anybody, you know, important was it? I think that trumps whatever you might find in the old law.

See my siggy for another good one.
 
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Jase

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Considering there are ZERO passages that give any approval or indication that homosexuality is okay, I'm pretty sure we're reading the texts correctly.
Your argument is illogical. As others have said - the majority of things in existence are not approved of in the Bible, yet I don't see you avoiding the computer, cars, processed foods, airplanes, cell-phones, television, etc. Is Quantum Mechanics disapproved of because the Bible never mentions it? How about Chemistry? Should we avoid nylon or polyester clothing? Oh and who can forget medicine? I mean afterall, the Bible tells us demons cause diseases not viruses and bacteria. Studying Medicine must be disapproved of by God too.

You are being inconsistent. You disapprove of homosexuality, not because it's not mentioned in the Bible, but because you were taught that it's "icky" and that God condemns it.


The argument that the modern day definition of homosexuality didn't exist back then is a smoke screen and should be an offense to everyone who says that they are born homosexual.
Sexual orientation was not discovered until the late 19th century. "Homosexual" was invented in 1893. Therefore, it's impossible for there to be a "homosexual" reference in the Bible. There was no such thing. Any mention of homosexual in the English Bibles is clear evidence of translators projecting their modern day bias onto the ancient text.

We know that the 5 verses condemning specific types of same-sex behavior are vague at best. Take 1 Cor 6:9 for example. Modern day Bibles inserted the word homosexual as one of the offenses. And yet, for all of Christian history - that is the last 2000 years, that word has never even remotely been translated as homosexual. It's meant numerous things, most notably kidnappers, and from Martin Luther until about 50 years ago, masturbator. That was the universally accepted meaning of that word. So why is it that you all of sudden are right, and everyone for the past 2000 years is wrong for not translating correctly?

Romans is another example of conservatives misrepresenting scripture. They love to claim the target audience is homosexuals, and yet Paul says they exchanged natural relations. Well, for a person born attracted to members of the same sex, it is 100% natural to be attracted to the same-sex. So what exactly did they exchange? Not to mention, we know for a fact Paul was directing this at former Christians who returned to their Paganistic ways, and continued to practice sex rituals and idolatry. There is no evidence Paul directed that verse at all gay people for all time.

As for the Leviticus verses, I've already explained that in Hebrew, they don't condemn consentual relationships. It was a specific prohibition on the dominating behavior of certain men during pagan sex rituals. This is completely in context with the rest of the verses surrounding it, such as sacrificing children to Molech.

Not to mention, even if Leviticus did condemn it - you don't follow Leviticus, so why should anyone else? It's meaningless to Christians - therefore, stop using it as an argument.

And let's not forget that Jesus Christ himself, never mentioned it. If it were the "abomination" you make it out to be, surely he would have devoted at least a paragraph to gay people.

The conservative position on the gay debate is completely baseless. They take 4 or 5, poorly mistranslated verses, half of which don't even apply to Christians anymore, and condemn hundreds of millions of people to Hell with them. It's extremely disappointing that Jesus' words have gone completely ignored.
 
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